"LadyVol" name is kaput next year...except for | Page 2 | The Boneyard

"LadyVol" name is kaput next year...except for

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Bayareahusky said:
Yes TP3 good words,. Pat and Geno both have treated their athletes as those free of gender labels.....

Lady Vols have a great tradition..... and there is nothing that needs to be changed in the name.....

As I say this, though, I wonder why (having not read into the story at all) UT has seen the need to can all other "Lady" titles
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Just in case you don't feel like reading - "branding", "having a consistent brand", coincident to a change in athletic providers (Addidas / Nike). Now-a-days, branding is such a "thing".

In some ways, Lady Vols WBB is a brand unto itself; I follow softball and often root for Tennessee when I watch on TV's and always had trouble thinking of them as the "Lady Vols", though they were, of course.
 
I wonder if Pat has gone public with her opinion on the change of all the other women's teams at UTenn?

Against it? Indifferent? Support it?

Any of our ...uhhh...LadyVol visitors know?
 
blakeon18 said:
I wonder if Pat has gone public with her opinion on the change of all the other women's teams at UTenn?

Against it? Indifferent? Support it?

Any of our ...uhhh...LadyVol visitors know?
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The AD met with Pat prior to the announcement. Her reps stated that she would not be commenting on it.
 
9: appreciate your info. My guess is that means she ain't a bit happy about it.
 
blakeon18 said:
9: appreciate your info. My guess is that means she ain't a bit happy about it.
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You're welcome. A lot of people aren't happy about it. I am torn personally. The two departments merged so one would expect the logos to be the same. However, the basketball logo should never change due to Pat's legacy and contribution to the University. As long as that does not change, I will be OK with it.
 
I certainly like Uconn being the single name for men's and women's teams at the school I support. In general I have always felt that the addition of 'Lady' to a school's name for the distaff side of their athletic department was slightly 'demeaning' and in keeping with the second class nature of women's athletics up until title IX (and continuing forward in time for many schools in terms of standards accepted.) For most schools removing the 'Lady' I think would be a positive move. However I do make an exception for LadyVols because of the record and the trail blazing nature of that program and their coach.
While I think gender bias is insidious in our society I do not feel it rises quite to the level of the racism that is still very real. And I think like race, women should be allowed to choose the form in which they would like to be referred to. The women's basketball team at TN has chosen and I am fine with that choice - just like the choices made between Miss/Mrs. vs. Ms. 'Lady' is not a pejorative in its common usage though of course it can be made to be with tone like most words. 'Redskin' on the other hand has always been racist while 'Indian' has a mixed history and has been moved into the racist arena by the adoption of 'Native American' as the preferred nomenclature.
 
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Personally, I find the term Lady Vol a convenient way to specify the women's program vs. the men's. The men's program should add "men" to the reference. Calling both teams Vols is too ambiguous.

The problem with the word lady is that it has had so many meanings over the years. Many people (all outside of Knoxville) are going to think of it as a derogatory or demeaning term, particularly older folks. Others will think it's an OK word. In the 60's & 70's, it was objected to by feminist. It connoted low class/demeaning. Cleaning lady, but always woman Doctor for instance. Today, take your pick of how you wish to envision the word's meaning. Will the ladies section of your health club contain exercise equipment usually known as "stripper poles", or will it be tables and tea?

Ironically, lady is currently more acceptable than it was when Tennessee first started using Lady Vols. Although rappers have done damage to the word. Not sure what Lady Gaga has accomplished. Stay tuned for what future use of the word will connote.
 
Bestiarius said:
Personally, I find the term Lady Vol a convenient way to specify the women's program vs. the men's. The men's program should add "men" to the reference. Calling both teams Vols is too ambiguous.

The problem with the word lady is that it has had so many meanings over the years. Many people (all outside of Knoxville) are going to think of it as a derogatory or demeaning term, particularly older folks. Others will think it's an OK word. In the 60's & 70's, it was objected to by feminist. It connoted low class/demeaning. Cleaning lady, but always woman Doctor for instance. Today, take your pick of how you wish to envision the word's meaning. Will the ladies section of your health club contain exercise equipment usually known as "stripper poles", or will it be tables and tea?

Ironically, lady is currently more acceptable than it was when Tennessee first started using Lady Vols. Although rappers have done damage to the word. Not sure what Lady Gaga has accomplished. Stay tuned for what future use of the word will connote.
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don't leave out Lady Antebellum too. LOL
 
I don't like the "Lady Whatevers" way of naming women's teams. I always mentally then call the men's team the "Gentlemen Whatevers" ;)

But even this feminist doesn't really quarrel with Lady Vols keeping their name and logo. They were extremely important in the rise of women's intercollegiate athletics with that name. So I think they are keeping it as an important anachronism.

