Paige Doing Paige Stuff

[HuskyNan]

The thing is, at Notre Dame, Arike Ogunbowale was a far more efficient shooter/scorer --- 44% from the floor, 39.3 percent from three, and 77.0 percent from the line.
She also averaged 4.6 rebounds per game for her career. And in her last two seasons, she put up 3.3 assists per contest with a career A/TO of nearly 2-to-1.

But after four coaches (Agler, Johnson, Trammel, and Kolcanes) have been unable to harness her tremendous talent into being a highly efficient player (or even a moderately good efficient one) in the professional ranks, one wonders if this is just who she is going to be as a WNBA player.

ND had scorers (Mabrey #1, Jackie Young, Brianna Turner, Jessica Shepard) that forced defenders to decide who to guard. Arike capitalized, as she should have. Now, she’s the only threat and is drawing double teams from the best guards in the country and shots aren’t as easy to find. So, she’s trying too hard, forcing shots, and doesn’t know what to do when the shots don’t fall. She is a shooter - even her ND bio highlights her scoring.

I’m guessing she’s thrilled Paige is there to draw the defense away but Arike is not capitalizing.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Again I agree with your overall points except for Ogunbowale. Between being as you say an inconsistent shooter and playing no defense, where or what is her immense talent?

Arike's ability to generate offense one-on-one is truly elite. Her handle/crossover to cause defenders to shift, thereby creating space,, is elite. She is considered one of the most prolific scorers in the league -- and has been for some time.

 

[baggerbob]

Fair enough. But I think Arike would have been more effective as a more well-rounded basketball player rather than a shooter. She’s forcing shots now and when they don’t go in, doesn’t have another effective facet to her game to go to.

Every UConn fan knows when shots don’t fall, players work to tighten up the defense, set a screen for a teammate, focus on rebounding, or drive to the hoop- anything that helps the team. Geno harps on this. Coaching matters

I agree, she got away with being a gunner at Notre Dame because that was the kind of offense McGraw ran . Whoever had the first open shot took it.

 

[BobbyJ]

Arike's ability to generate offense one-on-one is truly elite. Her handle/crossover to cause defenders to shift, thereby creating space,, is elite. She is considered one of the most prolific scorers in the league -- and has been for some time.

We obviously have different opinions of what immense and truly elite mean. It doesn't take elite talent to shoot 39%-34% and give it away at the other end but look good doing it. I see her game as one dimensional and nothing special. A lot of WNBA guards could score 18-22 ppg if they shot between 500 and 750 shots a season.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

We obviously have different opinions of what immense and truly elite mean. It doesn't take elite talent to shoot 39%-34% and give it away at the other end but look good doing it. I see her game as one dimensional and nothing special. A lot of WNBA guards could score 18-22 ppg if they shot between 500 and 750 shots a season.

You did not read my post as to what I said made her elite.
Post in thread 'Paige Doing Paige Stuff'
Paige Doing Paige Stuff

 

[RockyMTblue2]

A nice relaxing pregame warmup ... right?

 

[BobbyJ]

You did not read my post as to what I said made her elite.
Post in thread 'Paige Doing Paige Stuff'
Paige Doing Paige Stuff

Yes, I read it. She has flashy crossover moves that shift the D and create space for her to miss a lot of shots while her teammates watch in a stagnant offense. This allows her to score a prolific 18-22 ppg while doing nothing to get her teammates involved and contribute to winning many games. I don’t consider that to be elite talent but will watch to see which if any GMs will be willing to pay top money for it in her free agency this coming offseason.

 

[Bone Dog]

This is just an unhinged assessment backed by no evidence, but unless she’s forced to go, I don’t expect Paige will try to leave Dallas. I also wouldn’t be surprised to hear that she wants to make it work with Arike, just as I think (along with @HuskyNan) that Arike wants this too. Events may intervene and prevent it, but on her side Paige is not a quitter. She does not give up on teammates.

