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UConn's Atheltic department cannot last until 2024 in the AAC. Football and other sports will need to be cut back materially by then. The AD will lose tens of millions of dollars per year. Unless the state bails them out
 
We heard more than a decade ago that academics mattered when BCU and Miami went to the ACC because they we academically superior to other BE teams. Then we saw Louisville taken to the ACC with horrible academic standing. Research, no research, nothing like that really matters. I don't know who you are or what your credentials are, but I believe that you are full of it. I would like to know what great research is coming out of Rutgers. I haven't seen anything in the national news about any earth shattering research coming out of Rutgers, or any B1G schools of late. I don't think you really know much, if anything.

You're an angry elf, aren't you.
 
Thank you for pointing out my ignorance. But...yes I am angry. Not an elf, but really angry...and I don't believe that anything that I said is not true.

Besides the point that most of what you said is 100% wrong...

You are addressing CoastAtlantic - who didn't make those comments. Greg Fluguar did on Twitter.
 
Besides the point that most of what you said is 100% wrong...

You are addressing CoastAtlantic - who didn't make those comments. Greg Fluguar did on Twitter.
Besides the point that most of what you said is 100% wrong...

You are addressing CoastAtlantic - who didn't make those comments. Greg Fluguar did on Twitter.
Never mind!
 
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UConn's Atheltic department cannot last until 2024 in the AAC. Football and other sports will need to be cut back materially by then. The AD will lose tens of millions of dollars per year. Unless the state bails them out
When does the Big East money end? 2017? That's 7 years of a very big hemorrhage. I don't see we could sustain it that long without a very dramatic improvement in the AAC TV money, an amazing IMG deal, or a white knight stepping in.
 
Those publishing rights were worth $100+ million according to accounts when MJ's estate was estimated.

But...a program that signs a Big 12 or ACC GOR has, in fact, sold their media rights for a period of time. The proceeds of that sale are millions every year and more exposure.

While contracts such as the combined media/GOR contracts could be wrangled over in the courts, it would be mightily expensive to do so and one would have to have a solid legal footing. Not just a "I don't want to play anymore".

The bolded selection is where people continue to miss the mark, though. The schools are not "selling" their rights at all. They still inherently own them. They're granting exclusive usage of those rights for a set duration, but they're not selling them. It's more like a lease than a sale.
 
When you SELL exclusive usage for a set period...you do exactly as I related...."sold their media rights for a period of time". Any sale of exclusive usage for a set period is like a lease.

You are repeating what I said..in different words. A lease of rights is the same as a sale of time limited rights....just different words.

ESPN purchased the rights to ACC sports televising..and the GOR and the ESPN agreement are, like the Big 12 GOR, intertwined and reference each other.

No surprise since the Big 12 assisted the ACC to fashion the GOR....... from Bowlsby's reporting.
 
I'm not sure that royalty rights to songs (or any literature) equates to a GOR as royalties are paid on a usage basis (I don't believe that Oklahoma's media revenue per the deals in place are variable, depending on how many of their games are televised) but I'll play along for this:

At any time, royalty rights (once they hit the open market) can be bought and sold. The GOR can be monetized. The risk factor at the moment is that the cost of release from a GOR is unknown and the benefit of release at the moment is not leading anyone to attempt to pursue a release. This can change very easily and quickly if the B1G or SEC decide it is time to expand further. If a school decides they want to leave the ACC or B-12 for a spot in the B1G or SEC (once that is offered) monetary compensation to the former conference will be the result. If the school and the conference they are leaving cannot come to an agreement (most likely scenario as things have played out over the past decade or so) arbitration or litigation will eventually determine the compensation.
 
I find it hard to believe that a conference with a grant of rights is going to count on suing another conference with a grant of rights.

In terms of Virginia Tech's availability to the Big Ten prior to the expiration of the current ACC television contract, I would put it at zero percent.
 
I find it hard to believe that a conference with a grant of rights is going to count on suing another conference with a grant of rights.

In terms of Virginia Tech's availability to the Big Ten prior to the expiration of the current ACC television contract, I would put it at zero percent.
Perhaps, but the likelihood would increase at the GOR term nears the end.
 
