Non-Key Tweets

[jostar1]

GREG S W A I M SHOW ‏@G S waim · 6h6 hours ago
The latest #Big12Expansion theory is that after interviews TV partners offered #Big12 more money not to expand. We may know on October 17th.

Rjtim‏@Raiderfan1960
@G S waim neurotic! Not sure now that BYU would be better off staying out.

GREG S W A I M SHOW ‏@G S waim · 2h2 hours ago
Agree wholeheartedly, and want my alma mater, #OKState, to get out of the #Big12 asap.

 

[The Funster]

I just can't see Delany taking Texas as anything other than asn an equal partner. That means no Texas power plays and no LHN.

 

[Seaa Blue]

I just can't see Delany taking Texas as anything other than asn an equal partner. That means no Texas power plays and no LHN.

I could see Texas becoming an "equal" partner immediately... In consideration of all that work they put into LHN, immediately being vested in BTN; no charge.

Never mind that little piece of the contract that says it all belongs in ESPN; they'll figure it out.

 

[BKarchitect]

My dream scenario if everything falls apart for the Big 12...

I don't think 4x16 works because it leaves current P5 teams and/or Notre Dame out of the mix. Ken Starr and Baylor were about to take anybody and everybody to court to stop the Big 12 from imploding last time around and getting left out of the "new" landscape. No university currently in the P5 is going to simply take getting cut out sitting down. That's why I like 4x18 - you get everybody already P5 plus ND, BYU and a few other good additions like, ahem, UConn. Each division is 9 teams, so you get 4 home, 4 away in-division and 2-3 rotating cross-division games. Yes, the divisions in the new landscape are more akin to what old school conferences used to be...you won't see your cross-division teams all that often but let's be real - in the current SEC and B1G, you already don't play cross-division teams all that often. Old school divisions are the far superior setup - this just gets back to that under a broader, money-printing conference umbrella. Each of the 4 CCG's between the 8 division winners is the playoff quarterfinals. Easy peasy. Just not sure you incorporate OOC schedule...divisions probably determined only by conference record...maybe OOC plays a part in seeding the 4 semi-finalists or something.

KU, OU and UT to the B1G to cement their western wing and UConn to put finishing touches on the eastern wing.

B1G WEST
Kansas
Illinois
Iowa
Minnesota
Nebraska
Northwestern
Oklahoma
Texas
Wisconsin

B1G EAST
Indiana
Maryland
Michigan
Michigan State
Ohio State
Penn State
Purdue
Rutgers
UConn

 

[HuskyHawk]

If Delaney could get Oklahoma, Kansas and Texas for sure, and all he has to do is accept Oklahoma State, he's taking that deal. Yeah the Big Ten presidents probably don't care to have Oklahoma State, but if it gets them those three schools, they'll do it. That said, I think they would try to get Oklahoma without Oklahoma State. But if it's to a point where taking both gets them all four of those, they're gonna do that IMHO.

Maybe, but he's not giving in on that point easily. I think Delaney would much prefer UConn to OSU and even ISU to OSU.
My guess is that OU's only real obligation won't be to bring OSU with them, but to find a tolerable landing spot for them. If OSU can get an SEC invite, OU is going to be free to go where they want.

That said, I don't think Texas is going to the B1G. I'd say the Pac or even ACC are more likely.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

GREG S W A I M SHOW ‏@G S · 6h6 hours ago
The latest #Big12Expansion theory is that after interviews TV partners offered #Big12 more money not to expand. We may know on October 17th.

Rjtim‏@Raiderfan1960
@G S neurotic! Not sure now that BYU would be better off staying out.

GREG S W A I M SHOW ‏@G S · 2h2 hours ago
Agree wholeheartedly, and want my alma mater, #OKState, to get out of the #Big12 asap.

The math on this doesn't work at all for the networks. There is very little incentive to pay the Big 12 not to expand.

 

[CL82]

The math on this doesn't work at all for the networks. There is very little incentive to pay the Big 12 not to expand.

Not without a GOR extension that Texas and OU would never agree to.

