Maryland Punished?????

[MilfordHusky]

With all due respect, @1-of-the-6 , I am not sure "screwed" is exactly the right word to describe UConn's "overall" situation, but I see your point as to certain parts where I can agree that UConn got screwed. Follow with me (in typical Cam fashion, I will take several paragraphs to post what others will say in two sentences):

-- Based on RPI/SOS, Maryland deserved the three seed. Even if Maryland were a two seed, the team would have been the lowest two seed and would still be playing in Bridgeport. With the lowest two seed comes the highest three seed, based on the S-Curve. So Duke and Maryland would both be there.

-- Based on the "eye" test (as Rebecca Lobo likes to discuss), however, Maryland looks to be one of the top three teams in the country? Why? Because of how the Terrapins have played UConn the past two years. Both games were incredibly competitive. As I recall, the game last year (think it was in MSG) was a five or six-point game with about one minute remaining - and that was against Stewart/Tuck/Jefferson. This year, MD-UConn was a very competitive game, with UConn pulling away with a large lead, only for Maryland (Slocum) to storm back. And Maryland-UConn was a much more competitive game than UConn-ND (which was VERY competitive in the first half, but not so much in the second half), UConn-SC (after either Gray or Davis missed free throws in the third, UConn went on a massive run), or UConn-Baylor (it seemed only Alexis Jones was not intimidated by UConn, but other players like Nina Davis were frustrated by the Huskies' defense).

-- But the "eye" test is not the only test. And this is the same Maryland team (as a #2 seed) that lost in the second round to Washington last year, in a home game.

-- I understand Maryland's placement and seeding. That being said, if the Committee were really looking at making the tournament the most competitive possible (and was using this a factor, like it does with attendance), UConn-MD should take place in the Final Four...or many in the championship game.

-- UConn has Duke in its bracket. Gail Goestenkors went 2-2 against Geno Auriemma while at Duke, winning both games in the State of Connecticut. Joanne P. McCallie is 0-8 against Geno (while at Duke) and her teams have only scored over 52 points in only one of those eight games while scoring in the 40s in five of the eight. Duke has allowed between 74 and 87 points in seven of the eight games. Duke has lost those eight games by an average of 29 points...notwithstanding the fact that Duke was ranked in the Top 10 for every single one of those games (and in the Top 5 for four of the eight). Not exactly "screwed."

-- UConn is playing its games at home (first and second rounds) and in Bridgeport (Sweet 16 and Elite Eight). Technically, Bridgeport is not a "home" site (not Hartford or Storrs), but Bridgeport has hosted NCAA women's games in 2004 (early rounds), 2006 (regional), 2008 (early rounds), 2012 (early rounds), 2013 (regional), 2016 (regional), and 2017 (regional) - with UConn playing there every single time. Three times in the last five years, UConn has played Sweet 16 and Elite Eight games in Bridgeport; no other school can make the same claim for location and amount of times at said location. UConn has a lot more familiarity with that location than any other program in the Bridgeport Regional. Getting "screwed" is a bit much when you factor in that UConn will not have to leave CT to make the Final Four for the third time in the last five years.

-- THAT BEING SAID, the placement of Syracuse in UConn's bracket as an 8 seed was shocking (to me, at least). While most of the RPI sites had Syracuse at 31, Sagarin had Syracuse at 21. Syracuse went 11-5 in the ACC, arguably the most competitive conference this year.

-- AND HERE IS WHERE I CONTRADICT MYSELF...Based on the "eye" test, I thought Syracuse rated higher than an 8 seed. This team made the Final Four last year and has two of the most electrifying players in the country. A good matchup zone can hurt the Orange (see their losses to Duke), but this is a team that can score and score quickly - Notre Dame was down by four points after three quarters before rallying to win by five at Syracuse, 85-80 - AND that was with Brianna Turner going 13-14 from the floor and finishing with 31 points.

While I cannot say, overall, that UConn got screwed given Maryland's resume and the location of the games (and the fact that Geno Auriemma beats Joanne P. McCallie's teams like a redheaded stepchild of a mule (pick a reference, combine them, they all work), the second round matchup against Syracuse I would agree is UConn getting "screwed."

