New XL Center

[whaler11]

You've said before you are a Whalers fan and I don't buy it. Bruins? Rangers? Islanders?
I find it hard to believe an actual Whalers fan would say CT doesn't "Deserve" another pro team, as if we were given some great teams to root for but didn't show up. The Whale sucked for 85-90% of the seasons they were here.

Pittsburg was a disgrace attendance-wise for many years. Then Mario Lemieux skated into town and the entire city became big into hockey.

I'm not saying we need Mario Lemieux to come here to save pro-hockey but how about, oh I don't know, making the playoffs more than 2 or 3 times in 2 decades???

Thanks to Quebec and the NHL structure in the 80's... the Whalers actually made the playoffs 8 times in 19 seasons. 7 in a row!

 

[TheDoggPound]

I still don't understand why they needed to hire a consulting firm to tell them you need a new building for the NHL. Like did they not know what type of dynamite to use?

They're conducting analysis on the market demographics (last one commissioned was 2006 - a little outdated) and they were also brought on board to come up with the plans for each scenario.

Practically speaking I don't know if it's possible to go dark with UConn Hockey becoming a tenant and needing a home for the next 3-4 years so my belief is the existing XL Center will be entirely gutted (in phases), it's footprint expanded (Church Street closed-realigned and the garage demolished a distinct possibility) and the arena completely transformed into a 21st century facility; the only thing not state-of-the-art would be the original foundation.

SCI has a track record with massive renovations ala MSG. So that is likely the main reason they specifically were chosen.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

I actually think the two arena set up works well for Connecticut given the fickle nature of our fanbase and UConn being located in one of the more remote parts of the state.

Getting to Storrs from Fairfield or New Haven isn't happening if you have to work a full day. Hell, even coming from Hartford you're cutting it close.

I think in general Gampel is a better atmosphere, but XL can get loud too.

I think UConn would be foolish to cut out a big portion of the population by stopping games in Hartford.

 

[The Viking]

Thanks to Quebec and the NHL structure in the 80's... the Whalers actually made the playoffs 8 times in 19 seasons. 7 in a row!

You know what you're right. I meant finish over .500 not make the playoffs. I think they were over .500 only 2 or 3 times when they were here. Which always made Kevin Paul Dupont's attempt at mocking the Whale by calling the "Forever 500's" actually a compliment.

 

[superjohn]

I actually think the two arena set up works well for Connecticut given the fickle nature of our fanbase and UConn being located in one of the more remote parts of the state.

Getting to Storrs from Fairfield or New Haven isn't happening if you have to work a full day. Hell, even coming from Hartford you're cutting it close.

I think in general Gampel is a better atmosphere, but XL can get loud too.

I think UConn would be foolish to cut out a big portion of the population by stopping games in Hartford.

Don't worry, they will never stop playing in Hartford.

 

[FartMan69]

They're conducting analysis on the market demographics (last one commissioned was 2006 - a little outdated) and they were also brought on board to come up with the plans for each scenario.

Practically speaking I don't know if it's possible to go dark with UConn Hockey becoming a tenant and needing a home for the next 3-4 years so my belief is the existing XL Center will be entirely gutted (in phases), it's footprint expanded (Church Street closed-realigned and the garage demolished a distinct possibility) and the arena completely transformed into a 21st century facility; the only thing not state-of-the-art would be the original foundation.

SCI has a track record with massive renovations ala MSG. So that is likely the main reason they specifically were chosen.

Obviously the size of the building needs to be increased and you'd have to demolish, realign and rebuild the seating bowl up to modern standards with an upper concourse, low and mid level boxes etc. No way you can do that in Phases over the summer because the seating bowl, concourse and suites would are all connected as a whole and you can't build one without the other. MSG didn't have to be expanded and already had multiple concourse levels. They reconstructed one level at a time, you can't really compare the two. Also how can you keep the original foundation if you need to increase the footprint of the building? Unless you theoretically cut the current foundation in half and expand to the parking garage. The lease with UConn hockey will be up by the time construction starts and obviously the basketball teams have Gampel and Mohegan. I don't see how you can get an NHL caliber building out of that barn without starting from the ground up.