 

[kyleslamb]

Maybe, but he's not giving in on that point easily. I think Delaney would much prefer UConn to OSU and even ISU to OSU.
My guess is that OU's only real obligation won't be to bring OSU with them, but to find a tolerable landing spot for them. If OSU can get an SEC invite, OU is going to be free to go where they want.

That said, I don't think Texas is going to the B1G. I'd say the Pac or even ACC are more likely.

It won't be the Pac-12. It will be the Big Ten or ACC. I'd lay a lot of money on it being the Big Ten.

I definitely agree the Big Ten would prefer UConn to OSU in a vacuum, but realignment isn't in a vacuum so they'll do what they have to do to land the big prize(s). That said, I've been saying I think UConn ends up in the Big Ten for a while and I still believe that. I personally feel OSU will be given quarters in the SEC, but if Oklahoma holds firm on them joining, the Big Ten won't risk it.

 

[auror]

I definitely agree the Big Ten would prefer UConn to OSU in a vacuum, but realignment isn't in a vacuum so they'll do what they have to do to land the big prize(s). That said, I've been saying I think UConn ends up in the Big Ten for a while and I still believe that. I personally feel OSU will be given quarters in the SEC, but if Oklahoma holds firm on them joining, the Big Ten won't risk it.

They don't have to take either, though.

UConn isn't getting into the B1G unless we join the AAU or go to the football playoff, maybe both.

 

[HuskyinWRNY]

If the B1G can pick-off OU as #15 and goes to 16, then I agree that it will be between Kansas and UConn for #16 assuming Texas has no interest at that time. OU's football value and support from Nebraska & others will outweigh its Academic rank. Kansas likely gets in over UConn as it is AAU (though UConn ranks higher academically), its basketball blueblood status (though UConn has more titles and has the women's team), and as it serves as a landbridge to OU and potentially Texas (B1G should have taken Missouri) which outweighs UConn's stronger market access to the NYC and Boston markets. If the B1G goes to 20, which I believe is the goal, Texas is #17, UConn is #18 and then the question is if ND would be attracted to a conference stretching from NYC to Houston and jump ship as #19. #20 is a question.

As for OK St, I think they have a shot at the SEC based on their deep pocked donor, and decent football and basketball pedigree and as if the ACC stays together, OK State is one of the few viable candidates to get the SEC t0 16 along with whoever is the best of the rest in Texas, maybe TCU?

I think this is pie in the sky. We are always going to be the bridesmaid, always on the short list. We just can't bring enough overall value - $ talk.

 

[kyleslamb]

They don't have to take either, though.

UConn isn't getting into the B1G unless we join the AAU or go to the football playoff, maybe both.

If they have a chance to land Oklahoma, Texas and Kansas, they almost have to take one of those two if we're assuming the ACC is off-limits. I mean, unless Notre Dame wiggles loose in 2025 from the ACC, there really aren't any other options. Who else would the Big Ten take? Iowa State? Cincinnati? Texas Tech? Kansas State? I promise it won't be any of those schools. They would absolutely have to take another because they're not stopping at 17. So AAU or not, UConn would very much be in play.

 

[06029]

II mean, unless Notre Dame wiggles loose in 2025 from the ACC, there really aren't any other options.

Another season like this year and ND may be in the ACC for FB soon. They are playing just for a "bowl" now. Not a playoff bowl, not a primo New Years Day or NY Eve bowl but just a "bowl". No Orange bowl, and no Orlando bowl because with 3 losses and probably at least 1 or 2 more on the schedule, they will be at least 2 games behind the #2 and probably the #3ACC team (FSU, Ville, Clemson, UNC and VT all have very good chances to be 2 games up on ND at season end W/L). No chance to move up in the ACC standings even though they play 5 of them this year since since they don't belong to the conference.

Cue the ND posters to tell me I am wrong.

 

[auror]

If they have a chance to land Oklahoma, Texas and Kansas, they almost have to take one of those two if we're assuming the ACC is off-limits.

