Ortiz locks up HOF

[mauconnfan]

A-ROD admitted use. Manny not only may have been on the 2003 list but has been suspended twice directly because of PEDs. Ortiz was also on the list, but has not been implicated by any other means. Is he guilty? Possibly. Perhaps probably. Doesn't change the fact that evidence against him is circumstantial.

okay now take off the red glasses and tell us the truth........lol........he's your guy I get it!! No issues...........whatever he's been doing since 2003 he's a great clutch hitter and there's no denying that.

 

[Husky25]

okay now take off the red glasses and tell us the truth........lol........he's your guy I get it!! No issues...........whatever he's been doing since 2003 he's a great clutch hitter and there's no denying that.

I'm a realist. It is certainly a possibility, but here's the thing: I don't care. At the end of the day, I want to be entertained.

 

[Deepster]

Whether Ortiz gets into the Hall or not, he certainly has had his HOF moments. He's won the Edgar Martinez Award more times than Edgar Martinez. He's a 9 time All Star, a 5 time silver slugger winner, holds 3 records (Hits, RBIs and HRs) at his position and has been in the top 5 in MVP voting 5 times. He doesn't have a chance to cross traditional HOF Thresholds (3k hits, 500 HR), but his body of work, and penchant for the dramatic gets him some consideration.

I'm sorry. As far as the Hall of Fame goes, I dont' know how something like a "penchant for the dramatic" is ever included in the discussion. I keep seeing things like October hits, clutch, big moments and I think that, as Red Sox fans? That's dandy. When being measured up against the greatest hitters of all time over the span of their careers? A handful of hits don't mean a thing to me.

 

[Husky25]

Funny that you highlight 5 words at the end of the post. How about the 45 words that preceded what was bolded? That is what I mean by body of work. I will grant you that even absent the PED cloud, Ortiz is probably on the outside looking in to the "Hall of Fame (I.e. room with the plaques)," especially considering the era in which they occurred. However, his exploits should be on keen display in the attached museum of baseball history for all to appreciate.

 

[mauconnfan]

He has 2 WS rings since 2000 as do the Yanks, Cards and Giants......how many you want to add to that new museum of yours for keen display? He's been "Mr October" to you guys as Red Sox fans, other teams have theirs!! He's a good clutch hitter, ends there! Can't run or do anything else!

 

[60'sfan]

Not denying he is primarily a DH, but they only season in his career where Ortiz has not played in the field was 2008. He got hurt that year as well and did not play a full season.

The DH has been a bona fide position for 40 years and the members of the BBWAA are not holier than thou because they won't vote in a DH Primary. They are holier than thou because they are arbitrarily omitting 17 years from a museum of baseball history based on largely circumstantial evidence.

David Ortiz plays first base when the Sox are playing by National League rules. When is has played there, he has played quite well. I can remember a great play he made in the 2004 World Series against St. Louis when he nailed the Cardinal pitcher who had gone too far off of third base. So I don't think DH's should be ruled out. I think a position player should get additional consideration but only if they are exceptional at their position. i.e. Cal Ripken.

Has Ortiz done enough to get him into the Hall? I think it is debatable. He has certainly been a clutch player but that is very subjective. Should he be denied the opportunity because his name appeared on a list in 2003? Absolutely not. If I was voting, I would vote for him but I admit I am biased. But then again, who isn't?

 

[Jerry1714]

Red Sox fans are delusional, really really fn delusional!! LOL................the numbers jump out SCREAMING Manny and Papi juicing but there is doubt in their minds somehow!! funny !! hahahaha

2003 he suddenly goes from a hefty bag field to PAPI the slugger but there's still doubt in their minds........way too funny guys!!

Oh yeah then maybe ARod has an argument too!!

So you are saying Manny started juicing in 2003 and the numbers prove that? Even for a putz this a moronic statement.

Not saying Manny did not juice, but come on at least put together an accurate argument. His numbers were fantastic throughout his career, there nothing you can point to say hey here is when he started. Much like Arod and Pujols.

 

[Husky25]

He has 2 WS rings since 2000 as do the Yanks, Cards and Giants......how many you want to add to that new museum of yours for keen display? He's been "Mr October" to you guys as Red Sox fans, other teams have theirs!! He's a good clutch hitter, ends there! Can't run or do anything else!

What new Museum? The official title of the Hall of Fame is, "The National Baseball Hall of Fame and Museum." It's old. The Hall of Fame is merely the room where the plaques are hung. The rest is a museum.

Ortiz has earned two WS Rings since 2004 but that has nothing to do with it. Championship titles are team achievements, not individual. Otherwise Fisk, Teddy Ball Game, Yaz, and Rice, among others would not be in the Hall of Fame. Many players can't run and most Hall of Famers are there for what they do at the plate. Some players do not belong in the Hall at all but are still there. Many are voted in by the Veterans' committee, which is probably Ortiz's way in as well...if they deem him worthy in 31 or so years.

Maybe there should be a mechanism where the number of enshrinees is capped, and a current player has to knock a former out of the Hall. That would be great drama...

 

[mauconnfan]

So you are saying Manny started juicing in 2003 and the numbers prove that? Even for a putz this a moronic statement.

Not saying Manny did not juice, but come on at least put together an accurate argument. His numbers were fantastic throughout his career, there nothing you can point to say hey here is when he started. Much like Arod and Pujols.

No you dumb**........I somehow knew you would chime in with some "WTF" stuff but at least you are consistent - stupid but consistently so!!

Manny started in Cleveland more than likely and Papi didn't until he became Manny's protector........can you read dopey? Don't wast cyber space Jer, unlike Waq, Husky25, GO and 60's you don't have enough baseball knowledge to even be here!

