PAC dysfunction

[nelsonmuntz]

Pac-12 bylaws:

Withdrawal.
No member shall deliver a notice of withdrawal to the Conference in the period beginning on July 24, 2011, and ending on August 1, 2024; provided, that if any member does deliver a notice of withdrawal prior to August 1, 2024, in violation of this chapter, the Conference shall be entitled to an injunction and other equitable relief to prevent such breach, and if a court of competent jurisdiction shall deny the Conference such injunctive relief, the Conference shall be entitled to retain all the media and sponsorship rights in the multi-player video distribution (MPVD) and telecommunications/wireless categories of the member purporting to withdraw through August 1, 2024, even if the member is then a member of another conference or an independent school for some or all intercollegiate sports competitions. Additionally, if a member delivers notice of withdrawal in violation of this chapter, the member’s representative to the CEO Group shall automatically cease to be a member of the CEO Group and shall cease to have the right to vote on any matter before the CEO Group.


So I guess the question is what constitutes a notice of withdrawal. I'd say the schools have done enough as is, but I guess courts will decide.

It sounds like a functional grant of rights through August 1, 2024 ... so WSU and OSU own the media rights to all the other schools for the 2023-24 season?

Based on the section above, I think PJ is right. It looks like the Pac 12 schools breached their own Bylaws when they left. WSU and OSU appear to be asserting that the other members gave notice of withdrawal in violation of the bylaws. The other schools having signed with another conference is a pretty good fact pattern for WSU and OSU. Unless there is something else to work with, they are probably getting their injunction, although their rights will be limited as the only two surviving members until the litigation is settled. The assets within the Pac 12, including the 23-24 media rights, NCAA units, and whatever cash was left in the bank (I saw one estimate of $20 million) appears to be on their way to Oregon State and Washington State, eventually.

There has to be more to this story. I have no doubt that several of the schools are run by idiots, but I can't see Stanford and Cal making a mistake this big. Getting cute with the withdrawal provisions was a really stupid move if that is what happened. They should have voted as a group to amend them before they went their separate ways.

If the schools are literally leaving like $250 to $300 million in total for Oregon State and Washington State, then turning down the Apple deal will turn into one of the stupidest decisions in the history of college sports.

 

[Tfoyle]

All the schools taking a discount for BIG and ACC need a subsidy

 

[HartbeatHusky]

We need to call the mwc / pac 2 and get in as football only. Call umass or army up and see if they can join. Alternate schedule so pac 16 has a noon game each week. Make a 9 game sch 4 home 4 away one rivalry (umass or army)

I don't think we need to call the MWC but we definitely should be making contact with the WSU and OSU. UConn and UMass football could join immediately once it's established that they are the sole remaining voting members of the PAC.

 

[huskymedic]

Pac-12 bylaws:

Withdrawal.
No member shall deliver a notice of withdrawal to the Conference in the period beginning on July 24, 2011, and ending on August 1, 2024; provided, that if any member does deliver a notice of withdrawal prior to August 1, 2024, in violation of this chapter, the Conference shall be entitled to an injunction and other equitable relief to prevent such breach, and if a court of competent jurisdiction shall deny the Conference such injunctive relief, the Conference shall be entitled to retain all the media and sponsorship rights in the multi-player video distribution (MPVD) and telecommunications/wireless categories of the member purporting to withdraw through August 1, 2024, even if the member is then a member of another conference or an independent school for some or all intercollegiate sports competitions. Additionally, if a member delivers notice of withdrawal in violation of this chapter, the member’s representative to the CEO Group shall automatically cease to be a member of the CEO Group and shall cease to have the right to vote on any matter before the CEO Group.


So I guess the question is what constitutes a notice of withdrawal. I'd say the schools have done enough as is, but I guess courts will decide.

