One writer's thoughts on Caroline Ducharme

[MilfordHusky]

I think that Caroline shot about 40% from the arc about halfway through the season. Then she hit a slump, perhaps due to her hip and/or multiple head injuries. She was taking 3-pointers off the dribble, which seemed ineffective. I think she was a better shooter when set and getting a good pass.

Some people think Caroline is a great shooter, because she beat Azzi in a 3-point contest, but one needs to look at the details. I think there were 4 contestants, perhaps more. Caroline finished 2nd in the early round and advanced to the finals. That suggests she's pretty good. As I recall, Azzi made about 8 more 3-pointers (out of 25 shots/30 points) in the first round than anyone else, including Caroline. In the 2nd round, Azzi and Caroline finished with the same number of points. Because Azzi made more "money balls" and Caroline made more shots, Caroline won the tie breaker and the overall championship. Over 50 shots, Azzi made about 7 more buckets than Caroline, but Caroline's timing was better. I believe Azzi was still wearing a boot (she won the Curry Camp contest in a boot, beating the small number of girls and all the boys). Two points: (1) If you think Caroline is as good a shooter or better than Azzi, you are deluding yourself. Azzi is the best of the best. (2) If you think Caroline is a good shooter, I think that's true. I expect that she can shoot about 40% over a full season if not injured. BTW, that's about what Lou averaged over her past 3 seasons at Fairfield. I look for the team to shoot much better from the arc this year than last year.

 

[Bone Dog]

I look for the team to shoot much better from the arc this year than last year.

I want to see this trio — Azzi Caroline Lou — torch opponents one after another. Then Dorka Aaliyah Ice Ayanna will be unleashed in the paint.

 

[Happydad745]

Everybody, not just Azzi and Caroline, is going to have to do much more this year because of Paige's injury....developing a year without her could end up being a good thing, not that there is a choice.

 

[hoophuskee]

But I wouldn't ask either one to guard a speedy shooting guard without help. Often, "help" can solve the problem, but sometimes a speedy guard just can't be contained.

Defense is predicated by "Help Defense." SO ofc help can solve the problem. That's what good defenses do/ how they are set up.


So who is this "bag bad wolf" at the small forward are you thinking of that is so unstoppable that even help defense can't slow down or help so much that this superstar team would make them so unstoppable to guard? Heck even as the guard position as quick as Jefferson was, she needed Stewart and Stokes. sometimes. It wasn't all her.

On a similar note in regards to the Recruiting thread in which you said it was "essential" UCONN land two more post frosh recruits now looking into 2024-25 season-- why?? You saw two years ago UCONN go to the FF and they had a banged up Evina Westbrook as their starting PF as she got stuck playing 33, 38, 40, and 40 her last 4 games. They only had two legit scorers and their other frontcourt was the frosh Edwards and Liv wasn't very effective as a junior.

So in 2024-2025 in which Amari would be a senior, Brady and Patterson juniors and to play potentially play small ball you could have Ducharme, a senior play pf just like Geno has done getting to FF with Evina but this time the frontline would be potentially better, right?

SO I don’t follow the recruiting thread much but I had wanted to ask coco or maybe you or anyone else why not get a super wing in the 2024 class so when you either rest Ducharme or if you put Ducharme at the PF for spot minutes the super wing fills in at Small Forward? Why must it be post post post in this 2023 class? Why not Strong in 2024?

And it seems you have zero confidence in Amari, Brady and Patterson???? Otherwise why are you using the word "Essential" rather than wait and see? Couldn't there possibly be another "Dorka" out there too? It's why I don’t buy this desperation that UCONN needs not one but two low posts. I will say if one of them is a known super elite recruit, hell yeah get her.

 

[GEAinAustin]

"Then Dorka Aaliyah Ice Ayanna will be unleashed in the paint", you conveniently forgot Aubrey Griffin, a shut down defender and magnet as a rebounder.

 

[Bone Dog]

Defense is predicated by "Help Defense." SO ofc help can solve the problem. That's what good defenses do/ how they are set up.


So who is this "bag bad wolf" at the small forward are you thinking of that is so unstoppable that even help defense can't slow down or help so much that this superstar team would make them so unstoppable to guard? Heck even as the guard position as quick as Jefferson was, she needed Stewart and Stokes. sometimes. It wasn't all her.

On a similar note in regards to the Recruiting thread in which you said it was "essential" UCONN land two more post frosh recruits now looking into 2024-25 season-- why?? You saw two years ago UCONN go to the FF and they had a banged up Evina Westbrook as their starting PF as she got stuck playing 33, 38, 40, and 40 her last 4 games. They only had two legit scorers and their other frontcourt was the frosh Edwards and Liv wasn't very effective as a junior.