Again, I am primarily a Duke fan (though have watched UConn for many years and have posted on the Boneyard since 2002). If I were primarily a fan of UConn, might I think UConn got screwed with Maryland? Quite possibly. Heck, I thought Duke got screwed in 2006 when as a #1 seed, had to play UConn in Bridgeport, even though the seedings/S Curve might have justified the matchup.

Nice work, Cam, as usual. I haven't read very many of the posts on the brackets, but I think our 16, 8, and 3 seeds are better than normal. Duke is an average or slightly weaker 2 in my opinion. I certainly have seen easier brackets for us, but I'l take my chances with this team. They like a challenge. Playing in Storrs and Bridgeport will help.

Historical question for the board: Have the 2 teams that were in the prior year's NC game ever played in the Round of 32 the following season? Round of 16?

 

[1-of-the-6]

IMO, I Still don't see that UCONN "got screwed." Geno has told his team that they have to EARN IT...nothing going to be given to them. Yes, the bracket is "tough"... but the others are tough in their own ways too... that's how it's supposed to be when you get to this time of the season...top 64 teams. UCONN is overall #1... and that means they get the "lowest #2" and the "top #3"... and that played out to be Duke and MD... OK...Play it as it lies... Frankly, I think the others in Bridgeport Region have it worse...because they have to deal with the 1000 pound gorilla... UCONN!! and THEY know that when they step on the court. Geno says he doesn't like to play teams that they played during the season...i.e., MD... but think about it from MD's side of the equation. They had that Dec 29th game in THEIR House, in front of THEIR 17000+ fans, with Lou sick and Phe and Gabby in foul trouble. Everything was set up for them to win that game, but they did not get the job done. and THEY know that... and not in an "extra motivation" kind of way, but as in "do we have what it takes to beat them." We can assume MD will win against Bucknell... then they have to worry about playing WVU and Duke... before they even can think about UCONN. They know they didn't get the job done when it was set up for them... and neither Geno nor our Girls are going to let them take it from them during the National Championship Tournament!!! Just sayin' .... GO HUSKIES!!!!!

Are you quite finished yet? Nobody said anything along the lines that UCONN should have the regional given to them, that they didn't have to earn it. I just believe that several of the teams in the Bridgeport regional are better than their seedings. Not that they didn't deserve those seedings, but that they are, in fact, a little underrated. Which in turn makes the regional a bit tougher than it should be. For everybody. That's it. Period.

Except that my money says that in private, Geno and his coaching staff feel exactly the same way.

 

[PAHuskeyFan]

Are you quite finished yet? Nobody said anything along the lines that UCONN should have the regional given to them, that they didn't have to earn it. I just believe that several of the teams in the Bridgeport regional are better than their seedings. Not that they didn't deserve those seedings, but that they are, in fact, a little underrated. Which in turn makes the regional a bit tougher than it should be. For everybody. That's it. Period.

Except that my money says that in private, Geno and his coaching staff feel exactly the same way.

Well OK Then... I was addressing the issue of "UCONN got screwed"... which appears in several places in different threads. That's all...

 

[j66kicker]

Assuming UConn wins the first 3 games and plays either MD or Duke in the E8 game, that will be the second game of the Bridgeport weekend so there will be a short turnaround/prep time. If MD and Duke play each other in the regional semifinal, then they will have their hands full with each other and won't be able to look ahead to UConn. Of course UConn also gets the short turnaround. Who do you think the short prep time favors?

 

[eebmg]

Final Four nets Maryland women's basketball coach Brenda Frese bonuses topping $100,000

This is definitely punishment. And to please Jim Delany with another UConn-Big Ten Elite Eight in our backyard. If UMD makes it that far.

Geno. " I need to renegotiate". I did not realize getting to the final 4 should give me a bonus" Isn't that part of my job?

 

[j66kicker]

Geno. " I need to renegotiate". I did not realize getting to the final 4 should give me a bonus" Isn't that part of my job?

It is - Geno's contract has bonus payouts for awards and postseason wins.

 

[MilfordHusky]

It is - Geno's contract has bonus payouts for awards and postseason wins.

