Irish fan on why UConn belongs in the ACC

[SouthronCross]

I don't know, of course, whether Swofford's intent in '03 was a conference the extended the length of the Atlantic seaboard or not, but if it wasn't, it should have been. And if that was his intent, why didn't he simply say so? If that is his intent, why doesn't he say so now? Is his shyness a result of not wanting to piss off the B1G who seems to have designs on the North Atlantic themselves? I would have preferred an even bolder position than merely a conference that does business along the entire length of the Atlantic, such as "The ACC intends to be the preeminent college athletic conference along the eastern seaboard." That would have been a statement with some meat on it, something members could rally behind, something they would be willing to work toward.

The trouble with stating a goal is that it opens up the floodgates of second guessing. What, for example, did the additions of Pitt and Louisville have to do with the eastern seaboard objective? Why have an objective if you're just going to ignore it?

If Swofford's goal was a length-of-the-coast conference with oodles of quality network content, then it was his strategy that was flawed. Where was his vision most at risk? Why the North Atlantic, that's where. So, what's he do? Adds BC. Boston's on the North Atlantic, solid move. But he adds Miami. Huh? He's already got a solid Florida member. Marginal move at best but made worse because Miami wasn't going anywhere. The SEC wasn't going to add them.

Miami was always in play because, at the time of the original expansion, they were an annual Top 5 program nationally. For a conference looking to improve football, that add was a no-brainer. They crashed at the same time FSU struggled. Had they both been able to maintain what they were, Swofford would've been called a genius.

Their baseball program is also first-rate, and, that is a sport the ACC cares a lot about, too. Plus, they are a good fit academically.

So is BC. At the time they joined, they had a solid program. I know they catch a lot of hell over here...rightfully so... but, they did perform well here initially. They went to the ACCCG in both 2007 and 2008. The Spaziani years ended badly, but, otherwise, they've held their own.

Outside of Miami winning the ACC in 2013, neither have been all that great in hoops.

His real problem was in not adding Rutgers and UConn. I realize neither school was ready for prime time then, but strategies aren't necessarily meant to yield immediate payback. His biggest mistake was leaving that gaping freeway right through the heart of his conference ambitions, a freeway the B1G has now taken a leisurely Sunday drive down.

We all know of the ACC's interest in UConn. I do not think I've ever heard Swofford ever mention Rutgers, even in passing. Maybe they were in his plans at some point. I do not know that for certain. For some reason, RU was never viewed as a viable option.

I'm not sure that Syracuse and UConn would have locked up the northeast in 2011 because it left a big, important piece (Rutgers) unaccounted for. Like I said, the play was Rutgers, UConn and BC. That not only would have locked up the northeast but also have blocked the B1G moving east. Where would they have gone? Temple? Not bloody likely.

UConn and Syracuse would've made the ACC unquestionably the best basketball conference in 2011, and, that was for sure one of Swofford's goals. Albeit unstated. I believe both would thrive in football here. But, thats just my view.

Truthfully, had it not been at Miami's insistence, BC would've never gotten even a passing glance, IMHO. UConn was in long-range plans, but, I cannot speak on Rutgers. Maybe they were, and, I just never heard it.

As far a Louisville is concerned, so they would have gone to the B12, so what. Ditto Pitt. Neither fit the vision you articulated anyway. Let them go. Miami? They'd still be waiting patiently today should you want to invite them. Ditto Cuse.

Thanks for the reply. Good discussion.

 

[SouthronCross]

Swoffy over Delany....puleeze SC don't make yourself look like "that guy"?? And of all the ACC types u were garnering a shred of respect!! btw whatever happened to billybud? Get lost on his NYC trip?lol

Nicky, how did you pull THAT out of my post? I never said that Swofford was a better commissioner than Delany.

I just said that he is not the total incompetent that some here seem to believe he is.

billybud is probably paying more attention to FSU spring practice than to our discussion. Huge expectations for his Noles in 2014.

 

[NickyNewark]

Nicky, how did you pull THAT out of my post? I never said that Swofford was a better commissioner than Delany.

