NCAA D1 Player of the Year Poll

[Plebe]

What that says is that voters aren't doing their jobs. They are supposed to have a blank sheet and only vote on what's transpired this year. If someone was an All-American last year and had a BAD year, would they still get consideration?

Of course not. I'm just saying it's one factor that weighs in her favor. Nina Davis was an All-American the past two years. I wouldn't say she's having a "bad" year by any stretch, but her numbers are down enough from her All-American years (with much better players surrounding her now than was the case in her sophomore year) that she hasn't been making the midseason POY watchlists and she only made Second Team All-Big 12.

 

[1-of-the-6]

Have you ever seen Katie Lou games?
None, is my guess.

All of them this season. Every one. Via ESPN3 when they're not on somewhere else. Not every minute at the end of the blowouts, but she's not on the court by that time anyway.

 

[Buzzyboy]

Well I said if it's even close. For me it's not. Without Plum Washington, to me, is a mediocre team that would fail to make the NCAA's. Without KLS UConn is still very good although not a championship contender, but they get to go to Dallas. As Uc's post above clearly indicates with the numbers of her offensive skills and efficiency, Plum means more to that Washington team.

Now you're penalizing KLS because she has better teammates. So now, you judge the player of the year by the best player playing with lousy teammates? That might be a little bit off but it sure sounds like your point. I guess Breanna probably didn't deserve her player of the year awards because I'm sure UConn would have done pretty fine without her. If she wasn't there, it isn't like they'd only have 4 players on the court. UConn would have had a good player playing in her stead. So, shame on people voting for Breanna last year!

 

[1-of-the-6]

Man. This is ridiculous. Here's the deal. If you haven't seen Plum and Washington play at least a half dozen times this season you don't get to have an opinion on her or her team. You just don't. Not with me. And if you can't understand why, there's no saving you.

 

[UcMiami]

And just by the way - for a little professional UConn evaluation - Sue Bird is a huge fan of Plum and her game, and I bet she is lobbying her GM to figure out a way to bring her to Seattle!

 

[Plebe]

Man. This is ridiculous. Here's the deal. If you haven't seen Plum and Washington play at least a half dozen times this season you don't get to have an opinion on her or her team. You just don't. Not with me. And if you can't understand why, there's no saving you.

Here's the thing, though. Some people tend to see only what they want to see. They could watch her play 20 games and it won't matter.
It's hard to perceive anything objectively with homer glasses stapled to one's head.

 

[Coach]

I still don't get all the hype for Wilson. She's barely on my 2nd team AA, not anywhere close to discussion for NPOY. A prime example of a player who has all kinds of "hype and publicity", but has not performed nearly well enough if you really drill down into the results required for elite consideration.

Players off the top of my head who have played better and have better stats:

Kelsey Plum
KLS
Collier
Alexis Peterson
Kristin Anigwe
Tori Jankowska
Nia Coffey
Brionna Jones
Brittany Sykes
Taniya Page
Katija Laska
Asia Durr
Shatori Walker-Kimbrough
Lexi Brown

Wilson is not even in the top 50 in the nation in scoring average. I get it's not all about scoring, but if you look at the list of above players and their respective rebounds, or assists, or steals, etc etc, all of them have combined stats better than Wilson's. She was averaging close to 16 PPG for most of the year. I think she upped that and has come on strong lately, but let's face it - 17.7 PPG, 7.6 RPG, 59% FG%. Put those numbers on any other "lesser named" player and people would be like "All American? Umm No"...

Gabby is averaging 5.3 assist a game along with 86 steals and 45 blocks this season.

Are you taking into account that Gabby is arguably the best defensive player this year. She can defend 1-5 in the paint and perimeter. Rebecca Lobo just mentioned her as the best defensive play in the country. She's scoring and rebounding against 6-5 A'ja Wilson and 6-4 Coates from SC, 6-5 Lang from Texas . . .

You should re-watch the UCONN/ Notre Dame or South Carolina games where Gabby DOMINATED. Great players on your list but I doubt they would be able to accomplish what Gabby does. So if a lesser named player can do all these things against top 10 teams and talent, then I would say she's an "All American".

 

[Buckaroobanzai]

Man. This is ridiculous. Here's the deal. If you haven't seen Plum and Washington play at least a half dozen times this season you don't get to have an opinion on her or her team. You just don't. Not with me. And if you can't understand why, there's no saving you.

