Maybe Weist should have been the guy | Page 3 | The Boneyard

Maybe Weist should have been the guy

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nelsonmuntz said:
The talent argument, in a nutshell, is that a bunch of players who were mostly recruited to play in a BCS conference are now too untalented to even be competitive in a midmajor conference. Either the entire team is a collection of spectacular recruiting flops, or talent is not the only problem. Those are the only two choices. The "blame Pasqualoni" argument doesn't really hold up that well, because he only had 2 recruiting classes, and the assistant coaches, who do most of the recruiting, were pretty strong. The first one was mostly Edsall's, and by the time he was chucked last year, Weist and company were holding the class together with masking tape. I think Hank Hughes and Don Brown know something about recruiting, especially in the northeast. I am having a little bit of a problem with the talent argument.

For the Cummings defenders, you are right. The offense is a smooth running machine now. My bad. Much, much better offense than we would have had if Weist was HC.
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That's an interesting argument until you actually get into the roster. When you do, you'll find it's a little bit of both actually and the blame Pasqualoni argument absolutely is in play here...

Admittedly, this is quick and dirty, but roughly 98% of rosters for the 2014 college season are made up of the 2010 (RS SR) - 2014 (True Freshman) recruiting classes. So I compared the recruiting classes per Rivals for those years to the roster on UConnhuskies.com.

2010 and 2011 (according to the above) are Edsall's classes. Former "Coach" Pasqualoni owns 2012 and 2013, and 2014 is a combination of the departed staff and Diaco.

What I found was really remarkable. The number of players who are no longer associated with the team from the 2012 and 2013 recruiting classes is not much less the other 3 years combined (17 to 18 by my count). Mind you that 2010 recruits have to be RS SRs in order to be on the roster so the majority of the class would have move on regardless. Also, Rival's only shows the NLI signed commits for past years so it does not show the players who back out of their verbal when Pasqualoni was relieved of his duties.

This tells us at least one of a few things: (A) The assistant coaches were NOT strong recruiters; (B) The recruits were not focused enough to be at the FBS level (a not-so-insignificant slice of the talent pie); (C) They were not developed properly between fax transmission and stepping onto the game field (i.e. poor coaching); and/or (D) They were outright flops.

Put in Philosophy 102 (Logic) terms: my guess is a combination of (B), (C), and (D) are in play here.
However, given reasons (B), (C), and (D), one can only conclude (A).
 
whaler11 said:
The blame Pasqualoni argument doesn't hold water.

That might be worse than Edsall wasn't successful.
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Why?

We are 5 games in. We can certainly BLAME Paul Pasqualoni. He absolutely positively killed our momentum; damaged our fanbase & Brand; and sucked the spirit out of our investment. I blame him.

Diaco BETTER be good; because it is a steep climb back up to the form that HCRE had structured. And ... I think we have the potential to go further.
 
Pudge said:
Why?

We are 5 games in. We can certainly BLAME Paul Pasqualoni. He absolutely positively killed our momentum; damaged our fanbase & Brand; and sucked the spirit out of our investment. I blame him.

Diaco BETTER be good; because it is a steep climb back up to the form that HCRE had structured. And ... I think we have the potential to go further.
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My post was 100% sarcasm.

Read the second sentence.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
The talent argument, in a nutshell, is that a bunch of players who were mostly recruited to play in a BCS conference are now too untalented to even be competitive in a midmajor conference. Either the entire team is a collection of spectacular recruiting flops, or talent is not the only problem. Those are the only two choices. The "blame Pasqualoni" argument doesn't really hold up that well, because he only had 2 recruiting classes, and the assistant coaches, who do most of the recruiting, were pretty strong. The first one was mostly Edsall's, and by the time he was chucked last year, Weist and company were holding the class together with masking tape. I think Hank Hughes and Don Brown know something about recruiting, especially in the northeast. I am having a little bit of a problem with the talent argument.