So in 2024-2025 in which Amari would be a senior, Brady and Patterson juniors and to play potentially play small ball you could have Ducharme, a senior play pf just like Geno has done getting to FF with Evina but this time the frontline would be potentially better, right?

SO I don’t follow the recruiting thread much but I had wanted to ask coco or maybe you or anyone else why not get a super wing in the 2024 class so when you either rest Ducharme or if you put Ducharme at the PF for spot minutes the super wing fills in at Small Forward? Why must it be post post post in this 2023 class? Why not Strong in 2024?

And it seems you have zero confidence in Amari, Brady and Patterson???? Otherwise why are you using the word "Essential" rather than wait and see? Couldn't there possibly be another "Dorka" out there too? It's why I don’t buy this desperation that UCONN needs not one but two low posts. I will say if one of them is a known super elite recruit, hell yeah get her.

Zero confidence in Amari? Where on earth did you get that from? I’ve been defending her for a year now. Disagree with me that we need a 4 and a 5 in ‘23 or ‘24. I think we need someone to replace Dorka after this year, to be Amari’s backup, and a big 4 to backup Ice and Aaliyah for the future. Aaliyah will graduate at some point after all. Or do you think in ‘24 we should stand pat with Ice and Ayanna at the 4 with no backup? Disagree with me about this, if you like. But don’t tell me who I have confidence in. Or at least get it right.

And your reasoning elsewhere in your comment is perverse. Who’s the big bad wolf? It’s not a forward. It’s a guard. On the one hand we run a switching help defense, I think you concede this, but you then seem to conclude that this will mean Ayanna playing the 3 will never find herself switched on to the opposition’s 1 or 2. Huh? Any team who plays us when we have Ayanna at the 3 will run plays to force us to switch to create exactly this mismatch. I like the idea of playing Ayanna at the 3 in certain special situations. But I don’t think this is a viable unit for most game situations. Against slow teams like Tennessee or Oregon it could work well. Or maybe even against SC if they try to go to a twin towers set with Boston Cardoso Saxton (or Amihere) on the floor at once.

This is not why I think we need to recruit a 4 and a 5. It’s why we want guards. Fortunately, we are set with guards for ‘23. But when folks say that this year we’ll be able to play Ayanna at the 3, I can’t help but worry that we won’t be quick enough as a team to contain quicker opponents.

Now please don’t repeat the perverse error of accusing me of saying Azzi is slow. I’m talking about team quickness, which matters for our switching D. I’ve explained this several times already, so I’m not going to bother again.

So, now clarified: two different issues that you conflated and then attributed the confusion to me. Disagree with me, please. I’m interested in hearing what you think. But get what I’m saying right. Otherwise, take up someone else’s points.

 

[hoophuskee]

Zero confidence in Amari? Where on earth did you get that from? I’ve been defending her for a year now. Disagree with me that we need a 4 and a 5 in ‘23 or ‘24. I think we need someone to replace Dorka after this year, to be Amari’s backup, and a big 4 to backup Ice and Aaliyah for the future. Aaliyah will graduate at some point after all. Or do you think in ‘24 we should stand pat with Ice and Ayanna at the 4 with no backup? Disagree with me about this, if you like. But don’t tell me who I have confidence in. Or at least get it right.

And your reasoning elsewhere in your comment is perverse. Who’s the big bad wolf? It’s not a forward. It’s a guard. On the one hand we run a switching help defense, I think you concede this, but you then seem to conclude that this will mean Ayanna playing the 3 will never find herself switched on to the opposition’s 1 or 2. Huh? Any team who plays us when we have Ayanna at the 3 will run plays to force us to switch to create exactly this mismatch. I like the idea of playing Ayanna at the 3 in certain special situations. But I don’t think this is a viable unit for most game situations. Against slow teams like Tennessee or Oregon it could work well. Or maybe even against SC if they try to go to a twin towers set with Boston Cardoso Saxton (or Amihere) on the floor at once.

This is not why I think we need to recruit a 4 and a 5. It’s why we want guards. Fortunately, we are set with guards for ‘23. But when folks say that this year we’ll be able to play Ayanna at the 3, I can’t help but worry that we won’t be quick enough as a team to contain quicker opponents.

Now please don’t repeat the perverse error of accusing me of saying Azzi is slow. I’m talking about team quickness, which matters for our switching D. I’ve explained this several times already, so I’m not going to bother again.

So, now clarified: two different issues that you conflated and then attributed the confusion to me. Disagree with me, please. I’m interested in hearing what you think. But get what I’m saying right. Otherwise, take up someone else’s points.

