Klinsmann Out

[Excalibur]

Which is what I said. I consider him among our best players, but he had a weak second half against Mexico and a bad game against CR. Actually, I was thinking more about the guys around him, and whether he's had to make up for their lapses. In particular, Timmy Chandler was at RB in both games.

You said you considered him to be one of our five best "prior to the Hex", the clear implication that you no longer do. If you want to back off of that now, fine.

 

[HuskyHawk]

You said you considered him to be one of our five best "prior to the Hex", the clear implication that you no longer do. If you want to back off of that now, fine.

That wasn't the implication. The implication is that he hasn't been one of our five best players these last two games, and he hasn't. I said he needs to return to form....and be one of our best players. I think he was arguably our best player in the last WC, certainly our best defender.

 

[businesslawyer]

Then you're a clown, because the central positions in a flat back 4 are interchangeable. So that wraps up this discussion...

1. ZooCougar is 100% correct that currently coaches view left center backs as a different position than right center backs. If Brooks sits Besler plays. Third on the list would probably be Tim Ream. Cameron, Birnbaum and Oman are viewed as right center backs (although Cameron can play a number of positions).

2. Brooks was awful the last round of qualifiers. Brooks was also great in the Copa. Go figure -- almost like players are human beings.

 

[meyers7]

Gonzalez, who I think is equivalent to Brooks,

Ok, right there you just blew any confidence we might have had in anything you say.

 

[ZooCougar]

1. ZooCougar is 100% correct that currently coaches view left center backs as a different position than right center backs. If Brooks sits Besler plays. Third on the list would probably be Tim Ream. Cameron, Birnbaum and Oman are viewed as right center backs (although Cameron can play a number of positions).

2. Brooks was awful the last round of qualifiers. Brooks was also great in the Copa. Go figure -- almost like players are human beings.

I could be wrong, but I think Ream is more of Fullback these days for Fulham. I suspect he'll be another one of those guys that Arena said yesterday would get another opportunity.

Cameron and Brooks are top on the depth chart. The problem with Brooks, and this is well documented is that he doesn't travel well for these international breaks. He's a big dude and his back gives him problems after long flights.

US Soccer has money... and we have some really players in Germany that are pretty valuable. They should hire a private jet and fly our guys back for these breaks just like Barcelona/Argentina and a bunch Premier League clubs do. A million bucks a year to get our European based players over here in good condition is pretty much chump change when you consider benefits. I've been luck enough to fly Business a few times back and forth over the Atlantic, and I'm 5' 10" tall and I couldn't completely stretch out, Brooks is 6' 4" that would be awful.

 

[businesslawyer]

I could be wrong, but I think Ream is more of Fullback these days for Fulham. I suspect he'll be another one of those guys that Arena said yesterday would get another opportunity.

Cameron and Brooks are top on the depth chart. The problem with Brooks, and this is well documented is that he doesn't travel well for these international breaks. He's a big dude and his back gives him problems after long flights.

US Soccer has money... and we have some really players in Germany that are pretty valuable. They should hire a private jet and fly our guys back for these breaks just like Barcelona/Argentina and a bunch Premier League clubs do. A million bucks a year to get our European based players over here in good condition is pretty much chump change when you consider benefits. I've been luck enough to fly Business a few times back and forth over the Atlantic, and I'm 5' 10" tall and I couldn't completely stretch out, Brooks is 6' 4" that would be awful.

Fully agree that one private jet to get all European based players for national team breaks is the way to go. Since he's now stuck using Air Force 1 for the next 4 years, how about Trump supporters lobbying him to Make America Great AGain by letting the MNT use his plane a dozen times a year?

 

[HuskyHawk]

Fully agree that one private jet to get all European based players for national team breaks is the way to go. Since he's now stuck using Air Force 1 for the next 4 years, how about Trump supporters lobbying him to Make America Great AGain by letting the MNT use his plane a dozen times a year?

I know you're joking, but something tells me he'd do it. Great publicity.

 

[ZooCougar]

Fully agree that one private jet to get all European based players for national team breaks is the way to go. Since he's now stuck using Air Force 1 for the next 4 years, how about Trump supporters lobbying him to Make America Great AGain by letting the MNT use his plane a dozen times a year?

I know you're joking, but something tells me he'd do it. Great publicity.

Not totally out of the question, Trump is a soccer guy and he played high school soccer. and we've got plenty of jets in the inventory other than Air Force One.

I know it costs the government about $250 to contract an commercial airliner to fly military back and forth from deployments, so I don't think hiring small jet would be too cost prohibitive.

 

[businesslawyer]

Not totally out of the question, Trump is a soccer guy and he played high school soccer. and we've got plenty of jets in the inventory other than Air Force One.

I know it costs the government about $250 to contract an commercial airliner to fly military back and forth from deployments, so I don't think hiring small jet would be too cost prohibitive.

No, actually, I wasn't joking at all. He's got a plane that he can't sell and he can't use. I didn't know he had played soccer but it is absolutely great publicity. But it's not for those who opposed him to tell him what he now has to do for me with his personal assets. But those who supported him should make this happen.

 

[djct1999]

Classy move:
Jurgen Klinsmann posts heartfelt video to thank USMNT fans for support

 

[ZooCougar]

No, actually, I wasn't joking at all. He's got a plane that he can't sell and he can't use. I didn't know he had played soccer but it is absolutely great publicity. But it's not for those who opposed him to tell him what he now has to do for me with his personal assets. But those who supported him should make this happen.

Donald Trump played Varsity soccer in high school

I think he was an investor in an NASL team in the '80s as well. Men in Blazers had a clip of him this week doing some drawing with a bunch of English guys. He has some legitimate ties to the sport.