For the Cummings defenders, you are right. The offense is a smooth running machine now. My bad. Much, much better offense than we would have had if Weist was HC.
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What if... The talent was fine enough... But instead of coaching it up, P and GDL coached it down? What if... It takes some time to undo that damage?
 
nelsonmuntz said:
I don't know about that, but it does appear that just about every FBS (and many FCS) OC in the country knows more about coaching than that guy.
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And you make this decision based on? Points scored, Yards per game/play? What?
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Why do you follow the sport at all? The mindless cheerleaders who presented Edsall's mediocrity as success and now all claim that they knew from the start that Pasqualoni would suck (when I seem to remember that he was a pretty popular hire at the time) like to shout down anyone who points out the obvious problems. I was getting attacked back in the winter for being mildly critical of Diaco for hiring what seemed like a lightweight staff, particularly on the offensive side. Compare Diaco's staff to the resumes of the one Pasqualoni showed up with. I didn't just into the recruiting fray too much other than to agree with those who pointed out that we could have gotten a lot of these recruits that received early offers in December or January so why not aim a little higher over the summer and fall? I said that the game coaching was a problem after the Stony Brook game, and now that viewpoint is a lot more popular.

Diaco has had a rocky start. If you are not willing to acknowledge that, then you shouldn't follow the program. Acknowledging that the program is at a serious crossroads is not being negative, it is being realistic. If we give Diaco 4-5 years and things don't improve, shutting down the program is on the table. UConn is not going to pour millions of dollars into a sinkhole for a program in a lousy conference that is losing games in droves and drawing small crowds. That is just reality.

Diaco has to succeed, and I do think that he can and will get better. The only thing I can think of in terms of change is to find some gray hair to be his mentor and maybe coach the offense. There are too many brain farts and the offense does not look prepared going into games. Somewhere out there is a guy that has been around forever with maybe some HC experience that couldn't cut it with the top job. An offensive version of Ellis Johnson, if we can find one.
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What is a "brain fart"? The brain does not expel gas that I am aware of... and I should know. Do you mean "brain farct", which would be short term for "infarct"? That would be more appropriate as it would basically imply a lack of oxygen to an area of the brain. Nonetheless, I agree with your negative, yet realistic view of UConn football at this time. I also agree with you that the end is near for UConn football if they cannot get into a P5 Conference sooner rather than later.
 
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Confident Carl said:
SURE - YOU GUYS ARE RIGHT. CUMMINGS DOSN'T KNOW HOW TO RUN THE OFFENSE. NO IDEA OF WHAT HE IS DOING. THE PLAYERS HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. IT"S ALL HIS FAULT! Read on and you may have a different opinion. This man is a good coach. He didn't all of the sudden forget how to coach.
9609971.jpeg

Mike Cummings

Position:
Offensive Coordinator, Tight Ends
Experience:
First Season
Alma Mater:
Buffalo '84
06/17/2014

Mike Cummings, who served as the Offensive Coordinator for the past four seasons at Central Michigan,is in his first year in 2014the Offensive Coordinator atUConn and has position responsibility with the tight ends.

During Cummings' tenure at CMU, the school boasted one of the Mid-American Conference's top offenses. Cummings had position responsibility for the offensive line at Central Michigan and coached offensive tackle Eric Fisher, who was the first pick in the 2013 NFL Draft by the Kansas City Chiefs.
Coached Eric Fisher, 1st Pick in NFL Draft by the Kansas City Chiefs. Me thinks Coach Cummings knows what a quality offensive lineman looks like. Don't think UCONN has any NFL 1st pick in Draft O Lineman on this team.

Cummings and new UConn head coach Bob Diaco were on the same coaching staff together at Eastern Michigan in 2000 and '01.

In 2012, Cummings directed a CMU offense that averaged 6.2 yards per play, ranking No. 2 in the MAC, produced nearly 400 yards of offense per game and scored 30 or more points in 10 games. Much of the offensive success can be attributed to the play of the CMU offensive line, which Cummings has position responsibility for, which allowed just 15 sacks, ranking No. 17 nationally.
#2 Offense in MAC in 2012 average 400 yards of offense and 30 or more points in 10 games. Line only allowed 15 sacks all year. Ours gives up 15 per game. Do ya think it could be the players....Maybe??

