Neinas: Wvu's Entrance Contingent On Being Available Next Year

[JohnUnitas]

O.K. Einstein -- if WVU knew it could play its road games in the midwest next year, why did they need to go to court to get a Declaratory Judgment saying they could? You mean they weren't ready to rely on your legal opinion?

Doing their due diligence through a little bit of paper work isn't going to put the breaks on what the B12, WVa, FOX and ESPN want. Once the wheels are in motion in one of these situations, there is no stopping them, it's going to happen.

You can sit there and hold out hope all you want, but just be prepared when the upcoming home slate is made up of the Conference USA Murderers Row.

 

[businesslawyer]

Doing their due diligence through a little bit of paper work isn't going to put the breaks on what the B12, WVa, FOX and ESPN want. Once the wheels are in motion in one of these situations, there is no stopping them, it's going to happen.

You can sit there and hold out hope all you want, but just be prepared when the upcoming home slate is made up of the Conference USA Murderers Row.

You didn't offer any defense to your theory or rebuttal to my attack of it. But hey, you threw some buzz phrases around so maybe no one will notice.

WVU will be gone for the 2014 season. Earlier if the parties work something out, but that will require cooperation from leagues other than the Big XII. Insulting UConn's future doesn't change any of that.

 

[JohnUnitas]

You didn't offer any defense to your theory or rebuttal to my attack of it. But hey, you threw some buzz phrases around so maybe no one will notice.

WVU will be gone for the 2014 season. Earlier if the parties work something out, but that will require cooperation from leagues other than the Big XII. Insulting UConn's future doesn't change any of that.

I don't need to insult UConn's future when it's already dead in the water.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I don't need to insult UConn's future when it's already dead in the water.

Thank you for your interest in UConn athletics.

 

[businesslawyer]

I don't need to insult UConn's future when it's already dead in the water.

Good one. See what you can come up with when your Mom doesn't edit your posts.

Care to answer why WVU needed to go to court if it already knows it's not staying in the Big East for next season?

 

[ZooCougar]

So the Titanic said to the Hindenburg... "Dude you are totally F&&KED!!!"

 

[gioff23]

The CUSA schools and Boise can NOT join next year - WVU has to sit tight. Other than that and some minor legal niceties (which is what I suspect you feel the BE by-laws are), your arguments are sound. Go Colts!

 

[TheRogers]

"If I say it, it must be so." - JohnUnitas

 

[SAMCRO]

I've said this before on othjer posts and I stand by it - - the B12 is doomed. They don't like each other, they don't trust each other and they are going to split someday soon. Noone trusts UT, OU wishes they could be California girls, OSU goes where OU wants, and schools like KU, KSU, ISU and Baylor are holding on by a thread. Why do you think Mizzou wants out so badly. For the life of me I don't understand why the SEC doesn't go after OU (and OSU). Regardless, moving to the B12 is like jumping from one sinking ship to another. They are stuck between two expansionist conferences - the Pac 12 and the SEC (not to mention the B10 is sitting back waiting for schools to fall to them).

I don't blame WVU for leaving the BE; I simply think they will find themselves pimping for a conference again, very soon.

Exactly. The B12 is teetering. Don't get me wrong, it's significantly more stable than the BE is today and will ever be, so I get why WVU and UL wanted in so badly. I hope all the BE FB schools land where they want to land, but let's not get it twisted, there are very valid reasons why Nebraska, Colorado, aTm, and Mizzou wanted out of what appeared to be a very solid and stable conference. Those reasons are just as real today as they were last year. I'm guessing Luck and Co in Mo'Town know this, but see it as an opportunity to better position themselves for the SEC in 5+/- years time when the house of cards comes crashing down around the Big Longhorn Conference. I have always pulled for WVU, and was actually hoping they'd land in the SEC. When they got the B12 invite, I was happy for them. And then they went the lawsuit route which could harm UConn and all of their partners (the BE FB schools).

 

[HartbeatHusky]

Doing their due diligence through a little bit of paper work isn't going to put the breaks on what the B12, WVa, FOX and ESPN want. Once the wheels are in motion in one of these situations, there is no stopping them, it's going to happen.

You can sit there and hold out hope all you want, but just be prepared when the upcoming home slate is made up of the Conference USA Murderers Row.

OK, we'll see who is ranked higher in the final BCS rankings this year. WVU or Boise St. and Houston. WVU will probably finish behind Cincy.

 

[arnie3]

So WVU still hasn't even bothered to read the Big 12 bylaws yet?

That's what I was looking at! It's just outrageously stupid!

"We're just becoming familiar with the bylaws of the Big 12," Luck said. "There's lots of details we have to look at, but we'll get to that in due time and we'll make prudent decisions based on the best interests of our student-athletes and our university."

