Notre Dame in 2012-13.

[doggydaddy]

no clue... nor do I see her as FOY with BStew (MJ & MTuck also) in her way but we'll see

So who said Lewis was the only frosh with a good year?

 

[DaddyChoc]

Did they have one this year? And will ND have one?

that was a serious question, I know you're good at looking up rosters/height etc. so I thought you would have known.

I guess Stevens was/is their post presence... ND does have Achiwao (sp) at 6'3, yeah I know she's not the best player in a america but she is tall.

 

[DaddyChoc]

So who said Lewis was the only frosh with a good year?

no one but it was said others will not have the impact Lewis had/has.

 

[Scotter]

So, what is the 7 player rotation?

Diggins (5'9"), McBride (5'11"), Loyd (5'9"), Ochowa (6'3"), Turner (5'8"), Wright (6'2") and Cabel (5'11").

My guess would be Diggins, McBride, Loyd, Mabrey, Turner, Achonwa, and Wright with McBride playing a similar role to Kelly Faris again as McBride did this season.

This is an incredibly weak team on the boards.
Like UConn is an incredibly weak team on the boards this season? Or Notre Dame is this season starting 4 guards for that matter? Mallory and Novosel are physical players, but they aren't exactly setting rebounding records. They aren't going to out rebound everybody, but "incredibly weak" is way too strong.

We will just have to disagree about Achowa. If she was that good, she would have gotten more than 14 minutes a game. Can she handle 25-30? I don't think so. She is very foul prone.
I disagree that she is any more foul prone than is typical for a post, and I'm pretty sure her foul rate supports my opinion. She will have no problem playing 25-30 minutes next season. She doesn't play more than that now because playing two posts together isn't anymore effective for Notre Dame than it is for UConn. The benefits don't compensate for the way it bogs down the offense. Achonwa playing as the lone post surrounded by four shooters is a different story. She'll also gain significant experience this summer as a significant player on a Canadian national team trying to play its way into the 2012 Olympics. Achonwa is a problem for Notre Dame then there are plenty of very good teams that would like that problem.

Wright played very limited minutes this year. And not very productive when she did play.
She was a freshman post player, no different than many players that will be asked to play backup roles on 2nd tier contenders.
Mabrey will be the 3rd or 4th guard and if she is in, Loyd or Diggins are on the bench. Big drop in play.
This is a false assumption that all three won't be on the floor together.

Loyd (one L) is a terrific player from what I read. But still a freshman and no Lewis in 1st year impact.
She doesn't have to be Lewis. No one is saying Notre Dame is going to be just as good. And highly ranked freshman guards typically have some kind of impact especially when it comes to scoring.

After the top 3-4 players, ND next year will have the talent level equivalent of the bottom 4 on the UConn bench. Nice players but not top 10 talent. Can Diggins carry this team to that level? If she does, she should be player of the year.
The bottom four on UConn's bench would be in the rotation for just about every 2nd tier team in the country. These teams aren't playing a rotation of McDonald's All-Americans. Notre Dame won't be as good and their margin for error will be slim, but they still have the top end talent to matchup with anybody short of the elite teams. Give one of the best coaches in the country that, and I'll take my chances with Notre Dame being alright.

 

[Coler]

I love that you guys are overlooking Rutgers, who I think will be #2 in the BE next year. Yeah, we might lose Sykes, Speed, & Rushdan. But we're adding alot more.

We have the #3 in-coming recruiting class with ALOT of size.

6'4 Rachel Hollivay
6'3 Ariel Butts
6'1 Precious Person
6'1 Kahleah Copper

add those to

6'2 Chelsey Lee
6'2 Monique Oliver
6'3 Christa Evans
6'0 Betnijah Laney

and we'll be one of the tallest and longest teams, if not the tallest and longest team in the BE. Add in our speedy guards and we'll be a very tough team. The future is very bright.

 

[doggydaddy]

Scotter, I agree about the rotation. Insert Mabrey and remove Cabel. It doesn't change my opinion on how good they are.

Achowa had the highest foul/minute ratio, even higher than Peters, who is known for her foul issues. And I have a lot of doubt that Achowa can handle the additional 10 minutes a game and be consistent considering how inconsistent she was this year.

