Our Defense | Page 2 | The Boneyard

Our Defense

I love these threads in which boneyarders talk like they know more than our coaches. These coaches eat, drink and sleep basketball. Don’t you think they actually discuss every possibility? They meet every day before practice and toss around different ideas
It’s true of course but our coaches are still trying things and will ride the hot hand in many cases as they should. This ain’t paint by the numbers. I wonder how they are going to try to get Reed and Karaban more involved in the offense.
 
Someone needs to gently remind Dan Hurley we don't have Isaiah Whaley anymore. It might be time to end the high hedge

Please keep repeating this, thank you. Both 5s aren’t very good at it, one extends and doesn’t get back all the time the other extends gets back a little more but is never in rebounding position. Add to that our help defense or at least the understanding of it is horrible. I can’t tell you how many times I see the other teams kid go to the basket, beat his guy off the dribble and the weakside defenders are clinging to their guys with no idea of jumping off to help or hey, how about picking up a charge?

They’re not good on D it’s not going to change. Change some defensive strategy, maybe even some zone? But the high hedge, lose it after 1 step out no more than that!
 
I can’t tell you how many times I see the other teams kid go to the basket, beat his guy off the dribble and the weakside defenders are clinging to their guys with no idea of jumping off to help or hey, how about picking up a charge?
Pretty sure this is a coaching philosophy decision. To not give the help D, because it would give up open 3, allowing them to attack and kick. He coaches them to stay on their men, and you are on an island defending the penetration. Hence the Iso dilemma. What Jay Wright did to us (and everyone). Against Dixon we did run a double team at times, but otherwise you need to wall up on your own. Its infuriating to see the layups without shot blocker cleaning up, due to no help D. I was yelling this 2 yrs ago but what do I know,then Danny won his first one, as the team came around. Hope it happens again?
 
Here are the Evan Miya defensive ratings for UConn:

1) McNeeley 2.37
2) Reed 1.94
3) Diarra 1.85
4) Nowell 1.80
5) Johnson 1.34
6) Karaban 1.20
7) Mahaney 0.56
8) Ross 0.19
9) Stewart -0.34
10) Ball -0.60

For comparison, Clingan was 4.16, Castle was 2.93, Diarra was 2.47 last year.

Now, the offensive ratings:
1) Karaban 4.88
2) Diara 4.45
3) Ball 4.35
4) McNeeley 3.88
5) Johnson 3.38
6) Nowell 2.96
7) Mahaney 2.78
8) Stewart 2.28
9) Ross 2.27
10) Reed 1.75

Finally, here's a comparison between Johnson and Reed rebounds per 40 minutes:

Reed 14.5 rebounds/40 minutes
Johnson 6.0 rebounds/40 minutes

In my mind, Johnson's rebounding per 40 minutes is too low.

The bottom line, this year there are a group of players with a range of strengths and weaknesses that the coaches need to figure out how to make improvements. I think the coaches probably thought they would get defensive improvement this year from a number of players, but it really hasn't happened yet. And, UConn really needs McNeeley back.
 
Pretty sure this is a coaching philosophy decision. To not give the help D, because it would give up open 3, allowing them to attack and kick. He coaches them to stay on their men, and you are on an island defending the penetration. Hence the Iso dilemma. What Jay Wright did to us (and everyone). Against Dixon we did run a double team at times, but otherwise you need to wall up on your own. Its infuriating to see the layups without shot blocker cleaning up, due to no help D. I was yelling this 2 yrs ago but what do I know,then Danny won his first one, as the team came around. Hope it happens again?

There is no coaching philosophy that would have you stay on your man when you see your teammate get beat and you can get in the lane, none. That’s defense 101 you would much rather force them to make a 3 than give them a dunk or lay in. You get in the way with hands out so passes don’t sneak by back to your guy. They’re not teaching anything different in those situations than that. If you can help you help.
 
We win by making shots. We never win because we beat the hell out of the other team.
IMO a few doses of the 2-1-2, 3-2 or Box+1 Zone intermingled with the m2m would add some differnt looks and cause the opposng offenses some difficulty in adjusting. And, as soon as they adjust, switch back to m2m.
Sir, you are preaching to the choir!(at least a few choir members).
Not holding my breath though.
 
