Mid Term Exams are not over

[Tonyc]

Another A for UConn. Last nite poise determination effort and patience. I thought UConn used all 4 to pull out this win. How good is this team? Really Really good. Having 5 ball handlers on the floor is priceless. Being able to get a rebound and run with it, and pass it, and attack the basket and not just stand around, but moving because they can, because they are quick and becasue we are very good ballhandlers. We won again with defense. We won with a short bench which BTW we need to get some of our starters more rest.

I saw Ohio St rushing last nite. I saw them playing to much one on one. Mitchell is great however Ohio St needs to run plays to get everybody else involved. Ohio St has alot of potential to be very good. They have a good coach however watching UConn again patience, and poise just running plays well its a thing of beauty and no other team we have faced this season comes close.

So its off to Nebraska and I dont think it will be easy. We will win but I expect a hard fought game. Again our starters need a rest and Im hoping we can get out to a big lead and rest them before Maryland. Dont forget MD is at MD and its Christmas break so I dont expect a huge crowd which will help. MD another very talented team that really hasnt played a very tuff schedule, so we shall see.

This UConn team is a machine that runs their stuff almost flawlessly. They are consistent and relentless. You could see last nite right after Mitchell went off they didnt seem to be bothered. They continued to run their stuff knowing that eventually they would take the game over. Thats called trusting your stuff, and confidence. Nebraska will be number 86 in a row. Who wouldve thought? Geno is just that Great.

 

[msf22b]

Tony

Wonderful post as always
Isn't it remarkable what these overlooked kids have been able to accomplish?
The only qualm I have with your argument is your statement that "they have a good coach."

A case could be made that Ohio State had by far the greater collective talent on the floor last night.
Extraordinarily athletic players; deceptive and quick who can shoot lights out.

But their individual excellence could not hold a candle to UConn's team BB concept.
Coach Kevin McGuff can be complimented for recruiting a gaggle of great players.
But his inability to teach them the essence of team ball dooms their program;
relegates them to a lower rank.

Debbie Antonelli is correct; other coaches need to step up and fast.
This season, especially, is getting embarrassing.
With fine, but not overwhelming talent and no bench, UConn continues to prevail.
As Geno himself says...it shouldn't be happening
But so far, no group has found the answer to the organization that our program brings both on D (a thing of beauty) and O

Perhaps, before he retires, Geno could organize a doctoral level seminar, entitled
Rudiments and Practice of Coaching Basketball on the Collegiate Level. (6 credits)
Perhaps that might help.
Attendance required for all D1, top-25 coaches; (optional for those that have won 2 National Championships).

 

[Tonyc]

I gotta tell ya. I was just thinking. We stop Mitchell and many of the top scorers on opposing teams but they dont stop UConns top scorers. This year Lou and Collier just keep on scoring and opponents defenses dont stop them. They get their points and most of the time at a high percentage. As far as Ohio States coach being good. Compare him to most of the other coaches and he does well. Compare him to Geno and, well, you really cant compare any coach to Geno. Geno is in Geno Land and there is no other coach that has gotten.

 

[msf22b]

Tony

We played better team ball, without coaching, 3 on 3, half-court in Jewel Avenue Park in the 50's, then Ohio State played last night.
If someone was hogging the ball, dribbling too much or taking all the shots, someone would yell; "chucker." and that ended it.

If that's good coaching, I get chills thinking what bad coaching must be like.

 

[Kibitzer]

Tony

We played better team ball, without coaching, 3 on 3, half-court in Jewel Avenue Park in the 50's, then Ohio State played last night.
If someone was hogging the ball, dribbling too much or taking all the shots, someone would yell; "chucker." and that ended it.

If that's good coaching, I get chills thinking what bad coaching must be like.

McGuff lost control of his team the day he hired Kelsey Mitchell's dad as his assistant coach. (That's how he recruited his star.)

So, who's in charge?

 

[ochoopsfan]

Tony

We played better team ball, without coaching, 3 on 3, half-court in Jewel Avenue Park in the 50's, then Ohio State played last night.
If someone was hogging the ball, dribbling too much or taking all the shots, someone would yell; "chucker." and that ended it.

If that's good coaching, I get chills thinking what bad coaching must be like.

Is that Jewel Avenue Park in Flushing Queens off of Utopia Pkwy? If so, I played BBall there in the late 70's and and 80's.