While "Lady" may not have totally positive associations, I agree that it does not have the totally negative connotations of something like "Redskins".
 
cockhrnleghrn said:
To me, honoring the equality of women is to treat them the same as men - no special treatment, same pay for the same work, etc. In basketball, I believe in treating (read: cheering against, reminding of foul trouble, etc., nothing off color) opposing women's basketball players and coaches the same as I would opposing men's basketball players and coaches. Keeping a separate name for WBB at Tennessee strikes me as being archaic. I think the world of Pat Summitt and enjoyed watching her coach up close for many, many years, but I think it's time to drop "Lady ___" from team names.
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Should all team names be changed to gender neutral? For example, should the Gamecocks now be called the Chickens? I don't believe distinguishing oneself in some way is necessarily a bad thing and I don't find anything offensive about "Lady Vols". Especially since it distinguishes them as the team that has won eight National Championships and not the one that hasn't won any. :D
 
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Bestiarius said:
Personally, I find the term Lady Vol a convenient way to specify the women's program vs. the men's. The men's program should add "men" to the reference. Calling both teams Vols is too ambiguous.

The problem with the word lady is that it has had so many meanings over the years. Many people (all outside of Knoxville) are going to think of it as a derogatory or demeaning term, particularly older folks. Others will think it's an OK word. In the 60's & 70's, it was objected to by feminist. It connoted low class/demeaning. Cleaning lady, but always woman Doctor for instance. Today, take your pick of how you wish to envision the word's meaning. Will the ladies section of your health club contain exercise equipment usually known as "stripper poles", or will it be tables and tea?

Ironically, lady is currently more acceptable than it was when Tennessee first started using Lady Vols. Although rappers have done damage to the word. Not sure what Lady Gaga has accomplished. Stay tuned for what future use of the word will connote.
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Am I right in thinking that Tennessee was unique in having separate athletic departments for men and women among major Division 1 schools? If there are any other examples, does anyone know if their mascot names included a Lady moniker for the women's teams?

ETT - if you're following this thread, do you know if this has ever been a discussion point at Baylor?
 
Texas had, and possibly still have, separate departments for men's and women's athletics.

Tennessee and Texas were the only two in the country IIRC.
 
I don't have strong feelings one way or the other on this one but it seems like Hart has made a mess of things. It's clear that his goal is to bring all sports, including women's basketball, under one logo. He didn't accomplish his goal but still managed to cause quite a stir and generate a lot of anger. Seems like a lose-lose for him.
 
Were the female Gamecocks ever called the Game Hens? They really should become gender neutral and change their mascot to the Game Birds. Thank you for raising my awareness Reno Tony.
 
cabbie191 said:
Am I right in thinking that Tennessee was unique in having separate athletic departments for men and women among major Division 1 schools? If there are any other examples, does anyone know if their mascot names included a Lady moniker for the women's teams?

ETT - if you're following this thread, do you know if this has ever been a discussion point at Baylor?
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I was doing a bit of research on mascots at the major colleges and some Rutgers / Arizona opponents (in several sports) and there are a number of schools (not huge) that have both male and female mascots.

The mascots out here are Wilbur Wildcat and his "wife" Wilma Wildcat (there are actually 2 performers of each). Wilma has primary responsibility for Volleyball and Women's Basketball, Wilbur for men's basketball and football. Both work football games, however, and Wilbur was on hand for the Volleyball match-up against our rival ASU.
 
UcMiami said:
I certainly like Uconn being the single name for men's and women's teams at the school I support. In general I have always felt that the addition of 'Lady' to a school's name for the distaff side of their athletic department was slightly 'demeaning' and in keeping with the second class nature of women's athletics up until title IX (and continuing forward in time for many schools in terms of standards accepted.) For most schools removing the 'Lady' I think would be a positive move. However I do make an exception for LadyVols because of the record and the trail blazing nature of that program and their coach.
While I think gender bias is insidious in our society I do not feel it rises quite to the level of the racism that is still very real. And I think like race, women should be allowed to choose the form in which they would like to be referred to. The women's basketball team at TN has chosen and I am fine with that choice - just like the choices made between Miss/Mrs. vs. Ms. 'Lady' is not a pejorative in its common usage though of course it can be made to be with tone like most words. 'Redskin' on the other hand has always been racist while 'Indian' has a mixed history and has been moved into the racist arena by the adoption of 'Native American' as the preferred nomenclature.
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On your first point, I personally like all teams to have the same nickname (except I support the Lady Vols decision). At the same time, I don't associate use of the term "Lady" as being disparaging and, after all, I suspect if a player finds it offensive they will find somewhere else to go.

On your last point - there are lots of racist terms (Redskins is mild compared to many), but I do not think you can make the word "Indian" (or the word "Negro" among others) "racist". You can take them out of regular usage, you can make them not the preferred term - or even insulting, you can find more acceptable substitutes, but I refuse to believe you can make them "racist" words. They never carried a connotation of negative racism that a huge number of other words did, and while they may not be acceptable usage, as I say, you cannot make them inherently racist.
 
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I fully support the Lady Vols. when i coached girls basketball parks and rec, they always referred to the group in the term 'guys' (as in come on you guys stop fooling around). I get it, it is more gender neutral these days, but if you are going to draw a line, draw it all the way and I dont think it is necessary in this.