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I agree that mixing it up could help create some indecision for the opposition. Basically be a man to man defense but at times surprise the opponent with a zone. Don’t care what type just the one we are best at in practice.

My point being is how much lower in defensive metrics until we decide to make some tweaks to what is clearly not working.
Exactly
 
There is no coaching philosophy that would have you stay on your man when you see your teammate get beat and you can get in the lane, none. That’s defense 101 you would much rather force them to make a 3 than give them a dunk or lay in. You get in the way with hands out so passes don’t sneak by back to your guy. They’re not teaching anything different in those situations than that. If you can help you help.
you ever hear of Shell drill? its the defensive 101 drill that anyone who has ever coached knows is a cornerstone of instruction. It shows that if you are two passes away, that you have a foot in the lane to be available for help. We don't usually do this (other than the hedge, when the 4 man is on way to paint to cover 5 man roll). Hence no one "can get into lane", bc they are in deny position on their men, irrespective of being 2 passes away/foot in paint. It's a choice. Quick, name me the last charge you remember from a help defender. I'll wait. We are coached to stay on shooters at 3 pt line, so usually no 2 pass away-help in lane. During the tourney we do change this up, most notably against Arkansas
 
you ever hear of Shell drill? its the defensive 101 drill that anyone who has ever coached knows is a cornerstone of instruction. It shows that if you are two passes away, that you have a foot in the lane to be available for help. We don't usually do this (other than the hedge, when the 4 man is on way to paint to cover 5 man roll). Hence no one "can get into lane", bc they are in deny position on their men, irrespective of being 2 passes away/foot in paint. It's a choice. Quick, name me the last charge you remember from a help defender. I'll wait. We are coached to stay on shooters at 3 pt line, so usually no 2 pass away-help in lane. During the tourney we do change this up, most notably against Arkansas

Please stop it’s because we suck at reading help hence never on time to take a charge simple enough? . Any team on earth wants their players to leave their guy when they can HELP stop on a blow by whether it’s cut off or jab and retreat to make them throw a pass. This hasn’t changed ever and if you don’t know how or when to help then you’re not a good defender period. I was taught this at 11-12 years old and took charges my whole hoops life off of it. Our guys have their backs to the ball,, aren’t ready to help and are caught off guard so often it’s frustrating that’s my point. Our guys helped a ton last year even with Clingan back there, Cam being very good off the ball.
 
IMO a few doses of the 2-1-2, 3-2 or Box+1 Zone intermingled with the m2m would add some differnt looks and cause the opposng offenses some difficulty in adjusting. And, as soon as they adjust, switch back to m2m.
The 3-2 is by far the easiest zone for a team to score against, along with the 1-3-1.
 
Please stop it’s because we suck at reading help hence never on time to take a charge simple enough? . Any team on earth wants their players to leave their guy when they can HELP stop on a blow by whether it’s cut off or jab and retreat to make them throw a pass. This hasn’t changed ever and if you don’t know how or when to help then you’re not a good defender period. I was taught this at 11-12 years old and took charges my whole hoops life off of it. Our guys have their backs to the ball,, aren’t ready to help and are caught off guard so often it’s frustrating that’s my point. Our guys helped a ton last year even with Clingan back there, Cam being very good off the ball.
Very true about our guys turning their backs to the ball. One of the reasons we give up so many back doors
 
IMO a few doses of the 2-1-2, 3-2 or Box+1 Zone intermingled with the m2m would add some differnt looks and cause the opposng offenses some difficulty in adjusting. And, as soon as they adjust, switch back to m2m.
I know Hurley hates that, but Calhoun did it when needed. This team needs to be harder to game plan against. We're too easy to attack. Not even close to as good as the last two years.
 