On her side, Arike seems to harbor a grudge against the league (or the world) about lack of respect for her talent. The arrival of Paige could have exacerbated this, but instead she seems to have embraced this development. Perhaps she recognizes a turning point in her career and sees working with Paige as a way to make the best of it. I will be surprised if she ends up trying to leave a situation with Paige that might just retrieve her career.

I don’t care for ball-dominant players generally. But I feel for Arike in this moment. She has to rethink her game with little help from her coaches or most of her teammates. All there is for her to work with is Paige, and lucky for her Paige is the player most willing to try to make it work with her teammates. It’s a new idiom for Arike and she may not be all that comfortable in it and minor missteps abound along the way.

I’m reminded of a transition play a few games ago in which Paige tipped a pass away and it ended up in Arike’s hands. Naturally, Paige streaks down the floor and Arike follows dribbling the ball. She failed to do the smart thing and simply hit Paige with a long pass from midcourt. But she hangs on to it for too long and finally only gives the ball up to Paige around the free throw line. Paige scores, though it’s a more difficult finish then if Arike had passed it much sooner. This play looks to me like it encapsulates Arike’s dilemma and how difficult it is for her to change all her habits on the fly. I don’t think Paige will want to give up on her.

 

[YKCornelius]

This is just an unhinged assessment backed by no evidence, but unless she’s forced to go, I don’t expect Paige will try to leave Dallas. I also wouldn’t be surprised to hear that she wants to make it work with Arike, just as I think (along with @HuskyNan) that Arike wants this too. Events may intervene and prevent it, but on her side Paige is not a quitter. She does not give up on teammates.

On her side, Arike seems to harbor a grudge against the league (or the world) about lack of respect for her talent. The arrival of Paige could have exacerbated this, but instead she seems to have embraced this development. Perhaps she recognizes a turning point in her career and sees working with Paige as a way to make the best of it. I will be surprised if she ends up trying to leave a situation with Paige that might just retrieve her career.

I don’t care for ball-dominant players generally. But I feel for Arike in this moment. She has to rethink her game with little help from her coaches or most of her teammates. All there is for her to work with is Paige, and lucky for her Paige is the player most willing to try to make it work with her teammates. It’s a new idiom for Arike and she may not be all that comfortable in it and minor missteps abound along the way.

I’m reminded of a transition play a few games ago in which Paige tipped a pass away and it ended up in Arike’s hands. Naturally, Paige streaks down the floor and Arike follows dribbling the ball. She failed to do the smart thing and simply hit Paige with a long pass from midcourt. But she hangs on to it for too long and finally only gives the ball up to Paige around the free throw line. Paige scores, though it’s a more difficult finish then if Arike had passed it much sooner. This play looks to me like it encapsulates Arike’s dilemma and how difficult it is for her to change all her habits on the fly. I don’t think Paige will want to give up on her.

Bone Dog, I agree on both assessments that neither Paige or Arike will want to give up on the situation. That said, I believe the decision to stay or leave in Arike's case should not be left to her - even to influence. There is a lot that has to change in her game, and it requires a lot of energy, time and commitment to change from her. And the clock is ticking....

Arike's defense is horrendous. Not surprisingly (??), the Wings TV commentators have noted that Arike led the league last year in steals, and have presented that factoid as proof that she is a good defender. Utter nonsense. I have subscribed to watching WNBA games and replays on TV for the past five three years, and Arike's steals largely occur from trying to swipe at dribblers and passers - that's it. Furthermore, those deflections almost always occur before the opponent sets up their offense. It is evident to me that time and time again - including this year - the opponent is trying to isolate their guard play on Arike, knowing her defense is bad and that Arike (seemingly) doesn't want to risk picking up fouls. If Arike misses at swiping at the ball, her opponent has blown by her.

I am convinced, however, she will not be able to change on her own. AND, it will be difficult to change substantially in mid-season. I believe she and at least one dedicated coach need to sit down together and go through game film ad nauseum. She needs to somehow learn exactly what and when specific offensive and defensive actions need to be taken in order to be part of a successful team concept on both sides of the court. Presuming she learned any defense at ND, she has to be taught how to adjust that knowledge so that it translate at the faster, more talented level in the WNBA.