 

[Tfoyle]

This is great. Who would have thought that in the short term OSU and WSU could be the most financially successful schools.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I am surprised he does not just point to the Bylaws. Why even bring up precedent? Precedent is not a great foundation for a lawsuit other than it helps establish that the other members interpreted the agreement the same way as OSU and WSU are interpreting it now, but they can always come up with some other interpretation that explains what happened and justifies them remaining on the Board of the Pac 12. I wonder if there is another document out there that makes the withdrawal process or rules more vague, because I would not want to lean on precedent as they seem to be doing. I also would not have sued the Commissioner. He should be an ally to WSU and OSH, so why sue him?

This makes BCU's and Miami's Big East departure look like a love-in.

 

[Tfoyle]

I think OSU and WSU should just vote in UConn and UMass as football members. Have complete disregard for other schools.

 

[CL82]

That’s the smartest thing to do is to hang onto the PAC brand . If you own the brand you can claim the history. Our biggest mistake was giving away the brand. The C7 didn’t deserve a dime in fact they should have paid a reduced exit fee.for damages .
In any event when the Big East dissolved , There were various estimates of $70-100 million in the coffers . Significant *Exit fee money , and a huge amount of Basketball tournament money as the old Big East was the first in those earnings . Earning 23 units in 2011 alone . The vast majority earned by the football schools . This years 15 units earned was considered fantastic.
New schools got a bonus but , UConn , Cincinnati and USF received the bulk . As the damaged parties .
* Even TCU paid $5,000,000 and only attended 1 meetings
I believe everyone else paid at least $10,000,000 each which is cheap.
The current AAC is 15,000,000 and the MW $35,000,000
My understanding is no PAC team paid a dime ,due to a loophole in the contract . If they’re fighting for the crumbs then they should be called out as scumbags.

The Big East was never dissolved.

 

[JeepCSC]

I’m thinking since the PAC schools leaving are performing their last season with PAC regular-season games and competing for PAC championships, OSU and Wazzou won’t be able to stop media payments. But I think the two have a strong case for keeping any remainder assets. The others thinking they could simply dissolve the conference is gross.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I’m thinking since the PAC schools leaving are performing their last season with PAC regular-season games and competing for PAC championships, OSU and Wazzou won’t be able to stop media payments. But I think the two have a strong case for keeping any remainder assets. The others thinking they could simply dissolve the conference is gross.

Did you read something different than I read in the Bylaws? Why can't the Pac 12 stop media payments?

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Oregon, UW had 'inbound interest' to join Big Ten

Big Ten commissioner Tony Petitti cited "inbound interest" from Oregon and Washington among the league's reasons for adding the schools.

www.espn.com

This doesn't help Oregon or Washington.

 

[huskymedic]

 

[JeepCSC]

Did you read something different than I read in the Bylaws? Why can't the Pac 12 stop media payments?

I think they could try. But my non-legalese mind feels like a case could be made that they filled their performance appearances for the Pac and likely would get paid. Though the threat of the PAC schools possibly losing could bring them to the negotiating table. At least that's what I feel like they'd do on the Good Wife haha.

But the voting rights feel cut-and-dry. The Pac schools can't vote themselves bonuses on the way out.

 

[Kolumbo]

It's all pure gold. Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State were members of the PAC virtually since about 1915, 1917. Now everyone is chasing $$$ and these fools are going to be stuck in legal battles. Not one person at these universities is using any common sense or logic, it is all a race to the bank. There is zero reason these 4 universities shouldn't be in the same athletic conference, and it's happening all over the country. What a bunch of idiots.

 

[SU1968]

Sure, but they are also is considerable value in the exit fees. It's an interesting question as to whether or not the conference is dissolved. I would argue that the exit of the first two likely didn't dissolve the conference and immediately created a potential asset of their exit fees for the other teams including the four corner states. Whether or not the exit of the four corner schools is sufficient to cause dissolution is an interesting question. If I am Washington state or Oregon state I am arguing that these were two separate events, neither of which reach the level sufficient for dissolution. Hopefully, the bylaws provide clear guidance.

