OT: Poll--Who are you taking #1 in the draft?

[JSM1970]

Agree

Not the 2018 Nets pick, no way, maybe the C's #1

Chance for Porter Jr, Bamba or Ayton next year with Nets pick

The '18 Brooklyn pick is worth WAYYYYYY more than Dre is.

First off, he had a down year. His value is not anywhere near where it used to be -- when it would've justified a deal like that.

Second, the value of a car is never more high than right before it's driven off the lot -- Bamba or Ayton will have much higher value. While the Celts don't know if they'll be in the top 2, they've got as good a chance as anybody.

The Pistons would fall all over themselves trying to accept Dre-for-BK2018 straight up before the Celts had second thoughts.

 

[intlzncster]

I don't quite see it with Ball. He'll be really good, but I don't see how he'll be better than Ball. He's like Rondo without the defensive ability, but a bit more shooting (though with a form that is suspect as of now for the NBA).

I mean, watching him get worked by Fox in the tournament this year said something to me.

 

[Rocktheworld]

I've seen a decent case made for trading the pick. The main premise is based on the Celtics wanting to beat LeBron now and not waiting 4 years for a downtick. How many productive years does Horford have left? Is Fultz the difference-maker right now? Does he slip right in to the role as the #1 guy, whereas Lonzo won't as he will be a facilitator and spot-up shooter.

Some say they trade the pick and a piece for a Butler-caliber player.

 

[JSM1970]

I get the concept if they're committed to IT longer term

Move #1 and Crowder for Butler

Don't like it, rather build around Fultz, Hayward, Horford, Rozier, Nets 2018 #1

I've seen a decent case made for trading the pick. The main premise is based on the Celtics wanting to beat LeBron now and not waiting 4 years for a downtick. How many productive years does Horford have left? Is Fultz the difference-maker right now? Does he slip right in to the role as the #1 guy, whereas Lonzo won't as he will be a facilitator and spot-up shooter.

Some say they trade the pick and a piece for a Butler-caliber player.

 

[intlzncster]

I've seen a decent case made for trading the pick. The main premise is based on the Celtics wanting to beat LeBron now and not waiting 4 years for a downtick. How many productive years does Horford have left? Is Fultz the difference-maker right now? Does he slip right in to the role as the #1 guy, whereas Lonzo won't as he will be a facilitator and spot-up shooter.

Some say they trade the pick and a piece for a Butler-caliber player.

Sad as this is, I think trying to beat Lebron right now is a mug's game. C's should be in development mode, Horford's shelf life be damned.

 

[Rocktheworld]

I get the concept if they're committed to IT longer term

Move #1 and Crowder for Butler

Don't like it, rather build around Fultz, Hayward, Horford, Rozier, Nets 2018 #1

Thomas just can't be the ball-dominant guard. He's a shot maker and someone who can shoot or fake and drive from the perimeter to score off a kick-out, or can make the second pass. He's not and can't be expected to be a shot creator; it's physical reality.

That's the main skeptic's point regarding the taking of Fultz; he needs to immediately slip in to the system as the #1 guy and produce like a #1 guy has to. If anyone can make the transition a little easier in the East it's probably Stevens, but the idea is that a Butler could step right in and make the kind of difference that would at least be LeBron's best challenge in the East since he was last in Cleveland.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I don't quite see it with Ball. He'll be really good, but I don't see how he'll be better than Ball. He's like Rondo without the defensive ability, but a bit more shooting (though with a form that is suspect as of now for the NBA).

I mean, watching him get worked by Fox in the tournament this year said something to me.

Are you saying you don't see Ball better than Fultz? Agreed. I don't think Ball is as good as Fox. Fox impressed me as a one and done at Kentucky, playing very high level defense and still being well above average as a scorer and facilitator.

 

[boog204]

Are you saying you don't see Ball better than Fultz? Agreed. I don't think Ball is as good as Fox. Fox impressed me as a one and done at Kentucky, playing very high level defense and still being well above average as a scorer and facilitator.

I'm with you there... I haven't seen much of Fultz so I'll defer to everyone who raves. But to me, Fox is the better prospect over Ball. I think Ball's bust potential is very high. Fox is going to be a real nice player once he fills out and hones the jumper. But just his speed and athleticism alone will make him a factor.

