ND smackdown of Tennessee, Post Mortem | The Boneyard

ND smackdown of Tennessee, Post Mortem

Status
Not open for further replies.

EricLA

Cronus
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
15,123
Reaction Score
82,784
Some observations...

First, as much as i dislike Tennessee, it is incredibly hard to watch Pat on the bench. you can really tell the disease has gotten to her and it's so sad to see.

Having said that, i thoroughly enjoyed the ND smackdown, and to be honest, i didn't think ND played particularly well, at least not in the first half.

one very astute tennessee poster said "ND has an offense that works. Our problem is we do not have an offense that suites our skill set. The triangle offense only works when you have a STAR player, aka CP3 or Holdsclaw. The coaching staff needs to realize this and make changes." I believe his/her name was Catchingsfan24.

i point that out because it's something that other WCBB fans have noted for years. teams like RU and Tennessee have struggled on offense lately for several reasons. In Tennessee's case, the old adage of "recruit athletes, chuck up shots, hit the O-boards, and win by playing defense" no longer works. it was totally on display this game.

Massengale is good and is going to be VERY good but you can't expect a freshman to lead you to the promised land when the tools for the rest of the team have never been put into place. and by that, i mean teaching actual offense.

how much standing around, dribbling sideways, and doing things on offense that didn't result in moving the team towards a chance to score went on tonite? where was the passing? the motion offense? the screens? back screens? Tennessee did get 14 O-boards, but that won't win games any more. how many times did a guard dribble penetrate with no idea what she was going to do next?

i know you can't read an overly large amount of conclusions from one game, but if you look at how the team has played this year (close wins over a LSU team that got killed by a bad Arkansas team, the blowout to Stanford, loss to UVA, wins that were closer than they should have been) and you have to wonder where the improvement is.

and credit to ND as they played a solid game. but honestly i don't think they played as well as they did against UCONN. then again they didn't have to. this seems to be a tennessee team that, if not going backwards, is a shadow of its' former self...

this team has already lost more games (5) than their entire season last year. this team is filled with kids who were top 10 or 20 coming out of HS. i hate the thought of fans blaming the kids because you don't have that many HS AA's and under perform they way they are this year without looking at the coaching. i hope fans realize the coaching by committee is not working...

one final note... the amount of vitriol on their board towards the players is shocking. i get fan frustration, but i don't get the throwing the players completely under the bus...
 

BooRadley

CPL Boo, USMC
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
352
Reaction Score
1,072
This game made me sick...

It gave me a severe case of schadenfreude!
Oh, the pain of such horribly derived pleasure.

Your Ol' Pal BooHoohahaha
 

Tonyc

Optimus Prime
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,498
Reaction Score
35,488
Im in heaven, Im in heaven, Its beginning to look alot like Christmas all around ND. Sit the starters and start rebuilding. The best compliment I have is Terrible. TN gave up, no execition, ran no plays. Dribble into traffic. This is not a top 15 team. No heart, no pride, no care in the world just going through the motions. I would bench a bunch of them. Start rebuilding and start with the coaches. This is a very talented TN team. This TN team on paper is better then most. The problem lies with the coaching. Start from scratch. Stop pretending, stop living in the past. Its time to rebuild. This wasnt an off game. This was a cumulation of the past 4 seasons.
 

rbny1

Gotham Husky Fanatic
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
1,469
Reaction Score
4,604
As much as I hate Tennessee, I too found it sad to see Pat sitting there expressionless with her eyes glazed over. I thought it was almost invasive for the camera to focus on her so much. A friend of mine has early stage Alzheimer's, and he gets confused easily and is sometimes overwhelmed. It's a terrible disease.
 

Wbbfan1

And That’s The Way It Is
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
9,163
Reaction Score
17,437
Tenn administration won't force Pat out, nor should they. However, IMHO this should be Pat's last year and hopefully she and those around her will recognize this. Its sad to see her on the bench looking so lost and out of touch. I understand the need to transfer responsibilities to the assistant coaches, but Pat needs to be able to fire up her players like she used to do. Tonight was a total meltdown by the Tenn players and there was no effective guidance or chewing from the bench to stop it.

This is a talented Tenn team with lots of individual talent, so if they can put it together they could be dangerous. However, I just don't see it happening this year.
 