 

[TheDoggPound]

Obviously the size of the building needs to be increased and you'd have to demolish, realign and rebuild the seating bowl up to modern standards with an upper concourse, low and mid level boxes etc. No way you can do that in Phases over the summer because the seating bowl, concourse and suites would are all connected as a whole and you can't build one without the other. MSG didn't have to be expanded and already had multiple concourse levels. They reconstructed one level at a time, you can't really compare the two. Also how can you keep the original foundation if you need to increase the footprint of the building? Unless you theoretically cut the current foundation in half and expand to the parking garage. The lease with UConn hockey will be up by the time construction starts and obviously the basketball teams have Gampel and Mohegan. I don't see how you can get an NHL caliber building out of that barn without starting from the ground up.

Well we'll see tomorrow because I really don't know how either and don't want to act like an amateur engineer but I do know that's why they brought in SCI, they seem to think there's a way to do it with all of that in mind and without compromising anything.

As for UConn Hockey being interrupted, if the Courant article is to be believed and the CRDA wants this plan funded in 12-18 months then theoretically construction would start shortly thereafter. UConn Hockey will be in Hartford for the next 40 months.

 

[CL82]

Just read what Friemuth is saying and has said. "We know the building needs to be NHL-ready" "We know the building can't be a barrier for a professional team" "I believe the market exist".

Then the simple fact is they consulted SCI who writes the facility standards for the NHL and their buildings, that alone speaks for itself + there's the 2-3 investor groups who are likely waiting for the dust to settle on the arena front before formally announcing their intentions.

Hartford is getting back in the game. Tomorrow will be the first step.

Love the energy...doubt that the numbers work.

 

[FartMan69]

Well we'll see tomorrow because I really don't know how either and don't want to act like an amateur engineer but I do know that's why they brought in SCI, they seem to think there's a way to do it with all of that in mind and without compromising anything.

As for UConn Hockey being interrupted, if the Courant article is to be believed and the CRDA wants this plan funded in 12-18 months then theoretically construction would start shortly thereafter. UConn Hockey will be in Hartford for the next 40 months.

"Freimuth hopes a decision on state funding from the legislature might come in the next 12 to 18 months so work could begin in the next three to five years." add a year or two as this is a government matter

 

[TheDoggPound]

Love the energy...doubt that the numbers work.

Who are we to say it won't work when Friemuth has the figures in front of him and believes it can? Keep in mind this guy was not gung-ho from the beginning but has come around. Also the investors mulling around seem to think the numbers work as well. The obstacle is the facility. These people have more insight than us and they think it can work.

 

[TheDoggPound]

"Freimuth hopes a decision on state funding from the legislature might come in the next 12 to 18 months so work could begin in the next three to five years." add a year or two as this is a government matter

Yea but I don't put to much stock into that they just hedge their timelines. If you were to believe that then when the renovations were going on they said they would keep the building open for another 10 years, we know that's not the case.

 

[TheDoggPound]

They wait around 6-7 years and our relocation options (Coyotes & Panthers) likely dry out well before then, CRDA knows this. The only other candidate remaining would be Carolina and that's far from a formality. There has been sporadic rumors of the NHL going to 33 or 34 teams but we can't afford to miss any opportunity that may arise.

 

[ecasadoSBU]

The state of Connecticut has shown that despite how successful UConn is, it will never reach the level of support states like Kentucky and NC can provide college sports. Which is one of the few reasons we were passed up in conference realignment.

Its a shame really. Connecticut basketball deserves 25,000 SRO attendance on nightly basis based on their past 15 years of national success. Oh well...

Yet you have the shytty Cuses of the world selling out. The world ain't a fair place i guess.

 

[ecasadoSBU]

Just me dreaming, but if the state is going to build a new arena (something that I doubt will happen soon), I'd love to see it located near the Rent and designate that area as a "sports complex" (similar to Philadelphia). I'm sure the downtown Hartford businesses, especially the bars and restaurants, will fight tooth and nail to keep any new arena downtown. But as far as convenience of getting in and out go, having a sports complex located a stone's throw away from a major CT artery is a good idea. They could then build up that area with restaurants/bars/shopping/hotels similar to Patriot Place around Gillette. But to do all of this would probably require more land to be donated/sold by UTC.

Isn't I-84 right off the current Civic Center location? why move it if its already located near an artery?