I just said that he is not the total incompetent that some here seem to believe he is.

billybud is probably paying more attention to FSU spring practice than to our discussion. Huge expectations for his Noles in 2014.

HHmmmmm....I thought i gleaned that from your said post? Maybe I'll reread it but Im relieved to hear "Swofford considered/perceived by many the top commissioner in the P5 conferences" that u haven't lost your mind lol...I've come to enjoy and watch most everything u post because you seemed honest and sincere(unlike some)!! Just disregard this post as a misunderstanding SC. Maybe I took something out of context?

 

[NickyNewark]

Thanks for the reply. Good discussion.

From my limited understanding but knowing people involved in some of the inside going's on I believe that RU had longtime B1G ambitions and friends inside the B1G and Swoffy probably knew that if offered the PR disaster it would have brought on his head if they were quickly snapped up with an counteroffer from the B1G and accepting before the envelope hit the proverbial floor !?! Everyone interested knew of RU's unique relationship with a B1G school(PSU). Glen Mason,Gerry DiNardo and a few others I forget not to mention Jopa. Thats why I always say..its all about developing relationships in the CR wars.

 

[RegisteredUconn]

Swofford might be perceived to be the best coference commissioner in the land, but, he is not the incompetent boob many here believe him to be, either.

Swoffy over Delany....puleeze SC don't make yourself look like "that guy"?? And of all the ACC types u were garnering a shred of respect!! btw whatever happened to billybud? Get lost on his NYC trip?lol

Nicky, I think there may have been a typo in Southron's post. I think he meant to say that "Swofford might not be perceived to be the best coference commissioner in the land..." Otherwise, the part after the "but" doesn't make sense (to me anyway).

 

[upstater]

My thoughts on this thread after being away for a day and half:

- Holy crap!

- Louisville was the one of two possible replacements for Maryland and if the rumors (FSU and Clemson were leaving if football wasn't addressed) are true, it held The ACC together. IF that's the case, it was the only possible add. I have no clue if it's what went down, but completely understand The ACC's reasoning if it was.

We need to understand the context of the arguments here. I mentioned Louisville's market not to say Ville isn't deserving, but because we always heard that their TV market is what made them so desirable. At the same time, these people are dismissive of UConn's market.

- In my opinion, the real reason The ND administration doesn't want the Big10 is they need to be a presence where they want and get their students from: The NE/NYC metro areas. Sure there is animosity toward The Big10 on the ND fans and alumni part, but I highly doubt that if being in The Big10 was best for ND, those events would prevent The ND administration from doing what is best for the school. They already have a presence in the biggest city in The Midwest (Chicago), but playing games in NY state, Boston, Pennsylvania (Pitt games are broadcast in the Philly area, I presume) and playing against teams that have a large NE/NYC alumni presence (Miami, Duke) is huge getting their brand out to prospective students.

I made this point above when whaler and multiple others mentioned the students from New Jersey at Duke. There are a few hundred of them there. Not sure why this is so meaningful to ND. When comparing the 2 conferences, it's not the ACC that gives you that huge presence in ND's bread&butter region, but the B1G. PSU, Rutgers, Maryland are large state schools with huge footprints. UConn would add one more. These are the schools that are closer to NYC than Syracuse, BCU, Pitt and Louisville.

 

[upstater]

It's just par for the upstater course. Buffalo is thriving because it's 90 minutes from Toronto is a great example.

Louisville has a ridiculously good fanbase. I know you'll argue against that for eternity - but they do and it doesn't reflect poorly on UConn to just admit it.

The people saying the rust belt is dead have trouble with mathematics. What was your score on the SAT?

People like you tout Louisville's fantastic TV market, but hardly anyone lives there. More fans watched the UConn women in NYC with a 4.6 rating than watched the national championship in Louisville with a 45 rating. They may be rabid, but in terms of numbers, it's not that impressive. The ACC keeps grabbing teeny markets and patting themselves on the back. Meanwhile, the B1G drops bombs on New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Maryland/DC.