Absolutely right on. Having watched KP in several games this year, I concur that she is a magnificent offensive talent. She has scored more points than any women's college basketball player and, at least in the games I watched, scored essentially at will even though she was consistently face guarded. In my view (and I have seen KLS play most of her games @ Uconn), the decision is a no brainer: KP is the player of the year!

 

[JordyG]

Now you're penalizing KLS because she has better teammates. So now, you judge the player of the year by the best player playing with lousy teammates? That might be a little bit off but it sure sounds like your point. I guess Breanna probably didn't deserve her player of the year awards because I'm sure UConn would have done pretty fine without her. If she wasn't there, it isn't like they'd only have 4 players on the court. UConn would have had a good player playing in her stead. So, shame on people voting for Breanna last year!

Man, I love UConn. But some of you homers are just not satisfied unless every Husky wins every award every year. Then of course you'd criticize the presenters speech or the size or shape of the trophy.

 

[JordyG]

And just by the way - for a little professional UConn evaluation - Sue Bird is a huge fan of Plum and her game, and I bet she is lobbying her GM to figure out a way to bring her to Seattle!

To me Seattle is a far, far better fit than SA.

 

[Coach]

To me Seattle is a far, far better fit than SA.

I'm not sure. What are you going to do with Jewell Loyd?

 

[DefenseBB]

Do you really think Plum is a better PLAYER than Katie Lou?/ Scorer, maybe, not Player. The award isn't for Scorer of the Year-

YES, absolutely!!! Right now, this season, Plum is better than KLS. More points, more assists, more rebounds, more steals and means more to her team!

To JordyGs comments that Broadway has issues with, KLS has more upside and will be a better pro. KLS is my favorite player and she is just as much as deserving of all the accolades she is getting as Napheesa, Plum or Gabby. So if a tie exists between Plum and KLS, give it to Plum as the Senior.

These are all opinions on the site so mine is no more relevant than anyone else's given the logical support I present as long as a differeing opinion offers the same support of their view. In other words-don't just say my player is better! Show evidence. So my challenge to you is how is Plum less deserving given what I gave?

 

[Kaizen]

LOL, suddenly people claim how they love UConn and not allow anyone here says Katie Lou is NPOY.

And a BYer joined 6 years ago with less than 100 posts suddenly showed up and said choice Katie Lou is "the decision is a no brainer" ...

 

[JordyG]

I'm not sure. What are you going to do with Jewell Loyd?

Sad to say, but I don't think Jewel is the answer for that team. I like her game but frankly I think Plum's accuracy, movement and efficiency is a better fit for Seattle. I also personally think Plum's game is nicer all around. Coach, the girl is nice.

 

[JordyG]

LOL, suddenly people claim how they love UConn and not allow anyone here says Katie Lou is NPOY.

And a BYer joined 6 years ago with less than 100 posts said choice Katie Lou is "the decision is a no brainer" ...

Kaiz, I love ya. But I don't even think Lou, at this time, is the best player on the team. Pheese gets my vote. Some would say (rightfully) that Gabby is. But I also think as DefenseBB said, that Lou's upside is greater than Plum's. So is Pheese and Gabby's.

 

[Coach]

Sad to say, but I don't think Jewel is the answer for that team. I like her game but frankly I think Plum's accuracy, movement and efficiency is a better fit for Seattle. I also personally think Plum's game is nicer all around. Coach, the girl is nice.

I agree. I don't think Jewel has seen a shot she didn't like.

 

[JordyG]

YES, absolutely!!! Right now, this season, Plum is better than KLS. More points, more assists, more rebounds, more steals and means more to her team!

To JordyGs comments that Broadway has issues with, KLS has more upside and will be a better pro. KLS is my favorite player and she is just as much as deserving of all the accolades she is getting as Napheesa, Plum or Gabby. So if a tie exists between Plum and KLS, give it to Plum as the Senior.

These are all opinions on the site so mine is no more relevant than anyone else's given the logical support I present as long as a differeing opinion offers the same support of their view. In other words-don't just say my player is better! Show evidence. So my challenge to you is how is Plum less deserving given what I gave?

100% on you. Opinions are, opinions ain't. Glad to be a BY-er.

 

[EricSD]

Gabby is averaging 5.3 assist a game along with 86 steals and 45 blocks this season.