Wright could be part of the regular rotation. She better have some kind of big improvement. And if Mabrey is in, then if not Diggins or Loyd being out, McBride would be out. Still makes the lineup weaker substancially.

I just don't see better than an 11-15 ranked team. I think that makes them alright. Just not top 10.

 

[doggydaddy]

I love that you guys are overlooking Rutgers, who I think will be #2 in the BE next year. Yeah, we might lose Sykes, Speed, & Rushdan. But we're adding alot more.

We have the #3 in-coming recruiting class with ALOT of size.

6'4 Rachel Hollivay
6'3 Ariel Butts
6'1 Precious Person
6'1 Kahleah Copper

add those to

6'2 Chelsey Lee
6'2 Monique Oliver
6'3 Christa Evans
6'0 Betnijah Laney

and we'll be one of the tallest and longest teams, if not the tallest and longest team in the BE. Add in our speedy guards and we'll be a very tough team. The future is very bright.

Ok...move them ahead of ND too.

 

[Scotter]

I just don't see better than an 11-15 ranked team. I think that makes them alright. Just not top 10.

There isn't much distinction between 11-15 and the bottom of the Top 1o in real life. Notre Dame this season is about ten points better than anyone in the bottom half of the top ten this season, and about 15 points better than anyone else in the Big East besides UConn. That's a pretty big cushion to fall into. Teams that are that good typically don't suffer the grand fall that people like to predict.

 

[Louisville]

ND will finish 5th or 6th in the BE next year. They will still be a top 15 with their back court play but their weak front court is going to kill them. It will be interesting to see how Skylar performs without Natalie, Malory, and Dex.

ND needs a lot of top talent from the 2013 class that I don't think they will get to stay irrelevant with you guys like they have the past 2 years They MIGHT get Becca Greenwell but I see her staying in state to go to UK or UofL and Reimer would be a better fit with you guys. MaVunga/Russell will be Cardinals or Lady Vols.

 

[magical2]

Top 5 backcourt, but top 50 frontcourt. Achonwa is their only experienced frontcourt player and she is weak. Might even be only top 100 frontcourt.

They will be bringing in Jewell Loyd
#4 who is ELITE #1 guard and led Whitney Young in Ilinois to an undefeated season and #3 Nationally Ranking. They also got Marbrey #32 guard NJ,she will excel in their system,Huffmam #52 guard CA.They were in the mix for some elite bigs,but that didn't happen. You do not lose Novosol,Peters,and Mallory and with the returning players and Fr,not be less than what they have been the past 2 seasons! With Diggins SR,Mcbride SR,Achowna JR, as the big3 returning with reserves,Wright,Turner,Miller, Loyd and Marbrey will get plenty of time. They obviousely will be a guard oriented team. They will probably have an excellent class in 2013,but Diggins will be gone. What we are bring in with#1 Breanna,#2 Mo,#4 Morgan and everyone returning other than Tiff the landscape will have dramatically changed. We will be a prohibitive BE favorite and with Baylor really seperated from all other teams.
Loyd is special and Marbrey may be a sleeper. Meaning above HG ranking and contributing next season.
Compared to us in 2012 WOW

KML SO Ferris SR
Engelin JR Stewart FR
Tuck FR
Johnson JR
Dolson JR
Stokes SO
Buck SR

CD SR MO FR Bria JR
Banks So

 

[Icebear]

People, also, need to remember that Muffet is an extremely good coach. She will have quality ball players among her recruits who fit her eye because she knows what she wants and she will mold them into a solid team. She does that consistently. Next year will take some time but ND will be back, afterall, this could be their 4th FF.

 

[HuskyNan]

I love that you guys are overlooking Rutgers, who I think will be #2 in the BE next year. Yeah, we might lose Sykes, Speed, & Rushdan. But we're adding alot more.

We have the #3 in-coming recruiting class with ALOT of size.

