Providence Post Game Thread | Page 11 | The Boneyard

Providence Post Game Thread

NickDanger said:
No, you have the rule backwards. You’re not in the frontcourt until the ball and both feet are in. But once you are, if any of the three go into the backcourt, it’s a violation.
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I’m saying what you’re saying. You can’t have an over and back unless you’re in the front court, and you can’t be in the front court until both feet and the ball are completely over the line.
 
Yesterday our best offensive line up had Diarra, Ball, Mahaney and Karaban. But with that lineup, Reed has to be the 5 because if Johnson is the 5 we will never get a rebound. I have been a Samson backer all along but after what I saw yesterday maybe Reed should be the main guy at the 5. I just watched the replay and after the first 6 minutes Samson was pretty bad. I could use stronger words but not in a public forum. Also, from watching the replay, I think Stewart did enough to warrant starting vs Villanova with Mahaney being the first guy off the bench. Problem with playing Nova is they play iso ball and will attack the basket with the dribble. I also believe Dixon is playing alot at the 4 which will expose Karaban.
 
ucp990411 said:
I thought the backcourt call was correct. A call nobody has mentioned is the out of counts off Reed on the baseline. The ball was at least 3 inches from the baseline
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Seems like it may have been correct by a millimeter. Makes you wonder why they can’t seem to get OOB right. In addition to the one you mentioned, there was another when we (I think Ball maybe) caused the ball to deflect off a PC player along the sideline. It was obvious to all of us on that side of the arena except the ref standing 6 feet away that the ball went off PC but they called it off UConn.

What I will never understand is why a dual championship winning senior like Samson Johnson gets absolutely no benefit of the doubt while a freshman like #55 on PC did whatever he wanted out there last night.
He set about 50 picks in this game and not a single one was legal. He was leaning in constantly, and either shoving the UConn player trying to fight through, or actually grabbing them. He also did a lot of hacking down on our arms on rebounds. He was also one of two PC players who did unnecessary pull-ups on the rim. Mahaney would have shot 100% for the game if they called the hack on his drive to the hoop, which I believe was also #55.
 
homunculus said:
Seems like it may have been correct by a millimeter. Makes you wonder why they can’t seem to get OOB right. In addition to the one you mentioned, there was another when we (I think Ball maybe) caused the ball to deflect off a PC player along the sideline. It was obvious to all of us on that side of the arena except the ref standing 6 feet away that the ball went off PC but they called it off UConn.

What I will never understand is why a dual championship winning senior like Samson Johnson gets absolutely no benefit of the doubt while a freshman like #55 on PC did whatever he wanted out there last night.
He set about 50 picks in this game and not a single one was legal. He was leaning in constantly, and either shoving the UConn player trying to fight through, or actually grabbing them. He also did a lot of hacking down on our arms on rebounds. He was also one of two PC players who did unnecessary pull-ups on the rim. Mahaney would have shot 100% for the game if they called the hack on his drive to the hoop, which I believe was also #55.
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Agree on SJ and their players not just the 5. I don’t like using the refs as an issue but again through every pick they held our guys coming off and used their hands to stop any positive movement stopping momentum. You saw Diarra constantly slapping Joseph’s hand off of him in the last 4 minutes. They don’t call it so I’m thinking maybe we should be more aggressive in that regard on that end, but I know we won’t get the benefit of the doubt like they did. We almost aren’t physical enough to test that theory.
 
I will give English credit in one area-esp. the first half. He had his guys jumping our sets -clogging our back cut actions and screens-esp. Alex and Ball. Alex was getting bodied most of the game. I would expect more of the same as part of the opponent's scout while Liam is rehabbing. Try to make our 40%+ three point shooters work to get open vs the sets providing the action for them.
 
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RuffRuff said:
Best roster in Liam’s absence is pretty clear - Reed in to anchor the paint and rebound, and AM for offense. The Samson high hedge routine feels fruitless so often. We don’t need our big floating at the three point line, we need a big to hold the paint down. If Ross could add to the rebounding fine, but he doesn’t even do that. Pecking order off bench should be AM, Stew and then Ross.
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I guess I saw a different DePaul game than you. Last six minutes of that game Samson’s defense was one of the major reasons for the win.