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Please stop it’s because we suck at reading help hence never on time to take a charge simple enough? . Any team on earth wants their players to leave their guy when they can HELP stop on a blow by whether it’s cut off or jab and retreat to make them throw a pass. This hasn’t changed ever and if you don’t know how or when to help then you’re not a good defender period. I was taught this at 11-12 years old and took charges my whole hoops life off of it. Our guys have their backs to the ball,, aren’t ready to help and are caught off guard so often it’s frustrating that’s my point. Our guys helped a ton last year even with Clingan back there, Cam being very good off the ball.
I have to pay more attention to our team defense but I’m shocked to hear our guys having their backs turned to the ball a lot. You’re suppose to see ball and man at all times unless cutting is happening.

Yes, help defense should also be a thing with proper rotating when doing so making drivers make the longest pass possible in the rotations. Danny has more than proven he’s an elite defensive coach though so I don’t like questioning him much there.
 
I have to pay more attention to our team defense but I’m shocked to hear our guys having their backs turned to the ball a lot. You’re suppose to see ball and man at all times unless cutting is happening.

Yes, help defense should also be a thing with proper rotating when doing so making drivers make the longest pass possible in the rotations. Danny has more than proven he’s an elite defensive coach though so I don’t like questioning him much there.

I didn’t question Dan at all not sure if that’s what you perceived. It’s the players, their obvious shortcomings on that end.
 
I didn’t question Dan at all not sure if that’s what you perceived. It’s the players, their obvious shortcomings on that end.
Yeah there’s a lot not to like about our players on that end. Solo especially seems to have a bad defensive stance and plays way too up and down and plays his man straight up.

He has no leverage on his slides and doesn’t force his man to any side specifically. Those things are very coachable though as long as he’s willing to give the effort to do it.
 
I know Hurley hates that, but Calhoun did it when needed. This team needs to be harder to game plan against. We're too easy to attack. Not even close to as good as the last two years.
It's not even that Hurley hates it, it's that every time he has tried it for a few possessions it's been an unmitigated disaster
 
Please stop it’s because we suck at reading help hence never on time to take a charge simple enough? . Any team on earth wants their players to leave their guy when they can HELP stop on a blow by whether it’s cut off or jab and retreat to make them throw a pass. This hasn’t changed ever and if you don’t know how or when to help then you’re not a good defender period. I was taught this at 11-12 years old and took charges my whole hoops life off of it. Our guys have their backs to the ball,, aren’t ready to help and are caught off guard so often it’s frustrating that’s my point. Our guys helped a ton last year even with Clingan back there, Cam being very good off the ball.
Just a question about this (charges). Haven't they changed the charge rule so it is next to impossible to get a charge called? I think I heard the announcers talking about this a few games back. Or is this only on banging into someone when "backing them down".
In any event you hardly see anyone trying to take charges like a few years back. It seems like it has to be set up and stationary when the ballhandler is like 10 feet away.
If the Big East is such a physical league why is defense so ticky tacky?
 
Please stop it’s because we suck at reading help hence never on time to take a charge simple enough? . Any team on earth wants their players to leave their guy when they can HELP stop on a blow by whether it’s cut off or jab and retreat to make them throw a pass. This hasn’t changed ever and if you don’t know how or when to help then you’re not a good defender period. I was taught this at 11-12 years old and took charges my whole hoops life off of it. Our guys have their backs to the ball,, aren’t ready to help
Right lol. You're back is never to the ball if you are playing shell D correctly. We clearly don't. Man to man looks like a zone matchup even at times if you are doing it correctly. Unless the coaching is telling your players to stay in deny & to take away 3, regardless of how many passes you are away from the ball. Believe what you want. You think our entire defense this year can't play help D. Clearly often players have backs to ball, and its never fixed?? I say we are in deny, taking away 3 pt line, therefore shell man help principles are out window (other than your 5 man). Just watch next game, and see if we are in deny or foot in paint 2 passes away to provide help. I'll meet you back here
 
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Just a question about this (charges). Haven't they changed the charge rule so it is next to impossible to get a charge called? I think I heard the announcers talking about this a few games back. Or is this only on banging into someone when "backing them down".
In any event you hardly see anyone trying to take charges like a few years back. It seems like it has to be set up and stationary when the ballhandler is like 10 feet away.
If the Big East is such a physical league why is defense so ticky tacky?

