Lou - National Player of the Year?

[Buzzyboy]

I live in the Carolinas and think while A'ja is a tremendous player she would not be on my list of NPOY. I think the kind of player that can impose their will on the game at anytime is a NPOY and do not see that from her consistently. While I realize she is a big and not a guard so its a little more challenging to do so, look at how Napheesa has done it over this thus far challenging schedule.

I have not seen Plum play that much outside some highlights so its unfair for me to state whether she is or is not better than UCONNs two.

I will say that each KLS and NC are very different players which would be hard to pick from at this point. I like the write up in this thread that recognizes that her versatility continues to grow. One edge I give KLS is that the offense seems to flow through her where NC is a bit of the by product of it. KLS can score from anywhere at anytime. NC has an edge on that fall away jumper that let's her get off her shot against anyone and for the offense glass. While she is a good rebounder period, her Off Reb is outstanding which leads to easier scores and high FG%. Also while KLS can knock out a team (clear evidence in last two games but also in some others this year,) NC seems to be more of a quiet assassin. You just look at her box score and say wow, "I did not realize she had that kind of game."

Side note: If Gabby was a more reliable scorer, especially with an outside shot, and committed slightly less turnovers she would be here too because her intangibles and defensive versatility are off the charts compared to most women in the game. She fills a stat sheet across the board and seems to play big in big games.

It seems like an appreciable amount of Napheesa's points are of the "put back" variety, rebounding someone's miss and laying it in. That is the reason for her higher shooting percentage overall. I respect that and it's necessary but I do think that KLS and her shooting abilities really open things up for Napheesa and for Gabby, as well. Gabby is a monster, really contributing all over the court and is such an asset to this Huskie team but my favorite Huskie has to be KLS and as has been mentioned, she's only getting more multi-dimensional.

 

[Buzzyboy]

I agree with the sentiment and support provided. However, I believe that if anyone from UConn is given serious consideration, it will be Gabby, simply because her athletic feats are so much more...ostentatious...than Lou's work.

I also agree that this is largely a race between Wilson and Plum, but others (Kelsey Mitchell in particular) could knock Wilson out of that spot. Barring a Danny Manning/Carmelo Anthony/Kemba Walker-esque performance between now and the Final Four, I think that Lou is a longshot due to her being a sophomore. Maya is the only sophomore Wade winner ever; the Naismith has been won by a sophomore woman four times (Maya, Stewie, Clarissa Davis and Cheryl Miller).

Mentioning Kelsey Mitchell as a possibility in light of the negative reviews she got from a lot of Boneyarder's who thought her overall game is HIGHLY overrated was pretty brave. Many here were absolutely not impressed with her and thought that she was anything but a solid All-American type candidate, partially based on her performance the other night. I surely felt that a lot of the criticism was valid so you may want to reconsider her as a serious candidate. Then too, some here think that Aja Wilson isn't even the best player on her team so that makes it difficult to figure her winning Player of the Year consideration. Just saying!

 

[HardHatGuy#2]

Mentioning Kelsey Mitchell as a possibility in light of the negative reviews she got from a lot of Boneyarder's who thought her overall game is HIGHLY overrated was pretty brave. Many here were absolutely not impressed with her and thought that she was anything but a solid All-American type candidate, partially based on her performance the other night. I surely felt that a lot of the criticism was valid so you may want to reconsider her as a serious candidate. Then too, some here think that Aja Wilson isn't even the best player on her team so that makes it difficult to figure her winning Player of the Year consideration. Just saying!

No change to my opinions. I try to think from the voter's standpoint, and upper classmen/high scorers/big names/big schools tend to get the most votes. Both Mitchell and Wilson are upperclassmen at big programs, Mitchell making a run at the all-time NCAA scoring record and Wilson is as big a name as there is in Women's Basketball today.