Cummings coached five All-Mid-American Conference offensive linemen over the last three seasons. !!!!Colin Miller and Jeff Maddux were both named to the 2010 All-MAC Second Team, while Fisher was a Third Team selection in 2011 and was honored on the All-MAC First Team in 2012. Andy Phillips was a second team pick in 2013. 5 All-Mid --American Offensive linemen over last 3 seasons!

Fisher, who also earned All-America honors from the Associated Press, became the highest NFL draft pick in MAC and Central Michigan history. A starter of all 13 games in 2012, Fisher flourished under Cummings' tutelage rising from a relatively unknown commodity at the beginning of the season to a national sensation following dominant performances at the Senior Bowl and the NFL Scouting Combine. Fisher rose from an unknown to a National sensation under Cummings!

The Chippewas ranked in the top 25 nationally in passing offense during 2010 and '11 under Cummings. CMU ranked 25th nationally in 2011, averaging 274.2 yards per game through the air, one year after ranking 20th with a 284.0 yards per game average. The Chippewas have thrown for 295 or more yards 17 times over the past four seasons, including six games of 350 yards or more. High ranked offense under Cummings!

The 2010 season marked the start of Cummings' fourth stint at CMU. He was the Chippewas' offensive line coach from 1992-97 and 1999, and he was a graduate assistant at CMU during the 1988 and 1989 seasons. Cummings coached seven All-MAC honorees during his previous time at CMU.

Cummings served as the offensive line coach and recruiting coordinator at Marshall from 2005-09. At least one Marshall offensive lineman earned All- Conference USA honors in each of his five seasons. Did well with the O-line at Marshall too!

Prior to Marshall, Cummings was the offensive line coach and recruiting coordinator at Western Michigan for three seasons.

Cummings' career also includes stops at Eastern Michigan (defensive line/ special teams/recruiting coordinator, 2000-01), Michigan State (tight ends/ special teams, 1998), Millersville (offensive line, 1990-91) and Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute (offensive line, 1987).

Cummings earned three varsity letters in football at Buffalo. He earned his bachelor's degree in physical education and exercise science from Buffalo in 1984 and his master's degree in athletics administration from CMU in 1990.

Cummings and his wife Donna have two daughters, Elizabeth and Emily.

Year-By-Year With Mike Cummings



YearSchool/TeamPosition
1987RensselaerOffensive Line
1988-89Central MichiganGraduate Assistant
1990-91MillersvilleOffensive Line
1992-97Central MichiganOffensive Line
1998Michigan StateTight Ends/Special Teams
1999Central MichiganOffensive Line
2000-01Eastern MichiganDef. Line/Special Teams/Recruiting Coordinator
2002-04Western MichiganOffensive Line/Recruiting Coordinator
2005-09MarshallOffensive Line/Recruiting Coordinator
2010-13Central MichiganOffensive Coordinator/Offensive Line
Postseason Games As A Coach
YearGameSchool/Team Result
1994Las VegasCentral Michigan lost to UNLV, 52-24
2009Little Caesar'sMarshall def. Ohio, 21-17
2012Little Caesar'sCentral Michigan def. Western Kentucky, 24-21
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Sorry Carl, but that resume has Mid Major written all over it.
 
CTMike said:
What if... The talent was fine enough... But instead of coaching it up, P and GDL coached it down? What if... It takes some time to undo that damage?
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Fair point. But what happened literally as soon as Deleone and Pasqualoni got escorted from the premises? The team started playing better. What happened when the first 5 games of this season? The high point is a 17 point home loss.
 
nelsonmuntz said:
Fair point. But what happened literally as soon as Deleone and Pasqualoni got escorted from the premises? The team started playing better. What happened when the first 5 games of this season? The high point is a 17 point home loss.
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Literally? They lost 5 more uncompetitive games before beating Temple.
 