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
301
Reaction Score
452
Pat looked like a wax figure. Ten years ago getting blown by 20 much less 30 would have destroyed 10-20 clip boards. It is sad, but she needs to call it quits this year
 

HuskyNan

You Know Who
Joined
Aug 15, 2011
Messages
25,981
Reaction Score
214,417
Im in heaven, Im in heaven, Its beginning to look alot like Christmas all around ND. Dispicable, embarrassing, humiliating, did I leave anything out. Sit the starters and start rebuilding. The best compliment I have is Terrible. TN gave up, no execition, ran no plays. Dribble into traffic. This is not a top 15 team. No heart, no pride, no care in the world just going through the motions. A complete disgrace. I would bench a bunch of them. If I were the coach they wouldnt be wearing my uniform. Start rebuilding and start with the coaches. This is a very talented TN team. This TN team on paper is better then most. The problem lies with the coaching. Start from scratch. Stop pretending, stop living in the past. Its time to rebuild. If you think this is harsh, you better tuffin up. This wasnt an off game. This was a cumulation of the past 4 seasons.
Geez Tony. This is over the top, even for you.
 

Tonyc

Optimus Prime
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,498
Reaction Score
35,488
Tenn administration won't force Pat out, nor should they. However, IMHO this should be Pat's last year and hopefully she and those around her will recognize this. Its sad to see her on the bench looking so lost and out of touch. I understand the need to transfer responsibilities to the assistant coaches, but Pat needs to be able to fire up her players like she used to do. Tonight was a total meltdown by the Tenn players and there was no effective guidance or chewing from the bench to stop it.

This is a talented Tenn team with lots of individual talent, so if they can put it together they could be dangerous. However, I just don't see it happening this year.
I didnt mean get rid of Pat. Get rid of everybody else. Pat deserves to stay as long as she wants shes earned it.
 

Tonyc

Optimus Prime
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,498
Reaction Score
35,488
Geez Tony. This is over the top, even for you.
Nan as much as I hate TN for what they did to us, no coach deserves what this team did tonite. Pat deserves better.
 

cohenzone

Old Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
19,110
Reaction Score
23,305
I actually wanted them both to lose. Muffett is okay, but I just don't like the arrogance of ND sports in general. I also thought it odd that McGraw kept her entire starting team in until 1 minute was left. I guess she really did want to smack Tenn.

I do agree that it's sad seeing PS. She has no fire left.
 
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
879
Reaction Score
582
Said much of the same in the earlier thread.

Derived no joy from their loss. The pressure her players must be under was what I was mostly thinking about.

It was like watching the end of an era. Tragic.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk
 

Phil

Stats Geek
Joined
Aug 25, 2011
Messages
4,461
Reaction Score
5,838
I had to crack up and one comment the announcer made, reminding me of my odd statistical fact faux pas.

He said, can you believe this ND has now beaten both CT and TN in the same year. He said it in a tone of voice like it might the first time in history such a remarkable feat has happened.

So when's the last time it happened? Oh yeah, ten months ago.
 

Tonyc

Optimus Prime
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
5,498
Reaction Score
35,488
What did the Tennesse kids do that you had to say they have no heart, that it's like Christmas they were blown out? Let's have some class here
Made some changes. It was a little over the top. I got a little emotional. Sorry
 
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
861
Reaction Score
1,961
Some observations...



Massengale is good and is going to be VERY good but you can't expect a freshman to lead you to the promised land when the tools for the rest of the team have never been put into place. and by that, i mean teaching actual offense.

I do not follow TN closely. Did Massengale and Burdick arrive at Knoxville to take TN to the promised land? Or did Harrison, Massengale and Burdick arrive? You just cannot get the answer to some questions on the Summit.
 
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
861
Reaction Score
1,961
Heck of a game at South Bend tonight. TN was determined not to lose by 30 and they achieved their goal with margin to spare.

OK seriously this time.

Does this mean Holly Warlick will keep the seat warm for Nicki Caldwell until her contract at LSU expires?
 
Joined
Aug 29, 2011
Messages
154
Reaction Score
224
I actually wanted them both to lose. Muffett is okay, but I just don't like the arrogance of ND sports in general. I also thought it odd that McGraw kept her entire starting team in until 1 minute was left. I guess she really did want to smack Tenn.

I do agree that it's sad seeing PS. She has no fire left.
There's a way this can be done- a massive brawl breaks out and both teams forfeit to the NCAA. The commentators were bad: Dave O' Brien went into a monologue about how Tennessee will play anybody anywhere. Doris Burke is from South Bend. Notre Dame is from South Bend. Skylar Diggins is from South Bend. Doris was so busy carrying on about Skyler's 150,000+ fans on tweeter that she didn't correct him. This is as bad as Dickie V. and the men's Duke team, but we're going to have to hear about it. A Boneyard friend told me that referee Dee Kantner has slipped. She had a bad start tonight and I hope we don't get her in our re-match with ND. Muffett is in underrated coach. They only have two players that jump, and this is a smooth looking offense.
 
Joined
Nov 20, 2011
Messages
2,718
Reaction Score
7,094
The current situation doesn't bode well for Tennessee's future.