What we need is better rebounding from our perimeter players. Hurley stated this in his postgame presser. Last year the four starters who were not centers averaged around five rebounds per game.

Liam and AK are good rebounders. Hassan is adequate. The other players hopefully will improve.

Reed was gassed when he was taken out at end of the game. The minute distribution between Reed and Samson factors this in.

The first five minutes of the Providence game UConn played well with Samson at center and Ross playing even with Ross being a net negative factor.

We need one or both of Ross and Stewart to develop because both have the potential to be good rebounders. Without game play against the weaker BE conference teams it won’t happen.

It’s obvious from the postgame presser Ross is a good offensive player in practice but needs something to happen in a game to prove it to himself and develop the confidence going forward. He’s being utilized in the same manner Mahaney had been utilized once Hurley reassessed how to utilize him. That utilization paid dividends this game.

Too many people in this thread are insisting at immediate perfection from our developing players and not factoring in that most young players go through phases of less than ideal play before they achieve consistent good play.
 
ctchamps said:
I guess I saw a different DePaul game than you. Last six minutes of that game Samson’s defense was one of the major reasons for the win.

What we need is better rebounding from our perimeter players. Hurley stated this in his postgame presser. Last year the four starters who were not centers averaged around five rebounds per game.

Liam and AK are good rebounders. Hassan is adequate. The other players hopefully will improve.

Reed was gassed when he was taken out at end of the game. The minute distribution between Reed and Samson factors this in.

The first five minutes of the Providence game UConn played well with Samson at center and Ross playing even with Ross being a net negative factor.

We need one or both of Ross and Stewart to develop because both have the potential to be good rebounders. Without game play against the weaker BE conference teams it won’t happen.

It’s obvious from the postgame presser Ross is a good offensive player in practice but needs something to happen in a game to prove it to himself and develop the confidence going forward. He’s being utilized in the same manner Mahaney had been utilized once Hurley reassessed how to utilize him. That utilization paid dividends this game.

Too many people in this thread are insisting at immediate perfection from our developing players and not factoring in that most young players go through phases of less than ideal play before they achieve consistent good play.
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So you're ok with a starting 5 who averages less rebounds per game than the PG? What system has ever asked a 5 to forget about rebounding and to put the burden on the guards? C'mon now. Reed averages 3x more rebounds a game than Samson, with those same guards. It doesn't take much more than watching the actual game to recognize the difference in ability.

Field of 68 guys are wondering why they are sticking with Samson as the starting 5. And forget the DePaul's of the world, they stink. This is more about how this team needs to set the rotation for heart of the schedule, which starts in February, and for March.
 
RuffRuff said:
So you're ok with a starting 5 who averages less rebounds per game than the PG? What system has ever asked a 5 to forget about rebounding and to put the burden on the guards? C'mon now. Reed averages 3x more rebounds a game than Samson, with those same guards. It doesn't take much more than watching the actual game to recognize the difference in ability.

Field of 68 guys are wondering why they are sticking with Samson as the starting 5. And forget the DePaul's of the world, they stink. This is more about how this team needs to set the rotation for heart of the schedule, which starts in February, and for March.
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I'd make the switch to Reed, but we're a good rebounding team overall so I don't really care whether it's coming from the guards or Johnson/Reed. As long as someone is getting the rebounds it's a non-issue, and that's been happening
 
ctchamps said:
I guess I saw a different DePaul game than you. Last six minutes of that game Samson’s defense was one of the major reasons for the win.

What we need is better rebounding from our perimeter players. Hurley stated this in his postgame presser. Last year the four starters who were not centers averaged around five rebounds per game.

Liam and AK are good rebounders. Hassan is adequate. The other players hopefully will improve.

Reed was gassed when he was taken out at end of the game. The minute distribution between Reed and Samson factors this in.

The first five minutes of the Providence game UConn played well with Samson at center and Ross playing even with Ross being a net negative factor.

We need one or both of Ross and Stewart to develop because both have the potential to be good rebounders. Without game play against the weaker BE conference teams it won’t happen.