6'4 Rachel Hollivay
6'3 Ariel Butts
6'1 Precious Person
6'1 Kahleah Copper

add those to

6'2 Chelsey Lee
6'2 Monique Oliver
6'3 Christa Evans
6'0 Betnijah Laney

and we'll be one of the tallest and longest teams, if not the tallest and longest team in the BE. Add in our speedy guards and we'll be a very tough team. The future is very bright.

With all due respect, your freshman and senior classes were also ranked #3 and the sophomore class#9. I'm still not convinced CVS is sure how to harness her players' offensive prowess.

 

[DaddyChoc]

With all due respect, your freshman and senior classes were also ranked #3 and the sophomore class#9. I'm still not convinced CVS is sure how to harness her players' offensive prowess.

I agree

 

[LesMis89]

With all due respect, your freshman and senior classes were also ranked #3 and the sophomore class#9. I'm still not convinced CVS is sure how to harness her players' offensive prowess.

You said what I was thinking but much better than I could have said it.

 

[UConnCat]

They will be bringing in Jewell Loyd
#4 who is ELITE #1 guard and led Whitney Young in Ilinois to an undefeated season and #3 Nationally Ranking.

Loyd did not play for Whitney Young. She played for Niles West High School which did not have an undefeated season. She's still very good, though.

 

[UConnCat]

I love that you guys are overlooking Rutgers, who I think will be #2 in the BE next year. Yeah, we might lose Sykes, Speed, & Rushdan. But we're adding alot more.

We have the #3 in-coming recruiting class with ALOT of size.

6'4 Rachel Hollivay
6'3 Ariel Butts
6'1 Precious Person
6'1 Kahleah Copper

add those to

6'2 Chelsey Lee
6'2 Monique Oliver
6'3 Christa Evans
6'0 Betnijah Laney

and we'll be one of the tallest and longest teams, if not the tallest and longest team in the BE. Add in our speedy guards and we'll be a very tough team. The future is very bright.

Rutgers loses its top 2 scorers (Sykes and Rushdan, 2 of 3 players who average double figures) and its assist leader (by far) in Rushdan. And this is happening to a team that struggled mightily to score. Rutgers' height and length will be impressive, but putting the ball in the basket against better teams will still be a challenge.

 

[doggydaddy]

Rutgers loses its top 2 scorers (Sykes and Rushdan, 2 of 3 players who average double figures) and its assist leader (by far) in Rushdan. And this is happening to a team that struggled mightily to score. Rutgers' height and length will be impressive, but putting the ball in the basket against better teams will still be a challenge.

I've seen enough of the underachieving Sykes and I really believe it's addition by subtraction.

 

[EricLA]

Stanford gets back 3 injured players (Camp, Green and Ruef), something folks, and certainly the national media rarely mentions. I'm not sure if Boothe will come back for her 5th yr. We 2 frosh centers in next year's class.

We are top ten for sure, probably around 6 or 7, imho.

maybe. i'd almost say a little higher. i think a lot depends on how you match up with Maryland and Duke. i think next year it's pretty clear, as several have pointed out, that UCONN and Baylor will really be the teams to beat. given that i think there's another bit of a drop after Duke and MD, i think Stanford is as good a guess as any for #5.

i think ND drops to the 10-12 range. also agree with speedoo's other teams but you have to add in Rutgers as well. they have been recruiting really well. they get Lee back and i think her and Oliver will be a top 10 if not top 5 front court. and as much as tennessee takes a huge step backwards, on paper they have the talent to be a top 10 team.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Rather than responding to several posts in this thread, I am consolidating my comments/random observations into one post.

1) Duke and UConn have renewed their series.

2) Notre Dame losing Malina Howard to Maryland was probably one of the biggest recruiting losses of the year. Howard would have really shored up the frontline.

3) Notre Dame is not afraid to play a smaller lineup, with Muffet changing her offensive and defensive schemes to mask weaknesses. She is a really good coach whose teams always seem to overachieve in the postseason relative to talent.

4) Easy solution for Notre Dame to help Achonwa improve, establish a post presence, and balance the backcourt with the frontcourt is to work on Diggins/Achonwa running pick-and-rolls all summer, with Achonwa finishing at the rim (and learning to do so with either hand).

