Is the SEC Overrated?

[oldude]

At the end of last season, with SC beating MS St for the National Championship, the SEC reigned supreme. This season, the pundits have repeatedly proclaimed the SEC as the toughest conference in WBB. With 7 teams from the SEC making the Big Dance, only the 14 school ACC had more teams in the tournament with 8.

But so far, with the exception of MS St, the overall performance of the SEC in the tournament has been mediocre at best. While A’ja Wilson has been terrific, SC has looked like anything but the defending National Champion. The Gamecocks at home have beaten 14th seed NC A&T by 11 and 10th seeded UVA by 10, scoring 63 and 66 pts respectively. Injuries have certainly had an impact on SC this season, but there is no reason why the Gamecocks shouldn’t have easily disposed of the two teams they played in Columbia.

Missouri got taken out in the 1st round by 12th seeded, mid-major Fl Gulf Coast, a team without a single player over 6’. LSU also went down in the 1st round, to an 11th seeded, mid-major, CMU. Georgia struggled in the 1st round with Mercer, a 13th seeded mid-major, before finally prevailing by 5 pts. In the following round the Bulldogs got blown out by Duke. TX A&M needed a furious comeback at home to advance to the Sweet 16 by a single pt over Doug Bruno’s Depaul team, yet another mid-major.

Then there is TN. While we’ve all grown accustomed to the Lady Vols imploding, and many of us felt that Scott Rueck’s OSU team would be a difficult matchup for TN, the Lady Vols achieved an entirely new level of futility by losing their 1st NCAA tournament game ever at home. If you have not done so, I urge you to go to VolNation and read some of the angry posts by TN fans. HW, for her part, is vehemently defending her players from unfair criticism by fans and media alike, which is really an interesting way of shifting the spotlight from herself. The truth is that most Lady Vol fans, as well as the media, have a great deal of sympathy for the TN players. Their ire is largely directed at HW.

What exactly is the problem with the SEC? Here’s my theory. SEC WBB frequently looks like a game being played in a phone booth. The SEC is rightly credited with being a conference known for physical play and tough defense. SEC games often degenerate into ugly contests characterized by bad shooting, turnovers and a parade to the foul line. At the same time, the rest of WBB is embracing a more wide-open style of play, characterized by spreading the floor, motion offense and 3-pt shooting; a game patterned after a certain team in Storrs, CT.

The SEC is “offensively challenged” as a conference, which sets their teams up to be knocked off by well-coached mid-majors who spread the floor and shoot the ball effectively. To Vic Schaefer’s credit, after getting blown out by UConn in 2016, he reached out to Geno to discuss how to improve his offense. It is no accident that MS St leads the SEC in offense this season.

While I hate to acknowledge it, there are other teams that could win the national championship this year besides UConn: MS St, Baylor, Louisville, ND & OR. What they all have in common is the ability to score a lot of points. As for last year’s defending National Champion, they should get by Buffalo in the Sweet 16, but assuming they face UConn in the Elite 8, SC will struggle to score 60 pts, and that likely won’t be enough to advance to the FF against a team that leads the NCAA in scoring at over 90 ppg.

 

[Jim R]

At the end of last season, with SC beating MS St for the National Championship, the SEC reigned supreme. This season, the pundits have repeatedly proclaimed the SEC as the toughest conference in WBB. With 7 teams from the SEC making the Big Dance, only the 14 school ACC had more teams in the tournament with 8.

But so far, with the exception of MS St, the overall performance of the SEC in the tournament has been mediocre at best. While A’ja Wilson has been terrific, SC has looked like anything but the defending National Champion. The Gamecocks at home have beaten 14th seed NC A&T by 11 and 10th seeded UVA by 10, scoring 63 and 66 pts respectively. Injuries have certainly had an impact on SC this season, but there is no reason why the Gamecocks shouldn’t have easily disposed of the two teams they played in Columbia.

Missouri got taken out in the 1st round by 12th seeded, mid-major Fl Gulf Coast, a team without a single player over 6’. LSU also went down in the 1st round, to an 11th seeded, mid-major, CMU. Georgia struggled in the 1st round with 13th Mercer, a 13th seeded mid-major, before finally prevailing by 5 pts. In the following round the Bulldogs got blown out by Duke. TX A&M needed a furious comeback at home to advance to the Sweet 16 by a single pt over Doug Bruno’s Depaul team, yet another mid-major.