HuskyPete said:
Sorry Carl, but that resume has Mid Major written all over it.
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Yeah and here are some other coaches who came out of the Mid America Conference who's resumes' have Mid Major written over them too. So what
is that supposed to mean? The MAC is called the cradle of coaches!
  • Bo Schembechler - Miami of Ohio
  • Woody Hayes- Miami of Ohio
  • Ara Parseghian - Miami of Ohio
  • Urban Meyer - Bowling Green
http://www.vandelaysports.com/football/coaches.html
 
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nelsonmuntz said:
Well that's awesome. I look forward to seeing your picture in the Courant under the headline "Pepband99 promises to cover the football program's losses indefinitely". Get your checkbook out, because those losses could come to $4-5 million a year if we keep having 3 (or fewer) win seasons. At least we have this problem solved. Thanks a lot.
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Whatever I give will beat the giant sucking sound that surrounds you. Nice to change the subject (again).
 
We have the worst offensive line in the country. Until that problem is fixed its very hard to evaluate Cummings as an OC. KOD594 makes a good point about the true freshman on the offensive line. By the end of the year we may have 3 true freshman starting in the line.
 
Hiring interim coaches never works. Basketball did it and they're struggling...

You need to get a fresh start. Diaco is the fresh start. Give him time, the players suck. I"ll better evaluate his coaching performance once his recruits have more of an influence on the team.
 
HuskyPete said:
Sorry Carl, but that resume has Mid Major written all over it.
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? If you haven't noticed...We are a Mid Major program. A bad one at that! I believe Weist was also from a Mid Major program. Yes, he was.
 
Milo65 said:
? If you haven't noticed...We are a Mid Major program. A bad one at that! I believe Weist was also from a Mid Major program. Yes, he was.
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Nope. That lone season as Cincinnati's WR Coach seals his MAC resume.
 
CTBasketball said:
Hiring interim coaches never works. Basketball did it and they're struggling...

You need to get a fresh start. Diaco is the fresh start. Give him time, the players suck. I"ll better evaluate his coaching performance once his recruits have more of an influence on the team.
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You have to be one of the worst supporters of this University Football Team. In the last week you have called college students 'garbage' and now 'players suck'. Go root for a pro team.
I would like to call you a name but won't drop to your level.


GO TEAM!!
 
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Bonehead said:
You have to be one of the worst supporters of this University Football Team. In the last week you have called college students 'garbage' and now 'players suck'. Go root for a pro team.
I would like to call you a name but won't drop to your level.


GO TEAM!!
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Cite where I called students garbage. And if you can't bring yourself to the reality that the players aren't good then I feel sorry for you. Going through life with rainbows of optimism surrounding your ego must be painful.

And I've been going to football games ever since they went D1. I've been a fan ever since the 90's. I've been to every bowl game.

So please don't jump to irrational claims after reading 3 words.
 
CTBasketball said:
Cite where I called students garbage. And if you can't bring yourself to the reality that the players aren't good then I feel sorry for you. Going through life with rainbows of optimism surrounding your ego must be painful.

And I've been going to football games ever since they went D1. I've been a fan ever since the 90's. I've been to every bowl game.


So please don't jump to irrational claims after reading 3 words.
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Wow you have a short memory...

http://the-boneyard.com/threads/beat-ecu-or-ucf-or-cincy-at-home.65524/page-2#post-1079297
Post #37 your words 'garbage recruits' -

It was for more than 3 words - get off your 'High Unicorn'. You said it perfectly - you are a fan and not a supporter.

You sound like the type of college fan probably calling out a 20 something year old college student by name saying he sucks at a game - you would be better suited at a pro game.

Edit - medic found others!
 
Jimmy Serrano said:
Please don't confuse Nelson with facts. It's his pet strawman that will suffer.
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This is the point in the thread where Nelson pulls out his "How to be a Master Poster" handbook and has to decide between three tactics:

A. Resort to personal attacks
B. Change the topic and pretend you never said that Wiest had the same players
C. Stop posting on the thread and hope people forget about this

I was predicting A....but it appears to be C.
 
