MLS 2019

[Vowelguy]

Sacramento is team 29.

Is MLS ever going to go to a divisional setup? 15 teams is a jumbled mess.

 

[LIuconn]

Where will 30 be?

 

[Purple Stein]

Where will 30 be?

 

[DarthGrumpy]

I did not know that MLS already released drawings of the Inter Miami's proposed stadium on top of a toxic waste dump. This must be during a game showing Miami's famously supportive fan base, though it does look a little less crowded than the usual Miami Marlin's game.

 

[Pudge]

Beckham (and partners) have the Eurotrash view of America. Yeah. Maybe Miami can flourish.

But for my view ... owning & running a Solid Program in Sacramento is a better MLS construct. You’ll play solid LA Teams, Seattle, Portland, RSL ... and have a driving distance rival in San Jose. A city like Sacramento will be behind you.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

It's clear that MLS has simplified the criteria for expansion teams - money, money and show MLS owners the money. That's it.

Charlotte 'front of line' for MLS expansion - Garber

MLS commissioner Don Garber said Friday that Charlotte is at the front of the line of potential expansion cities, ahead of Las Vegas and Phoenix.

www.espn.com

"It's fair to say that Charlotte has done a lot of work, to move their bid really to the front of line," Garber said. "It starts with David Tepper, the owner of the Carolina Panthers. He's a very passionate guy about sport, he's very passionate about Charlotte."

Tepper is indeed passionate about Charlotte; but, he has not done the work to build a fan base and development program in the Charlotte area (Raleigh has) and he seems to be using the MLS carrot as a way to get public financing to renovate his football stadium instead of investing in an actual soccer pitch. Without an existing, strong fan base (Seattle and Atlanta has such before MLS arrived), its crazy to think a city with a metro area of 2.57 Million (#23 in the US) will be able to pack a NFL-sized stadium of 60K for an entire season of MLS soccer as Seattle with 3.94 Million (#15) and Atlanta with 5.95 (#9) can. That's why comparable metros with MLS stadiums (Denver with 2.93, Orlando with 2.57, Portland 2.48, Sacramento with 2.48, Cincinnati with 2.19) all have soccer venues int he 20K to 30K range.

As for NFL owners in MLS, how's that new stadium for the New England Revolution coming?

 

[Waquoit]

It's clear that MLS has simplified the criteria for expansion teams - money, money and show MLS owners the money. That's it.

The MLS is a Ponzi scheme. Just more proof.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

No doubt MLS absolutely chases owner dinero, but recent additions also strongly suggest current and projected population and employment growth, demographics (age, ethnicity), increasing disposable income, media/DMA shifts, etc. weigh in MLS expansion calculus.

Reasonable or otherwise beyond the obvious deep pocket owner impact, shrinking population, economic projections, etc versus traditional and current soccer hot bed St Louis. The Gateway to the West gets a team based on soccer heritage versus larger, faster growing increasingly hipster magnets, e.g., Nashville, Charlotte, even Sacramento with about 2X St Louis’ population. Edit: Little did I know STL was awarded a franchise)

Even supported by Quicken’s founder and NBA franchise owners, metro Detroit appears to lose despite its’ population bottoming out and possibly even growing. No deep pocket challenges nor lack of prospective Fortune 500 support exists. However, slower economic growth, perhaps overall metro wealth, average age, etc. may not help Detroit’s bid versus other cities.

 

[Pudge]

I’m not sure I can quibble with their expansion plan. Yes. Deep pocket owners WITH local ties. Austin Saint Louis (legacy plus Enterprise) Sacramento all day

Cincinnati will be interesting after the first year stumble - after LAFC & Atlanta rose.

I would think Raleigh over Charlotte because of soccer base. But one guy can make a huge difference.

The Big question mark ... is Miami & Beckham. Feels flaky & Florida has had plenty of shaky franchises

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

I would think Raleigh over Charlotte because of soccer base. But one guy can make a huge difference.

In MLS eyes, one guy with legitimately more massive deep pockets makes even a huuuuuger difference. However, Charlotte appears to have 2X Raleigh’s population, the Charlotte metro area DMA and population being larger than the RTP DMA, and larger growth projections may tip the MLS scale over the RTP’s upside potential and minor league success. Corporate and political influences ???