1-- You sent me a post about the discussion being about 2024-2025. It was post# 81 on the Recruiting Thread. That’s why I spoke of 2024-2025. So now you are not concerned about 2024-2025? Great! Neither am I! So, we're in agreement as of right now it is not "essential" to worry about 2024-2025 Posts?

2--- So, in regards to switching. If that is your huge concern, and we want to discuss that then why would you want more posts other than 1? The more post players you have then it would stand to reason that the quicker guards which you refer to will give UCONN more trouble because they be switched off having to defend the guards, wouldn’t they?

3--- You are incredibly undervaluing Patterson if you think teams will look to take advantage of her defense once she gets settled. Bonedog please don’t take offense to my next questions. They are questions not accusations (curious why you think she'll be taken advantage of other than experience.). Why do you think she ended up being the number 4 rank recruit at 6'2? How do you think a 6'2 player with not much of an outside shot could get to a number 4 rank recruit on Hoopgurlz? Anyhow from what I seen I thought all of us would believe she being very capable defending outside. Hoopgurlz ratings says she has defensive versatility. It’s a highlight of her strengths. The prior year They called her a terrific extremely athletic perimeter player. That is another highlight of her strengths. That doesn’t sound like a player that teams will aggressively look to take advantage of other than experience.

I'm just surprised that your posts are usually are very positive and I'm not saying you are trashing Patterson, not one bit. But you are seriously understating her permitter defensive (not offensive) capabilities.

4--- I agree with you that Patterson is not really a 3. I 100% agree with you there. And UConn will be in trouble if she has to play significant time as a 3.

But I ask you just to ponder this-- not trying to convince you. But just ponder and put your positive cap on. If Patterson is able to defend well enough on the perimeter and be the 3 defensively/handle the switches (It would mean she is nowhere near a plodder so throw last year out the window.), then you can see how she would also be able to fit well offensively inside too, right? Because potentially every one of the other big post players will have some degree of a perimeter/outside shooting game.

And also ponder this last thing - as you and I are both positive posters. Do you feel what I am about to say is a possibility? "Brady is just as good as she has been hyped on here. And as you are positive on Amari then in her junior year as an upperclassman she'll be okay. And Griffin could come back for another year." Are any of these things outlandish? If they aren't, then how desperate is UCONN in the post excluding Ducharme if we get another "Lou?" Because Ducharme will certainly be able to play at the 4 as well if Evina was able to as well. So we’d have even another body to play the 4. Duchamre is gonna be a playa no matter where u put her!!

 

[Bone Dog]

I think Ice and Ayanna will be tremendous. It may take a little while for them to find their footing. But it will happen.

My remarks about switching placing Ayanna in a difficult situation is not about recruiting posts. Please don’t make me explain this again.

Lots of folks have said how wonderful it will be this year to let Ayanna and Aubrey play the 3 occasionally. I think this could be an interesting move for us, but it has its downside as well. This is what I’ve said several times already.

What’s the downside? Team speed. Ayanna is quick for a pf, but not for a wing. That is my entire observation. Some may think I’m wrong about this and that Ayanna is quick enough to cover any guards she may get switched on to. This is possible. It’s only my guess based on extrapolations from watching a few of her games.

I think having Nika Azzi Caroline (or Lou) on the floor is a quicker unit than Nika Azzi Ayanna, or Azzi Caroline Ayanna. There will be some situations in which this slower unit is still quick enough, but others in which it isn’t. There, that’s the entirety of my thinking on this topic.

 

[jabstep]

I think until proven otherwise that our main scoring threats will be Azzi, Caroline and Lou. We have others that can have big games as well. Dorka, Aaliyah and Aubrey. Nika, might surprise us with improved three point shooting and penatration for kicks or scoring. The rookies I think have a lot of potential. With Ice having a very good shot from the elbow which will make our cutting offense effective if she can hit that shot . Amari has to show me she wants to get on the court. I will wait and see on her.
The bottom line is last year Caroline stepped up when we couldn't score and took over. She was our go to player for half the season until she got hurt. I can't wait for the season to start. Go Huskies!!!!!!

 

[CL82]

Fudd is a force, no more so IMO than Caroline. Pre Uconn Fudd was (rightly) highly touted, Caroline not so much.

Caroline absolutely was highly ranked.

Now I grant you, that Azzi was more highly ranked, (#1 vs. #5) but it’s noted above Caroline was “an elite prospect”.

 

[Bone Dog]

Caroline absolutely was highly ranked.