For Example: Kelly Faris may have been the single best all around player UConn ever had, but she was never seriously considered for either award (outside of the BY and the like). She was arguably the best shutdown defender UConn has ever had, a tireless worker both in practice and on the court, a Leader in the locker room, and (paraphrasing the color commentator for the NC game) referred to as "The embodiment of all that is Good in Women's Basketball". All of that, and not even on the final list of Wade candidates; while she did make the final 30 for the Naismith, there was no buzz over her.

Nope, I stand on Mitchell, Wilson, and Plum. At this time my money is on Plum, despite being at a lesser (or newcomer) program.

 

[oldude]

I was able to watch Plum last night, as a result of purchasing Sports Pass 2 nights ago so I could watch the Huskies bury the Huskers.

She had 29 pts & she is really good. Her game is similar to that other Kelsey (Mitchell), but she plays under control. Plum is definitely a legitimate NPOY candidate although I still go with Lou who is a better passer, rebounder & defender IMO.

 

[HopJim]

I don't know. Given that I haven't seen South Carolina play this year, and I have seen ND only once, and I haven't seen Plum and I haven't seen .... Given what I haven't seen I'm not ready to make a NPOY pronouncement yet.

I could see KLS and Collier in the running if they continue to improve on aspects of their game. I think they are both strong AA candidates right now.

The thing that KLS has is a transcendent skill -- she can score with the very best UConn has seen (as a sophomore) and has the scorer's confidence. She is a loud scorer. Big bold shots. Throwing daggers from deep and hitting arteries.

Collier is very quiet. Even her blocks are quiet. I thought her last game was one of her worst and I look at the stats and she has 14 points and 15 rebounds. She doesn't scare you with any of her skills ... she will just beat you.

Samuelson is the yin to Collier's yang. Often when Samuelson makes a big shot of takes a charge she will let out a scream. When Collier scores or blocks a shot she barely smiles. Samuelson gives the the refs side eye, Collier gives them wide eyes. Samuelson is a cannon blow. Collier is death by a thousand cuts. They will both kill you. They are different sides of the same coin. Both great. Both AAs ... so far.

Well thought out comments. As with many sports, tough when two players are at such a high level to pick one as #1. Likely split vote will come into play.

 

[hoophuskee]

Have no idea who would be NPOY. For UCONN a lot will come down to their games vs MD and USC. If they win, there is no way some of the Core 4 can't be in the discussion. No way one or two or even three of them cant be in the discussion. I don't think Kia has the individual numbers to be a NPOY type. That's not her game unless she begins to drill 3's at a proficient/efficient/prolific rate. There are only so many baskets I think se can get driving the lane. So it would be down to 3:

Gabby- To be a NPOY she has to score more. She is averaging just 10 ppg. You won't get voted as a NPOY at just 10 per game unless your defense and passing are so obviously great. Gabby's defense is great but because she is being forced to play power forwards and centers/ out of position, not her fault, I don't thin she'll get NPOY consideration for that. For her to eb NPOY, she must be able to consistently hit outside jump shots. They do sag off of her. If she can hit consistently, then she becomes MORE than "Draymond Green" which Geno once compared her to. Instead she would be more like an elite HOF type of comparable player. Until she knocks down at least the 15 footers at a decent volume / efficient rate, I don't think her current stats will get to be a NPOY.

Which leads us to Lou and Collier. Defensively Collier does everything better. There are a few offensive things she does better too. Overall it appears she is the likely number 1 candidate.

With that said-- Lou brings something non-statistical in which Collier can't bring to her game. Lou impacts the game just by standing on the court. As most of us have said about Lou many times, she is a nightmare / mismatch matchup. She is 6'3, long, and has a high release. Teams are scared to play UCONN in a zone even though Collier and Gabby flourish with their movement and drives and ability to score inside. I just recall two tough opponents post game presser - Texas and Notre Dame. Both coaches said they thought about playing zone but decided against it? OFC Kia shooting very, very well and Chong is a fine shooter and Danger and even Collier can shoot-- but who do they most fear? Would these players in of itself preclude you from playing zone? So far the elite teams are reluctant to play zone in large part because of Lou. Thus Lou's presence opens the floor and allows Gabby and Collier to play more towards their strengths. And with so much emphasis on the comment we hear often when Lou is taking a 3- we hear "If there is one player you can't lose on UCONN, it is Lou." This type of emphasis allows Kia and others more looks from 3 which is why as a team - even without Lou UCONN is shooting 38.2% from 3. Which is terrific.