Are you taking into account that Gabby is arguably the best defensive player this year. She can defend 1-5 in the paint and perimeter. Rebecca Lobo just mentioned her as the best defensive play in the country. She's scoring and rebounding against 6-5 A'ja Wilson and 6-4 Coates from SC, 6-5 Lang from Texas . . .

You should re-watch the UCONN/ Notre Dame or South Carolina games where Gabby DOMINATED. Great players on your list but I doubt they would be able to accomplish what Gabby does. So if a lesser named player can do all these things against top 10 teams and talent, then I would say she's an "All American".

My post had nothing to do with Gabby. It was solely about A'ja Wilson...

 

[JordyG]

I agree. I don't think Jewel has seen a shot she didn't like.

Funny enough is every time I watch Plum, and I've seen her maybe 15x over the years, her game just gets nicer. Her scorers IQ is so far ahead of DD's (ugh) or K. Mitchell's. Plum has a nice change of pace with the ball, but Mitchell's cutting ability with pace while handling the ball is phenomenal. But again, she too is wild and a chucker.

 

[Orangutan]

Isn't it possible that instead of getting her teammates involved and allowing them better opportunities to score, she tried to win these games by herself and actually COST her team the wins.

No.

Your thoughts are purely speculative and maybe her team would be better if she WASN'T scoring at the level she was. If she's not allowing her teammates to get involved to the extent that they are getting better, maybe she's actually a detriment to the team. Everyone here knows that Samuelson could be scoring appreciably more than she does if she shot more but she's working WITHIN the team formula that has made UConn the envy of women's basketball.

How is that Plum assists more frequently and has a better assist/turnover ratio than Samuelson and yet somehow Plum's the one not getting her teammates involved?

The idea that Plum is "actually a detriment to the team" is ludicrous.

Extrapolating Samuelson's points/fga to Plum's number of shots still leaves her 91 points short of Plum's total. And your efficiency usually goes down with an increase in FGA. It's not merely that Plum scores more than Samuelson because she shoots more. She scores more AND more efficiently.

 

[Kaizen]

Kaiz, I love ya. But I don't even think Lou, at this time, is the best player on the team. Pheese gets my vote. Some would say (rightfully) that Gabby is. But I also think as DefenseBB said, that Lou's upside is greater than Plum's. So is Pheese and Gabby's.

Jordy, you have your own opinions, other people have their own opinions.

We should respect both sides ....

 

[Wally East]

Jordy, you have your own opinions, other people have their own opinions.

We should respect both sides ....

There are informed opinions and there are uninformed opinions. Uniformed opinions are worthless.

 

[nwhoopfan]

Isn't it possible that instead of getting her teammates involved and allowing them better opportunities to score, she tried to win these games by herself and actually COST her team the wins. I'm not sure that happened but I'm being the devils advocate. Your thoughts are purely speculative and maybe her team would be better if she WASN'T scoring at the level she was. If she's not allowing her teammates to get involved to the extent that they are getting better, maybe she's actually a detriment to the team. Everyone here knows that Samuelson could be scoring appreciably more than she does if she shot more but she's working WITHIN the team formula that has made UConn the envy of women's basketball.

I can understand if someone hasn't watched UW this year they might ask this question. It doesn't fit the reality of the situation though. Plum is very adept at the drive and kick game. At that point it's on her teammates to knock down shots. Some games they have, some games they haven't. Stanford is an extreme example but it illustrates the point quite clearly. Other than Plum, the UW starters were 2-26 from the floor. Let that sink in for a minute. The bench was a bit better, going 4-11. So combined, the team excluding Plum shot 6-37 that game. Plum was 17-27. If anything Plum should've taken MORE not less shots that game. That's the most drastic example, but there are other games where the other Huskies just haven't gotten it done and it's been up to Plum to carry them.

Utah was another fairly stark example. Plum was 19-28. Osahor was 5-11 and scored 14 but fouled out at the beginning of the 4th quarter. The other starters were 3-16 and none scored more than 5 points. Not much from the bench either. In that game, there were at least 5 or 6 times in the 2nd half alone when Plum drove and dished to a teammate for a wide open 3 and they missed every single one of them. Plum can set her teammates up, but she can't make the shot for them.