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When you SELL exclusive usage for a set period...you do exactly as I related...."sold their media rights for a period of time". Any sale of exclusive usage for a set period is like a lease.

You are repeating what I said..in different words. A lease of rights is the same as a sale of time limited rights....just different words.

ESPN purchased the rights to ACC sports televising..and the GOR and the ESPN agreement are, like the Big 12 GOR, intertwined and reference each other.

No surprise since the Big 12 assisted the ACC to fashion the GOR.. from Bowlsby's reporting.

Sale:

1
: the act of selling; specifically : the transfer of ownership of and title to property from one person to another for a price

With the Grant of Rights, ownership is not changing hands, and does not meet the definition of a sale. What you described is exactly like a lease...

1.
a contract by which one party conveys land, property, services, etc., to another for a specified time, usually in return for a periodic payment.
 
Perhaps, but the likelihood would increase at the GOR term nears the end.

Besides a "buyout" of a GOR, Virginia Tech would also be faced with the separate ACC exit fee. How much would both cost the school and would it be worth it (assuming without evidence that Virginia Tech is even interested in changing conferences in the next ten years or so) ?
 
If you want into the Big Ten you bury the evidence and hope for a "cash retained" settlement. So clearly the best evidence we have is that there is no evidence. What evidence were you expecting?

On the other hand, since Twitterland obviously reads this board, all one has to do is say it on this board for much anything to become "a source"

p.s. I knew this legal talk would get you back on this board. ;)
 
I agree that one would call a time limited purchase of rights a lease....but when one purchases an item, you have, in our common parlance..a sale.

We could accurately say that ESPN subleased ACC content to Raycom and Fox...but we would probably refer to it, on a message board, as selling games.
 
From what I gather, ESPN and other networks like to refer to their acquired rights as "properties".

Can anyone provide some legal insight as to the origin of the term in relation to rights?
 
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If you want into the Big Ten you bury the evidence and hope for a "cash retained" settlement. So clearly the best evidence we have is that there is no evidence. What evidence were you expecting?

On the other hand, since Twitterland obviously reads this board, all one has to do is say it on this board for much anything to become "a source"

p.s. I knew this legal talk would get you back on this board. ;)


I only said that I was done commenting on the other thread about ND, not leaving the board.

Virginia Tech better have a lot of "cash retained" if it hopes to skate on both a GOR and an exit fee.

The "evidence" I was talking about would be anything more substantial than this Minnesota guy in his basement.
 
Stumbled across this FAQ page on the Big 12 football rights.

http://www.big12sports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?ATCLID=204969096

Q. What are the appearance requirements? A. No institution may appear in more than six games under Big 12 control per season on ABC, but that provision is eliminated starting in 2016 when ABC/ESPN and FOX will begin altering picks through a draft process.

S
o, one way the Big 12 is maximizing revenue is by dropping the requirement to spread the air time amongst the institutions.

Q. What does owning the rights entail? A. At the most basic level it means that the telecast partners control the right to televise games live on all existing and future platforms whether linear (traditional cable or over-the-air distribution) or digital (Internet-based). ABC has the right to televise up to 19 home games involving Big 12 teams, but that number increase to 23 starting with the 2016 season. FOX has the rights to all remaining games, except that each institution may retain one game for distribution on a permitted member institution outlet, or it can provide the game back to FOX for telecasts on one of its platforms.

With a firm number of games that will receive national air time, I'm sure that plays into not wanting the slice the pie into smaller pieces.

 
Virginia Tech better have a lot of "cash retained" if it hopes to skate on both a GOR and an exit fee.
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With that I was getting at Maryland's settlement. It seems easier for both sides to say "just keep whatever you/we already have" because "a check will not be in the mail".
 
Virginia Tech better have a lot of "cash retained" if it hopes to skate on both a GOR and an exit fee.
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With that I was getting at Maryland's settlement. It seems easier for both sides to say "just keep whatever you/we already have" because "a check will not be in the mail".
 
Virginia Tech better have a lot of "cash retained" if it hopes to skate on both a GOR and an exit fee.

