Notre Dame in 2012-13.

[Icebear]

People, also, need to remember that Muffet is an extremely good coach. She will have quality ball players among her recruits who fit her eye because she knows what she wants and she will mold them into a solid team. She does that consistently. Next year will take some time but ND will be back, afterall, this could be their 4th FF.

 

[HuskyNan]

I love that you guys are overlooking Rutgers, who I think will be #2 in the BE next year. Yeah, we might lose Sykes, Speed, & Rushdan. But we're adding alot more.

We have the #3 in-coming recruiting class with ALOT of size.

6'4 Rachel Hollivay
6'3 Ariel Butts
6'1 Precious Person
6'1 Kahleah Copper

add those to

6'2 Chelsey Lee
6'2 Monique Oliver
6'3 Christa Evans
6'0 Betnijah Laney

and we'll be one of the tallest and longest teams, if not the tallest and longest team in the BE. Add in our speedy guards and we'll be a very tough team. The future is very bright.

With all due respect, your freshman and senior classes were also ranked #3 and the sophomore class#9. I'm still not convinced CVS is sure how to harness her players' offensive prowess.

 

[DaddyChoc]

With all due respect, your freshman and senior classes were also ranked #3 and the sophomore class#9. I'm still not convinced CVS is sure how to harness her players' offensive prowess.

I agree

 

[LesMis89]

With all due respect, your freshman and senior classes were also ranked #3 and the sophomore class#9. I'm still not convinced CVS is sure how to harness her players' offensive prowess.

You said what I was thinking but much better than I could have said it.

 

[UConnCat]

They will be bringing in Jewell Loyd
#4 who is ELITE #1 guard and led Whitney Young in Ilinois to an undefeated season and #3 Nationally Ranking.

Loyd did not play for Whitney Young. She played for Niles West High School which did not have an undefeated season. She's still very good, though.

 

[UConnCat]

I love that you guys are overlooking Rutgers, who I think will be #2 in the BE next year. Yeah, we might lose Sykes, Speed, & Rushdan. But we're adding alot more.

We have the #3 in-coming recruiting class with ALOT of size.

6'4 Rachel Hollivay
6'3 Ariel Butts
6'1 Precious Person
6'1 Kahleah Copper

add those to

6'2 Chelsey Lee
6'2 Monique Oliver
6'3 Christa Evans
6'0 Betnijah Laney

and we'll be one of the tallest and longest teams, if not the tallest and longest team in the BE. Add in our speedy guards and we'll be a very tough team. The future is very bright.

Rutgers loses its top 2 scorers (Sykes and Rushdan, 2 of 3 players who average double figures) and its assist leader (by far) in Rushdan. And this is happening to a team that struggled mightily to score. Rutgers' height and length will be impressive, but putting the ball in the basket against better teams will still be a challenge.

 

[doggydaddy]

Rutgers loses its top 2 scorers (Sykes and Rushdan, 2 of 3 players who average double figures) and its assist leader (by far) in Rushdan. And this is happening to a team that struggled mightily to score. Rutgers' height and length will be impressive, but putting the ball in the basket against better teams will still be a challenge.

I've seen enough of the underachieving Sykes and I really believe it's addition by subtraction.

 

[EricSD]

Stanford gets back 3 injured players (Camp, Green and Ruef), something folks, and certainly the national media rarely mentions. I'm not sure if Boothe will come back for her 5th yr. We 2 frosh centers in next year's class.

We are top ten for sure, probably around 6 or 7, imho.

maybe. i'd almost say a little higher. i think a lot depends on how you match up with Maryland and Duke. i think next year it's pretty clear, as several have pointed out, that UCONN and Baylor will really be the teams to beat. given that i think there's another bit of a drop after Duke and MD, i think Stanford is as good a guess as any for #5.

i think ND drops to the 10-12 range. also agree with speedoo's other teams but you have to add in Rutgers as well. they have been recruiting really well. they get Lee back and i think her and Oliver will be a top 10 if not top 5 front court. and as much as tennessee takes a huge step backwards, on paper they have the talent to be a top 10 team.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Rather than responding to several posts in this thread, I am consolidating my comments/random observations into one post.

1) Duke and UConn have renewed their series.

2) Notre Dame losing Malina Howard to Maryland was probably one of the biggest recruiting losses of the year. Howard would have really shored up the frontline.

3) Notre Dame is not afraid to play a smaller lineup, with Muffet changing her offensive and defensive schemes to mask weaknesses. She is a really good coach whose teams always seem to overachieve in the postseason relative to talent.