It seems to me that most games she starts out trying to get her teammates involved, then takes over as the game progresses. When the other Huskies are hitting some shots they are dangerous, when they aren't they are very beatable even when Plum is unstoppable.

 

[Kaizen]

There are informed opinions and there are uninformed opinions. Uniformed opinions are worthless.

Thank you for your non-interest in UConn women's basketball as well as your uninformed views about acting....

 

[JordyG]

Jordy, you have your own opinions, other people have their own opinions.

We should respect both sides ....

Katz with you it's never an argument. It's always a discussion.

 

[jonson]

Thank you for your non-interest in UConn women's basketball as well as your uninformed views about acting....

I don't know how "non-interest" gets into this, but, in any case, I think Wally East, NWhoopfan, Orangutan, and the other Plum defenders deserve better than this. I don't post a lot here (obviously) but read daily and have been a UCONN fan since the beginning of the Geno era (I grew up in Wethersfield) and an Oregon fan (where I live now) for almost as long as that. With Washington being Oregon's "Notre Dame" I certainly do not think of myself as a "homer" as far as the school to the north is concerned.

But what too many people in this thread have said about Plum is imo completely wrong and can only (I hope) be based on not having watched many of Washington's games this year. The Plum of her first years in the Pac12 may indeed have been akin to Ohio's Kelsey Mitchell. This year, however, she has been extraordinarily efficient and done everything possible to carry a team in which she only gets consistent help from one other player. There was a moment toward the end of the tournament game with Oregon in which she slid 10 ft across the floor to get to a loose ball which she then batted to a teammate for an easy layup. It was exactly the kind of play that UCONN fans expect (and see) all the time, but also the kind of thing Plum has been doing (in addition to the scoring) all season. Is her ceiling higher than, or even as high as, Katie Lou's or Napheesa's? Probably not. But she is a very fine player nevertheless and in my view an entirely appropriate choice for player of the year.

 

[Kaizen]

Katz with you it's never an argument. It's always a discussion.

Thank you, Jordy.
How can I not like you ???

 

[Wally East]

Thank you for your non-interest in UConn women's basketball as well as your uninformed views about acting....

Oh, Kaizen. I don't even know why I bother responding to you.

What's so hard to understand about the idea that uninformed opinions are worthless? If someone hasn't seen "Citizen Kane," how can they comment on it? If they do comment, the opinion is meaningless. What insight could they offer? They haven't seen the movie.

If someone never saw Kelsey Plum play, how can they compare the parts of the game that don't show up in box scores to another player's? If do offer an opinion on the comparison, the opinion isn't worth much. What insight could they offer about Plum? They haven't seen her play.

This isn't hard or new. Informed opinions are valuable. Uninformed opinions are not.

 

[Kaizen]

I don't know how "non-interest" gets into this, but, in any case, I think Wally East, NWhoopfan, Orangutan, and the other Plum defenders deserve better than this. I don't post a lot here (obviously) but read daily and have been a UCONN fan since the beginning of the Geno era (I grew up in Wethersfield) and an Oregon fan (where I live now) for almost as long as that. With Washington being Oregon's "Notre Dame" I certainly do not think of myself as a "homer" as far as the school to the north is concerned.

But what too many people in this thread have said about Plum is imo completely wrong and can only (I hope) be based on not having watched many of Washington's games this year. The Plum of her first years in the Pac12 may indeed have been akin to Ohio's Kelsey Mitchell. This year, however, she has been extraordinarily efficient and done everything possible to carry a team in which she only gets consistent help from one other player. There was a moment toward the end of the tournament game with Oregon in which she slid 10 ft across the floor to get to a loose ball which she then batted to a teammate for an easy layup. It was exactly the kind of play that UCONN fans expect (and see) all the time, but also the kind of thing Plum has been doing (in addition to the scoring) all season. Is her ceiling higher than, or even as high as, Katie Lou's or Napheesa's? Probably not. But she is a very fine player nevertheless and in my view an entirely appropriate choice for player of the year.

johson, I have a house in Seattle and my 2 daughters went to UW.

 

[Wally East]

State per game normalized for 40 minutes, in case anyone was wondering:

Plum plays about 37 min/game, while KLS and Fee play 31 and 30.

You could argue that the 6.5 difference in rebounds per 40 minutes makes up for 7 points. I'm not sure *I* would buy that but you could argue it. (On the other hand, there's the difference in a/g).