I'm not from Hartford nor from Connecticut... but I visited Hartford several times before and I know it needs all the help it can get. Moving things away from the business center sounds like a bad idea. the city has a lot of potential... and as the capital of the state it has the added economic opportunity of attracting government employees to spend or live within the city. Moving the arena to a new location would only make matters worse as people will continue to spend money outside of the city limits (in this case they would lose revenue to East Hartford).... ofcourse, just my 2 cents based on the little i know about the city

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Whoever's idea it was to put an interstate through the middle of the city should have been shot.

Hartford was not the only one. Happened to nearly every city, small and big, in the 1950's. The US government and urban planners saw the Autobahn in Germany during WWII and decided it would be great for the US. Mass transit and cities were pushed to the side for cars and suburbs. Sadly, as land acquisitions costs were high, many highways when they hit cities, were driven right through the poorest neighborhood often separating them from the city center (and jobs) making things even worse. I believe Boston was on of the first cities to rally against highways when the inner belt was stopped. NYC and several other cities followed suit. Even CT put a stop to the build-out as highlighted by this map.

 

[Palatine]

You've said before you are a Whalers fan and I don't buy it. Bruins? Rangers? Islanders?
I find it hard to believe an actual Whalers fan would say CT doesn't "Deserve" another pro team, as if we were given some great teams to root for but didn't show up. The Whale sucked for 85-90% of the seasons they were here.

Pittsburg was a disgrace attendance-wise for many years. Then Mario Lemieux skated into town and the entire city became big into hockey.

I'm not saying we need Mario Lemieux to come here to save pro-hockey but how about, oh I don't know, making the playoffs more than 2 or 3 times in 2 decades???

Actually Whaler GM Eddie Johnson traded Ronnie Francis and Ulf Samuelson to Pittsburgh for John Cullen and Zarley Zalapsky (one of the worst and most one sided trades in history) and then the Penguins became Stanley Cup Champs and Pittsburgh became a hockey town.

In fact, Hartfrod traded every great player that skated for it from Mark Howe to Mike Rogers, to Ronnie and Pronger and Shanahan. The franchise was a disaster.

 

[NorwalkHusky]

If one could role back the clock, Connecticut should have established one major city instead of 3 mid-major cities (Hartford, New Haven, Bridgeport), likely New haven would be it as its centrally located (east west) no too close to one of the borders and can still be linked by rail to New York. The state is too small in terms of populations and resources to support 3 mid-majors and a host of secondary cities (New Britain, New London, Waterbury, Norwalk, Stamford). A 'super' New Haven with East Haven, West Haven, and most of Hamden added to it would have the people and resources to rival Boston and there would be no question on it hosting major sport teams. All well.

New Haven was (and parts still are) a mess in the late 80's and most of the '90s'. The big change happened when Yale realized that it could not live behind its Ivy walls while the city fell apart and expect to survive. Thus, it partnered with New Haven and over the 20 years has truly transformed downtown. Hartford's downfall is that its downtown was built for business and only business so when globalization pulled many of the company's big corporate partners out of the city before the urban trend to pull residential dwelling back into the urban core in the 2000's. Corporations can move with relative ease. Universities can't.

PS - Providence is a lot like New Haven. Really nice downtown and up on Federal Hill and College Hill (Brown); but, parts are a mess, such as the neighborhood around Providence College.

This is a really interesting point I have always thought a similar thing. Connecticut has very small (Land area wise) Cities, just look at Bridgeport less than 20 square miles with nearly 150,000 people. Who knows what could have been if Fairfield, Stratford, and Trumbull were all part of Bridgeport. New Jersey is very similar with their cities (Actually there cities land areas are even smaller)

One of the things about being in a state of Connecticut is that you are never going to get out of the influence of larger cities in the area, New York around me and Boston up there. I think the future is going to bring more millennials to the large cities, but also to edge city areas like Stamford and West Hartford.

Where am I going with all this? I'm not quite sure, but I believe for the state to remain competitive we need to focus on creating livable, fun, and walking downtowns in cities all over the state. And I know Malloy just proposed a freaking Billion dollar whatever project (who knows where the money is coming from) on transportation. But I think he is right we need to bet on ourselves as a state. And hopefuly if we build all of this up we will attract people and corporations on come into Connecticut

 

[Bonehead]

I'm having a hard time seeing how a new area, or even a substantial renovation can have a decent ROI absent a pro sports franchise.

It will be difficult - only way I see new is with NHL.