I'm 50-50 with Lou and Collier. The beauty of this team and these two players - they are freak matchups. How do you defend them other than "hope they miss?" That's the beauty of this team. You take away something - they seem to have the counter-answers. Hopefully it continues.

 

[wallman]

In my opinion there is not much similarity in anyones game to KLS, especially her offensive game. Long range on a very quick hard to guard shot beyond the arc, which she can pop or shoot off the dribble or in transition, mid range game both off the dribble, off the curl, pop and flare with great reads on the D, gets to the hoop by reading the D on a close out and before the double comes, posts and cuts around the basket. She sees the court several plays and passes ahead, outlets the ball long, Gabby becoming also great at this, passes on the touch reading and seeing the players and leads them to easy shots. Movement without the ball second to none on this team as far as the defense face guarding and doubling her, CDs inner monolog obviously working.

She can create wide open lay ups for others by her movement alone and forcing 2 or more players to hedge toward her. She is as smart defensively, having clearly learned from your coaches how to use that length and long wing span but also uses her smarts to position herself against the other players weaknesses which can be seen by the number of charges she takes. Geno seems to always go to her when he needs a bucket or a pass to a bucket or to break the press.

My scout of this team would be to exploit Collier in the post as she is often out of position, i.e. against Turner in the second half of ND game, against Lewis and also even against Shepard although Shepard was unable to hit anything. I wouldn't be going at Williams as he pushes her player away from the basket and can jump out of the gym. Offensively I would leave Collier open away from the basket, using only a slight hedge as she is a slow shooter and needs set up, thats what Nebraska did and not let her get her favorite scoring position around the basket where she is at her most dangerous.

 

[easttexastrash]

For UCONN players, Collier gets my vote. IMO, Alexis Jones is as strong a candidate as anyone but probably won't be considered because she wasn't on the radar last year, and in WCBB you often get rewarded for what you did last year and what your reputation is coming into the season.

Thus, A'ja Wilson will most likely be the POY since she is the most hyped coming into the season. That is not to say that she is not a super player, just that she is the most hyped and therefore has the edge with those who get to vote. I also think that if WNBA teams could pick any player from any classification that Wilson would be the top pick in the WNBA draft.

 

[shinobimono]

I don't know how you can nominate Lou for NPOY without giving the same nod to Napheesa. I think they are both potential NPOY candidates, but I don't see Lou overshadowing NC at this stage of the season. To me, NC appears to be further along in the mental side of the game and does a lot of other things well (blocks, steals and rebounds). Lou, on the other hand, is a really explosive offensive player, more explosive than Stewie was, in my view, and scores points rapidly and effortlessly. Her overall game is steadily improving in almost all facets and will continue to do so under Geno (this, after all, is why she came to UConn). By the end of the year, they could both well be serious NPOY candidates (in fact, it's scary to think how good they could be as juniors and seniors). To me, they are the backbone of this team (and its quiet leaders), something that I think Geno acknowledged in his recent comment about how you need two players of their caliber around which to build a championship team. They have really risen to the challenge this year, taking on leadership roles. This is not meant to take anything away from Gabby or Kia, who are very key players in their own right. The future of UConn WBB is truly exciting. And next year's team, OMG!

 

[Waquoit]

I think Gabby is the best player on the team. But it's a moot point. These guys play team ball and let the stats fall where they may.

 

[DefenseBB]

For UCONN players, Collier gets my vote. IMO, Alexis Jones is as strong a candidate as anyone but probably won't be considered because she wasn't on the radar last year, and in WCBB you often get rewarded for what you did last year and what your reputation is coming into the season.