 

[ochoopsfan]

McGuff lost control of his team the day he hired Kelsey Mitchell's dad as his assistant coach. (That's how he recruited his star.)

So, who's in charge?

Agree,

I was more disappointed in tOSU on the court last night than I was happy with UConn. What a horrible exhibition of "Me" ball vs "We" ball. If that is what McGuff has his team do than I am glad I dont watch them often.

 

[ME Husky Fan]

Tony

We played better team ball, without coaching, 3 on 3, half-court in Jewel Avenue Park in the 50's, then Ohio State played last night.
If someone was hogging the ball, dribbling too much or taking all the shots, someone would yell; "chucker." and that ended it.

If that's good coaching, I get chills thinking what bad coaching must be like.

Back where I grew up 60 miles north of Philly, we called 'chuckers' 'Gunnar Back's', after a newscaster on Channel 6 in Philly. I had to laugh at the OSU coach's comments about Mitchell getting her team involved - 1 assist from her and I think less than 10 overall as a team? Reminds me of who I thought was the best college Bball player ever - Pete Maravich, who ended up with a bunch of personal records but no postseason laurels on his resume. I think UCONN beats opponents game over game and year over year because they buy into a system, they execute to that system, their team defense is a huge differential, they're typically smarter than their opponent and it's tough to out-coach them.

 

[ME Husky Fan]

Tony

We played better team ball, without coaching, 3 on 3, half-court in Jewel Avenue Park in the 50's, then Ohio State played last night.
If someone was hogging the ball, dribbling too much or taking all the shots, someone would yell; "chucker." and that ended it.

If that's good coaching, I get chills thinking what bad coaching must be like.

Back where I grew up 60 miles north of Philly, we called 'chuckers' 'Gunnar Back's', after a newscaster on Channel 6 in Philly. I had to laugh at the OSU coach's comments about Mitchell getting her team involved - 1 assist from her and I think less than 10 overall as a team? Reminds me of who I thought was the best college Bball player ever - Pete Maravich, who ended up with a bunch of personal records but no postseason laurels on his resume. I think UCONN beats opponents game over game and year over year because they buy into a system, they execute to that system, their team defense is a huge differential, they're typically smarter than their opponent and it's tough to out-coach them.

 

[EricLA]

I am consistently amazed at how other teams not named UCONN run offense (or perhaps I should say I'm amazed at how they DON'T run offense). So much dribbling by one player around the perimeter. So much 1 on 1 (6 assists TOTAL for OSU on 27 made baskets. Contrast that to 17 assists for UCONN on 28 made baskets). It's not even that these teams don't run plays - they simply do not run offense. It's often just mishmash of running around, probing our defense, and then driving into the teeth and jacking up a shot. And even worse for opponents, when they DO run a play, UCONN plays such stellar defense that their play often breaks down, resulting in bad shot attempts.

The announcers kept talking about how Mitchell likes to get other teammates involved. Were they watching the same game we were? She's a great talent and a scoring machine, but a "willing passer" she is not.

I also disagree with the poster who said "this season is embarrassing". I don't ever recall Geno saying this "shouldn't be happening" (he did say he wanted the team to get their asses kicked so they would see it's not this easy). UCONN may not have "overwhelming" talent this season, but they do have overwhelming coaching, chemistry, and team play. They have players who (unlike Mitchell) have completely embraced the concept of Team First. And to me, it's the opposite of embarrassing. It shows that even without the BEST talent, UCONN still has the best coaching, and best TEAM oriented players.

And it's not something other coaches can just learn. I believe Geno can get the kind of team first players now for several reasons:

1. He's ALWAYS done it this way - starting when he had losing teams thru turning UCONN into a dynasty
   
2. He's achieved tremendous success getting the right players, even if they are great
3. Players who want to be part of something special still flock to UCONN
4. Players also know they can be developed to be the very best they can be (just look at our WNBA results and Olympians) while NOT being a "superstar"

It's especially hard for other coaches to emulate this because if they want to land other great players, there is much more of a "me first" attitude in this tech savvy, social media generation. Coaches who don't have Geno's history and track record probably end up promising these kids things that Geno would never promise. Geno and co. have noticed this and it's why it's generally harder to find the right kids for UCONN.