Then there is TN. While we’ve all grown accustomed to the Lady Vols imploding, and many of us felt that Scott Rueck’s OSU team would be a difficult matchup for TN, the Lady Vols achieved an entirely new level of futility by losing their 1st NCAA tournament game ever at home. If you have not done so, I urge you to go to VolNation and read some of the angry posts by TN fans. HW, for her part, is vehemently defending her players from unfair criticism by fans and media alike, which is really an interesting way of shifting the spotlight from herself. The truth is that most Lady Vol fans, as well as the media, have a great deal of sympathy for the TN players. Their ire is largely directed at HW.

What exactly is the problem with the SEC? Here’s my theory. SEC WBB frequently looks like a game being played in a phone booth. The SEC is rightly credited with being a conference known for physical play and tough defense. SEC games often degenerate into ugly contests characterized by bad shooting, turnovers and a parade to the foul line. At the same time, the rest of WBB is embracing a more wide-open style of play, characterized by spreading the floor, motion offense and 3-pt shooting; a game patterned after a certain team in Storrs, CT.

The SEC is “offensively challenged” as a conference, which sets their teams up to be knocked off by well-coached mid-majors who spread the floor and shoot the ball effectively. To Vic Schaefer’s credit, after getting blown out by UConn in 2016, he reached out to Geno to discuss how to improve his offense. It is no accident that MS St leads the SEC in offense this season.

While I hate to acknowledge it, there are other teams that could win the national championship this year besides UConn: MS St, Baylor, Louisville, ND & OR. What they all have in common is the ability to score a lot of points. As for last year’s defending National Champion, they should get by Buffalo in the Sweet 16, but assuming they face UConn in the Elite 8, SC will struggle to score 60 pts, and that likely won’t be enough to advance to the FF against a team that leads the NCAA in scoring at over 90 ppg.

Oldude - as always, appreciate the support materil! OVERRATED? Of course it is....the SEC being the toughest conference is a myth, continuing to be perpetuated by many of the their coaches, and to some extent, WCBB broadcasters - especially, the olders ones. Like any "Legacy system", unfortunately, its usually a slow death, with lots of denial!

 

[HuskylnSC]

Well said friend and you didn't even need to touch upon their defensive inadequacies.

 

[Adesmar123]

At the end of last season, with SC beating MS St for the National Championship, the SEC reigned supreme. This season, the pundits have repeatedly proclaimed the SEC as the toughest conference in WBB. With 7 teams from the SEC making the Big Dance, only the 14 school ACC had more teams in the tournament with 8.

But so far, with the exception of MS St, the overall performance of the SEC in the tournament has been mediocre at best. While A’ja Wilson has been terrific, SC has looked like anything but the defending National Champion. The Gamecocks at home have beaten 14th seed NC A&T by 11 and 10th seeded UVA by 10, scoring 63 and 66 pts respectively. Injuries have certainly had an impact on SC this season, but there is no reason why the Gamecocks shouldn’t have easily disposed of the two teams they played in Columbia.

Missouri got taken out in the 1st round by 12th seeded, mid-major Fl Gulf Coast, a team without a single player over 6’. LSU also went down in the 1st round, to an 11th seeded, mid-major, CMU. Georgia struggled in the 1st round with Mercer, a 13th seeded mid-major, before finally prevailing by 5 pts. In the following round the Bulldogs got blown out by Duke. TX A&M needed a furious comeback at home to advance to the Sweet 16 by a single pt over Doug Bruno’s Depaul team, yet another mid-major.

Then there is TN. While we’ve all grown accustomed to the Lady Vols imploding, and many of us felt that Scott Rueck’s OSU team would be a difficult matchup for TN, the Lady Vols achieved an entirely new level of futility by losing their 1st NCAA tournament game ever at home. If you have not done so, I urge you to go to VolNation and read some of the angry posts by TN fans. HW, for her part, is vehemently defending her players from unfair criticism by fans and media alike, which is really an interesting way of shifting the spotlight from herself. The truth is that most Lady Vol fans, as well as the media, have a great deal of sympathy for the TN players. Their ire is largely directed at HW.