 

[DarthGrumpy]

In MLS eyes, one guy with legitimately more massive deep pockets makes even a huuuuuger difference. However, Charlotte appears to have 2X Raleigh’s population, the Charlotte metro area DMA and population being larger than the RTP DMA, and larger growth projections may tip the MLS scale over the RTP’s upside potential and minor league success. Corporate and political influences ???

On the corp side, while RDU has a lot of employers, outside of the Universities and their hospitals, many are not headquartered there - Cisco Systems (Silicon Valley), GlaxoSmithKline (UK), Wells Fargo (San Francisco), Lenovo (Hong Kong), Fidelity (Boston), etc. I think SAS is one of their biggest. Red Hat was another at one time; but, they got bought by IBM (NY). In Charlotte, they Have Bank of America, Lowe's, Honeywell, Sun Trust/BB&T, etc. So, that and population-wise, Charlotte is a lot bigger. My contention is that the Raleigh soccer team has been around for a long-time, has a strong basis, and they have a proposed soccer stadium to plug into Raleigh. Charlotte has money and a NFL stadium.

 

[ZooCougar]

I’m not sure I can quibble with their expansion plan. Yes. Deep pocket owners WITH local ties. Austin Saint Louis (legacy plus Enterprise) Sacramento all day

Cincinnati will be interesting after the first year stumble - after LAFC & Atlanta rose.

I would think Raleigh over Charlotte because of soccer base. But one guy can make a huge difference.

The Big question mark ... is Miami & Beckham. Feels flaky & Florida has had plenty of shaky franchises

going to be fun when they stop expanding and that expansion money stops flowing in.

 

[Waquoit]

going to be fun when they stop expanding and that expansion money stops flowing in.

That's when we'll get pro/rel!

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

going to be fun when they stop expanding and that expansion money stops flowing in.

Yup, then MLS and existing owners may try flipping poor performing franchises (financially) to other desperate cities or new prospective owners willing to throw their wallets at ego rides.

Unless North American media and advertisers inexplicably opt not to give a hoot about MLS teams moving from big to potentially small DMA, MLS dramatically changes its’ ownership structure, and/or MLS relicates from the States and Canada , chances of pro/rel ...

 

[DarthGrumpy]

That's when we'll get pro/rel!

There is no chance on earth that the ego's of MLS's millionaires/billionaires club would be able to handle religation. Just imagine if there was relegation in the NFL that mess it would cause if Miami and both New York teams could be relegated in the same season?

 

[Waquoit]

There is no chance on earth that the ego's of MLS's millionaires/billionaires club would be able to handle religation.

Remember, we're talking about a scenario after the valuation bubble bursts. Pro/rel might be a way for these guys to get out with something.

 

[ZooCougar]

Inside the confidential 2016 study that provided the blueprint for MLS’s modern era
Inside the confidential 2016 study that provided the...

Behind a paywall.

 

[Waquoit]

Inside the confidential 2016 study that provided the blueprint for MLS’s modern era
Inside the confidential 2016 study that provided the...

This is all I needed to see : [Boston Consulting Group] recommends coaching the league’s broadcast partners to “reinforce quality in broadcasts,” even suggesting that the league might launch a national “play quality” campaign to change its perception.

Since the level of play isn't going to get much better they paid millions for someone to tell them to just proclaim it better anyway. They think we're nitwits.

 

[ZooCougar]

This is all I needed to see : [Boston Consulting Group] recommends coaching the league’s broadcast partners to “reinforce quality in broadcasts,” even suggesting that the league might launch a national “play quality” campaign to change its perception.

Since the level of play isn't going to get much better they paid millions for someone to tell them to just proclaim it better anyway. They think we're nitwits.

I think it’s funny that only 3-4 teams are turning a profit.

the study also recommended they shut down academies.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

As the Charlotte thread went-off the rails a bit, posting this hear. The owner of the Panthers - Tepper, the Mayor of Charlotte and MLS's Garber had a press conference scheduled for this Tuesday, the 18th, for a major announcement.