 

[Jerry1714]

No you dumb* ........I somehow knew you would chime in with some "WTF" stuff but at least you are consistent - stupid but consistently so!!

Manny started in Cleveland more than likely and Papi didn't until he became Manny's protector........can you read dopey? Don't wast cyber space Jer, unlike Waq, Husky25, GO and 60's you don't have enough baseball knowledge to even be here!

Not only do you write like a child, but you make the dumbest posts on this board. Use inteligible sentences, I know that is tough for you because then you would not be able to use emoticons, but people might have a clue what you are trying to say. You said look at the numbers? What numbers for Manny? Where is the year you can say he started???

I love how you think you are a baseball wizard but a quick review of your posts show the complete opposite.

Oh and glad you came back after crying for attention earlier:

http://the-boneyard.com/threads/good-luck-guys.43995/

http://the-boneyard.com/threads/alomst-gone.44043/#post-696049

Could you be any more desperate for people to pay attention to you? You could not be more stereotypical of someone who has 5k posts on a message board and a chick who would never look at them as their avatar. Carry on Mau, we all enjoy your verbal diarrhea.

 

[The Viking]

Nope........can't be. It's baseball, he needs to wear the glove. Or else I guess we need to open up the HOF for guys like Mark Belanger who hit .211 but made ALL the plays so really he was important in one aspect of the game like Papi??? No way he gets in unless they open up a new room for DH's........

Well it *was* baseball, but isn't the National League the only league in the world that doesn't use a DH? Maybe there's a league I'm missing though, who knows.
And while defense is being valued heavily in today's era, I don't know that there are any GM's right now who would take an all glove no hit SS over Ortiz.

 

[The Viking]

Oh look what was recently posted on Yahoo.

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/mlb-b...ain-tigers-jhonny-peralta-153829758--mlb.html

I think there are a lot of fans and players who are wondering why the guys caught in the case down in Florida are allowed back just in time to make an impact in the playoffs. I don't think this is crazy that some players on Boston might privately wonder the same thing when Peralta carried them through the Oakland series and won game 1 and nearly game 2 for them in the ALCS.

 

[mauconnfan]

Not only do you write like a child, but you make the dumbest posts on this board. Use inteligible sentences, I know that is tough for you because then you would not be able to use emoticons, but people might have a clue what you are trying to say. You said look at the numbers? What numbers for Manny? Where is the year you can say he started???

I love how you think you are a baseball wizard but a quick review of your posts show the complete opposite.

Oh and glad you came back after crying for attention earlier:

http://the-boneyard.com/threads/good-luck-guys.43995/

http://the-boneyard.com/threads/alomst-gone.44043/#post-696049

Could you be any more desperate for people to pay attention to you? You could not be more stereotypical of someone who has 5k posts on a message board and a chick who would never look at them as their avatar. Carry on Mau, we all enjoy your verbal diarrhea.

Thanks Jerry need that from you! I feel better now...........people who speak of others intelligence and such as much as you need to understand one thing - We all need people who clean our stuff and people who throw burgers on a grill at a fast food place so we can keep making impacts out there in the "intelligent" parts of the world. So that coffee you're making and the donuts you prepare for me are huge, don't ever discount that Jer!!

And while I may write like a child to you, it is you who I need to communicate with in such a manner so figure that one out!! You have nothing ever to bring to the table unless it's what you think is correct, you will find that to be otherwise with me. You are the dope here Jerry so check that mirror out.......

 

[mauconnfan]

Well it *was* baseball, but isn't the National League the only league in the world that doesn't use a DH? Maybe there's a league I'm missing though, who knows.
And while defense is being valued heavily in today's era, I don't know that there are any GM's right now who would take an all glove no hit SS over Ortiz.

Vike, I agree with you that everyone would take Papi, heck the rumors of the Yanks interest for a DH had me thinking of him in Yankee Stadium a couple years back. He can hit like mad and is a force in the lineup........but that doesn't change the HOF chances I don't think.........it's part of the game so eventually they may put someone in but his 2003 listing will more than likely deny him of being the first.

If he gets in he gets in but I there are too many players who have performed and won with the glove as well as being decent hitters so I can't grasp a DH making it.......then again I don't have Papi!!

 

[Jerry1714]

Thanks Jerry need that from you! I feel better now...........people who speak of others intelligence and such as much as you need to understand one thing - We all need people who clean our stuff and people who throw burgers on a grill at a fast food place so we can keep making impacts out there in the "intelligent" parts of the world. So that coffee you're making and the donuts you prepare for me are huge, don't ever discount that Jer!!

And while I may write like a child to you, it is you who I need to communicate with in such a manner so figure that one out!! You have nothing ever to bring to the table unless it's what you think is correct, you will find that to be otherwise with me. You are the dope here Jerry so check that mirror out.......

Maybe it's my job as an attorney that has makes me a stickler for facts and evidence as opposed to opinions pulled outta you know where. I guess that's where we differ.

I look forward to your next cry for attention.

 

[mauconnfan]

Maybe it's my job as an attorney that has makes me a stickler for facts and evidence as opposed to opinions pulled outta you know where. I guess that's where we differ.

I look forward to your next cry for attention.

No need to cry out for attention my attorney friend, not here I promise!!

See kids even a dope can be an attorney (no offense gars).......that gives some hope to many Jer, thanks for the heads up! Never give up.........

 

[Deepster]

Maybe it's my job as an attorney that has makes me a stickler for facts and evidence as opposed to opinions pulled outta you know where. I guess that's where we differ.

I look forward to your next cry for attention.

HEY EVERYONE! LOOK AT ME! I'M A LAWYER!!!

 

[G0UCONN]

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