Thus, A'ja Wilson will most likely be the POY since she is the most hyped coming into the season. That is not to say that she is not a super player, just that she is the most hyped and therefore has the edge with those who get to vote. I also think that if WNBA teams could pick any player from any classification that Wilson would be the top pick in the WNBA draft.

No disrespect but you lost me on this preamble. So according to your logic, UConn who #3 preseason and even that as generous should not be considered as the favorite for the NC now. The season has unfolded (at least 1/3 of the way), and here is UConn #1 with ND a distant #2. Therefore Recomsidering who is the key player for this team must be considered and that is KLS not NC or GW. That is not a slight at either of these two ladies, as without them UConn would not be in the current situation. If you are Brenda Frese or Dawn Staley, which player are you focused on to stop from beating you? Its KLS, not GW nor NC who are key but secondary (1B/1C) contributors.
Plum is definitely a leader as is Anigwa from Cal (they, as our esteemed collegue pointed out on MD, played more cupcakes than the school bakesale has mad) depending how well they do in Conference Play. Turner lost out to NC, GW and KLS in their head to head. Aja has not been as strong as Coates to this point and then there's Mitchell who was clearly second fiddle to our stars. Am I missing anyone else truly worthy? Durr, Vivians, Allen or any MD players?

 

[Ouremblem]

Rick Barry! The mention of his name brought back memories of listening to the NY Nets (this was in the ABA days) on my transistor radio in the late '60s. I remember his trademark underhanded free throw technique, and his teammates Bill Melchionni and, of course, the amazing Dr. J. Remember those red, white and blue balls?
Thanks for triggering those memories, Bags.

Ray,
I actually attended games at the Island Garden arena before they went to the Nassau Coliseum. Sonny Dove. Billy Paultz. John Roche. That does bring back memories. Mel Daniels. Dan Issel. Charlie Scott.

 

[HumblePie]

No disrespect but you lost me on this preamble. So according to your logic, UConn who #3 preseason and even that as generous should not be considered as the favorite for the NC now. The season has unfolded (at least 1/3 of the way), and here is UConn #1 with ND a distant #2. Therefore Recomsidering who is the key player for this team must be considered and that is KLS not NC or GW. That is not a slight at either of these two ladies, as without them UConn would not be in the current situation. If you are Brenda Frese or Dawn Staley, which player are you focused on to stop from beating you? Its KLS, not GW nor NC who are key but secondary (1B/1C) contributors.

Well said!

 

[easttexastrash]

No disrespect but you lost me on this preamble. So according to your logic, UConn who #3 preseason and even that as generous should not be considered as the favorite for the NC now. The season has unfolded (at least 1/3 of the way), and here is UConn #1 with ND a distant #2. Therefore Recomsidering who is the key player for this team must be considered and that is KLS not NC or GW. That is not a slight at either of these two ladies, as without them UConn would not be in the current situation. If you are Brenda Frese or Dawn Staley, which player are you focused on to stop from beating you? Its KLS, not GW nor NC who are key but secondary (1B/1C) contributors.
Plum is definitely a leader as is Anigwa from Cal (they, as our esteemed collegue pointed out on MD, played more cupcakes than the school bakesale has mad) depending how well they do in Conference Play. Turner lost out to NC, GW and KLS in their head to head. Aja has not been as strong as Coates to this point and then there's Mitchell who was clearly second fiddle to our stars. Am I missing anyone else truly worthy? Durr, Vivians, Allen or any MD players?

I'm sorry, but at what point did I indicate that UCONN should not be considered as the favorite for the National Championship? I'm not sure what you are smoking that you interpreted ANYTHING I said as an indication that UCONN is not the favorite. I was discussing POY candidates and merely stated that since Wilson had more hype before the season started that she is going to get some votes simply based on reputation. If I were a WNBA GM and I could pick any player in WCBB, my pick would be Wilson. Sorry if that bothers you.