The bad performance in this game wasn't the players fault. They played hard the entire game but flagged at the end. Lack of conditioning because of recent injuries probably contributed to that.

The turmoil in the coaching ranks and the resulting lack of a cohesive coaching plan is a key factor that isn't likely to improve for a number of years to come. There are probably too many distractions for the coaches to concentrate on developing the players, or perhaps they just don't have Pat's skills. They need to find another Pat to pull things together again, and that will not be easy.

A large part of Tenn recruiting success was Pat's ability to put a team on the court year after year that was not only physically skilled, but well coached. She knew how to build a winner. Today, High School kids will see the handwriting on the wall, and will shy away from Tenn.

It makes me want to remind Geno to have his annual medical checkups and do all he can to stay healthy.
 

meyers7

You Talkin’ To Me?
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
23,522
Reaction Score
60,907
Figured ND would have their way with TN, especially at home. Didn't think it would be 30 point though.

But it does feel good. :)
 

EricLA

Cronus
Joined
Aug 24, 2011
Messages
15,123
Reaction Score
82,784
Heck of a game at South Bend tonight. TN was determined not to lose by 30 and they achieved their goal with margin to spare.

OK seriously this time.

Does this mean Holly Warlick will keep the seat warm for Nicki Caldwell until her contact at LSU expires?
that's a good question and i'm not sure there are many fans out there, if any, who are qualified to answer it. but a couple things.

First, Nikki just took over LSU this year so i'm not sure if Tennessee needs a new HC next year if she'd even be available. Second, as great and classy as she "looks" (to me she just looks like a head coach), she didn't recruit any great shakes at UCLA. i don't have the time or energy to go back and see just who she got, but a program witih the history of UCLA (even tho it's all on the men's side) ought to be able to recruit top kids to that program.

she took two teams to the NCAA's, but that was largely with another coach's recruits. this is the first year she's been gone (3 years of coaching and recruiting there) and the kids SHE recruited are 8-10 so far. perhaps she saw the writing on the walls which is why she skedaddled...

the Tennessee assistants have been there for over 20 years, but Micki didn't really do anything great while at Kentucky, and after going to Texas as an asst, came back to Tennessee. not sure if Holly or Dean are HC material. or if they'd even want it.

then there's Kelly Harper, at NC State - hard to recruit kids there, but it's got to be easier than recruiting kids to, say, Hartford. still, i'm not sure you can look at her record, successes, or recruiting and say she's going to continue to take Tennessee to great heights should she end up there.

i almost think they'd be better off looking outside their program and try to find someone at a mid major who hash done great things. Look at what Mitchell and Walz have accomplished at Kentucky and L'ville. maybe look at the HC's of Wisc Green Bay, Gonzaga, BYU, Marist, or other mid major type of programs that have really achieved success "in spite" of not being at a major school.

do Tennessee fans really think Gail G, or Sherri Coale, or Joanne Boyle or Charlie Turner Thorne or ___ (insert other big name coach here) would have great success at tennessee? i'm not so sure. and i'm not sure any of those coaches would even want to coach at Tennessee. but time will tell...
 

meyers7

You Talkin’ To Me?
Joined
Aug 26, 2011
Messages
23,522
Reaction Score
60,907
that it's like Christmas they were blown out?
I see no problems with this. That part I agee with. Anytime TN loses is a good day. Hello, it's TN.
 
Joined
Jan 22, 2012
Messages
4
Reaction Score
12
Tennessee, on paper, has Top 10 level talent. Additionally, there are a few players, namely Messengale and Johnson, who do seem to care and try to do well. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said for the remainder of the roster. The current version of the Lady Vols is a shadow of the passion, intensity, and aggressiveness exhibited by prior Tennessee teams. I feel that this is due in part to the lack of direction from the bench, as it has become noticeable that Coach Summitt is no longer the main coach for the Lady Vols. The Lady Vols have never been known for their offensive prowess, but you could always count on their rebounding and defensive skills. Even that seems to be missing this year. Mind you, there have been flashes of TN playing well (stretches against Baylor come to mind), but overall, there is no cohesiveness.

It is truly heartbreaking to watch Coach Summitt. I would love it if her drive, intensity, and fire could return to the sidelines and the "glare" could once more be directed towards players and referees alike. However, it does appear that we will no longer have that opportunity, and for that, I am sad. Coach Summitt, despite some missteps, truly built what WCBB is today.

I, for one, hope Tennessee can turn it around. WCBB is a lot more intriguing and interesting when TN is a player for the national title.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Online statistics

Members online
377
Guests online
2,243
Total visitors
2,620

Forum statistics

Threads
159,812
Messages
4,206,381
Members
10,077
Latest member
Mpjd2024


.
Top Bottom