Correct. Geno's contract is structured roughly like Brenda's, with cumulative payouts for post-season success. I think Geno gets one month's pay for making the tourney, one month's pay for making the round of 16, one month's pay for the round of 8, and one month's pay for the Final Four. I think he gets 3 month's pay for winning the championship. I assume the monthly pay relates to his $400K base. Thus, the cumulative amounts are $33K for making the tourney, $66K for the round of 16, $100K for the Elite 8, $133K for the Final Four, and $233K for winning the championship. That's more than Brenda's contract. Brenda does not get $100K just for making the Final Four. The $100K amount is the cumulative pay for that round PLUS all the preceding rounds. If Geno's bonuses are based on his total package--which I think is unlikely--multiply all of the above amounts by about 6.

 

[MilfordHusky]

UConn has a contract with the Webster Bank Arena. It actually is home court for UConn. UConn does have a branch campus in Stamford, if you did not know. And the branch campuses here do not have their own athletic departments, at least so far. Except maybe Avery Point.

What's the definition of a "home court"?

 

[MilfordHusky]

This person gets it. You get an A+ for your post.

The thing I hated about the committee selections was the fact that conference play had no importance whatsoever. If all the committee cares about is quality wins and SOS all the super powers in WCBB need to schedule 8 games against each other. Maryland can go 6-12 like Cal did in conference and make the tournament as long as they get some quality wins. The committee this year was just pathetic. Cal really?

I think Maryland deserved a 2 and is a top 5 or so team. I don't see them behind Duke. That said, the OOC schedule definitely hurt. Brenda may have done the scheduling because of the large number of freshmen on the team and wanting to break them in slowly. The other thing that hurt them was the conference. If Maryland had the same record in the ACC, they would have had a 1 seed. The Big 1o was the weakest of the 5 Power Conferences in WCBB this year, possibly by a wide margin. I think the loss to OSU cost them a lot. It narrowed the gap between the Terps and the Buckeyes and, in so doing, narrowed the gap between Maryland and the rest of a so-so conference. If they had only the UConn loss, irrespective of their schedule, they had a strong argument for being somewhere between 2 and 5 at the lowest.

Let's see how the Terps do. If they advance to the Final Four, the 3 seeding was a joke. If they advance to the Regional Finals and play UConn close, they were under-seeded. If they lose at home in the second round again, their seeding was merited. For their sake, they should not be focused on UConn or even Duke. WVU could be a tough out. We'll know more in time.

 

[Plebe]

Thanks - and I buy that somewhat until you look at the best wins for bubble teams and VA gets left in the cold when they beat FSU and Dayton which combined is better than UNI.

I don't quite agree that Virginia's FSU and Dayton wins combined are better than the wins over K-State and Creighton. The FSU win is of course the best single win of the four, but Dayton, while in the RPI top 50, would not have been an at-large selection. The committee may have also viewed the FSU game with the asterisk of Thomas's shoulder injury.

And my issue with the quality win scenario has always been: Very few teams in WCBB are consistent and almost every one of them throws a few absolute clunkers during the year. Even Uconn with its 100+ winning streak is not immune so is Tulane getting a bid if they score one more basket and Uconn misses one more? Or what about Alabama - they beat TN twice and Auburn and have a record of 19-13 - those three top 50 RPI wins are significantly better than UNI's?

You raise an interesting question about Alabama. In fact, Alabama also beat Missouri in addition to Tennessee twice and Auburn. But their RPI was #132, severely dragged down by a nonconference SOS ranking of #345 (!!!). Think about that: only 4 teams in all of Division I played a weaker OOC than Alabama. (And we thought Maryland's was bad!) They committee wants to reward teams for their quality wins, but the teams, for better or worse, have to meet them halfway by at least getting their RPI within range. (Interesting that Alabama is much higher in both Massey (#61) and Sagarin (#60), which are less skewed by weak scheduling.)

 

[Adios]

What's the definition of a "home court"?

As defined by the powers that be.

UConn Teams Need A Better Home In Hartford

Webster can count for being a home now as XL. Besides, UConn is in Tolland County, not Hartford County. Going to be that way going into the future, anyway.