I think the best path for Arike is to hope that either of the expansion teams (Toronto and Portland) will have an interest in her. I can't see any of the current clubs wanting to have to deal with trying to integrate her into a team concept.

 

[WiseWillie]

This is just an unhinged assessment backed by no evidence, but unless she’s forced to go, I don’t expect Paige will try to leave Dallas. I also wouldn’t be surprised to hear that she wants to make it work with Arike, just as I think (along with @HuskyNan) that Arike wants this too. Events may intervene and prevent it, but on her side Paige is not a quitter. She does not give up on teammates.

On her side, Arike seems to harbor a grudge against the league (or the world) about lack of respect for her talent. The arrival of Paige could have exacerbated this, but instead she seems to have embraced this development. Perhaps she recognizes a turning point in her career and sees working with Paige as a way to make the best of it. I will be surprised if she ends up trying to leave a situation with Paige that might just retrieve her career.

I don’t care for ball-dominant players generally. But I feel for Arike in this moment. She has to rethink her game with little help from her coaches or most of her teammates. All there is for her to work with is Paige, and lucky for her Paige is the player most willing to try to make it work with her teammates. It’s a new idiom for Arike and she may not be all that comfortable in it and minor missteps abound along the way.

I’m reminded of a transition play a few games ago in which Paige tipped a pass away and it ended up in Arike’s hands. Naturally, Paige streaks down the floor and Arike follows dribbling the ball. She failed to do the smart thing and simply hit Paige with a long pass from midcourt. But she hangs on to it for too long and finally only gives the ball up to Paige around the free throw line. Paige scores, though it’s a more difficult finish then if Arike had passed it much sooner. This play looks to me like it encapsulates Arike’s dilemma and how difficult it is for her to change all her habits on the fly. I don’t think Paige will want to give up on her.

BD, I think you have described the current situation Erike vis a vis Paige pretty darn well. Nothin more to add except that if ever there was a player to depend on for helping a team it is Paige. She is the consummate teammate always pushing herself to improve and striving for the best in herself and her teammates.

 

[Scud49]

 

[baggerbob]

This is just an unhinged assessment backed by no evidence, but unless she’s forced to go, I don’t expect Paige will try to leave Dallas. I also wouldn’t be surprised to hear that she wants to make it work with Arike, just as I think (along with @HuskyNan) that Arike wants this too. Events may intervene and prevent it, but on her side Paige is not a quitter. She does not give up on teammates.

On her side, Arike seems to harbor a grudge against the league (or the world) about lack of respect for her talent. The arrival of Paige could have exacerbated this, but instead she seems to have embraced this development. Perhaps she recognizes a turning point in her career and sees working with Paige as a way to make the best of it. I will be surprised if she ends up trying to leave a situation with Paige that might just retrieve her career.

I don’t care for ball-dominant players generally. But I feel for Arike in this moment. She has to rethink her game with little help from her coaches or most of her teammates. All there is for her to work with is Paige, and lucky for her Paige is the player most willing to try to make it work with her teammates. It’s a new idiom for Arike and she may not be all that comfortable in it and minor missteps abound along the way.

I’m reminded of a transition play a few games ago in which Paige tipped a pass away and it ended up in Arike’s hands. Naturally, Paige streaks down the floor and Arike follows dribbling the ball. She failed to do the smart thing and simply hit Paige with a long pass from midcourt. But she hangs on to it for too long and finally only gives the ball up to Paige around the free throw line. Paige scores, though it’s a more difficult finish then if Arike had passed it much sooner. This play looks to me like it encapsulates Arike’s dilemma and how difficult it is for her to change all her habits on the fly. I don’t think Paige will want to give up on her.

As much as I don't like the way Arike has always played, I have to look at a player like Loyd.
When she had teammates like Sue and Stewie, who both were always looking for the best play, she was very good as a role player.
Then when the burden of being the star was thrust on her she didn't measure up.
It probably is going to take some time, but eventually she should fit in at Las Vegas.

 

[fireford]

Shirley Temple-flavored Gatorade anyone?

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