The reason I'm explaining all this is because emulating UCONN is not just something that CAN happen at most programs, even if they wanted to. They don't have the history of success, and don't have the ability to attract top talent while playing unselfish basketball. I think there are several teams who do that well (Notre Dame comes to mind), and others who are pretty close, but most teams simply can't recruit the way UCONN can, even if they wanted to morph into a totally "team first" program...

 

[Ozzie Nelson]

I am consistently amazed at how other teams not named UCONN run offense (or perhaps I should say I'm amazed at how they DON'T run offense). So much dribbling by one player around the perimeter. So much 1 on 1 (6 assists TOTAL for OSU on 27 made baskets. Contrast that to 17 assists for UCONN on 28 made baskets). It's not even that these teams don't run plays - they simply do not run offense. It's often just mishmash of running around, probing our defense, and then driving into the teeth and jacking up a shot. And even worse for opponents, when they DO run a play, UCONN plays such stellar defense that their play often breaks down, resulting in bad shot attempts.

The announcers kept talking about how Mitchell likes to get other teammates involved. Were they watching the same game we were? She's a great talent and a scoring machine, but a "willing passer" she is not.

I also disagree with the poster who said "this season is embarrassing". I don't ever recall Geno saying this "shouldn't be happening" (he did say he wanted the team to get their asses kicked so they would see it's not this easy). UCONN may not have "overwhelming" talent this season, but they do have overwhelming coaching, chemistry, and team play. They have players who (unlike Mitchell) have completely embraced the concept of Team First. And to me, it's the opposite of embarrassing. It shows that even without the BEST talent, UCONN still has the best coaching, and best TEAM oriented players.

And it's not something other coaches can just learn. I believe Geno can get the kind of team first players now for several reasons:

1. He's ALWAYS done it this way - starting when he had losing teams thru turning UCONN into a dynasty
   
2. He's achieved tremendous success getting the right players, even if they are great
3. Players who want to be part of something special still flock to UCONN
4. Players also know they can be developed to be the very best they can be (just look at our WNBA results and Olympians) while NOT being a "superstar"

It's especially hard for other coaches to emulate this because if they want to land other great players, there is much more of a "me first" attitude in this tech savvy, social media generation. Coaches who don't have Geno's history and track record probably end up promising these kids things that Geno would never promise. Geno and co. have noticed this and it's why it's generally harder to find the right kids for UCONN.

The reason I'm explaining all this is because emulating UCONN is not just something that CAN happen at most programs, even if they wanted to. They don't have the history of success, and don't have the ability to attract top talent while playing unselfish basketball. I think there are several teams who do that well (Notre Dame comes to mind), and others who are pretty close, but most teams simply can't recruit the way UCONN can, even if they wanted to morph into a totally "team first" program...

Fine post Eric...

 

[huskeynut]

Eric - you got it.

I will add that other coaches don't seem to have the stomach to bench the "me" players. Its easier to let me "do their thing" than have them ride the pines.

Geno has no such problems.

 

[Florida Fan]

Agree,

I was more disappointed in tOSU on the court last night than I was happy with UConn. What a horrible exhibition of "Me" ball vs "We" ball. If that is what McGuff has his team do than I am glad I dont watch them often.[/QUOTE

McGruff, Muffet, Warwick, Staley, they love their kids and they seek adoration in return. That's why Mitchell, Agunbowale and DeShields can dribble and shoot with impunity. Against the cupcakes that style doesn't hurt them, up against UCONN it's a death knell. These coaches have great cumulative records, but fall apart against the Huskies because it ain't team basketball and nobody gets reamed for that level of ego-centered stupidity. Pull that in Storrs and you WILL sit, not getting back in until you get the message.

 

[victor64]

Two added thoughts about the UConn program that must have some influence on recruiting.

UConn graduates 100% of its four year players.
UConn players typically do very well at the next level.

The only negative that I can think of is that some kids might not like the cold weather in the middle of no where and lately that hasn't been much of a factor.

 

[Ozzie Nelson]

Parental propinquity persuades prospective performers.

 

[msf22b]

Is that Jewel Avenue Park in Flushing Queens off of Utopia Pkwy? If so, I played BBall there in the late 70's and and 80's.

Yeah, did we not discuss this 2 years ago?
Or, perhaps someone else?

I played there through high school
Ca: 53-56
Lived on 178 near Union Tpke.