4) Easy solution for Notre Dame to help Achonwa improve, establish a post presence, and balance the backcourt with the frontcourt is to work on Diggins/Achonwa running pick-and-rolls all summer, with Achonwa finishing at the rim (and learning to do so with either hand).

5) Yes, Stanford gets players back, but they are not of the caliber of Nneka Ogwumike. And Beebe, the Cardinal's top recruit, is coming off a major injury. Stanford will still be very good, but their frontline will not be as dominant as it has been in recent years, at least as far as points in the paint, athleticism, and rebounding. On the other hand, the backcourt will be better, and their will be more balance between the backcourt and the frontcourt (something missing this year since Pohlen's graduation). And Tara can run high/low with Tinkle and Chiney and other schemes to take advantage of the fact that Stanford's returning post player (outside of Chiney) lack the athleticism of Nneka (and Chiney) but also bring shooting range beyond the three-point line.

6) Rutgers loses its best scorers from a team that struggles to score. And these two players (Sykes and Rushdan) are two of the players who can create their own shots. That will hurt.

7) Louisville is my pick for second in the Big East next year, as their young players will be more experienced, with a few players returning from injuries.

 

[speedoo]

I've seen enough of the underachieving Sykes and I really believe it's addition by subtraction.

Having seen her play dozens of times, I have to agree. This is despite her scoring, which is not really that difficult to shut down IMO, because she is so slow.

 

[cardfan]

Rather than responding to several posts in this thread, I am consolidating my comments/random observations into one post.

1) Duke and UConn have renewed their series.

2) Notre Dame losing Malina Howard to Maryland was probably one of the biggest recruiting losses of the year. Howard would have really shored up the frontline.

3) Notre Dame is not afraid to play a smaller lineup, with Muffet changing her offensive and defensive schemes to mask weaknesses. She is a really good coach whose teams always seem to overachieve in the postseason relative to talent.

4) Easy solution for Notre Dame to help Achonwa improve, establish a post presence, and balance the backcourt with the frontcourt is to work on Diggins/Achonwa running pick-and-rolls all summer, with Achonwa finishing at the rim (and learning to do so with either hand).

5) Yes, Stanford gets players back, but they are not of the caliber of Nneka Ogwumike. And Beebe, the Cardinal's top recruit, is coming off a major injury. Stanford will still be very good, but their frontline will not be as dominant as it has been in recent years, at least as far as points in the paint, athleticism, and rebounding. On the other hand, the backcourt will be better, and their will be more balance between the backcourt and the frontcourt (something missing this year since Pohlen's graduation). And Tara can run high/low with Tinkle and Chiney and other schemes to take advantage of the fact that Stanford's returning post player (outside of Chiney) lack the athleticism of Nneka (and Chiney) but also bring shooting range beyond the three-point line.

6) Rutgers loses its best scorers from a team that struggles to score. And these two players (Sykes and Rushdan) are two of the players who can create their own shots. That will hurt.

7) Louisville is my pick for second in the Big East next year, as their young players will be more experienced, with a few players returning from injuries.

No kidding. Nneka is one of kind, franchise player and imho better than Griner. Huge loss for sure.

 

[speedoo]

2) Notre Dame losing Malina Howard to Maryland was probably one of the biggest recruiting losses of the year. Howard would have really shored up the frontline.

Could not agree more, even though I am not sold on Howard. But she does bring size and enough mobility to have been able to make a real contribution to ND next year, had she chosen to go to South Bend.

 

[speedoo]

No kidding. Nneka is one of kind, franchise player and imho better than Griner. Huge loss for sure.

Sorry, I can't let this comment pass without asking you to explain. And please address defense as well as offense. Note that Griner has 157 blocks this year to Nneka's 31.

 

[cardfan]

Sorry, I can't let this comment pass without asking you to explain. And please address defense as well as offense. Note that Griner has 157 blocks this year to Nneka's 31.

I know the stats. It doesn't take much effort to block shots when you're a foot taller than most players . Nneka offensive skills, footwork, and athleticism are greater than Griner's. Defense she is quicker and jumps higher.

 

[Vowelguy]

I know the stats. It doesn't take much effort to block shots when you're a foot taller than most players . Nneka offensive skills, footwork, and athleticism are greater than Griner's. Defense she is quicker and jumps higher.

Nneka also had to overcome the disadvantage of playing against teams that were so crappy that their shots were nowhere close to the basket. How can you block shots in that situation?

 

[speedoo]

I know the stats. It doesn't take much effort to block shots when you're a foot taller than most players . Nneka offensive skills, footwork, and athleticism are greater than Griner's. Defense she is quicker and jumps higher.

