OT: The Brow requests a trade

[Lefty2one]

Ok, I've really talked myself into the Knicks having the best package to offer – contingent upon them doing some pre-agency negotiation w/ KD (who is a free agent, and there's no way he's going back to GSW).

• Kristaps
• Knox
• Trier
• Lee (more on him in a minute)
• 2019 1st (top 3 guaranteed at the moment)

That trumps anything the Lakers or even the Celtics could offer, largely because Porzingis is better than any of the available players on their rosters, partially because Knox, Trier & the 2019 pick are all young players with upside, and partially because Lee actually gives the Pels flexibility to go get a second-level star who wants out.

As it stands, New Orleans have two significant expirings on next year's roster in Solomon Hill ($13.3m) and E'Twuan Moore (8.7m, but I think he'll be traded in the next week). Getting Lee would give them flexibility and the chance to match numbers for any team who wants to get rid of a big contract.

They need to do something like this because they're absolutely not going to get any high-level player in free agency, and if things go right they'll be too good to get a top pick w/ their own. But having $25m of expirings and a couple of good young players would put them in the mix for guys like Wiggins or Otto Porter.

If I was NOP I would absolutely tell the Knicks and Celtics to sit tight and refuse to deal with the Lakers until the summer. I hope that's what happens.

If Dell Demps pulls off that deal Springfield should start producing his bronze bust the following morning, especially if the Knicks land a top three pick in the lottery. Off the top of my head, that would be the best return in the league's history of trading stars and by a pretty wide margin too.

That leaves the Knicks with...

Frank (who I think will be good eventually but they need a vet PG)
Hardaway Jr
Durant
AD
Mitchell Robinson

No depth and their cap space is shot but the 2020 FA class is blah anyway. Tough to see them adding the much-coveted third star.

Porzingis's contract situation throws a wrench into this though. The Knicks haven't offered him his max rookie extension in order to retain flexibility this summer. KP once called the Pelican's arena his least favorite place to play in the NBA. He absolutely doesn't want to go to NO. Although it would be extremely risky for a 7'3 23-year-old coming off knee surgery, he could sign an offer sheet elsewhere for one year. He can reject any long-term offers. Sure, the Knicks can match it and then trade him but if NO knows KP is walking in summer 2020 the deal probably falls through.

 

[Matrim55]

If Dell Demps pulls off that deal Springfield should start producing his bronze bust the following morning, especially if the Knicks land a top three pick in the lottery. Off the top of my head, that would be the best return in the league's history of trading stars and by a pretty wide margin too.

I mean, he'd be the best player to get traded since Kareem. It absolutely should be a massive haul.

And while you're right that they wouldn't have a true third star, they would have THJ's expiring and Frank to try to get someone in the 22 million range. It can be done.

 

[Walker11]

If Dell Demps pulls off that deal Springfield should start producing his bronze bust the following morning, especially if the Knicks land a top three pick in the lottery. Off the top of my head, that would be the best return in the league's history of trading stars and by a pretty wide margin too.

That leaves the Knicks with...

Frank (who I think will be good eventually but they need a vet PG)
Hardaway Jr
Durant
AD
Mitchell Robinson

No depth and their cap space is shot but the 2020 FA class is blah anyway. Tough to see them adding the much-coveted third star.

Porzingis's contract situation throws a wrench into this though. The Knicks haven't offered him his max rookie extension in order to retain flexibility this summer. KP once called the Pelican's arena his least favorite place to play in the NBA. He absolutely doesn't want to go to NO. Although it would be extremely risky for a 7'3 23-year-old coming off knee surgery, he could sign an offer sheet elsewhere for one year. He can reject any long-term offers. Sure, the Knicks can match it and then trade him but if NO knows KP is walking in summer 2020 the deal probably falls through.

If the Knicks win the lottery I don't think they need to add Porzingis. A young star to sell tickets is absolutely what NO wants. Zion would be an absolute home run. Now what the Knicks would do after that, who the hell knows.

 

[superjohn]

I mean, he'd be the best player to get traded since Kareem. It absolutely should be a massive haul.

And while you're right that they wouldn't have a true third star, they would have THJ's expiring and Frank to try to get someone in the 22 million range. It can be done.

Who is the best player to get traded since Kareem?

 

[Lefty2one]

Who is the best player to get traded since Kareem?

If we're being pedantic a- holes the answer is LeBron.

 

[Matrim55]

Who is the best player to get traded since Kareem?