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sports/article238306243.html

I actually like Charlotte and think its turning into a great city; but, I don't like how Tepper is basically buying and MLS franchise instead of earning it. In addition, his interet in MLS is at least driven by a 'need' (he's worth $2.3 Billion) to get more publci money to renovate his NFL football stadium, which seemd to have worked as Charlotte has offered $100 Million. The Charlotte metro area does not have the legacy, grassroots support of soccer like Raleigh/Durham, which is had a professional soccer team (NC Railhawks/North Carolina FC) since 2006 and averages 4,500 fans per game. Charlotte added a USL team in 2014 (Charlotte Independence) and averages 1,600 per game. In addition, its crazy to think that this new franchise over the long-term will be able to validate playing in a NFL design stadium of 75K in terms of ticket sales AND environment within in a soccer culture that is in its infancy in a metro area that is 2/3 and less than 1/2smaller than the two 2 franchises that Tepper keep comparing to in Seattle and Atlanta (Charlotte #23 in the US with 2.569 Million, Seattle #15 with 3.939 Million and Atlanta (#9 with 5.950 Million).

As I have said before, if these jealous owners (Tepper sees Blank at Atlanta as his rival), make them earn it. Move to a European model where a new owner has to buy a lower tier team (USL) and invest in the team's players and facilities to earn their way-up to the big league via promotion. It also forces existing owners to continue to invest in their MLS team unless that want to be relegated down. That competition results in better teams, a better players, and a better experience for fans.

 

[ZooCougar]

As the Charlotte thread went-off the rails a bit, posting this hear. The owner of the Panthers - Tepper, the Mayor of Charlotte and MLS's Garber had a press conference scheduled for this Tuesday, the 18th, for a major announcement.

https://www.charlotteobserver.com/sports/article238306243.html

I actually like Charlotte and think its turning into a great city; but, I don't like how Tepper is basically buying and MLS franchise instead of earning it. In addition, his interet in MLS is at least driven by a 'need' (he's worth $2.3 Billion) to get more publci money to renovate his NFL football stadium, which seemd to have worked as Charlotte has offered $100 Million. The Charlotte metro area does not have the legacy, grassroots support of soccer like Raleigh/Durham, which is had a professional soccer team (NC Railhawks/North Carolina FC) since 2006 and averages 4,500 fans per game. Charlotte added a USL team in 2014 (Charlotte Independence) and averages 1,600 per game. In addition, its crazy to think that this new franchise over the long-term will be able to validate playing in a NFL design stadium of 75K in terms of ticket sales AND environment within in a soccer culture that is in its infancy in a metro area that is 2/3 and less than 1/2smaller than the two 2 franchises that Tepper keep comparing to in Seattle and Atlanta (Charlotte #23 in the US with 2.569 Million, Seattle #15 with 3.939 Million and Atlanta (#9 with 5.950 Million).

As I have said before, if these jealous owners (Tepper sees Blank at Atlanta as his rival), make them earn it. Move to a European model where a new owner has to buy a lower tier team (USL) and invest in the team's players and facilities to earn their way-up to the big league via promotion. It also forces existing owners to continue to invest in their MLS team unless that want to be relegated down. That competition results in better teams, a better players, and a better experience for fans.

I am sort of glad NC Fc is getting . They shouldn‘t have sold out to the USL and MLS. Same goes for Ottawa which was another USL team that shuttered probably forever this winter.

 

[upstater]

I think it’s funny that only 3-4 teams are turning a profit.

the study also recommended they shut down academies.

I know this can be too political a statement for this board, but I find the professional consulting class so underwhelming in terms of quality, that it doesn't surprise me their advice is "tell 'em it's great," since they wouldn't know excellence or quality themselves. Every org, forprofit or nonprofit, seems to be infiltrated by these know-nothings and their advice. A nation of finks and fakes.

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

Imagine selling US and Canadian media, Madison Avenue, etc on relegation of teams in/near the City, Chicago, LA, Houston, Bay Area, etc to low populated, backwater cities, and slow or negative growth locations. Sorrycuse, Sioux City, Saskatoon ... suhhhhh-weeeeet!

 

[Waquoit]

Imagine selling US and Canadian media, Madison Avenue, etc on relegation of teams in/near the City, Chicago, LA, Houston, Bay Area, etc to low populated, backwater cities, and slow or negative growth locations. Sorrycuse, Sioux City, Saskatoon ... suhhhhh-weeeeet!

That's what will happen after the massive implosion. Soccer will become a local sport!

 

[Da_Aisijimo_Gou]

That's what will happen after the massive implosion. Soccer will become a local sport!

Dont see professional soccer in the US transitioning to a local nor even an entirely regional sport, but can envision a reconstituted, downsized, or newly organized top division of sorts with fewer franchises. Time will tell