 

[eebmg]

It is - Geno's contract has bonus payouts for awards and postseason wins.

Sorry. I should have looked closer at the contract. When it was being discussed earlier, I did not notice it. My bad.

 

[Jimbo]

Historical question for the board: Have the 2 teams that were in the prior year's NC game ever played in the Round of 32 the following season? Round of 16?

I've just spent some time combing through all the brackets, and…nope. A championship game rematch has never transpired in the following year's tournament in any round prior to the Final Four. Here are the six times it has happened in the Final Four:

1984 La. Tech-USC (Semifinal)
1988 La. Tech-Tennessee (Semifinal)
1989 Auburn-La. Tech (Semifinal)
1996 Connecticut-Tennessee (Semifinal)
2004 Connecticut-Tennessee (Championship)
2015 Connecticut-Notre Dame (Championship)

 

[veryolddog]

Back to Maryland being punished. If Maryland gets by West Virginia or Duke, then UConn will really punish them and win by 20.

 

[UcMiami]

I've just spent some time combing through all the brackets, and…nope. A championship game rematch has never transpired in the following year's tournament in any round prior to the Final Four. Here are the six times it has happened in the Final Four:

1984 La. Tech-USC (Semifinal)
1988 La. Tech-Tennessee (Semifinal)
1989 Auburn-La. Tech (Semifinal)
1996 Connecticut-Tennessee (Semifinal)
2004 Connecticut-Tennessee (Championship)
2015 Connecticut-Notre Dame (Championship)

Part of the reason is probably that as far as I can remember Louisville is the only other #7 seed to make a championship game - there are not a lot of teams, even with graduating senior classes that are good enough to make the championship game and then totally disappear the following year to the point of getting a #7 seed or worse. The history of low seeds making the FF is pretty scarce in general.

 

[eebmg]

I've just spent some time combing through all the brackets, and…nope. A championship game rematch has never transpired in the following year's tournament in any round prior to the Final Four. Here are the six times it has happened in the Final Four:

1984 La. Tech-USC (Semifinal)
1988 La. Tech-Tennessee (Semifinal)
1989 Auburn-La. Tech (Semifinal)
1996 Connecticut-Tennessee (Semifinal)
2004 Connecticut-Tennessee (Championship)
2015 Connecticut-Notre Dame (Championship)

Is this being brought up because of the significant possibility that Syracuse will meet UConn in the round of 16 this year?

 

[Jimbo]

Part of the reason is probably that as far as I can remember Louisville is the only other #7 seed to make a championship game - there are not a lot of teams, even with graduating senior classes that are good enough to make the championship game and then totally disappear the following year to the point of getting a #7 seed or worse. The history of low seeds making the FF is pretty scarce in general.

I'm a little confused. Louisville was a #3 seed in 2009 and a #5 seed in 2013. Syracuse was a #4 seed last year. But I think your general point is valid; a NC rematch in the following year's second round isn't going to happen very often. I suppose both teams could fall off enough that they could meet the next year in a 3-vs.-6 or 4-vs.-5 matchup, but even that seems unlikely. But I was a little surprised to find that no NC rematch has ever occurred even in the following year's Elite 8.

 

[Jimbo]

Is this being brought up because of the significant possibility that Syracuse will meet UConn in the round of 16 this year?

It would be in the round of 32, but yes, I'm sure that's why Milford posed the question.

 

[MilfordHusky]

I've just spent some time combing through all the brackets, and…nope. A championship game rematch has never transpired in the following year's tournament in any round prior to the Final Four. Here are the six times it has happened in the Final Four:

1984 La. Tech-USC (Semifinal)
1988 La. Tech-Tennessee (Semifinal)
1989 Auburn-La. Tech (Semifinal)
1996 Connecticut-Tennessee (Semifinal)
2004 Connecticut-Tennessee (Championship)
2015 Connecticut-Notre Dame (Championship)

Thanks!

 

[LO TRADER]

Checking my bracket, I have Stanford losing to UCONN in the Finals. Washington losing to UCONN in the Semis. OSU losing to South Carolina in the regional final. UCLA and Oregon losing to UCONN. Cal losing to Baylor and ASU losing to South Carolina in the 2nd round.