 

[dayooper]

I made this point above when whaler and multiple others mentioned the students from New Jersey at Duke. There are a few hundred of them there. Not sure why this is so meaningful to ND. When comparing the 2 conferences, it's not the ACC that gives you that huge presence in ND's bread&butter region, but the B1G. PSU, Rutgers, Maryland are large state schools with huge footprints. UConn would add one more. These are the schools that are closer to NYC than Syracuse, BCU, Pitt and Louisville.

Absolutely, but ND already agreed to The ACC pact before RU and UMD were announced (which took most by surprise). That's one of the reasons why they were non-football members of the Big East - It held the NYC metro better than anyone else. With Rutgers, UConn, and the like, it was great for ND. Throw in The Catholic 7 and it was almost the perfect scenario. They new it was crumbling, though, so they bolted.

 

[RegisteredUconn]

Thanks for the reply. Good discussion.

Miami was always in play because, at the time of the original expansion, they were an annual Top 5 program nationally. For a conference looking to improve football, that add was a no-brainer. They crashed at the same time FSU struggled. Had they both been able to maintain what they were, Swofford would've been called a genius.

Their baseball program is also first-rate, and, that is a sport the ACC cares a lot about, too. Plus, they are a good fit academically.

So is BC. At the time they joined, they had a solid program. I know they catch a lot of hell over here...rightfully so... but, they did perform well here initially. They went to the ACCCG in both 2007 and 2008. The Spaziani years ended badly, but, otherwise, they've held their own.

Outside of Miami winning the ACC in 2013, neither have been all that great in hoops.
Miami was the glitzy convertible of its day, that was for sure. The problems I have with what Swofford did were first, he wasn't in the convertible driving business at that time. He was in the conference building business. Heavy lifting would be involved. He needed a couple of serviceable Ford F150s even if they weren't showroom spiffy and one had a couple of dings and some rust (UConn) and the other had more dings and more rust (Rutgers). Second, Miami wasn't going anywhere. The southeast corner of the southeast state just wasn't in play. Better to lay the foundation for the master plan before looking around for shiny baubles.

Your point about baseball is well taken and fits with the objective you offered about content for the network. The academics aspect was good as well up to and including the rejection of WVU. I'm sure you can see where I would be going next so we'll just leave it at that.

We all know of the ACC's interest in UConn. I do not think I've ever heard Swofford ever mention Rutgers, even in passing. Maybe they were in his plans at some point. I do not know that for certain. For some reason, RU was never viewed as a viable option.
I, too, never heard any rumors of Rutty to the ACC. In fact, as long as I've been trolling...er, following the various versions of the UConn board, all I've ever heard was Rutgers to the Big Ten. I makes me wonder why such discussions never materialized. (You don't suppose the answer is kept in Area 51, do you?)

UConn and Syracuse would've made the ACC unquestionably the best basketball conference in 2011, and, that was for sure one of Swofford's goals. Albeit unstated. I believe both would thrive in football here. But, thats just my view.

Truthfully, had it not been at Miami's insistence, BC would've never gotten even a passing glance, IMHO. UConn was in long-range plans, but, I cannot speak on Rutgers. Maybe they were, and, I just never heard it.

As I've said (or implied at any rate) previously on this thread, Swofford is just too myopic for my tastes Too often, his moves seem unrelated to his presumed goals. Why, for example did he decide to monitor the laying of a foundation along the Atlantic seaboard from the shores of the Finger Lakes and the confluence of the Monongahela and the Allegheny? It's not the acquisition of Syracuse and Pitt that I fault. It was the timing. The foundation hadn't been completed. I get that there were member institutions with goals of their own. But it was his job to conceive, articulate, and sell a vision. Failing that meant failing, it was that simple.