Not sure of the Dennis maybe. But if you read a play and get square they can’t change that.
 
Right lol. You're back is never to the ball if you are playing shell D correctly. We clearly don't. Man to man looks like a zone matchup even at times if you are doing it correctly. Unless the coaching is telling your players to stay in deny & to take away 3, regardless of how many passes you are away from the ball. Believe what you want. You think our entire defense this year can't play help D. Clearly often players have backs to ball, and its never fixed?? I say we are in deny, taking away 3 pt line, therefore shell man help principles are out window (other than your 5 man). Just watch next game, and see if we are in deny or foot in paint 2 passes away to provide help. I'll meet you back here

It doesn’t matter what you’re in deny or anything the simple part of the game called help defense is always part of the game. You don’t play deny defense or any defense without knowing where the damn ball is. And by no means will a coach ever get pissed if you leave your guy to help when solo ball is getting beat off the dribble yet again.

Agree to disagree I’m done!
 
Just a question about this (charges). Haven't they changed the charge rule so it is next to impossible to get a charge called? I think I heard the announcers talking about this a few games back. Or is this only on banging into someone when "backing them down".
In any event you hardly see anyone trying to take charges like a few years back. It seems like it has to be set up and stationary when the ballhandler is like 10 feet away.
If the Big East is such a physical league why is defense so ticky tacky?

Actually they are saying it's extremely difficult for the help defender to get a charge call, the point of emphasis is to call it a blocking foul now in those situations
 
Yeah there’s a lot not to like about our players on that end. Solo especially seems to have a bad defensive stance and plays way too up and down and plays his man straight up.

He has no leverage on his slides and doesn’t force his man to any side specifically. Those things are very coachable though as long as he’s willing to give the effort to do it.
The plan was to force his man to the left… every time he touched the ball. Maybe that needs more discussion.
 
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The plan was to force his man to the left… every time he touched the ball. Maybe that needs more discussion.
Thanks. Too bad TV commentators don't seem to know this or are just thinking about something else.
 
It's not even that Hurley hates it, it's that every time he has tried it for a few possessions it's been an unmitigated disaster
Because he doesn't practice it. Put the time in and I think the guys can execute it. But that takes away from working on the man defense, which is challenging for us because of the high hedge.
 
Actually they are saying it's extremely difficult for the help defender to get a charge call, the point of emphasis is to call it a blocking foul now in those situations
Which I don't like at all. I get the need to stop flopping. On the other hand, the shoulder to the chest should just be called a charge even if the defender doesn't fall down. Those guys fall because otherwise it never gets called. Rules overly favor the offense.
 
I think we recruited a few too many guys we thought Hurley could coach up on defense and also just had some bad luck with recruiting misses.

I doubt that anyone thought with Solo's athleticism and length he would be a bottom 1% defender in all of high-major ball that can't rebound. He just isn't learning to process fast enough.

I don't think anyone realized Mahaney we were recruiting Joey California 2.0 when we signed Mahaney.

No one thought Samson would be a generationally bad rebounder for a 6'11 athletic freak.

And then, of course, Stewart and Ross are improving, but just not fast enough to make up for these other failures. Both are probably behind where we thought they'd be.

We play a defense that requires an extremely high IQ. We don't have the personnel.
 
I love these threads in which boneyarders talk like they know more than our coaches. These coaches eat, drink and sleep basketball. Don’t you think they actually discuss every possibility? They meet every day before practice and toss around different ideas
Based on the past few years and comments directly from Hurley? I do think we sometimes see things they don’t, or because we aren’t in the locker room are more willing to try some different things. Of course some of our ideas are bad or wouldn’t work but Hurley has come around to the Yard way of thinking more than once, to our success.

I feel like Dan Hurley tends to get stuck with a plan and can be slow to pivot when it’s not working, especially when it comes to players not fitting. Reed should not hedge, IMO, for example.

I have faith in our coaching but it doesn’t mean I always think they are foolproof either.
 
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