ShakyTheMohel said:
This is the point in the thread where Nelson pulls out his "How to be a Master Poster" handbook and has to decide between three tactics:

A. Resort to personal attacks
B. Change the topic and pretend you never said that Wiest had the same players
C. Stop posting on the thread and hope people forget about this

I was predicting A....but it appears to be C.
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We are at the point in the thread where Serrano and Shaky decide to start a personal pissing match despite more or less agreeing with what I said. We mostly agree that Diaco is having a rocky start and we mostly all like Weist. Moving on.
 
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Bonehead said:
Wow you have a short memory...

http://the-boneyard.com/threads/beat-ecu-or-ucf-or-cincy-at-home.65524/page-2#post-1079297
Post #37 your words 'garbage recruits' -

It was for more than 3 words - get off your 'High Unicorn'. You said it perfectly - you are a fan and not a supporter.

You sound like the type of college fan probably calling out a 20 something year old college student by name saying he sucks at a game - you would be better suited at a pro game.

Edit - medic found others!
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Thanks for citing and it further proves my point - from a personnel standpoint, this is one of the worst teams in America right now. The only exception is Davis, and he's not even that good. He's good and all for the American, but he's not anything spectacular.

But to clarify, I never said just "students" I said, "recruits and players." (Yes I know they're students...kinda)

And I'm sorry I don't drop thousands of dollars for football games like I do basketball. That makes me a terrible fan and I know it. I have no right or am in no position to call out a "UConn Football Supporter" because I don't buy season tickets anymore. Once PP got hired I knew what was going to happen so I stopped buying. From a financial standpoint, it made sense.
 
Not sure Weist could have managed the O Line situation any better. Then to lose Casey let's face it this is an uphill slog. We lost friend Green Bennett and Hemingway and got Cruz back. As bad as Hemingway was he was better than anybody that we have. The defense has held its own. Weist would have been as good as Diaco, but man I just don't know how he would have done much better given the situation.

The questions are can the O'Line progress or not and who will take the reigns from Whitmer.

I am impressed with the RB situation and some of the younger guys can play D.
 
CTBasketball said:
Thanks for citing and it further proves my point - from a personnel standpoint, this is one of the worst teams in America right now. The only exception is Davis, and he's not even that good. He's good and all for the American, but he's not anything spectacular.

But to clarify, I never said just "students" I said, "recruits and players." (Yes I know they're students...kinda)

And I'm sorry I don't drop thousands of dollars for football games like I do basketball. That makes me a terrible fan and I know it. I have no right or am in no position to call out a "UConn Football Supporter" because I don't buy season tickets anymore. Once PP got hired I knew what was going to happen so I stopped buying. From a financial standpoint, it made sense.
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You got cited - try to spin it if you want or be a real man/woman and just admit it.

I would be more than happy to pay your way to a football game, attend the Husky Walk with me and let Chandler and the PP recruits know that they are garbage and 'kinda students'.

Thank god the BB team is up to your standards - if P5 doesn't happen and Ollie takes an NBA gig can't wait to see your analysis on future student athletes on that team.

I'm fairly confident the Athletic Department and UConn can survive and would be happy without your type of fandom and money - all the sports.

You made my point -

FYI - you might not want to follow the hockey team this year being in a new conference and all.
 
I can't fault Diaco. Look what he has to deal with with Whitmer and DeLorenzo as primary offensive options. No coach could win with those two.
 
If Weist were coach we would have beaten USF and maybe Boise. Boyle would be QB in a no huddle offense, Newsome, Johnson and Mariner would be catching slant passes and running crossing routes for short passes and the OL would not be zone blocking. Straight up man, block the guy in front of you.


I believe that, but I also believe Diaco is the better recruiter and probably the better solution for winning long term. I also think he can become a media darling and restore respect to this program when he starts winning.
 
Weist couldn't beat USF at home a year ago (with a far better offensive line than we currently have). How can you be so sure that he would have beaten them this year at USF?
 
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