What exactly is the problem with the SEC? Here’s my theory. SEC WBB frequently looks like a game being played in a phone booth. The SEC is rightly credited with being a conference known for physical play and tough defense. SEC games often degenerate into ugly contests characterized by bad shooting, turnovers and a parade to the foul line. At the same time, the rest of WBB is embracing a more wide-open style of play, characterized by spreading the floor, motion offense and 3-pt shooting; a game patterned after a certain team in Storrs, CT.

The SEC is “offensively challenged” as a conference, which sets their teams up to be knocked off by well-coached mid-majors who spread the floor and shoot the ball effectively. To Vic Schaefer’s credit, after getting blown out by UConn in 2016, he reached out to Geno to discuss how to improve his offense. It is no accident that MS St leads the SEC in offense this season.

While I hate to acknowledge it, there are other teams that could win the national championship this year besides UConn: MS St, Baylor, Louisville, ND & OR. What they all have in common is the ability to score a lot of points. As for last year’s defending National Champion, they should get by Buffalo in the Sweet 16, but assuming they face UConn in the Elite 8, SC will struggle to score 60 pts, and that likely won’t be enough to advance to the FF against a team that leads the NCAA in scoring at over 90 ppg.

Yes

 

[oldude]

Oldude - as always, appreciate the support materil! OVERRATED? Of course it is....the SEC being the toughest conference is a myth, continuing to be perpetuated by many of the their coaches, and to some extent, WCBB broadcasters - especially, the olders ones. Like any "Legacy system", unfortunately, its usually a slow death, with lots of denial!

Well, at least the SEC can take solace from knowing that they're better than the BIG, which placed '0" teams in the Sweet 16.

 

[Jim R]

Well, at least the SEC can take solace from knowing that they're better than the BIG, which placed '0" teams in the Sweet 16.

There's that

 

[HoopsFan21]

Shhhh let the $EC continue down its path. The fans of those schools are happy enough to be able to chant esssssss eeeeee seeeee as their teams get their brains beat in.

 

[HoopsFan21]

Well, at least the SEC can take solace from knowing that they're better than the BIG, which placed '0" teams in the Sweet 16.

If the B1G's looking for a WCBB team to represent, I know a school that'll get the job done and would happily join their conference.

 

[Frodo]

In a word...YES. And it's been overrated for a long time. Having two SEC teams in the championship game last year only fed the myth. The NCAA supposedly wanted to improve the women's game by opening it up a bit, e.g., a point of emphasis was not allowing teams to bump cutters in the lane. At the final 4 last year the officials apparently decided that wasn't such a good idea with the predictable result that the 2 two teams than emphasized movement and fluid offense lost to two teams that played the game like a rugby scrum, but in the long run the days of SEC teams competing with that style of play are pretty much over. Fans want to see scoring and terrific athletes making great plays and the game will continue to evolve toward more flowing offense, but most SEC coaches are still stuck in the physical defense/rebounding style that Summitt was successful with 20 years ago. I think most of them thought that emulating Summitt's successful formula was the road to winning, but the game is leaving them behind.

 

[RockyMTblue2]

Stop with the rhetorical questions already!

 

[sharris952]

In a word...YES. And it's been overrated for a long time. Having two SEC teams in the championship game last year only fed the myth. The NCAA supposedly wanted to improve the women's game by opening it up a bit, e.g., a point of emphasis was not allowing teams to bump cutters in the lane. At the final 4 last year the officials apparently decided that wasn't such a good idea with the predictable result that the 2 two teams than emphasized movement and fluid offense lost to two teams that played the game like a rugby scrum, but in the long run the days of SEC teams competing with that style of play are pretty much over. Fans want to see scoring and terrific athletes making great plays and the game will continue to evolve toward more flowing offense, but most SEC coaches are still stuck in the physical defense/rebounding style that Summitt was successful with 20 years ago. I think most of them thought that emulating Summitt's successful formula was the road to winning, but the game is leaving them behind.

All of these opinions seemed slighted to a feeling that there is only one way to skin a cat. Though UConn is the gold standard, everyone playing their way does not guarantee championships by any strectch of the imagination. All of these offensively explosive teams seemed to not be able to handle the other side of the floor as well and thus they do not win anymore than the SEC teams. Top tier teams like Miss. St., SC, Texas A&M, have been competitive with or beaten other top tier teams other than UConn which is had their way with most teams. It is not a reflection on the SEC. SC played a ND team that was one of the highest scoring teams in the country in the final four by one point that year, and some pretty miraculous things had to happen in the last minute for that to occur. Even this year, they led ND by double digits and eventually lost by 5 or 7 pts after one guard was hurt during the game, and the point guard had fouled out. As for the other conferences and teams, if the SEC is overrated, then then everyone is overrated. I think people prefer different styles, but looking at the SEC against other conferences during the year, they more than earn their keep. This is a down year for top flight teams, but them being overrated is an opinion more than a fact based argument.