Overall record of 20-7. That's pretty good damage.

Your bracket shows respect for the PAC-12.

 

[1-of-the-6]

Your bracket shows respect for the PAC-12.

Sometimes it also reflects who I'm rooting for in the game, so as to avoid conflicts of interest.

 

[magic]

Backword thinking. The committee found a way to put an extra FF roadblock in front of Uconn in the regional final. I only pay attention to team and player matchups at tourney time. Essentially uconn will play 3 FF games ! The seed was planted when the committee talked negatively about Maryland's schedule. Blah, blah, blah ! Propaganda ! Doesn't anyone remember when uconn was in the big east and all we heard was " yeah, uconn is good " but they play in the big east. Evey game will be built up as the " game " to watch because blah, blah, blah. GO HUSKIES !

 

[Longtime fan]

Well thinking back to all the talk about an easy schedule and MD avoiding many top teams OOC because they had so many freshman and they get a 3 seed and the UConn region. Some UConn fans think its unfair for UConn I dont. I feel the committee might have felt if MD had gone to another region they might have won but in CT the chance was slim.

Think about this. First MD has WVa and thats not a cake walk. Could be a tuff game for MD. WVa has been playing well and is hitting their outside shots which will make MD have to come out and guard them. Next MD has UConn if they win at UConn. In our only meeting with MD we were up 19 at MD when all the fouls were called on UConn making them defensless and UConn still won by 6. Point is with all the pressure on and our lead diminishing quickly we found a way to win and not loose. Thats huge in itself. Now with that said MD has WVa and UConn. Thats a tall task. NCAA sending a message regarding OOC tuffness.

For me the reward of playing MD after we have already played them and we were in foul trouble and Lou was sick in a bucket and we still won and we have played them and we know them. I dont would rather be playing a team we are familiar with then a good team we havent faced. Yeah some UConn fans are concerned but not as concerned as Brenda MD and their fans. Heck we're UConn.

With all the talk about how Uconn could be beaten brings only one thing to my mind. Not so much UConn getting in foul trouble but a game called close where fouls are called that only a blind man would call. If they let them play UConn wins it all. If the refs get involved we could have a rocky road. With that said we've been through it before and came out with a win so I wouldnt worry to much.

Bottom foul trouble reduces the effectiveness of our defense and we win with defense. I expect CD and Butler to see minutes to avoid Collier and Williams getting into foul trouble. Also keep in mind. We score alot of points and many teams in the tourney dont and wont against UConns defense. Hey Im not saying we cant lose but I dont think we will for quite some time.

Not so fast. Maryland may well not beat West Virginia. In fact, if I were to pick an " upset," that would be the game.

 

[Longtime fan]

I find three things hard to believe on this topic....
First as long as Brenda has been around the game she does not understand strength of schedule...
A look back in January ...Committee's message: Don't overlook strength of schedule
Second as long as Brenda has been around the game she does not understand strength of schedule...
Maryland women's basketball gets 'disappointing' No. 3 seed in UConn's region

Third and last for now and just my own opinion. A coach with a team in the upper echelon of the sport should become more of a leader rather than a whiner. Any good coach with overall knowledge of the situation would make it the positive that it is. This for the fan base and the team. Brenda has to show some basketballs.
It is not for lack of recruiting as her team is loaded with all state players and McDonald's AA's. Her approach to this and her comments to the team should be along the lines of, " first and foremost as always we have to focus on our next opponent." Behind closed doors to the team " we have been blessed with the opportunity to be the team that prevents UConn from going to the final four!"

I'm not sure I get Brenda's complaint. Unless her goal was to make the final four, rather than the championship, one has to beat the best to win it all. So UCONN now or UCONN later, you still have to beat them.

 

[j66kicker]

I'm not sure I get Brenda's complaint. Unless her goal was to make the final four, rather than the championship, one has to beat the best to win it all. So UCONN now or UCONN later, you still have to beat them.

As was pointed out, she has a financial incentive to make it as far as she can. So she definitely would want to try to "beat the best" as late in the tournament as possible.