It’s obvious from the postgame presser Ross is a good offensive player in practice but needs something to happen in a game to prove it to himself and develop the confidence going forward. He’s being utilized in the same manner Mahaney had been utilized once Hurley reassessed how to utilize him. That utilization paid dividends this game.

Too many people in this thread are insisting at immediate perfection from our developing players and not factoring in that most young players go through phases of less than ideal play before they achieve consistent good play.
Expand ...

I've liked the looks of Ross's last 2-3 looks from 3...they just didn't go down. He also had that nifty put-back and reverse lay-up.

You can see the potential on offense is there. We saw it against the cream-of-tomato cans we played earlier as well.

We got really spoiled by last year's team...we need to have patience and trust the process.

Hurley's first 2 year's teams steadily & substantially improved throughout the entire season...but started from a much much lower level of talent than our current team. I expect the same kind of incremental improvements this year, but the ceiling is so much higher. It's a great time to be a fan of UConn basketball.
 
RuffRuff said:
So you're ok with a starting 5 who averages less rebounds per game than the PG? What system has ever asked a 5 to forget about rebounding and to put the burden on the guards? C'mon now. Reed averages 3x more rebounds a game than Samson, with those same guards. It doesn't take much more than watching the actual game to recognize the difference in ability.

Field of 68 guys are wondering why they are sticking with Samson as the starting 5. And forget the DePaul's of the world, they stink. This is more about how this team needs to set the rotation for heart of the schedule, which starts in February, and for March.
Expand ...

I put this in the Tarris thread as well, but this is why Samson continues to start over Reed. These are 1st-half metrics since we got back from Maui:

Tarris-Samson-1st halves.jpg


Having a Podcast doesn't mean you know what you're talking about nor does it mean you take the time to do some research before presing "record" and yapping away with hot takes :)
 
English took away our outside shooters by putting his center in the middle of the lane on D and leaving Samson above the free throw line by himself. There was no opportunity for backcuts as the lane was filled. Samson is no threat to shoot from there so they ignored him. Their defenders really stuck with their man. The Friars got away with clutching, bumping and grabbing cutters and our dribblers. And we missed some makeable short shots to go into the half a mess.
The inability to inbound the ball at the end and in general has to get fixed. That was a wakeup call for the staff. Is Karaban the best player to inbound under pressure? Pitino will most likely press us all game. It will be interesting to see if other BE coaches attack us in this way.
 
navery12 said:
I'd make the switch to Reed, but we're a good rebounding team overall so I don't really care whether it's coming from the guards or Johnson/Reed. As long as someone is getting the rebounds it's a non-issue, and that's been happening
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We've seen this for years. Shabazz Napier used to pull down a ton of rebounds. I don't ever remember hearing that was a bad thing.
 
navery12 said:
I'd make the switch to Reed, but we're a good rebounding team overall so I don't really care whether it's coming from the guards or Johnson/Reed. As long as someone is getting the rebounds it's a non-issue, and that's been happening
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The Friars 3 bigs were big as in strong and one was a frosh and one a soph. Reed could stand up to them better.
 
RuffRuff said:
So you're ok with a starting 5 who averages less rebounds per game than the PG? What system has ever asked a 5 to forget about rebounding and to put the burden on the guards? C'mon now. Reed averages 3x more rebounds a game than Samson, with those same guards. It doesn't take much more than watching the actual game to recognize the difference in ability.

Field of 68 guys are wondering why they are sticking with Samson as the starting 5. And forget the DePaul's of the world, they stink. This is more about how this team needs to set the rotation for heart of the schedule, which starts in February, and for March.
Expand ...
Yes! And not just because I think Hurley is a better coach than you would be.
 
JustbrewitMan said:
I put this in the Tarris thread as well, but this is why Samson continues to start over Reed. These are 1st-half metrics since we got back from Maui:

View attachment 106020

Having a Podcast doesn't mean you know what you're talking about nor does it mean you take the time to do some research before presing "record" and yapping away with hot takes :)
Expand ...
In the first half, the guy behind me was yelling to put Reed in on every possession. When they eventually did, he cheered. At that time, Samson was our 2nd leading scorer with 10 pts behind someone (Solo?) with 11.