 

[Frodo]

Quick follow-up to my previous comment. It's interesting to look at Massey's ratings following the first weekend of the tournament. Miss St, S. Carolina held their positions from the previous week, ATM moved up 3 spots, but Tennessee was -6, Georgia -8, Missouri-16, and LSU -8. Given that all of these teams had very favorable seedings does seem to suggest what many suspected, i.e., that the SEC teams were overrated by the selection committee.

 

[sharris952]

In a word...YES. And it's been overrated for a long time. Having two SEC teams in the championship game last year only fed the myth. The NCAA supposedly wanted to improve the women's game by opening it up a bit, e.g., a point of emphasis was not allowing teams to bump cutters in the lane. At the final 4 last year the officials apparently decided that wasn't such a good idea with the predictable result that the 2 two teams than emphasized movement and fluid offense lost to two teams that played the game like a rugby scrum, but in the long run the days of SEC teams competing with that style of play are pretty much over. Fans want to see scoring and terrific athletes making great plays and the game will continue to evolve toward more flowing offense, but most SEC coaches are still stuck in the physical defense/rebounding style that Summitt was successful with 20 years ago. I think most of them thought that emulating Summitt's successful formula was the road to winning, but the game is leaving them behind.

These same arguments come up with SEC football, because games are more defensive struggles than offensive masterpieces but in the end all of the Big 12 super offenses seemed to fail in the big games. Often times though UConn is poetry in motion on offense, it is their excellent defense that helps them win their championships in my opinion. But you cannot argue that their teams are more competitive then some of these conferences where on or two teams have great players and every other team has no one of any mention playing. The ACC is the same way. with competitive teams. As for SC, UConn handled them pretty well earlier and may beat them again, but it is important to note that they had just lost their top 3pt shooter before that game, and Aja was just returning from an Ankle injury, so we had a lot of freshman having to play in that game who never should have been on the floor at that time. I think they are in a better place now as roles and abilities have been established. I do, however love the collective hate for the SEC because it is sort of a compliment. The SEC has a different style and it is not for everyone, but their teams are successful by and large and I don't see another conference that is as "DEEP" in good teams as them.

 

[DefenseBB]

I appreciate Oldude's post but it is a bit excessive in exaggeration. I used this line yesterday but it fits here also-"Never let the truth get in the way of a good story". Let's go over some of the facts to assess whether we "perceive" the SEC to be really strong by what we "think" we hear from "pundits". I have quoted words specifically as stats do not bear out that the world thinks the SEC is almighty. The talking heads on TV talk generalities about all the conferences that they are announcing so I don't read too much into "public speak". I listed the conference, the MasseyRating (Mas), Sagarin Rating (Sag), and RPI for each conference.
Conf Mas Sag RPI
ACC 3 3 2 had 7 teams; went 10-3; 4 teams in the S16. By seeds, 2 teams overachieved-Duke/Va, 1 team underachieved-FSU (I don't view 8/9 matchups as under/over)
SEC 4 5 1 had 7 teams; went 8-4; 3 teams in the S16. By seeds, 4 teams underachieved-LSU lost to an underseeded CMU, Mizzou lost to FGCU, Georgia as a 4 lost to a 5 and then Tenn to OreSt which also was underseeded.
PAC 4 1 5 had 6 teams; went 9-2; 4 teams in S16. By seeds, 1 team overachieved-OreSt, 1 team underachieved-Cal and the rest did what they should have.
Big12 1 2 4 had 4 teams; went 5-2; 2 teams in S16. By seeds, did what they should have
Big10 5 4 6 had 6 teams; went 4-6; 0 teams in S16. By seeds, 2 teams underachieved-tOSU, Iowa (lost to Creighton), 1 team overachieved-Minn beat Green Bay.
MAC 8 8 10 had 2 teams; went 4-0; 2 teams S16. Both teams overachieved by seed.