Most conferences have a rule that schools lose their vote when they announce they're leaving. Maybe OSU and WSU can make the decision as a conference of two

 

[CTFAN4LIFE]

With regards to the value of keeping the PAC name alive, I am on the fence. For sports fans, I think the name is now associated with negatives including incompetence, infighting, deception, implosion, etc. To non-sports fans I suppose you could say they might still see something positive but what does that really matter in the scheme of things? Compared to the Big East brand name at the time of its demise/dismantling, at least half of the schools stayed together.

 

[KryHavok]

It's all pure gold. Oregon, Oregon State, Washington, Washington State were members of the PAC virtually since about 1915…There is zero reason these 4 universities shouldn't be in the same athletic conference, and it's happening all over the country. What a bunch of idiots.

I’ve no hate for OSU or WSU (thanks for Drew Bledsoe ), but seeing all this insanity and chaos makes me a feel a little better in that at least other “big“ schools can experience what UConn has had to deal with in terms of being left behind. Though they’ll end up okay with some cash eventually, so really, I’d wish they’d just shut up and realize they had it good riding on other PAC12 teams’ coattails.

 

[JeepCSC]

The PAC was 1/2 of the anchor to the most famous bowl game in the country. There is a ton of historical and cultural resonance in the name, even without the LA schools.

But more to the point, there is no value in the MWC name.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

There better be another document or partners agreement or something that gives Kliavkoff and more importantly, the Pac 12 General Counsel, some rationale for their behavior, or they are screwed beyond belief. Kliavkoff should have recused himself, or severely restricted his authorized activities, immediately when ASU, Arizona and Utah departed. The GC should have done the same, and demanded an outside counsel be brought in to serve as conference GC. The GC was hopelessly conflicted when the conference came apart. I can't believe he did something this stupid.

This filing is one side of the argument, and the Bylaws are the only document that is publicly available. The defendants better hope there is some other document or Board resolution that authorized this scheme to confiscate the assets of the conference, because otherwise this fact pattern is really bad for the defendants.

 

[Tfoyle]

Can OSU and WSU just add us so we have a home for football.

 

[Figurehead]

With regards to the value of keeping the PAC name alive, I am on the fence. For sports fans, I think the name is now associated with negatives including incompetence, infighting, deception, implosion, etc. To non-sports fans I suppose you could say they might still see something positive but what does that really matter in the scheme of things? Compared to the Big East brand name at the time of its demise/dismantling, at least half of the schools stayed together.

Like the Ford Edsel. It is already tainted

 

[Figurehead]

I’ve no hate for OSU or WSU (thanks for Drew Bledsoe ), but seeing all this insanity and chaos makes me a feel a little better in that at least other “big“ schools can experience what UConn has had to deal with in terms of being left behind. Though they’ll end up okay with some cash eventually, so really, I’d wish they’d just shut up and realize they had it good riding on other PAC12 teams’ coattails.

Let the courts figure it all out. I don't think the other 10 will accept nothing nor should they. Let the lawsuits and counter suits begin over the money amounts. Maybe it will all resolve itself in about two years. Freeze all the assets until the court sorts it all out and then who really wins?

 

[Kolumbo]

Our friend, Jayathi, the president of Oregon State, is wicked smaht.

Jayathi Y. Murthy is an Indian-American mechanical engineer who is the current President of Oregon State University. [1] Previously, she was the Ronald and Valerie Sugar Dean of the UCLA Henry Samueli School of Engineering and Applied Science at the University of California, Los Angeles[2] where she was also a distinguished professor. Her research interests include macroelectronics, computational fluid dynamics, heat transfer, and phase-change materials. [3] Murthy has served on the Engineering and Computer Science jury for the Infosys Prize since 2018.[4]

 

[hank970]

Let the courts figure it all out. I don't think the other 10 will accept nothing nor should they. Let the lawsuits and counter suits begin over the money amounts. Maybe it will all resolve itself in about two years. Freeze all the assets until the court sorts it all out and then who really wins?

Litigators representing both sides will win.

 

[Figurehead]

Litigators representing both sides will win.

I could see the final litigation bill in the millions. Funny when you think about it. You are sort of suing yourself suing the conference and litigating against the conference maybe in the tune of millions when all is said and done.