 

[ZooCougar]

Donald Trump once did the draw for English soccer’s League Cup. Really.

 

[businesslawyer]

Classy move:
Juurgen Klinsmann posts heartfelt video to thank USMNT fans for support

This surprises me. I thought he thought we were too dumb to figure out how to play an internet video.

 

[UConnDan97]

Ok, right there you just blew any confidence we might have had in anything you say.

Brooks is better than Gonzalez. what I meant by that was that coaches who prefer the big bodied center backs will look at Gonzalez in that same manner.

The question becomes whether we want to continue playing 2 big center backs and not go with the faster backs who want to bring the ball up more. the Borchers type, or for the throwbacks here, the Bocanegra type. if Arena chooses to go with the latter situation, I don't think he'll choose Brooks over Gonzalez. I'm not saying that's the right decision. I'm saying that will likely be the one he makes. I don't see any way that Cameron doesn't play when he's healthy...

 

[UConnDan97]

1. ZooCougar is 100% correct that currently coaches view left center backs as a different position than right center backs. If Brooks sits Besler plays. Third on the list would probably be Tim Ream. Cameron, Birnbaum and Oman are viewed as right center backs (although Cameron can play a number of positions).

2. Brooks was awful the last round of qualifiers. Brooks was also great in the Copa. Go figure -- almost like players are human beings.

I'm aware that players prefer one over the other. I'm also aware that they can play the one they don't prefer with very little adjustment.

The perfect example is one I've already offered up; Sergio Ramos. He is unarguably right foot dominant, and many times even plays right wing back. But he has also been used on the left side of center as well. So what it means is that you should play your best two center backs when you can, even if both are "right footed" or "left footed"...

 

[meyers7]

Brooks is better than Gonzalez. what I meant by that was that coaches who prefer the big bodied center backs will look at Gonzalez in that same manner.

Ok, that's different.

The question becomes whether we want to continue playing 2 big center backs and not go with the faster backs who want to bring the ball up more. the Borchers type, or for the throwbacks here, the Bocanegra type. if Arena chooses to go with the latter situation, I don't think he'll choose Brooks over Gonzalez. I'm not saying that's the right decision. I'm saying that will likely be the one he makes. I don't see any way that Cameron doesn't play when he's healthy...

If not, he should be fired on the spot.

 

[UConnDan97]

Ok, that's different.


If not, he should be fired on the spot.

Well, the one aspect that I agree with Zoo about (don't tell Zoo) is that I think Arena will favor a player that he's familiar with over another; in this case, Gonzalez over Brooks. Not that this is very different from Klinsmann in some regards, just the other side of the pendulum.

However, if we take Arena at his word, he said that anyone qualified to wear the US jersey is welcome. We'll see...

 

[whaler11]

Arena might be boring but had they not made a move let me know how bored you'd be in 2018 when the US stayed home.

 

[junglehusky]

I think this chart reinforces that Klinsmann's stewardship was one of volatility, risks and unrealized potential. The high marks were similar to his predecessors but he was never able to sustain it, and you could certainly make the argument that overcoaching and being "too cute" from the game tactics and philosophy perspective was behind the low points and ultimately was JK's undoing. Well that, plus the fact that he wasn't hired to replicate Arena and Bradley's high points - he was supposed to raise the ceiling (and the floor) of the USMNT, and his contract reflected that. So while there might be a MLS-centric mindset pervading the US Soccer community as Zoo points out... I think Gulati was justified in firing JK for not fulfilling expectations for what JK specifically was hired to do.

 

[ZooCougar]

Arena might be boring but had they not made a move let me know how bored you'd be in 2018 when the US stayed home.

You've followed the Hex before. There's like a zero % chance that would have happened, even if Alum86 were managing.

 

[businesslawyer]

You've followed the Hex before. There's like a zero % chance that would have happened, even if Alum86 were managing.

The team quit on him. Yes, we're better than T&T and Honduras and Panama, and should still qualify, but when teams quit on coaches it stops mattering if you're better than your opponents. Just like our football team quit on HCBD.

It was not guarantied that we'd climb up to 3rd without a change

 

[SubbaBub]

We don't want to be in the playoff regardless of who the opponent would be. Beat CRC at home and steal a point in Mexico City (not easy) and we have chance to still win the group as long as we don't drop too many points to the others, namely Honduras and Panama.

Brooks and Cameron is our best pair at the moment. Gonzo lacks positional discipline. But form will matter a lot.

 

[UConnDan97]

The team quit on him. Yes, we're better than T&T and Honduras and Panama, and should still qualify, but when teams quit on coaches it stops mattering if you're better than your opponents. Just like our football team quit on HCBD.

It was not guarantied that we'd climb up to 3rd without a change

Exactly.

And if I'm right about the 2018 format, finishing 4th would mean that we would have to draw to see if we play against an Asian team, Oceanic team, or South American team. If the draw was held today, the South American team would be Argentina. Which would mean we would be staying home...

 

[UConnDan97]

The way to look at the rest of the hex is like this: you need about 15 points to finish in the top 3 based on historical finishes. With the 8 remaining games, we have to finish about 4 wins, 3 ties, 1 loss to get to 15 points. That's why it was so crucial to get the ship back on course. We certainly have the personnel to do it in this group, but there can't be any lapses going forward...

 

[ZooCougar]

Sporting KC has a MAJOR announcement tomorrow, some suspect that Peter Vermes is leaving to take a position on Arena's staff. He'd been mentioned as a candidate in the past. I think the only reason he would leave a head coach gig to take that job is if he was a "Head Coach in waiting". That would be utterly shambolic.