So you think that if they were the same height, NNeka would be the better player. I don't necessarily agree with that hypothetical, but the fact remains Griner is 6-8 and she uses her height and length very well and that makes her the better player.

 

[cardfan]

Nneka also had to overcome the disadvantage of playing against teams that were so crappy that their shots were nowhere close to the basket. How can you block shots in that situation?

funny guy. It's not like the Big 12 is that great.

 

[UConnCat]

Nneka is obviously a great player but Griner deserves POY. I wasn't certain that Griner would be POY heading in to the season, but Griner has shown tremendous improvement in her offensive game. She dominates both ends of the floor unlike any other player in WCBB.

 

[cardfan]

So you think that if they were the same height, NNeka would be the better player. I don't necessarily agree with that hypothetical, but the fact remains Griner is 6-8 and she uses her height and length very well and that makes her the better player.

Yes.

Disagree that Griner's ht makes her the better player. I'm looking at offensive package, Nneka's skills are greater in many areas; footwork, outside shots, moves to the basket, etc. (all from my vantage pt in 3rd row)

 

[cardfan]

Nneka is obviously a great player but Griner deserves POY. I wasn't certain that Griner would be POY heading in to the season, but Griner has shown tremendous improvement in her offensive game. She dominates both ends of the floor unlike any other player in WCBB.

Griner is more accurate (from close in) but I don't see that as a huge improvement. To me, a huge improvement is adding an outside shot like Nneka has, which she can use against Baylor if we meet.

 

[UConnCat]

Griner is more accurate (from close in) but I don't see that as a huge improvement. To me, a huge improvement is adding an outside shot like Nneka has, which she can use against Baylor if we meet.

I didn't mention accuracy. I'm talking about extending the range on her face-up shot and, more importantly, showing the ability to go over either shoulder with her back to the basket. Also, her FT shooting has improved tremendously (81%). Add all of that to her dominance on the defensive end and she is deserving of POY.

 

[cardfan]

I didn't mention accuracy. I'm talking about extending the range on her face-up shot and, more importantly, showing the ability to go over either shoulder with her back to the basket. Also, her FT shooting has improved tremendously (81%). Add all of that to her dominance on the defensive end and she is deserving of POY.

Nneka has improved in those areas too. 82% FT

I'm just curious how people can judge and compare Griner and Nneka when obviously they don't see Nneka play as much given Stanford is not on ESPN at all, and didn't have that many games on Fox Sports. I posed the same question to Mechelle, who is a good friend of mine, but I disagree with her as well.

 

[DaddyChoc]

BG is a finalist for the National Olympic team...

 

[cardfan]

BG is a finalist for the National Olympic team...

I know. 6'8" is a huge advantage. pun intended.

 

[doggydaddy]

Nneka has improved in those areas too. 82% FT

I'm just curious how people can judge and compare Griner and Nneka when obviously they don't see Nneka play as much given Stanford is not on ESPN at all, and didn't have that many games on Fox Sports. I posed the same question to Mechelle, who is a good friend of mine, but I disagree with her as well.

Right now Nneka is the 1st pick in the draft.

If Griner left early, she would be the 1st pick in the draft.

Not one of your better arguments...lol.

 

[DaddyChoc]

Cardfan no one is saying NO is a stiff... but BG is a game changer!

 

[Suebird10fan]

seven to ten

Where would you rank a team that had this for their 7 player rotation.

Hartley
Faris
Jefferson
Stokes
Engeln
Johnson
Buck

Top 10?

 

[Suebird10fan]

Glad someone sees it my way!

There isn't much distinction between 11-15 and the bottom of the Top 1o in real life. Notre Dame this season is about ten points better than anyone in the bottom half of the top ten this season, and about 15 points better than anyone else in the Big East besides UConn. That's a pretty big cushion to fall into. Teams that are that good typically don't suffer the grand fall that people like to predict.

 

[cardfan]

Cardfan no one is saying NO is a stiff... but BG is a game changer!

Nneka is game changer too.

 

[HuskyNan]

I know. 6'8" is a huge advantage. pun intended.

Griner is much, much more than just a tall woman. She got great hands, a deft touch around the basket and terrific passing skills. She's fluid on both offense and defense. If simply being tall made a woman a great player, 6-9 Alyssa DeHaan would have been National POY. DeHaan was very good, an All American honorable mention, but nowhere near as dominant as Griner.

BTW, blocks are more than just being tall, too. It has a lot to do with timing and positioning. Tall kids that just swipe at the ball usually get called for fouls but BG averages only 2 fouls a game and has not fouled out this year.