 

[Kibitzer]

I am consistently amazed at how other teams not named UCONN run offense (or perhaps I should say I'm amazed at how they DON'T run offense). So much dribbling by one player around the perimeter. So much 1 on 1 (6 assists TOTAL for OSU on 27 made baskets. Contrast that to 17 assists for UCONN on 28 made baskets). It's not even that these teams don't run plays - they simply do not run offense. It's often just mishmash of running around, probing our defense, and then driving into the teeth and jacking up a shot. And even worse for opponents, when they DO run a play, UCONN plays such stellar defense that their play often breaks down, resulting in bad shot attempts.

The announcers kept talking about how Mitchell likes to get other teammates involved. Were they watching the same game we were? She's a great talent and a scoring machine, but a "willing passer" she is not.

I also disagree with the poster who said "this season is embarrassing". I don't ever recall Geno saying this "shouldn't be happening" (he did say he wanted the team to get their asses kicked so they would see it's not this easy). UCONN may not have "overwhelming" talent this season, but they do have overwhelming coaching, chemistry, and team play. They have players who (unlike Mitchell) have completely embraced the concept of Team First. And to me, it's the opposite of embarrassing. It shows that even without the BEST talent, UCONN still has the best coaching, and best TEAM oriented players.

And it's not something other coaches can just learn. I believe Geno can get the kind of team first players now for several reasons:

1. He's ALWAYS done it this way - starting when he had losing teams thru turning UCONN into a dynasty
   
2. He's achieved tremendous success getting the right players, even if they are great
3. Players who want to be part of something special still flock to UCONN
4. Players also know they can be developed to be the very best they can be (just look at our WNBA results and Olympians) while NOT being a "superstar"

It's especially hard for other coaches to emulate this because if they want to land other great players, there is much more of a "me first" attitude in this tech savvy, social media generation. Coaches who don't have Geno's history and track record probably end up promising these kids things that Geno would never promise. Geno and co. have noticed this and it's why it's generally harder to find the right kids for UCONN.

The reason I'm explaining all this is because emulating UCONN is not just something that CAN happen at most programs, even if they wanted to. They don't have the history of success, and don't have the ability to attract top talent while playing unselfish basketball. I think there are several teams who do that well (Notre Dame comes to mind), and others who are pretty close, but most teams simply can't recruit the way UCONN can, even if they wanted to morph into a totally "team first" program...

Graham Hays is a usually a good wcbb writer for ESPN, but he had an off-day when composing his account of the UConn vs. OSU game. He devoted much of his game description to rhapsodizing about "the best player on the court," Kelsey Mitchell.

Puh-leeze, Graham, lay off that spiked egg nog!

 

[BroadwayVa]

Tony

Wonderful post as always
Isn't it remarkable what these overlooked kids have been able to accomplish?
The only qualm I have with your argument is your statement that "they have a good coach."

A case could be made that Ohio State had by far the greater collective talent on the floor last night.
Extraordinarily athletic players; deceptive and quick who can shoot lights out.

But their individual excellence could not hold a candle to UConn's team BB concept.
Coach Kevin McGuff can be complimented for recruiting a gaggle of great players.
But his inability to teach them the essence of team ball dooms their program;
relegates them to a lower rank.

Debbie Antonelli is correct; other coaches need to step up and fast.
This season, especially, is getting embarrassing.
With fine, but not overwhelming talent and no bench, UConn continues to prevail.
As Geno himself says...it shouldn't be happening
But so far, no group has found the answer to the organization that our program brings both on D (a thing of beauty) and O

Perhaps, before he retires, Geno could organize a doctoral level seminar, entitled
Rudiments and Practice of Coaching Basketball on the Collegiate Level. (6 credits)
Perhaps that might help.
Attendance required for all D1, top-25 coaches; (optional for those that have won 2 National Championships).

I was looking at the list of players on Ohio St team--it looked like a wish list other coaches had over the past 2-3 years.
All the names have shown up on every list of top talent--and top scoring threats.

In an article abt the game Geno spoke about Kelsey Mitchell and her getting her points--and the job his kids did on the rest of Ohio St.
Years ago Geno spoke about top player/scorers--he believed in allowing them to get their points and shutting down the rest--to see if that one player could score more than Geno's five. It appears his theory is still working.