She was indeed! It’s nice to be reminded of how she seemed to people. There weren’t many videos available of her hs games. But you could see how she carried her team. A bit reminiscent of JuJu Watkins today. She was a big kid playing guard who was impossible to cover. The opposing guards tended to be too small, and the bigs were too slow to send out to the perimeter to cover her. And hitting the 3s put her over the top. Watkins is a bit quicker, it seems to me, but I’m not sure she’s quite the perimeter threat Caroline was and is. Rae Burrell or Jordan Horston are similar players.

 

[Alydar]

I think Ice and Ayanna will be tremendous. It may take a little while for them to find their footing. But it will happen.

My remarks about switching placing Ayanna in a difficult situation is not about recruiting posts. Please don’t make me explain this again.

Lots of folks have said how wonderful it will be this year to let Ayanna and Aubrey play the 3 occasionally. I think this could be an interesting move for us, but it has its downside as well. This is what I’ve said several times already.

What’s the downside? Team speed. Ayanna is quick for a pf, but not for a wing. That is my entire observation. Some may think I’m wrong about this and that Ayanna is quick enough to cover any guards she may get switched on to. This is possible. It’s only my guess based on extrapolations from watching a few of her games.

I think having Nika Azzi Caroline (or Lou) on the floor is a quicker unit than Nika Azzi Ayanna, or Azzi Caroline Ayanna. There will be some situations in which this slower unit is still quick enough, but others in which it isn’t. There, that’s the entirety of my thinking on this topic.

Patterson could well be quicker than Ducharme.

 

[Vancat]

"UNLEASHED"
that is all

 

[Bone Dog]

Patterson could well be quicker than Ducharme.

I think that’s likely. I’m sure in the straight sprints down the practice court Ayanna will be one of the quicker ones on the team. But Caroline is what scouts call “deceptively quick.” She’s clever and makes decisions well, takes a first step her opponent isn’t ready for, or is off-balance for. She’s not “jab step quick” by any means, but she gets an opponent on her hip and muscles past her before she can do anything about it. And she’s got good anticipation on defense, is rarely out of position.

Ayanna has the physical skills to be all these things too. I just didn’t see her do it in any of her hs games, many of which are available online. But I look forward to her developing herself in all these ways, maybe even sooner than my remarks have suggested. I will be happily surprised by Ayanna, and it will be the first of many times in the coming years, I imagine!

 

[Bone Dog]

Yes, I was struck by her 3 pt shooting last season. It seemed to decline from her hs performance. I guess that’s not that surprising. Azzi carried all her perimeter skills over from hs, but that maybe because her form is so perfect, as even Geno remarked about last year. Caroline’s shooting form is compact and efficient, though she releases the ball lower than I like to see, and it isn’t quite as smooth as Azzi’s form. I suspect this means there is room for her to improve her form, and maybe even her accuracy. She’s eminently coachable. Whether she can reach 40% remains to be seen.

 

[Alydar]

I think that’s likely. I’m sure in the straight sprints down the practice court Ayanna will be one of the quicker ones on the team. But Caroline is what scouts call “deceptively quick.” She’s clever and makes decisions well, takes a first step her opponent isn’t ready for, or is off-balance for. She’s not “jab step quick” by any means, but she gets an opponent on her hip and muscles past her before she can do anything about it. And she’s got good anticipation on defense, is rarely out of position.

Ayanna has the physical skills to be all these things too. I just didn’t see her do it in any of her hs games, many of which are available online. But I look forward to her developing herself in all these ways, maybe even sooner than my remarks have suggested. I will be happily surprised by Ayanna, and it will be the first of many times in the coming years, I imagine!

I wasn't insinuating that Ducharme is slow, just that Patterson is amazingly quick. I've been reading that Patterson can't play the wing because she isn't quick enough while they feel Ducharme should play the wing.
The difference is that one is an uber-elite athlete, very strong upper body & amazing elevation while the other is known for shooting/scoring. The thing I first liked about Ducharme was the absence of hesitation when receiving the ball. She was decisive. If she was open she didn't waste time looking around for others to pass it to, she shot it. That's rare in a freshman, especially when there are 3 seniors on the floor with you.

My bottom line is that Geno has several outstanding options at wing. They are different. That's a good thing.

 

[Bone Dog]

I wasn't insinuating that Ducharme is slow, just that Patterson is amazingly quick. I've been reading that Patterson can't play the wing because she isn't quick enough while they feel Ducharme should play the wing.
The difference is that one is an uber-elite athlete, very strong upper body & amazing elevation while the other is known for shooting/scoring. The thing I first liked about Ducharme was the absence of hesitation when receiving the ball. She was decisive. If she was open she didn't waste time looking around for others to pass it to, she shot it. That's rare in a freshman, especially when there are 3 seniors on the floor with you.