The rotation with the two is set and not changing. They both have their strengths and roles and it's effective in total. I get it. Reed is more of a "beast" and imposing physically. And there were times 2 years ago that Donovan was "better" and flashier than Sanogo.

I know it's going to continue all season, but Samson is starting and that's that. Keep screaming at the clouds if you'd like.
 
JustbrewitMan said:
I've liked the looks of Ross's last 2-3 looks from 3...they just didn't go down. He also had that nifty put-back and reverse lay-up.

You can see the potential on offense is there. We saw it against the cream-of-tomato cans we played earlier as well.

We got really spoiled by last year's team...we need to have patience and trust the process.

Hurley's first 2 year's teams steadily & substantially improved throughout the entire season...but started from a much much lower level of talent than our current team. I expect the same kind of incremental improvements this year, but the ceiling is so much higher. It's a great time to be a fan of UConn basketball.
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Two years ago AJ did not make the starting lineup until Oklahoma State - eight games into the season. After the 6 game swoon in the BE conference play Hurley had to modify the half court offense after teams changed how they guarded AJ. All that season he utilized Joey, Hassan and Nahiem situationally. Of course this forum new better than Dan and was constantly giving their plug nickels how he was doing it wrong. It took almost 2/3 of the season until Tristen transformed into the role Hurley wanted. And we know how this forum predominantly felt about him.

But even that year was considerably different than this year experience wise. We had a senior and two juniors returning. One sophomore in Hawk who mirrors in many ways Solo. And four upperclassmen transfers who had a lot of college experience.

Last season was an aberration. The seven players who had the predominate minutes integrated quickly. Donovan picked things up quickly even though he was a sophomore. Stephon did as well in spite of being a freshman and had a delay from an early season injury. Cam probably developed as a basketball player in utero. What did he take - one or two games before he was fully integrated into our schemes and playing with new players? We had an experienced Hassan off the bench. And Samson did a really good job as a backup in spite of limited playing time prior to last season.

Hurley hyped up this season and people naturally got caught up in it because of the past two seasons. I felt differently. A lot of new parts to integrate and a lot of players who haven't yet reached their potential.

I'm happy to give Solo, Jaylin and Jayden more time before I start negatively nitpicking their play. I'll let the BMOTB have fun finding the flaws in these players games.
 
alphasigko said:
Including getting beat consistently off the dribble. Hard to believe that here we are, halfway thru the regular season, and he cannot figure out how to solve this defensive issue.
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I saw hope for Solo defensively in yesterdays game. He made positive defensive plays that he wouldn't or couldn't 3-4 weeks ago. Has the goods, just learning how to use them. Never going to be a Steph Castle lock 'em down guy, but will continue to improve.
 
Deepster said:
In the first half, the guy behind me was yelling to put Reed in on every possession. When they eventually did, he cheered. At that time, Samson was our 2nd leading scorer with 10 pts behind someone (Solo?) with 11.

The rotation with the two is set and not changing. They both have their strengths and roles and it's effective in total. I get it. Reed is more of a "beast" and imposing physically. And there were times 2 years ago that Donovan was "better" and flashier than Sanogo.

I know it's going to continue all season, but Samson is starting and that's that. Keep screaming at the clouds if you'd like.
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Not debating Samsons starting, but the use of the high hedge, which I hate in general. On a number of occasions, as Samson went out towards the 3 point line, one of our guards was getting beaten and PC turned the corner to find Samson staring him in the face. PC guy retreated, and dribble drive averted. Not sure exactly how many times he did this but I remember 3. Thinking I am a bit more of a High Hedge fan today.
 
Saw an interesting and revealing stat for PC game. Mahaney-Reed-Diarra scored 40 of their combined 44 pts in the 2nd half on Sunday.
 
Excalibur said:
I’m saying what you’re saying. You can’t have an over and back unless you’re in the front court, and you can’t be in the front court until both feet and the ball are completely over the line.
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I realized my mistake and posted a correction.
But the line acts like an out of bounds line: the heel of your foot can be in the air over it, and the front on the ground in the front court, and you’ve arrived in the front court.
 
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