The course on BB by Geno could be very very short--Talent, Conditioning, Defense, Motivation and the search for perfection in all you
do.
It's no secret--anyone can do it. So why don't they??? It takes work and buy in by coaches and players--it's an awful lot of work.

 

[BroadwayVa]

Tony

Wonderful post as always
Isn't it remarkable what these overlooked kids have been able to accomplish?
The only qualm I have with your argument is your statement that "they have a good coach."

A case could be made that Ohio State had by far the greater collective talent on the floor last night.
Extraordinarily athletic players; deceptive and quick who can shoot lights out.

But their individual excellence could not hold a candle to UConn's team BB concept.
Coach Kevin McGuff can be complimented for recruiting a gaggle of great players.
But his inability to teach them the essence of team ball dooms their program;
relegates them to a lower rank.

Debbie Antonelli is correct; other coaches need to step up and fast.
This season, especially, is getting embarrassing.
With fine, but not overwhelming talent and no bench, UConn continues to prevail.
As Geno himself says...it shouldn't be happening
But so far, no group has found the answer to the organization that our program brings both on D (a thing of beauty) and O

Perhaps, before he retires, Geno could organize a doctoral level seminar, entitled
Rudiments and Practice of Coaching Basketball on the Collegiate Level. (6 credits)
Perhaps that might help.
Attendance required for all D1, top-25 coaches; (optional for those that have won 2 National Championships).

I was looking at the list of players on Ohio St team--it looked like a wish list other coaches had over the past 2-3 years.
All the names have shown up on every list of top talent--and top scoring threats.

In an article abt the game Geno spoke about Kelsey Mitchell and her getting her points--and the job his kids did on the rest of Ohio St.
Years ago Geno spoke about top player/scorers--he believed in allowing them to get their points and shutting down the rest--to see if that one player could score more than Geno's five. It appears his theory is still working.

The course on BB by Geno could be very very short--Talent, Conditioning, Defense, Motivation and the search for perfection in all you
do.
It's no secret--anyone can do it. So why don't they??? It takes work and buy in by coaches and players--it's an awful lot of work.

 

[BroadwayVa]

Graham Hays is a usually a good wcbb writer for ESPN, but he had an off-day when composing his account of the UConn vs. OSU game. He devoted much of his game description to rhapsodizing about "the best player on the court," Kelsey Mitchell.

Puh-leeze, Graham, lay off that spiked egg nog!

Seems like he's a candidate for AA and I don't mean All American!

 

[Kibitzer]

Graham Hays is a usually a good wcbb writer for ESPN, but he had an off-day when composing his account of the UConn vs. OSU game. He devoted much of his game description to rhapsodizing about "the best player on the court," Kelsey Mitchell.

Puh-leeze, Graham, lay off that spiked egg nog!

Graham's opening statement featured this gem: "[T]he best individual talent on the court wasn't in a UConn uniform."

Then: "Mitchell put on an All American show. . . ."

I couldn't make this stuff up. Now I wonder how he did.

 

[cbraarj]

McGuff lost control of his team the day he hired Kelsey Mitchell's dad as his assistant coach. (That's how he recruited his star.)

So, who's in charge?

Her sister is on the team but doesnt play also, Kib. Want to say twins.

 

[Kibitzer]

Her sister is on the team but doesnt play also, Kib. Want to say twins.

Hmm. . .

The Mitchell family apparently has Dad on the payroll (Asst. WBB Coach) and two daughters of his enrolled on athletic scholarships, one of whom is productive. Hey, not bad!

 

[donalddoowop]

Hey, Tonyc. Uconn does not always run their offense flawlessly. There are times when they struggle in the half court. Last night much of their scoring came off fast breaks. Too many times they stop moving and take the first shot available. Geno gets on them about it. When the time comes that they get their offense to where Geno wants it, they may average 85 to 90 points a game. With their quickness and ability to shoot accurately, they will wear the other teams down.

 

[donalddoowop]

Hey, Tonyc. Uconn does not always run their offense flawlessly. There are times when they struggle in the half court. Last night much of their scoring came off fast breaks. Too many times they stop moving and take the first shot available. Geno gets on them about it. When the time comes that they get their offense to where Geno wants it, they may average 85 to 90 points a game. With their quickness and ability to shoot accurately, they will wear the other teams down.