5) Yes, Stanford gets players back, but they are not of the caliber of Nneka Ogwumike. And Beebe, the Cardinal's top recruit, is coming off a major injury. Stanford will still be very good, but their frontline will not be as dominant as it has been in recent years, at least as far as points in the paint, athleticism, and rebounding. On the other hand, the backcourt will be better, and their will be more balance between the backcourt and the frontcourt (something missing this year since Pohlen's graduation). And Tara can run high/low with Tinkle and Chiney and other schemes to take advantage of the fact that Stanford's returning post player (outside of Chiney) lack the athleticism of Nneka (and Chiney) but also bring shooting range beyond the three-point line.

6) Rutgers loses its best scorers from a team that struggles to score. And these two players (Sykes and Rushdan) are two of the players who can create their own shots. That will hurt.

7) Louisville is my pick for second in the Big East next year, as their young players will be more experienced, with a few players returning from injuries.

 

[speedoo]

I've seen enough of the underachieving Sykes and I really believe it's addition by subtraction.

Having seen her play dozens of times, I have to agree. This is despite her scoring, which is not really that difficult to shut down IMO, because she is so slow.

 

[cardfan]

Rather than responding to several posts in this thread, I am consolidating my comments/random observations into one post.

1) Duke and UConn have renewed their series.

2) Notre Dame losing Malina Howard to Maryland was probably one of the biggest recruiting losses of the year. Howard would have really shored up the frontline.

3) Notre Dame is not afraid to play a smaller lineup, with Muffet changing her offensive and defensive schemes to mask weaknesses. She is a really good coach whose teams always seem to overachieve in the postseason relative to talent.

4) Easy solution for Notre Dame to help Achonwa improve, establish a post presence, and balance the backcourt with the frontcourt is to work on Diggins/Achonwa running pick-and-rolls all summer, with Achonwa finishing at the rim (and learning to do so with either hand).

5) Yes, Stanford gets players back, but they are not of the caliber of Nneka Ogwumike. And Beebe, the Cardinal's top recruit, is coming off a major injury. Stanford will still be very good, but their frontline will not be as dominant as it has been in recent years, at least as far as points in the paint, athleticism, and rebounding. On the other hand, the backcourt will be better, and their will be more balance between the backcourt and the frontcourt (something missing this year since Pohlen's graduation). And Tara can run high/low with Tinkle and Chiney and other schemes to take advantage of the fact that Stanford's returning post player (outside of Chiney) lack the athleticism of Nneka (and Chiney) but also bring shooting range beyond the three-point line.

6) Rutgers loses its best scorers from a team that struggles to score. And these two players (Sykes and Rushdan) are two of the players who can create their own shots. That will hurt.

7) Louisville is my pick for second in the Big East next year, as their young players will be more experienced, with a few players returning from injuries.

No kidding. Nneka is one of kind, franchise player and imho better than Griner. Huge loss for sure.

 

[speedoo]

2) Notre Dame losing Malina Howard to Maryland was probably one of the biggest recruiting losses of the year. Howard would have really shored up the frontline.

Could not agree more, even though I am not sold on Howard. But she does bring size and enough mobility to have been able to make a real contribution to ND next year, had she chosen to go to South Bend.

 

[speedoo]

No kidding. Nneka is one of kind, franchise player and imho better than Griner. Huge loss for sure.

Sorry, I can't let this comment pass without asking you to explain. And please address defense as well as offense. Note that Griner has 157 blocks this year to Nneka's 31.

 

[cardfan]

Sorry, I can't let this comment pass without asking you to explain. And please address defense as well as offense. Note that Griner has 157 blocks this year to Nneka's 31.

I know the stats. It doesn't take much effort to block shots when you're a foot taller than most players . Nneka offensive skills, footwork, and athleticism are greater than Griner's. Defense she is quicker and jumps higher.

 

[Vowelguy]

I know the stats. It doesn't take much effort to block shots when you're a foot taller than most players . Nneka offensive skills, footwork, and athleticism are greater than Griner's. Defense she is quicker and jumps higher.

Nneka also had to overcome the disadvantage of playing against teams that were so crappy that their shots were nowhere close to the basket. How can you block shots in that situation?