So, with these numbers in hand. Did the SEC underachieve? Yes, as 5 teams were seeded in top 16 and only 3 made it. However, to dismiss victories of double digits as underachieving as Oldude did against SC is not logical. This team has flaws, yes it does but it also has major injuries at guard so they are understaffed. I would not be surprised if they lost to a gritty Buffalo team but they did play a very good schedule. I think our bias against A'ja Wilson comes into play here more than logic. She is absolutely a stud player. We think KLS is better and we feel the ESPN announcers are too effusive in Wilson praise, but to deny that A'ja is not really, really good is just myopic.

Tennessee was ripe for this when the brackets were announced. Holly has continued to lower the bar each year. Now it's two years in a row this team failed to get to the sweet 16. Make no mistake, they did earn the #3 seed and the right to host by their strong OOC and their wins, however bad the coaching is.

LSU, Georgia and Mizzou were all flawed teams as well which, as Olddude did correctly assert, and fit the style of the SEC where they achieved some good wins. LSU was without it's center AND CMU was probably underseeded so we can't be to negative on that one loss. Mizzou was a very bad loss. Georgia losing at home to #5 Duke isn't an upset but getting blown out by how they did is surprising. Heck, even Texas A&M needed a miracle to beat DePaul.

Conference strength ebbs and flows over time and as you can see, even the rating entities can't gain a consensus-one has the Big12, one has the PAC12 and one has the SEC.
To me, the eye test and court play say it's the ACC followed by the PAC12 with the SEC 3rd. The SEC has 1 really good team and 1 pretty good team. The ACC has 2 really good teams, The PAC12 has 1 really good team and 3 pretty good teams.

Again, I appreciate Oldude's well thought out premise, it was just a wee bit over the top and feeding to a frenzied mob of SEC haters, of which I am one.

 

[Bronx23]

At the end of last season, with SC beating MS St for the National Championship, the SEC reigned supreme. This season, the pundits have repeatedly proclaimed the SEC as the toughest conference in WBB. With 7 teams from the SEC making the Big Dance, only the 14 school ACC had more teams in the tournament with 8.

But so far, with the exception of MS St, the overall performance of the SEC in the tournament has been mediocre at best. While A’ja Wilson has been terrific, SC has looked like anything but the defending National Champion. The Gamecocks at home have beaten 14th seed NC A&T by 11 and 10th seeded UVA by 10, scoring 63 and 66 pts respectively. Injuries have certainly had an impact on SC this season, but there is no reason why the Gamecocks shouldn’t have easily disposed of the two teams they played in Columbia.

Missouri got taken out in the 1st round by 12th seeded, mid-major Fl Gulf Coast, a team without a single player over 6’. LSU also went down in the 1st round, to an 11th seeded, mid-major, CMU. Georgia struggled in the 1st round with Mercer, a 13th seeded mid-major, before finally prevailing by 5 pts. In the following round the Bulldogs got blown out by Duke. TX A&M needed a furious comeback at home to advance to the Sweet 16 by a single pt over Doug Bruno’s Depaul team, yet another mid-major.

Then there is TN. While we’ve all grown accustomed to the Lady Vols imploding, and many of us felt that Scott Rueck’s OSU team would be a difficult matchup for TN, the Lady Vols achieved an entirely new level of futility by losing their 1st NCAA tournament game ever at home. If you have not done so, I urge you to go to VolNation and read some of the angry posts by TN fans. HW, for her part, is vehemently defending her players from unfair criticism by fans and media alike, which is really an interesting way of shifting the spotlight from herself. The truth is that most Lady Vol fans, as well as the media, have a great deal of sympathy for the TN players. Their ire is largely directed at HW.

What exactly is the problem with the SEC? Here’s my theory. SEC WBB frequently looks like a game being played in a phone booth. The SEC is rightly credited with being a conference known for physical play and tough defense. SEC games often degenerate into ugly contests characterized by bad shooting, turnovers and a parade to the foul line. At the same time, the rest of WBB is embracing a more wide-open style of play, characterized by spreading the floor, motion offense and 3-pt shooting; a game patterned after a certain team in Storrs, CT.

The SEC is “offensively challenged” as a conference, which sets their teams up to be knocked off by well-coached mid-majors who spread the floor and shoot the ball effectively. To Vic Schaefer’s credit, after getting blown out by UConn in 2016, he reached out to Geno to discuss how to improve his offense. It is no accident that MS St leads the SEC in offense this season.