This is building hypotheticals on top of hypotheticals. They can stop at Oklahoma and Texas if that were to happen, and if they don't get both, then they can add Kansas (or whomever, I know they are land grant and AAU but they were like 57th in the WSJ what's your sports team worth and the largest market in the state is 65th).

 

[BKarchitect]

This is building hypotheticals on top of hypotheticals. They can stop at Oklahoma and Texas if that were to happen, and if they don't get both, then they can add Kansas (or whomever, I know they are land grant and AAU but they were like 57th in the WSJ what's your sports team worth and the largest market in the state is 65th).

KU's home market is the entire Kansas City metro area which is 33rd.

That WSJ quote is for football programs only (where we ranked 57th in football in the latest WSJ report for football based on 2015). Our basketball program ranks 2nd nationally in value at almost three times our football brand's worth and combining the two major revenue sports would see us rank much, much higher in total net value than 57th.

I'm not saying I disagree with your premise but there is significant reason to believe (albeit not guaranteed) that the B1G will look strongly at KU should the ACC be off the table (which it seems it is). Our $1.85 billion endowment would keep us very much competitive with the figures for many of the current B1G schools as well.

I'm sure UConn would likewise receive strong consideration.

 

[auror]

Polite Kansas rebuttal

I apologize, the headline didn't say football, just "college sports" so I assumed, but you're right. The combined numbers put KU, OK St, and KSt all around the same general area of 350-400 million (and probably low 20's, high 30's combined ranking). The B1G would definitely look at KU and those schools, but there is no impetus on them to take any members past 16 with the obvious conference revenue generators (TX and OK) already acquired.

 

[Hoophound]

The Big Ten can look at UConn and see that a bigger arena with big-name opponents coming in and real television revenue will launch us to the very top few spots on that list. The fact we sit at #11 while in the AAC is unbelievable.

 

[TRest]

KU's home market is the entire Kansas City metro area which is 33rd.

That WSJ quote is for football programs only (where we ranked 57th in football in the latest WSJ report for football based on 2015). Our basketball program ranks 2nd nationally in value at almost three times our football brand's worth and combining the two major revenue sports would see us rank much, much higher in total net value than 57th.

I'm not saying I disagree with your premise but there is significant reason to believe (albeit not guaranteed) that the B1G will look strongly at KU should the ACC be off the table (which it seems it is). Our $1.85 billion endowment would keep us very much competitive with the figures for many of the current B1G schools as well.

I'm sure UConn would likewise receive strong consideration.

Receiving strong consideration is what we do.

 

[Stinger92860]

Our tv market is 21 and football drives the bus, or so I'm told.

 

[Tyler2Rings]

With the new ACC network and GOR, I think there's a minimal chance that the Big Ten pulls a team out of the ACC now. If the Big Ten wants to go to 16, now, they will have to go west. Oklahoma, Kansas, maybe Texas, and even Missouri from the SEC are most likely IMO. Personally, I would guess KU and Mizzou just because OU seems like more of a fit in the SEC and Texas clearly won't bow to anyone (my own speculation that Mizzou would jump to the Big Ten...it would seem to make sense culturally and essentially be a wash financially).

It makes me wonder, if the Big Ten had a network from Kansas City to New York and the SEC owned the football landscape (with OU), how would the ACC respond? There is not a whole lot of room for the ACC to increase their athletic prestige. I think that they would have to get Notre Dame in the conference as a football member by 2025 when the NBC contract is up. And of course, ND would need a partner to join with...

 

[kyleslamb]

This is building hypotheticals on top of hypotheticals. They can stop at Oklahoma and Texas if that were to happen, and if they don't get both, then they can add Kansas (or whomever, I know they are land grant and AAU but they were like 57th in the WSJ what's your sports team worth and the largest market in the state is 65th).

You're ignoring that they actually want Kansas. They really are a school that Big Ten presidents like and think would fit perfectly. True, they don't "have" to go to 18 if they get Oklahoma and Texas... but they actually want to. They like the scheduling 'symmetry' it creates, from everything I've heard. Plus, if the Big 12 is eaten alive, we will wind up with four super conferences anyhow and it would essentially create an 8-team playoff. At that point, they'll create a third subdivision or else the rest of FBS would be absorbed into FCS.