I noticed years ago that many of the All American Red Heads referred to themselves as "Ladies" when referring to their teams in earlier days and the earlier teams in the 40s and all used the term 'girls'.

There was no disrespect meant at all. in fact those terms were used in respect.

The Huskies are the Huskies. I do not refer to them as Lady, etc. Out of respect.

I will refer to the Tennesse womens basketball team as the "Lady Vols".. out of nothing but respect.
 
UConnCat said:
I don't have strong feelings one way or the other on this one but it seems like Hart has made a mess of things. It's clear that his goal is to bring all sports, including women's basketball, under one logo. He didn't accomplish his goal but still managed to cause quite a stir and generate a lot of anger. Seems like a lose-lose for him.
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Totally agree.
 
I think as far as branding goes it's more confusing having the women's bb team continue to be the Lady Vols, while all the other women's sports are now just the Vols, than it would be to just leave them all as Lady Vols. Makes more sense to me that this exception was done for the sake of $$ donations, like the posted USA Today article says, than "to honor Pat's legacy."

Also, regarding the USC Gamecocks, to me the whole cockfighting reference is more of a concern than whether the women's teams are called the Lady Gamecocks, or Gamehens - whatever. (My daughter is a Clemson alum - I won't tell you what she calls them :D )
 
j66kicker said:
I think as far as branding goes it's more confusing having the women's bb team continue to be the Lady Vols, while all the other women's sports are now just the Vols, than it would be to just leave them all as Lady Vols. Makes more sense to me that this exception was done for the sake of donations, like the posted USA Today article says, than "to honor Pat's legacy."

Also, regarding the USC Gamecocks, to me the whole cockfighting reference is more of a concern than whether the women's teams are called the Lady Gamecocks, or Gamehens - whatever. (My daughter is a Clemson alum - I won't tell you what she calls them :D )
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Makes me wonder if the decision to allow the Bball team to retain the Lady Vols name is being done by the UT administration as a temporary measure and that in a few years, the term Lady will be dropped here as well.
 
mcannon1 said:
Were the female Gamecocks ever called the Game Hens? They really should become gender neutral and change their mascot to the Game Birds. Thank you for raising my awareness Reno Tony.
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In the early days they were called the "Chicks" and then that was quickly changed to "Lady Gamecocks". They've been simply "Gamecocks" for at least 20 years. "Gamecock" is not just a reference to a fighting rooster, one of the most famous South Carolina generals during the Revolutionary War was Thomas Sumter, who was nicknamed, "The Gamecock". FTR, I don't think the mascots themselves need to be gender neutral, but adding "Lady" to the front of a nickname just seems old fashioned to me.
 
j66kicker said:
I think as far as branding goes it's more confusing having the women's bb team continue to be the Lady Vols, while all the other women's sports are now just the Vols, than it would be to just leave them all as Lady Vols. Makes more sense to me that this exception was done for the sake of donations, like the posted USA Today article says, than "to honor Pat's legacy."

Also, regarding the USC Gamecocks, to me the whole cockfighting reference is more of a concern than whether the women's teams are called the Lady Gamecocks, or Gamehens - whatever. (My daughter is a Clemson alum - I won't tell you what she calls them :D )
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LOL, that's ok, we have some perjorative names for them, too. As far as the cockfighting reference, see my post above for the rest of the story.
 
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were the Huskies ever called the LADY Huskies... pre-Geno?
 
Three factoids:
1. As far as the Lady in Lady Vols, it could be worse. At Centennial in Louisiana the teams are the Gentlemen and the Ladies, and at Kenyon in OH, it's the Lords and the Ladies. Best use of the term is for Washburn U. in KS, which has Lady Blues, which has a Billie Holiday feel to it.
2. First servicewomen in the US military, were the Lady Yeomen of WW1. Oberlin has the Yeomen and Yeowomen, so maybe they should pick up the Lady Yeomen term as like the Lady Volunteers it has patriotic war service connotations.
3. Unrelated, but I just read that Rocky Top was written in 10 minutes. I would have assumed that a masterpiece like that would have taken at least twice that long.
 
DobbsRover2 said:
Three factoids:
1. As far as the Lady in Lady Vols, it could be worse. At Centennial in Louisiana the teams are the Gentlemen and the Ladies, and at Kenyon in OH, it's the Lords and the Ladies. Best use of the term is for Washburn U. in KS, which has Lady Blues, which has a Billie Holiday feel to it.
2. First servicewomen in the US military, were the Lady Yeomen of WW1. Oberlin has the Yeomen and Yeowomen, so maybe they should pick up the Lady Yeomen term as like the Lady Volunteers it has patriotic war service connotations.
3. Unrelated, but I just read that Rocky Top was written in 10 minutes. I would have assumed that a masterpiece like that would have taken at least twice that long.
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These were the authors:

1917022_165462182350_1675666_n.jpg
 
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