Swofford's failure probably won't be immediately apparent. There's far too much current turmoil for that. But he has consigned you guys to the second tier of the P5 for as far as the eye can see. What happens if the SEC decides 16 teams make a better configuration than 14? What happens if they decide to finally fulfill their destiny as the "South East" conference by adding a North Carolina and a Virginia (no offense to Stimpy thinking of VA as a mid-Atlantic state) school. How much does NC State identify with Texas A&M's desire to climb out of Texas' shadow and want to climb out of yours? How fast would VaTech be dialing a good divorce lawyer in their haste to kick UVA to the curb? I don't know those answers but the questions sure would worry me.

Let me conclude by again stating my admiration for the University of North Carolina and that a conference affiliation with them would not merely be a "well, it's better than the American" but a truly desirable destination, one that I would quickly warm to. UNC, Virginia, Georgia Tech, Clemson, Florida State, and the others...very desirable indeed.

 

[whaler11]

The people saying the rust belt is dead have trouble with mathematics. What was your score on the SAT?

People like you tout Louisville's fantastic TV market, but hardly anyone lives there. More fans watched the UConn women in NYC with a 4.6 rating than watched the national championship in Louisville with a 45 rating. They may be rabid, but in terms of numbers, it's not that impressive. The ACC keeps grabbing teeny markets and patting themselves on the back. Meanwhile, the B1G drops bombs on New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Maryland/DC.

Well claiming the Rust Belt isn't a mess because it's within driving to distance to Toronto doesn't make much sense now does it?

It's like claiming Willimantic isn't falling apart because it's not that bad of a drive to Boston.

I'm not really touting Louisville's market, I just like pointing the ridiculousness of your pretzel logic. The school has a really good fanbase why you just will continue to argue the contrary for eternity is puzzling.

Next up the 25k plus they had for their spring game and the huge basketball crowds they average are all really Kentucky fans who can't get tickets.

 

[upstater]

Well claiming the Rust Belt isn't a mess because it's within driving to distance to Toronto doesn't make much sense now does it?

It's like claiming Willimantic isn't falling apart because it's not that bad of a drive to Boston.

I'm not really touting Louisville's market, I just like pointing the ridiculousness of your pretzel logic. The school has a really good fanbase why you just will continue to argue the contrary for eternity is puzzling.

Next up the 25k plus they had for their spring game and the huge basketball crowds they average are all really Kentucky fans who can't get tickets.

The rust belt is a mess. And it's falling apart. No one said otherwise, but continue on with your strawmen. There are millions of people who live there, as opposed to podunk burgs like Louisville. Buffalo alone is 2x as big but the surrounding cities like Niagara Falls, So. Ontario (which is 10 minutes from me by foot), Rochester, etc. contain 4x as many as Ville. And this is Buffalo, I'm not even referring to Michigan which absolutely blows the southern burgs out of the water when it comes to population. The idea that moving to remote southern locales is somehow a coup for the ACC is preposterous.

 

[dayooper]

Well claiming the Rust Belt isn't a mess because it's within driving to distance to Toronto doesn't make much sense now does it?

It's like claiming Willimantic isn't falling apart because it's not that bad of a drive to Boston.

I'm not really touting Louisville's market, I just like pointing the ridiculousness of your pretzel logic. The school has a really good fanbase why you just will continue to argue the contrary for eternity is puzzling.

Next up the 25k plus they had for their spring game and the huge basketball crowds they average are all really Kentucky fans who can't get tickets.

Except for university exposure, Louisville's market presence means nothing for The ACC right until 2027, when their contract is up. There is no ACCN, and ESPN probably won't be giving The ACC more money. If the rumors are true and Louisville kept The ACC together, it was the right move.

 

[TerryD]

I made this point above when whaler and multiple others mentioned the students from New Jersey at Duke. There are a few hundred of them there. Not sure why this is so meaningful to ND. When comparing the 2 conferences, it's not the ACC that gives you that huge presence in ND's bread&butter region, but the B1G. PSU, Rutgers, Maryland are large state schools with huge footprints. UConn would add one more. These are the schools that are closer to NYC than Syracuse, BCU, Pitt and Louisville.