 

[Scalito]

You didn't offer any defense to your theory or rebuttal to my attack of it. But hey, you threw some buzz phrases around so maybe no one will notice.

WVU will be gone for the 2014 season. Earlier if the parties work something out, but that will require cooperation from leagues other than the Big XII. Insulting UConn's future doesn't change any of that.

If WVU really wants to play in the Big XII next year I do not believe there is anything that a court will do to stop it. As I am sure you know, the ordinary remedy for breach of contract is monetary damages, not specific performance. That being said, I agree with you that Neinas' comments were not advisable from a litigation standpoint.

 

[businesslawyer]

If WVU really wants to play in the Big XII next year I do not believe there is anything that a court will do to stop it. As I am sure you know, the ordinary remedy for breach of contract is monetary damages, not specific performance. That being said, I agree with you that Neinas' comments were not advisable from a litigation standpoint.

But you've stated a truism that doesn't add anything. Of course monetary damages is the "ordinary remedy," but that doesn't eliminate equitable relief where the standards are met (likelihood of success on the merits and irreperable harm). Care to comment on why you are confident the Big East couldn't prevail on that? You may ultimately be correct, but you haven't provided enough for anyone to be able to evaluate the likelihood of that..

 

[UConnSportsGuy]

If WVU really wants to play in the Big XII next year I do not believe there is anything that a court will do to stop it. As I am sure you know, the ordinary remedy for breach of contract is monetary damages, not specific performance. That being said, I agree with you that Neinas' comments were not advisable from a litigation standpoint.

I am not a lawyer (so take my opinion with a grain of salt)...but I think it is more likely that the court rules that they cannot force WVU to play in the Big East, but they can force them not to be able to join another conference until 2014 because of their contract with the Big East.

So WVU's choice will be to stay in the BE until 2014, or completely blow up their schedule by going independent, losing the BCS bid possibility, losing all bowl affiliations, losing all TV agreements (no TV would kill recruiting) and losing out on the Big East revenue. I am sure they would much rather be in the BE for those 2 years than go independent on such short notice.

 

[UConnJRod]

For the law people out there, anyone have an educated guess as to how long this might take in the court system to figured out whether WVU has to stay in the BE, or whether they can leave. Normally, as someone that has no idea about law, I would say this is a mess and guess a couple years. But I'm assuming this can get expedited somehow given the time frame WVU is trying to leave in. Anyone know?

 

[businesslawyer]

For the law people out there, anyone have an educated guess as to how long this might take in the court system to figured out whether WVU has to stay in the BE, or whether they can leave. Normally, as someone that has no idea about law, I would say this is a mess and guess a couple years. But I'm assuming this can get expedited somehow given the time frame WVU is trying to leave in. Anyone know?

There are no hard and set rules, and it varies by jurisdiction, but given that the case for equitable relief doesn't need to get into ESPN or the Big XII, and given the time frame (that we're talking about a season that starts in 10 months), I would think 3 to 4 months. But that's not much more than a WAG.

A full case, including damages, would be more than a year under almost any scenario.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The most amazing part of this thread is how many posters think you can just bust a contract with minor consequences. If you don't like a deal you signed, just walk away. It's that easy!!!

 

[husky10]

If WVU really wants to play in the Big XII next year I do not believe there is anything that a court will do to stop it. As I am sure you know, the ordinary remedy for breach of contract is monetary damages, not specific performance. That being said, I agree with you that Neinas' comments were not advisable from a litigation standpoint.

What the court can do is make the monetary damages too high for WVU to be able to afford to go to the B-12. The loss of the BCS status is somewhere around $23 million a year plus their $5 millon buyout I think $28 million would be too much for the mountaineers to recover especially since they are part-earners for the first few years in the B-12

 

[businesslawyer]

The most amazing part of this thread is how many posters think you can just bust a contract with minor consequences. If you don't like a deal you signed, just walk away. It's that easy!!!

Where would they get that from? Maybe from many on the board who assumed the Big East could just get out of its ESPN deal whenver it wanted, or ignore the exclusive negotiating window that was in that agreement?

 

[UConnSportsGuy]

especially since they are part-earners for the first few years in the B-12

I don't think that is true. While TCU doesn't get a full share the first few years in the B12, I am pretty sure that I read that WVU will get a full share of revenue from the get go.

 

[HuskyHawk]

For the law people out there, anyone have an educated guess as to how long this might take in the court system to figured out whether WVU has to stay in the BE, or whether they can leave. Normally, as someone that has no idea about law, I would say this is a mess and guess a couple years. But I'm assuming this can get expedited somehow given the time frame WVU is trying to leave in. Anyone know?

2017.

 

[businesslawyer]

That's what I was looking at! It's just outrageously stupid!

"We're just becoming familiar with the bylaws of the Big 12," Luck said. "There's lots of details we have to look at, but we'll get to that in due time and we'll make prudent decisions based on the best interests of our student-athletes and our university."