 

[BroadwayVa]

Wait..... timeout..., A'Ja is not a guard? Has anyone communicated this to her?

Apparently you missed that memo---Dawn sent that memo only to staff and Uconn fans---don't know how you could have missed it??? Just to be sure---Aja Wilson --IS NOT A GUARD!! GOT IT???

 

[BroadwayVa]

I'm sorry, but at what point did I indicate that UCONN should not be considered as the favorite for the National Championship? I'm not sure what you are smoking that you interpreted ANYTHING I said as an indication that UCONN is not the favorite. I was discussing POY candidates and merely stated that since Wilson had more hype before the season started that she is going to get some votes simply based on reputation. If I were a WNBA GM and I could pick any player in WCBB, my pick would be Wilson. Sorry if that bothers you.

The quote could have been mine in Sept---Uconn can't win it all-- I changed in November--and said Uconn is on to the Final 4. Wait until next monday--it may change again. But I'm a rigid in my belief!!!

You are here on the Boneyard--how can you even mention Wilson?? Some have had audacity to say Turner. I think they were tarred and feathered.

Being sorry it bothers me isn't enough--Shakespeare wrote of taking pounds of something--that should be adequate.

 

[BroadwayVa]

How many shots does it take to accomplish her ppg average and how high is her shooting per centage? I've watched her play for three years and she is as much of a ball hog as Kelsey Mitchell to the point that one of her teammates got on her last season about not trusting her teammates.

I suppose it's a fine line for Katie Lou to follow--satisfying Geno's demands to shoot and teammate demands she passes---but for the games I've seen (and i've seen all of them) at times Katie Lou can be faulted for passing when she has the shot. Damned if you do damned if you don't!!

 

[oldude]

I'll live & die with Lou shooting the ball any time, anywhere. I watched KML miss her 1st five 3's of a game more than a few times, only to catch fire and bury an opponent. IMO, Lou is even better, and what's more important is that Geno both trusts her & expects her to take the shots to get the offense rolling, to stop an opposing team's run, coming out of a timeout; in short, at all the key points of the game.

 

[BroadwayVa]

I have been shocked and elated with her play this year. I was afraid that she would be another Ann Strothers, a kid who had a great freshman year playing second fiddle to Diana Taurasi, but who struggled the next three years when the team depended on her.

KLS has really evolved into an all-around star: great inside game, strong defense underneath, great passing, and superb outside shooting. She is light years beyond Strothers in her second year.

Anne in my opinion would be in 7th heaven if she were on this team---she would not alone be responsible for scoring or the big moments those can be handled by Collier, Gabby, Saniya, Danger, (assuming Katie Lou isn't there). Anne wouldn't score as much as KLS
but she'd be happy and contribute. She wasn't as big or as great a shooter as KLS. Light years beyond Anne is a bit harsh. You are comparing apples and ball bearing--you guess which is which. Remember Anne is good enough to be Wnba and play in China or Europe for big bucks---that says something about her talent and ability to contribute. With apparently time to think of starting a family>/?

 

[Huskee11]

I have read all of these posts and they are terrific.

I will take a step back and think back to this summer, when I was looking all over to try and find out how Lou was progressing with her foot, and Pheese with her hip.

It is truly wonderful to now be discussing those two badasses as potential players of the year.

We are blessed, Husky fans. Happy holidays.

 

[dtbtbtb]

I doubt KLS or Phee will win POY this season, not because they are not deserving but due to the media not wanting to givea UConn player after the last few years. IMO Plum will win it.
In regard to the UConn MVP so far this season, i'll go with KLS as she is clearly the focal point of any defensive planning for opposing coaches and the one who is looked for to score whenever UConn needs a basket...

 

[donalddoowop]

I suppose it's a fine line for Katie Lou to follow--satisfying Geno's demands to shoot and teammate demands she passes---but for the games I've seen (and i've seen all of them) at times Katie Lou can be faulted for passing when she has the shot. Damned if you do damned if you don't!!