 

[Bonehead]

A new arena in Hartford and Gampel would compliment one another nicely. Nice 1-2 punch as far as facilities are concerned and we would stack up vs. anybody else in the country.

You want two new buildings ? You arent asking for much...Why not just build one in between - like in Manchester...

 

[Deepster]

You've said before you are a Whalers fan and I don't buy it. Bruins? Rangers? Islanders?
I find it hard to believe an actual Whalers fan would say CT doesn't "Deserve" another pro team, as if we were given some great teams to root for but didn't show up. The Whale sucked for 85-90% of the seasons they were here.

Pittsburg was a disgrace attendance-wise for many years. Then Mario Lemieux skated into town and the entire city became big into hockey.

I'm not saying we need Mario Lemieux to come here to save pro-hockey but how about, oh I don't know, making the playoffs more than 2 or 3 times in 2 decades???

I hate to disappoint you but I was a Whalers fan. A big one. Went to 25+ games a year, travelled to MSG, Montreal and Boston for road games. My Dad golfed with Blaine Stoughton on occasion and I still have a bunch of signed sticks and pucks from the team in his era. And...I don't think Hartford deserves a pro franchise. I'm not even sure it can support the minor league baseball team that's moving in. Terrible city. Terribly laid out. Terrible, fickle, unsupportive bandwagon jumping fan base. Not a single sports team, minor or major league, has thrived or flourished or even survived here in the last 50 years.

 

[FartMan69]

unsupportive bandwagon jumping fan base.

Name me your favorite pro sports teams and I'll show you a bandwagon fanbase. To say this is exclusive to Hartford makes you look foolish. Im a HUGE Sox fan and guess what? Pink Hats everywhere. Seattle's 12th man? If it wasn't for Paul Allen that franchise would be in LA. Stop with this nonsense.

 

[superjohn]

I hate to disappoint you but I was a Whalers fan. A big one. Went to 25+ games a year, travelled to MSG, Montreal and Boston for road games. My Dad golfed with Blaine Stoughton on occasion and I still have a bunch of signed sticks and pucks from the team in his era. And...I don't think Hartford deserves a pro franchise. I'm not even sure it can support the minor league baseball team that's moving in. Terrible city. Terribly laid out. Terrible, fickle, unsupportive bandwagon jumping fan base. Not a single sports team, minor or major league, has thrived or flourished or even survived here in the last 50 years.

This is nonsense and it's this type of attitude from Nutmeggers that's always hurt the state.

 

[gioff23]

I hope Hartford someday returns to the NHL (or should I say I hope the NHL someday returns to Hartford). I'll buy season tix - I'll sign up for a PSL. I give the likelihood of success a 0.01% chance of happening. I would rather NOT divert state/city funds to a venture with that likelihood of success.

 

[Deepster]

Name me your favorite pro sports teams and I'll show you a bandwagon fanbase. To say this is exclusive to Hartford makes you look foolish. Im a HUGE Sox fan and guess what? Pink Hats everywhere. Seattle's 12th man? If it wasn't for Paul Allen that franchise would be in LA. Stop with this nonsense.

When did I say that was exclusive to Hartford? The fact is that it IS reflective of Hartford. Look at the UConn men. 4 national championships in 15 years and they can't draw fans to a XL Center game against a lower tier non-conference opponent.

12/14/14 Sunday against Coppin State. Attendance = 8,260
11/26/13 Tuesday against Loyola. Attendance = 9,497

You really think a .500 NHL team is going to get HALF a building on a cold Tuesday against Columbus or Toronto? In Hartford? Riiiiiight. Sure thing.

 

[FartMan69]

When did I say that was exclusive to Hartford? The fact is that it IS reflective of Hartford. Look at the UConn men. 4 national championships in 15 years and they can't draw fans to a XL Center game against a lower tier non-conference opponent.

12/14/14 Sunday against Coppin State. Attendance = 8,260
11/26/13 Tuesday against Loyola. Attendance = 9,497

You really think a .500 NHL team is going to get HALF a building on a cold Tuesday against Columbus or Toronto? In Hartford? Riiiiiight. Sure thing.

So what your saying is that any market that doesn't sell out for a sub par team doesn't deserve a team? Okay well than lets just give Canada every team than and cut our losses. Your problem is less with Hartford fans and more with sports fans in general.