In retrospect, probably Harden. But when Harden was traded people didn't know he'd be THIS.

Honestly there's not a clear answer. Davis is an MVP-level player just entering his prime. How many times have guys like that been traded?

 

[Lefty2one]

In retrospect, probably Harden. But when Harden was traded people didn't know he'd be THIS.

Yeah, it can't be Harden given what he was at the time. He hadn't even made an All-Star team. Paul George was a x4 All Star, made All-NBA and All-Defense. Butler and Cousins were both well-accomplished too.

The answer might be Kevin Garnett though.

 

[superjohn]

In retrospect, probably Harden. But when Harden was traded people didn't know he'd be THIS.

Honestly there's not a clear answer. Davis is an MVP-level player just entering his prime. How many times have guys like that been traded?

Lebron and Shaq were free agents? Were basically all the huge moves, signings and not trades?

 

[Matrim55]

Lebron and Shaq were free agents? Were basically all the huge moves, signings and not trades?

Basically all free agents who either outright signed w/ a new team, or free agent who pushed for sign-and-trades in order to get supermax deals.

The answer might be Kevin Garnett though.

Yeah that might be the one. Garnett was traded for:

Al Jefferson (21-year-old C who'd averaged 9p/7r in his 2nd year in the league), Ryan Gomes (23-year-old PF who'd been 2nd team all rookie), Gerald Green (averaged 10p as a 21-year-old in his second year), Bassy Telfair (throw-in), Theo Ratliff's expiring contract & two lottery picks.

Does the Knicks package I came up with top that? Not sure.

 

[Lefty2one]

Lebron and Shaq were free agents? Were basically all the huge moves, signings and not trades?

LeBron was traded to Miami, technically.

July 10, 2010: Traded by the Cleveland Cavaliers to the Miami Heat for a 2011 2nd round draft pick (Milan Macvan was later selected), a 2012 2nd round draft pick (Jae Crowder was later selected), a 2013 1st round draft pick (Nemanja Nedovic was later selected) and a 2016 1st round draft pick (Timothe Luwawu-Cabarrot was later selected). Cleveland also received a trade exception from Miami. Cleveland had the option to swap 1st round draft picks with Miami in 2012 but did not do so.

 

[Walker11]

Basically all free agents who either outright signed w/ a new team, or free agent who pushed for sign-and-trades in order to get supermax deals.


Yeah that might be the one. Garnett was traded for:

Al Jefferson (21-year-old C who'd averaged 9p/7r in his 2nd year in the league), Ryan Gomes (23-year-old PF who'd been 2nd team all rookie), Gerald Green (averaged 10p as a 21-year-old in his second year), Bassy Telfair (throw-in), Theo Ratliff's expiring contract & two lottery picks.

Does the Knicks package I came up with top that? Not sure.

I think the Knicks offer could blow that out of the water but it of course depends on where the pick lands/when the trade happens.

 

[Lefty2one]

Yeah that proposed Knicks offer is much better than what Boston gave up for KG.

 

[nomar]

Chris Haynes is reporting that the Celtics aren't one of Davis's desired destinations because of growing buzz that Kyrie doesn't return. We have a long way to go but he is a good reporter.

Transparent propaganda that he reported because the source is valuable to him.

Doesn't pass the smell test. Growing buzz? What does that mean? Why would AD care about that manufactured rumor given that he gets to make a decision AFTER Kyrie does?

 

[Mr. French]

I was saying the same stuff last postseason when people were going nuts over him. Pump the brakes.

I'm not disagreeing with any of what you said but plenty of people out there think he's the next Durant or the second-best young player in the league after Luka. He's not that. He's maybe your #2 on a championship team but probably #3. Even in this thread Celtic fans think he's their franchise cornerstone and #1.

I was right there with you. Good player, but he’s not untouchable.

 

[the Q]

If zinger is on the table it’s game over. However, Knick’s wouldn’t fit that description of a contender if they can’t make the deal without Zinger.

They need to make the deal and keep zinger imo. Otherwise they’re not really much better than NO.

 

[the Q]

Yeah that proposed Knicks offer is much better than what Boston gave up for KG.

People forget how highly regarded Jefferson was at that time.

But he wasn’t zinger.

But that Miny pick was expected to be a very high pick and they wanted it back. It was easily the best Star package so far at the time of the deal. How they aged it could be a different story.

 

[Lefty2one]

People forget how highly regarded Jefferson was at that time.