 

[intlzncster]

Are you saying you don't see Ball better than Fultz? Agreed. I don't think Ball is as good as Fox. Fox impressed me as a one and done at Kentucky, playing very high level defense and still being well above average as a scorer and facilitator.

Yes. I mistyped. I wasn't trying to say Ball was going to be an average player either. It's just that you don't often see a great player get so exposed like that in a big spot in college. It happens of course, but to me, it says he's gonna need some work. I did watch some other games and was impressed at times, but there's def holes right now.

Not sure on Ball vs Fox. Love his game and moxie, not sure about his size. Dude is thin. But he's young, so we'll see.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Yes. I mistyped. I wasn't trying to say Ball was going to be an average player either. It's just that you don't often see a great player get so exposed like that in a big spot in college. It happens of course, but to me, it says he's gonna need some work. I did watch some other games and was impressed at times, but there's def holes right now.

Not sure on Ball vs Fox. Love his game and moxie, not sure about his size. Dude is thin. But he's young, so we'll see.

Any thinner than Curry was coming out?

 

[intlzncster]

Any thinner than Curry was coming out?

Zero idea man. I just know that watching Fox during the tournament, he looked like a twig. And let's be fair here, Curry should not be used as the norm. He's something else.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Fulton wasn't good enough to even get Washington a winning record this year, but people think he will be an nba start next year?

 

[husky429]

Fulton wasn't good enough to even get Washington a winning record this year, but people think he will be an nba start next year?

Personally, I'd love to see him come off the bench for the Celts and play 25 minutes a game or something. I think that's less risky as far as development goes. But he COULD easily be an NBA starter.

He's the kind of guy that is going to translate well to the better spacing and PnR style of the NBA right now. Similar to Simmons. Fultz will also benefit from not being the only option on his team. At UW teams constantly blitzed him off of screens, and tried to run him off the court, since he was the only threat to go off for 30 points if left alone.

He's not a guarantee, obviously, but he has an NBA-style skill set that is farther along than any of the others in this draft right now. His ceiling isn't Lebron James, but his floor seems to be a pretty decent sixth man. Lonzo is an AWESOME player, but GM's worry that the style he plays, lack of burst, and his awkward shot will not translate. It could, but it's less of a guarantee. His floor is low. Someone like Josh Jackson has crazy athleticism, but has the skills of a face-up 4-man right now, and the size of a tall SG. He might have the highest ceiling in the draft, though. His floor is exceptionally low.

 

[SWHuskyFan]

Fultz is the complete package. The sin he committed was to play for a bad coach on a horrible team that plays at a time when no one watches. If this kid played for Duke the whole narrative would be different.

Most scouts rave about him, he's got no weaknesses in his game. He's amazingly polished for an 18 year old, he's big for a point guard with long arms and high level athleticism. He's already got an NBA level jumper and he's good in the PnR game which is so prevalent in the NBA.

All the other prospects have big question marks. To me if they keep the pick and I see no realistic reason they don't, he's far and away the best choice.

The trade possibilities would require the Celtics to add a lot of players to the mix to offset salary. They'd also be giving up years of a relatively low cost player and inheriting a max contract older player in return. The trade is simply not going to happen as it would take an asset that no one would ever trade in return. George and Butler are no where near that level of asset, if that offer ever existed it disappeared after the lottery.

 

[husky429]

Fultz is the complete package. The sin he committed was to play for a bad coach on a horrible team that plays at a time when no one watches. If this kid played for Duke the whole narrative would be different.

Most scouts rave about him, he's got no weaknesses in his game. He's amazingly polished for an 18 year old, he's big for a point guard with long arms and high level athleticism. He's already got an NBA level jumper and he's good in the PnR game which is so prevalent in the NBA.

All the other prospects have big question marks. To me if they keep the pick and I see no realistic reason they don't, he's far and away the best choice.

The trade possibilities would require the Celtics to add a lot of players to the mix to offset salary. They'd also be giving up years of a relatively low cost player and inheriting a max contract older player in return. The trade is simply not going to happen as it would take an asset that no one would ever trade in return. George and Butler are no where near that level of asset, if that offer ever existed it disappeared after the lottery.

I wouldn't say he has NO weaknesses, but I get what you mean.

From what I've seen his perceived weaknesses are some carelessness with the ball, lack of super-elite athleticism. He's not the first down the court, and athletic defenders could give him fits. That lack of first step, and also some effort issues, were part of what made him an iffy defender in college. He got burned pretty often.