What does this have to do with my post? It is referring to Plum. I don't think KLS shoots too often. Also dtbtbtb, your last sentence is not necessarily true, imo. Any one of four players could fill that role.

 

[wallman]

I don't know how you can nominate Lou for NPOY without giving the same nod to Napheesa. I think they are both potential NPOY candidates, but I don't see Lou overshadowing NC at this stage of the season. To me, NC appears to be further along in the mental side of the game and does a lot of other things well (blocks, steals and rebounds). Lou, on the other hand, is a really explosive offensive player, more explosive than Stewie was, in my view, and scores points rapidly and effortlessly. Her overall game is steadily improving in almost all facets and will continue to do so under Geno (this, after all, is why she came to UConn). By the end of the year, they could both well be serious NPOY candidates (in fact, it's scary to think how good they could be as juniors and seniors). To me, they are the backbone of this team (and its quiet leaders), something that I think Geno acknowledged in his recent comment about how you need two players of their caliber around which to build a championship team. They have really risen to the challenge this year, taking on leadership roles. This is not meant to take anything away from Gabby or Kia, who are very key players in their own right. The future of UConn WBB is truly exciting. And next year's team, OMG!

Gabby Wiliams IMO is the best defensive player on the team, flat out so to me that excludes Collier from the discussion as she does not have the offensive game of KLS and Wiliams matches Collier offensively. When 90% of your baskets come around the rim and the majority are wide open due to your team they cannot be on par with what Williams does to get her baskets i.e. skying over players 5" taller with a hook shot or any of the offensive moves that KLS has with the D keying on her. The Nebraska game was pretty eye opening to the extent that they left Collier open away from the basket and she missed every shot and they were wide open. Before any player can be in the conversation they at least need to show that they can hit a quick shot while being aressively guarded that is not within 2 feet of the basket.

And dt is absolutely correct and it goes in this order KLS, Nurse, WIliams, which is probably why everyone is worried about Nurse but teams know what she can do. You take KLS off the team and you are swamped inside with defensive players with 1 overplaying Nurse, you take Nurse off your teams and your inside players would never get a basket.

 

[meyers7]

I agree with the sentiment and support provided. However, I believe that if anyone from UConn is given serious consideration, it will be Gabby, simply because her athletic feats are so much more...ostentatious...than Lou's work.

I also agree that this is largely a race between Wilson and Plum, but others (Kelsey Mitchell in particular) could knock Wilson out of that spot. Barring a Danny Manning/Carmelo Anthony/Kemba Walker-esque performance between now and the Final Four, I think that Lou is a longshot due to her being a sophomore. Maya is the only sophomore Wade winner ever; the Naismith has been won by a sophomore woman four times (Maya, Stewie, Clarissa Davis and Cheryl Miller).

Actually Parker won her Soph year. (She had r/s her FR year, but technically for BB purposes, it was her Soph year 06-07) She won Wade, Wooden and AP that year. Harding took the Naismith.

 

[CocoHusky]

The Nebraska game was pretty eye opening to the extent that they left Collier open away from the basket and she missed every shot and they were wide open.

In the Texas Game Napheesa made 3 of 4 shots like you are describing and is shooting a very respectable 38% on trey balls for the season.

Before any player can be in the conversation they at least need to show that they can hit a quick shot while being aressively guarded that is not within 2 feet of the basket.

All 10 players on the UCONN roster can do what you are suggesting.

You take KLS off the team and you are swamped inside with defensive players with 1 overplaying Nurse, you take Nurse off your teams and your inside players would never get a basket.

Say what? Assists totals for UCONN this season:
1) Gabby 51
2) Kia 46
3) Crystal 33
4) KLS 32
5) Saniya 25
Gabby is the best interior passer on the team, just ask ND. Gabby destroyed ND by passing from the high post.