While I hate to acknowledge it, there are other teams that could win the national championship this year besides UConn: MS St, Baylor, Louisville, ND & OR. What they all have in common is the ability to score a lot of points. As for last year’s defending National Champion, they should get by Buffalo in the Sweet 16, but assuming they face UConn in the Elite 8, SC will struggle to score 60 pts, and that likely won’t be enough to advance to the FF against a team that leads the NCAA in scoring at over 90 ppg.

Excellent, detailed analysis!
I have nothing to add, which is quite rare!
Bronx23

 

[oldude]

Stop with the rhetorical questions already!

Rocky, you got me. When I created this thread, I had considered a declarative title, "The SEC is Overrated!." But I decided to go with a question instead as I felt it would stimulate more discussion.

 

[HoopsFan21]

The $EC is so desperate to knock UConn from its perch and threatened by this little mid-major school in Storrs that they accused UConn of cheating to recruit Maya Moore. And they still believe it to this day simply because Pat Summitt said "Geno knows what he did." As if the NCAA would pass up a chance to go after UConn for such an egregious violation. Actually the NCAA would sanction our WCBB program for something dumb like Geno telling a 7th grade little leaguer that will never be recruited by or play for Geno good luck in her next baseball game. Again precipitated by the $EC's pathetic jealousy. So, who has more NCAA violations in their history? Pat or Geno? Some folks may not like the answer to that. I dislike the $EC for all the crap they've tried to pull on us over the years.

 

[oldude]

The $EC is so desperate to knock UConn from its perch and threatened by this little mid-major school in Storrs that they accused UConn of cheating to recruit Maya Moore. And they still believe it to this day simply because Pat Summitt said "Geno knows what he did." As if the NCAA would pass up a chance to go after UConn for such an egregious violation. Actually the NCAA would sanction our WCBB program for something dumb like Geno telling a 7th grade little leaguer that will never be recruited by or play for Geno good luck in her next baseball game. Again precipitated by the $EC's pathetic jealousy. So, who has more NCAA violations in their history? Pat or Geno? Some folks may not like the answer to that. I dislike the $EC for all the crap they've tried to pull on us over the years.

I think it's time that the BY move on from criticizing Pat Summitt, who did more to elevate WBB than anyone who came before her.

I'm willing to give Summitt a pass on her 40 page indictment of UConn WBB which in fact was determined to have one minor violation, that UConn set up what was determined to be an impermissible meeting at ESPN's studios in Bristol for Maya during her recruiting visit. The reason Pat gets a pass from me, is because of what I've learned about Alzheimer's. Specifically that this terrible disease can affect an individual's personality many years before it is actually diagnosed. The earliest signs can be a slow and steady loss of mental sharpness, irritability and memory loss.

 

[HoopsFan21]

I think it's time that the BY move on from criticizing Pat Summitt, who did more to elevate WBB than anyone who came before her.

I'm willing to give Summitt a pass on her 40 page indictment of UConn WBB which in fact was determined to have one minor violation, that UConn set up what was determined to be an impermissible meeting at ESPN's studios in Bristol for Maya during her recruiting visit. The reason Pat gets a pass from me, is because of what I've learned about Alzheimer's. Specifically that this terrible disease can affect an individual's personality many years before it is actually diagnosed. The earliest signs can be a slow and steady loss of mental sharpness, irritability and memory loss.

Pat made damn sure she poisoned the well. Pat went above and beyond in an attempt to destroy UConn WCBB and Geno because she saw her monopoly on the sport slipping away for good. No pass from me ever.

 

[oldude]

Pat made damn sure she poisoned the well. Pat went above and beyond in an attempt to destroy UConn WCBB and Geno because she saw her monopoly on the sport slipping away for good. No pass from me ever.

I’m sorry you feel the way you do. As for me, if Geno can find it in his heart to forgive Pat, I know I can.

I would point out that the first time Geno saw Pat after her diagnosis, he broke down in tears. When Pat set up her foundation to combat Alzheimer’s, Geno was one of the 1st to step up making a 6 figure donation.

One last point, back in 1995, during MLK day, when nobody wanted to play upstart UConn in Storrs, before a national TV audience on ESPN, Pat Summitt agreed, and as she commented at the time, “We’ll play anyone, anytime, anywhere.” Arguably, that game did more for WBB in general and UConn in particular than any single event before or since.