Then there's the intagibles: can he lead a team? How will the veterans on a Celtics (I assume) team accept him? Does he have the drive to work to be great? Tough to say.

 

[NielsisGood]

I do agree with SWHusky that the Fultz hype would be pretty huge right now if he had gone to a big name program

 

[SWHuskyFan]

I wouldn't say he has NO weaknesses, but I get what you mean.

From what I've seen his perceived weaknesses are some carelessness with the ball, lack of super-elite athleticism. He's not the first down the court, and athletic defenders could give him fits. That lack of first step, and also some effort issues, were part of what made him an iffy defender in college. He got burned pretty often.

Then there's the intagibles: can he lead a team? How will the veterans on a Celtics (I assume) team accept him? Does he have the drive to work to be great? Tough to say.

Don't love the intangibles argument as he's 18 and played on a horrible team, really hard to make much of it either way. I think the complaint on his defense and 1st step could be real, though I've heard things both ways about his athleticism. His length will certainly cover up for some of that.

 

[I Bleed Blue]

Honestly take Fultz this year and keep next years pick for a shot at Ayton or Porter Jr. Ayton is the big prize!! Fultz is IT insurance thus move Rozier or Smart. Finally, sign Hayward unless y'all think Jalen Brown will ascend to that next level.

Boom this GM stuff is easy! *shuts off 2K*

 

[husky429]

Don't love the intangibles argument as he's 18 and played on a horrible team, really hard to make much of it either way. I think the complaint on his defense and 1st step could be real, though I've heard things both ways about his athleticism. His length will certainly cover up for some of that.

I think the intangibles part is something that GMs need to try to figure out as best they can in interviews and workouts with the team. The same thing was said about Drummond, and it didn't seem to be true until his regression this year.

As far as first step, that's something hard to know since he didn't go to the combine. It's not like you can overlap his step with an NBA guards on tape and compare--way too many variable for that.

His defense was bad at Washington, that's just a fact. But how much of that (and his motivation intagibles) had to do with being on a godawful team, when he didn't really want to be in college? it's tough to say. He definitely has the physcial profile to be a great defender.

 

[intlzncster]

Honestly take Fultz this year and keep next years pick for a shot at Ayton or Porter Jr. Ayton is the big prize!! Fultz is IT insurance thus move Rozier or Smart. Finally, sign Hayward unless y'all think Jalen Brown will ascend to that next level.

Boom this GM stuff is easy! *shuts off 2K*

Hayward and Jalen could play together I think. They'd give up some height at the PF, but that's not as big a deal in today's NBA.

I'd keep both Smart and Rozier, relatively cheap quality role players. It's between Bradley or IT. I would lean to Bradley, if it looks like Fultz will grade out highly.

 

[Hugo]

Hayward and Jalen could play together I think. They'd give up some height at the PF, but that's not as big a deal in today's NBA.

I'd keep both Smart and Rozier, relatively cheap quality role players. It's between Bradley or IT. I would lean to Bradley, if it looks like Fultz will grade out highly.

"lean" meaning keep or move ? Tough choice here between the two. Bradley is an excellent defender whereas IT is not but IT can create much better than Bradley. Without researching shooting %, I'd guess they are similar, but IT has the advantage in clutch time. It may come down to how you can package them for a max free agent as well as what Ainge thinks is Fultz's ceiling is and if he feels Smart can be a full-time PG. Either way it's a nice problem to have.

 

[intlzncster]

"lean" meaning keep or move ? Tough choice here between the two. Bradley is an excellent defender whereas IT is not but IT can create much better than Bradley. Without researching shooting %, I'd guess they are similar, but IT has the advantage in clutch time. It may come down to how you can package them for a max free agent as well as what Ainge thinks is Fultz's ceiling is and if he feels Smart can be a full-time PG. Either way it's a nice problem to have.

IT is the better player, of that there's no doubt, but Bradley compliments Fultz (if he is to be what they think he is-they'll have a year to evaluate). That's why I'd go with Bradley 3andD two guard. I like Smart for his versatility, strength to guard bigger players, run the show as a back up, get to the hole, hit free throws, occasionally shoot threes, etc.

And yep, it's a great problem to have. Ideally you'd keep everyone, but the money makes that infeasible.