But he wasn't zinger.

Right, he was the prize of the deal. He was valuable enough that it gave Ainge pause before making the deal. Some Celtics fans didn't like the move.

 

[uconnbaseball]

What I really love about him is that his highlights are so fun to watch. He's like the anti-Harden that way.

I wanted to see Doncic and Jokik on the same team. That would be some sick basketball.

You saw Jokic full court pass a little while back? Unreal.

If I am AD, I am hoping Denver gets in on the sweepstakes. Jokic-AD would be a legendary pairing.

 

[Deepster]

You realize how much better AD is than George, Cousins, Butler? An order of magnitude. He's a generational player. A franchise altering player.

You really think he's a "generational" player? I guess I just don't see it. He reminds me of Tracy McGrady. Looks great. Really talented. But just not going to put a team on his back and make them a winner. Take guys like Dirk or Iverson or Garnett. I just feel like Davis sleepwalks his way into his box score every night.

 

[Lefty2one]

A bit amusing by comparison's sake...

EDIT: I don't know why the hell it's embedding the video instead of linking to the article. Anyway, Toronto is throwing their hat into the ring...

NBA - Sportsnet.ca

On paper, it seems like the Raptors have enough to put together a compelling package. Pascal Siakam, the emerging star who has a legitimate chance of winning the NBA’s Most Improved Player award, figures to be the starting point in negotiations. OG Anunoby is an additional young piece with intriguing potential, and point guard Delon Wright would be another name to float along. Draft-pick considerations would also likely be included as the Pelicans look to the future, and Toronto has veterans like Serge Ibaka and Jonas Valanciunas that would need to be added to balance salaries — a necessity in NBA trades.

 

[the Q]

A bit amusing by comparison's sake...

EDIT: I don't know why the hell it's embedding the video instead of linking to the article. Anyway, Toronto is throwing their hat into the ring...

NBA - Sportsnet.ca

On paper, it seems like the Raptors have enough to put together a compelling package. Pascal Siakam, the emerging star who has a legitimate chance of winning the NBA’s Most Improved Player award, figures to be the starting point in negotiations. OG Anunoby is an additional young piece with intriguing potential, and point guard Delon Wright would be another name to float along. Draft-pick considerations would also likely be included as the Pelicans look to the future, and Toronto has veterans like Serge Ibaka and Jonas Valanciunas that would need to be added to balance salaries — a necessity in NBA trades.

I’d love Toronto to go all in.

 

[uconnbill]

You really think he's a "generational" player? I guess I just don't see it. He reminds me of Tracy McGrady. Looks great. Really talented. But just not going to put a team on his back and make them a winner. Take guys like Dirk or Iverson or Garnett. I just feel like Davis sleepwalks his way into his box score every night.

It is his defense that separates him from what you are stating.

 

[Huskyforlife]

Toronto’s problem is they don’t have many intriguing young pieces outside of siakam. Wright and OG are nice role players/backups, but we know New Orleans is going to want multiple young/talented prospects and picks. Davis to Toronto would definitely shake the NBA though.

 

[navery12]

Ok, I've really talked myself into the Knicks having the best package to offer – contingent upon them doing some pre-agency negotiation w/ KD (who is a free agent, and there's no way he's going back to GSW).

• Kristaps
• Knox
• Trier
• Lee (more on him in a minute)
• 2019 1st (top 3 guaranteed at the moment)

That trumps anything the Lakers or even the Celtics could offer, largely because Porzingis is better than any of the available players on their rosters, partially because Knox, Trier & the 2019 pick are all young players with upside, and partially because Lee actually gives the Pels flexibility to go get a second-level star who wants out.

As it stands, New Orleans have two significant expirings on next year's roster in Solomon Hill ($13.3m) and E'Twuan Moore (8.7m, but I think he'll be traded in the next week). Getting Lee would give them flexibility and the chance to match numbers for any team who wants to get rid of a big contract.

They need to do something like this because they're absolutely not going to get any high-level player in free agency, and if things go right they'll be too good to get a top pick w/ their own. But having $25m of expirings and a couple of good young players would put them in the mix for guys like Wiggins or Otto Porter.

If I was NOP I would absolutely tell the Knicks and Celtics to sit tight and refuse to deal with the Lakers until the summer. I hope that's what happens.

As a Knicks fan I want no part of that deal

 

[the Q]

I read they can’t trsdr trier so it’s really Knox the high first l, Mitchell and the Frenchman plus cap fodder