I've thinking about the GoR thing. Seems to me that the exit fee in itself is less defensible with the GoR in place. That is, if the GoR is supposed to handle the TV rights issue, how can an exit fee of $60+ million be justified (without TV money factored in)? Just a thought.
 
I've thinking about the GoR thing. Seems to me that the exit fee in itself is less defensible with the GoR in place. That is, if the GoR is supposed to handle the TV rights issue, how can an exit fee of $60+ million be justified (without TV money factored in)? Just a thought.

Great point. And we already know that the exit fee can't simply be punitive. It's hard to justify having both. There would be *some* loss in value even if the Grant of Rights continued beyond a school's exit because a few additional out-of-conference games would be lost, but $60 million? Not even close.
 
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I've thinking about the GoR thing. Seems to me that the exit fee in itself is less defensible with the GoR in place. That is, if the GoR is supposed to handle the TV rights issue, how can an exit fee of $60+ million be justified (without TV money factored in)? Just a thought.
Great point. And we already know that the exit fee can't simply be punitive. It's hard to justify having both. There would be *some* loss in value even if the Grant of Rights continued beyond a school's exit because a few additional out-of-conference games would be lost, but $60 million? Not even close.

I think you are overlooking some potential termination scenarios here.

First, although the GoR is from school to conference, it inures primarily to the benefit of the networks, to whom the conferences have assigned the rights. The purpose of the GoR is to give the network security that even if a school leaves a conference, it will retain the broadcast rights or at least get compensation for the lost rights (which didn't happen when e.g. schools left the B12, devaluing the rights but with no drop in compensation).

But, if a school leaves, and the conference ceases to compensate it for its rights as the B12 bylaws provide, why should the school allow the former conference's network to come on campus to film events? A natural termination/breach outcome, unless contracts specify otherwise, is for the two to part ways with neither rights nor compensation continuing. This was in fact the outcome of the Maryland-ACC dispute.

If that's how a GoR agreement terminates, then the conference is stuck. It owes rights to the network (presumably this is enshrined in a contract, e.g. ESPN gave ACC schools an extra $2 mn per year per school or so in exchange for their GoR agreement, so there must be a pass-through agreement between the conference and ESPN). But it doesn't have the school's media rights if the school has breached/terminated. Now the conference is in breach of its agreement with the network. In fact there might be a risk that its whole TV deal could be terminated or radically renegotiated as a result of the departure. If not, presumably the network is entitled to financial compensation.

The network might have a right to sue the school for its failure to provide the rights through the GoR, if the conference had simply re-assigned rights originating with the school to the network. But to secure the rights contained in the GoR, the network would presumably have to compensate the school. You can't have a contract that terminates with one set of obligations continuing but the other side's obligations ending. So maybe the GoR is supposed to continue in some fashion after a school's exit from the conference, but with the conference cut out of its intermediary position.

Now, we haven't seen the agreements, especially the conference-network agreements, so we don't know what the termination provisions are. But it's quite likely that the termination of the GoR leads to a situation where the conference suffers significant financial losses. The only way to compensate the conference for those losses is with an exit fee.
 
Looks expensive...Maryland, with no GOR, paid $31 million...

The GOR is much more complex...and add the Exit Fee on top of the GOR and we may be talking a triple digit figure.
 
Looks expensive...Maryland, with no GOR, paid $31 million...

The GOR is much more complex...and add the Exit Fee on top of the GOR and we may be talking a triple digit figure.
$31 Million is $19 million less than the $50 million the ACC told MD they were going to pay!
 
Yep...but still a record exit payment. I think a GOR break could go double that.
 
Yep...but still a record exit payment. I think a GOR break could go double that.
Not necessarily.

If it comes to judgement the the cost of breaking a GOR will be compensation if monetary damages. If school X leaves a conference and is replaced by school Y with no change to the in place contracts, there are no damages.

Also, I could well be wrong but wasn't the GOR a replacement of an exit payment?
 
1...No...the Exit Fee still stands

2...And damages are not really as simple as you describe....Maryland was replaced by Louisville...but there are many variables to damages...even if the ACC makes as much with Louisville.
 
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