 

[HoopsFan21]

I’m sorry you feel the way you do. As for me, if Geno can find it in his heart to forgive Pat, I know I can.

I would point out that the first time Geno saw Pat after her diagnosis, he broke down in tears. When Pat set up her foundation to combat Alzheimer’s, Geno was one of the 1st to step up making a 6 figure donation.

One last point, back in 1995, during MLK day, when nobody wanted to play upstart UConn in Storrs, before a national TV audience on ESPN, Pat Summitt agreed, and as she commented at the time, “We’ll play anyone, anytime, anywhere.” Arguably, that game did more for WBB in general and UConn in particular than any single event before or since.

Well I guess that's because Geno is a good Catholic whose religion places an importance upon recognizing and forgiving sins. I'm an atheist and as such there are no such tenets in my world. As to the last paragraph, UConn WCBB doesn't exist because of that one game. Just like Geno doesn't exist because of Pat. Geno would still have been a great coach and UConn would have still won the 1995 title with or without Pat and the Vols. It's not cause and effect anymore than purple unicorns were responsible for you having a successful career. It's like watching Raiders of the Lost Ark: with or without Indiana Jones the movie turns out the same.

 

[UcMiami]

I think for a long time the SEC relied on recruiting and everyone tried to emulate Pat in toughness and it has taken quite a while for the SEC teams to upgrade their coaching. It isn't going to happen overnight but I believe their is a definite shift occurring. Holly is still trying to make herself over as Pat part two, but she is becoming more of an outlier.

Leagues in general that get lots of teams into the dance, have a hard time getting a lot of teams beyond the first weekend - used to happen with the BE, and has happened with most of the other leagues that get into that 6-8 teams in the NCAAs as well. Did the SEC get better seeding than they should have ... meh. That range of teams from around 11-30 is really hard to seed because they almost all have obvious flaws in their resumes and you never know which flaws are going to show up in any given game. And the NCAAs for most of the past 5 years have had a mixed bag of upsets going into the S16 and E8. I didn't think any of the SEC teams that got in were anywhere near the 'bubble', and especially not compared to say Oklahoma.

So yes, maybe, but I don't think the NCAA seeding or selection is any more egregious toward the SEC than toward any of the other P5. And this year, they seemed to respect some non-P5 conferences more than maybe in the past as far as selection at least.

 

[hoopingcrane]

I think it's time that the BY move on from criticizing Pat Summitt, who did more to elevate WBB than anyone who came before her.

I'm willing to give Summitt a pass on her 40 page indictment of UConn WBB which in fact was determined to have one minor violation, that UConn set up what was determined to be an impermissible meeting at ESPN's studios in Bristol for Maya during her recruiting visit. The reason Pat gets a pass from me, is because of what I've learned about Alzheimer's. Specifically that this terrible disease can affect an individual's personality many years before it is actually diagnosed. The earliest signs can be a slow and steady loss of mental sharpness, irritability and memory loss.

Let's keep in mind that the "violation" was a tour of ESPN, which at the time was available to anyone; the "violation" was not an "impermissible meeting" but that someone from UConn called to schedule the tour.

 

[oldude]

Let's keep in mind that the "violation" was a tour of ESPN, which at the time was available to anyone; the "violation" was not an "impermissible meeting" but that someone from UConn called to schedule the tour.

That’s a fair point. My point was that it’s time for UConn fans to get over any animosity they may hold for Pat Summitt, as Geno has done.

 

[oldude]

Well I guess that's because Geno is a good Catholic whose religion places an importance upon recognizing and forgiving sins. I'm an atheist and as such there are no such tenets in my world. As to the last paragraph, UConn WCBB doesn't exist because of that one game. Just like Geno doesn't exist because of Pat. Geno would still have been a great coach and UConn would have still won the 1995 title with or without Pat and the Vols. It's not cause and effect anymore than purple unicorns were responsible for you having a successful career. It's like watching Raiders of the Lost Ark: with or without Indiana Jones the movie turns out the same.

HF21, with all do respect, you have no idea if Geno is a practicing Catholic, or more likely to spend Sunday mornings playing golf than attending mass.

In addition, I never suggested that UConn WBB exists because of one game. What I allude to is the significance of that game to WBB in general and UConn specifically, an event that is well documented in “Birth of a Dynasty.”

As to your last points about purple unicorns and Raiders of the Lost Ark, I have no damned clue what in hell you’re talking about.