Why should he bother to read their By-laws? He's already demonstrated to the Big East that he doesn't care what is in them anyway.

 

[uconnric]

For the law people out there, anyone have an educated guess as to how long this might take in the court system to figured out whether WVU has to stay in the BE, or whether they can leave. Normally, as someone that has no idea about law, I would say this is a mess and guess a couple years. But I'm assuming this can get expedited somehow given the time frame WVU is trying to leave in. Anyone know?

If the Big East seeks an injunction to prevent WVU from playing in the Big Twelve next year, a hearing on a temporary order could come fairly quickly. I would doubt that this will ever go to trial, but it has the potential to be pretty interesting. I guess that's why Syracuse and Pitt aren't making noise about challenging it. The Big East has to be consistent in how it treats all 3 schools.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I see no reason for the Big East to ever settle this claim. This is one of those rare situations where the liabilities are potentially unlimited, and will grow larger over time. If I am the Big East, I would never agree to any conditions for WVU's withdrawal other than those in the existing contract.

 

[Druken Friar]

Right now the venue is Morgantown, is there any way to change the location? It seems like WVU does have a significant home field advantage.

Doesn't the conference have a specific legal venue that all schools have agreed to before hand? How long does the conference have to respond to the filing?

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Where would they get that from? Maybe from many on the board who assumed the Big East could just get out of its ESPN deal whenver it wanted, or ignore the exclusive negotiating window that was in that agreement?

The negotiating window was and is a joke. Damages are difficult to prove, because the Big East was under no obligation to sign with ESPN under an circumstances. I agree with you that we should simply ignore or use a relatively simple work-around like having Boise begin negotiations.

That TV deal was life or death, and I was right about that. If dissolving the league or a major reconstruction was needed to get around that deal, the league should have done it.

WVU is simply tearing up a contract and walking away, and about half the posters on this board think that is a great idea.

 

[businesslawyer]

We don't know if the parties all agreed to one venue to resolve disputes (although if they didn't in the wak of the last law suit every school President and Tranghese should be lined up and shot).

If they did not agree to another jurisdiction, the Big East will, I assume try to get the case moved to federal court in WV. I am not an expert in jurisdiction, as opposed to contracts and corporate governance, so others can analyze that for you.

Varies by jurisdiction but you normally have 30 days to respond, and that date is often extended. In this case, I would expect the Big East to have papers to a court somewhere other than WV state court by Monday or Tuesday.

 

[ctchamps]

I've said this before on othjer posts and I stand by it - - the B12 is doomed. They don't like each other, they don't trust each other and they are going to split someday soon. Noone trusts UT, OU wishes they could be California girls, OSU goes where OU wants, and schools like KU, KSU, ISU and Baylor are holding on by a thread. Why do you think Mizzou wants out so badly. For the life of me I don't understand why the SEC doesn't go after OU (and OSU). Regardless, moving to the B12 is like jumping from one sinking ship to another. They are stuck between two expansionist conferences - the Pac 12 and the SEC (not to mention the B10 is sitting back waiting for schools to fall to them).

I don't blame WVU for leaving the BE; I simply think they will find themselves pimping for a conference again, very soon.

I said the same thing several post prior to yours. This whole thing is just two power players, OU and Texas, trying to beat the other university. OU, and OSU, will be bolting to the PAC, if the B12 doesn't get BYU. And I'm thinking BYU would rather park itself in the BE mess than the B12 mess if it joins a conference. This thing isn't over by a long shot for the B12.

 

[Scalito]

But you've stated a truism that doesn't add anything. Of course monetary damages is the "ordinary remedy," but that doesn't eliminate equitable relief where the standards are met (likelihood of success on the merits and irreperable harm). Care to comment on why you are confident the Big East couldn't prevail on that? You may ultimately be correct, but you haven't provided enough for anyone to be able to evaluate the likelihood of that..

It is a pretty important "truism," considering it is the default rule a litigant requesting specific performance must justify departing from. The Big East must establish that monetary damages would not adequately compensate them for WVU's breach in order to get an order of specific performance, and I don't see that happening. The damages by the loss of WVU may be hard to quantify, but it wouldn't be impossible.

 

[Druken Friar]

I said the same thing several post prior to yours. This whole thing is just two power players, OU and Texas, trying to beat the other university. OU, and OSU, will be bolting to the PAC, if the B12 doesn't get BYU. And I'm thinking BYU would rather park itself in the BE mess than the B12 mess if it joins a conference. This thing isn't over by a long shot for the B12.

Most people see the same dynamic and the resulting issues. I agree with several other posters that Texas will go independent once it is sure the dollars will be there. I think OU and OSU could end up most anywhere. I'm not sure the Pac 12 really wants them.