My bottom line is that Geno has several outstanding options at wing. They are different. That's a good thing.

Those are reasonable points. I’d add that Caroline is a very good shot blocker, especially for guards who try to drive past her. She has excellent one-handed form and manages to avoid fouling quite well. That is a very coached skill she has. Obviously Ayanna can block shots, but I haven’t seen that particular skill in her. I’m sure she’ll develop it as soon as she recognizes it. A wing defender needs that in her arsenal.

 

[BobbyJ]

Yes, I was struck by her 3 pt shooting last season. It seemed to decline from her hs performance. I guess that’s not that surprising. Azzi carried all her perimeter skills over from hs, but that maybe because her form is so perfect, as even Geno remarked about last year. Caroline’s shooting form is compact and efficient, though she releases the ball lower than I like to see, and it isn’t quite as smooth as Azzi’s form. I suspect this means there is room for her to improve her form, and maybe even her accuracy. She’s eminently coachable. Whether she can reach 40% remains to be seen.

It's not so much form as it is mechanics. She has two things to fix. She doesn't use her legs to extend up into the shot and she doesn't utilize the optimum arc. Her shots are flat and often short because she shoots AT the front rim instead of OVER it. Fudd's mother/shooting coach could help her a lot.

 

[hoophuskee]

I agreed with you about last year and put out a Like. I recall you made the point of her 3poitn shooting last year pretty frequently.

This year is a new animal. Jefferson went from 26% to 41.8%.

I don't think she'll shoot 40 either but mid 30's is good and she did have a reputation as a shooter. And if there is "help" scoring where it's not mostly her and Azzi but others so when she is off she isn't going to keep firing up shots because her team needs her to, imo she can get above mid 30's.

And for anyone thinking 35% isn't good - that's equivalent to 52.5% from a 2pt shooter.

 

[hoophuskee]

I wasn't insinuating that Ducharme is slow, just that Patterson is amazingly quick. I've been reading that Patterson can't play the wing because she isn't quick enough while they feel Ducharme should play the wing.


My bottom line is that Geno has several outstanding options at wing. They are different. That's a good thing.

I'm not buying from anyone that thinks Patterson can't defend well athletically on the wing once she gets acclimated. Not only do the vids show her elite athleticism but HoopGurlz specifically has identified as her strengths her versatility and her perimeter athleticism.

I also think Ducharme is a fluid 2/3/4. A bit awkward maybe for a 2 and bit small for a 4 but still a very fluid and very tough player. I think though the 3 is her best as is Lou. Generally UCONN has a wing that's a shooter / scorer and these two fit that well. Just hope Lou cna play the D needed.

So, with that said, I don't think Patterson is "an outstanding option" at all as a wing. Because her shot isn't very good at this point in her career, she is going to force one of the bigs to play offense on the perimeter.

I'm very excited to see her however. Very very excited. She can play high post or in the paint offensively. I'm really excited to see how she and Brady play Morrow.

 

[Alydar]

It's not so much form as it is mechanics. She has two things to fix. She doesn't use her legs to extend up into the shot and she doesn't utilize the optimum arc. Her shots are flat and often short because she shoots AT the front rim instead of OVER it. Fudd's mother/shooting coach could help her a lot.

Good points. I wonder though how long it would take? I was critical of ONO's lonnnnng and slowwww shot motion. Slow back, slow through. I thought it took far too long to execute in a game. Morgan Tuck played her whole career at UConn with a very flat shot. Sometimes what works is better than what's right. Bettencourt's shooting style isn't classic either but if they go in I wouldn't change a thing.

 

[BobbyJ]

Good points. I wonder though how long it would take? I was critical of ONO's lonnnnng and slowwww shot motion. Slow back, slow through. I thought it took far too long to execute in a game. Morgan Tuck played her whole career at UConn with a very flat shot. Sometimes what works is better than what's right. Bettencourt's shooting style isn't classic either but if they go in I wouldn't change a thing.

I actually like Bettencourt's shot. See her shots at 1:32, 1:52, 2:05, and 3:05 of this video. Good legs, extension, arc, and follow through. I agree, don't change a thing.
Tuck had better arc than Ducharme and a better, no rush, controlled release. Takes a few in the first few minutes of this game and a couple nice makes here at 2:50 and 3:45. Morgan Tuck #3 White Final Four
I hope the videos work for you.

 

[Bone Dog]

I totally agree about Caroline’s ability to finish around the basket. When we went through our layup swoon last season, she could always be counted on to score without any fuss.