 

[auror]

It makes me wonder, if the Big Ten had a network from Kansas City to New York and the SEC owned the football landscape (with OU), how would the ACC respond? There is not a whole lot of room for the ACC to increase their athletic prestige. I think that they would have to get Notre Dame in the conference as a football member by 2025 when the NBC contract is up. And of course, ND would need a partner to join with...

Nothing says football prestige like UConn.

(I know you said athletic prestige and it is the ACC we are talking about so basketball is relevant. Let's hope concussions kill off football by 2025).

 

[auror]

You're ignoring that they actually want Kansas. They really are a school that Big Ten presidents like and think would fit perfectly. True, they don't "have" to go to 18 if they get Oklahoma and Texas... but they actually want to. They like the scheduling 'symmetry' it creates, from everything I've heard. Plus, if the Big 12 is eaten alive, we will wind up with four super conferences anyhow and it would essentially create an 8-team playoff. At that point, they'll create a third subdivision or else the rest of FBS would be absorbed into FCS.

Would love some non Non-Key Tweet sources on this.

 

[JeepCSC]

With the new ACC network and GOR, I think there's a minimal chance that the Big Ten pulls a team out of the ACC now. If the Big Ten wants to go to 16, now, they will have to go west. Oklahoma, Kansas, maybe Texas, and even Missouri from the SEC are most likely IMO. Personally, I would guess KU and Mizzou just because OU seems like more of a fit in the SEC and Texas clearly won't bow to anyone (my own speculation that Mizzou would jump to the Big Ten...it would seem to make sense culturally and essentially be a wash financially).

It makes me wonder, if the Big Ten had a network from Kansas City to New York and the SEC owned the football landscape (with OU), how would the ACC respond? There is not a whole lot of room for the ACC to increase their athletic prestige. I think that they would have to get Notre Dame in the conference as a football member by 2025 when the NBC contract is up. And of course, ND would need a partner to join with...

Norte Dame and UConn and call it a day would be my preference, but I don't think I have much pull in Greensboro. It will likely be whomever Notre Dame wants. I only pray it isn't Texas, because that looks like a marriage destined to fail.

 

[kyleslamb]

Would love some non Non-Key Tweet sources on this.

Which part were you looking for sourcing? This all is stuff I've heard from my own time covering athletics or from friends that work in FBS athletic departments. The third subdivision thing was admittedly something they were discussing before the autonomy but it's still something they're talking about behind the scenes casually. Whether they do it or not is just an educated guess, but it's something I'm expecting to happen at some point.

 

[CoastAtlantic]

I wouldn't necessarily agree with that. The Big Ten could take Oklahoma, Texas and Kansas along with Connecticut to go to 18. The biggest issue for UConn in the Oklahoma-Big Ten scenario is if Oklahoma demands Oklahoma State to tag along in expansion. That's where it could be tricky.

Oklahoma is really the key to this and that's probably why Boren hasn't deviated from the OU-OSU package, presumably. The leverage that they have is they can go to the SEC by themselves or with the Pokes in tow. "Let them go," you might say. Well, consider the short term media contract the Big Ten just signed recently. The conventional wisdom of the day is they're waiting to see how streaming and cord cutting plays out in real life before going to a new long-term deal.

But what if that is predicted on them being able to land a football "brand" or two? Sure, they'd be fine with the programs they have. However, if the ACC is no longer breakable and the PAC is still too far away, and then the SEC shuts off a pathway to a massive recruiting state needed to meet the demands of alumni and donors over the longer term, especially with regards to football, then they could well end up in a more precarious position in decades' time. The SEC cutting off the path to the Southwest, which breaks contiguity with the northern plains states, does that.

Also, Big 8 culture has a lot of similarities with the western side of the Big Ten. Texas may be different but a lot of Big Ten alumni are already living there.