But the ACC puts ND in both the Northeast (as I define it, a Western Pa. guy) and the Southeast (where ND has emphasized it wants to be for exposure and recruiting purposes).

The Big Ten does not put ND in Boston, Atlanta or Miami. The ACC affiliation in football (and playing basketball, baseball and other sports there regularly) does.

Jack Swarbrick is on record as saying that ND wants exposure/games in a number of metro areas in the Northeast and Southeast.

ND can get into NYC and Washington by playing "neutral site" and Shamrock Series games in the former and Navy (and Shamrock Series' "home away from home" games)in the latter.

ND obviously covers the Midwest with six home games in South Bend per year.

Look at ND's future schedules I posted in this thread. ND wants to play in pro stadiums and/or big exposure venues in the Northeast.

BC and ND are going to play in Fenway Park. ND is going to play Army in Yankee Stadium and Syracuse at Met Life. ND will play Temple at Lincoln Field, etc...

ND will play Pitt at Heinz Field as an ACC opponent. ND will play Navy (and others) in Fed Ex Field in Washington, DC. I bet we see ND games at Gillette in the future.

ND's recruiting is being more concentrated in the Virginia Tidewater, the Carolinas, Georgia and Florida.

QB Everett Golson is from South Carolina. Possible first round picks Stephon Tuitt and Louis Nix are both from Georgia. Both stud running backs on the current roster (Greg Bryant and Tarean Folston) are from Florida. Look at the current roster and see the players from ACC territory. ND wants more recruits from the Southeast.

The Irish want the exposure of playing fairly regularly in the Southeast to counter the negative recruiting of "ND is so far away, your parents will never see you play in person" that ND gets from Georgia, Alabama, Florida, etc..

The Big Ten is of absolutely no help in this area. ND's leaders are concerned about being pigeon holed as a Midwest program in a mainly Midwest conference. That is one reason (of many) why the Big Ten holds absolutely no appeal to ND.

With the Northeast, Midwest and Southeast covered, ND then covers the Southwest with games against Texas, Oklahoma and Arizona State (as well as Shamrock Series "home" games at Jerry Jones' palace in Dallas and in the Alamodome in San Antonio) and the West with games against BYU, Southern Cal and Stanford.

ND wants to play football games in all areas of the country. The ACC helps with that where the Big Ten does not and cannot. ND has no interest in regular games against schools like Indiana, Iowa, Minnesota or Wisconsin (check the last time ND played any of them),

 

[dayooper]

The rust belt is a mess. And it's falling apart. No one said otherwise, but continue on with your strawmen. There are millions of people who live there, as opposed to podunk burgs like Louisville. Buffalo alone is 2x as big but the surrounding cities like Niagara Falls, So. Ontario (which is 10 minutes from me by foot), Rochester, etc. contain 4x as many as Ville. And this is Buffalo, I'm not even referring to Michigan which absolutely blows the southern burgs out of the water when it comes to population. The idea that moving to remote southern locales is somehow a coup for the ACC is preposterous.

Rustbelt states Illinois, Pennsylvania, Ohio, and Michigan are still in the top 10 most populous states and only Michigan lost residents, and that was minimal. In fact, most of the population loss came from Wayne County (Detroit) while suburban counties such as Oakland, Macomb, Livingston, and Washtenaw all saw gains in population, just not enough to counter effect the losses of Detroit.

 

[whaler11]

The rust belt is a mess. And it's falling apart. No one said otherwise, but continue on with your strawmen. There are millions of people who live there, as opposed to podunk burgs like Louisville. Buffalo alone is 2x as big but the surrounding cities like Niagara Falls, So. Ontario (which is 10 minutes from me by foot), Rochester, etc. contain 4x as many as Ville. And this is Buffalo, I'm not even referring to Michigan which absolutely blows the southern burgs out of the water when it comes to population. The idea that moving to remote southern locales is somehow a coup for the ACC is preposterous.

Except that Louisville specifically has a really good fanbase.

There is no argument against Louisville being in a conference from an athletics standpoint. Unless you are a dinosaur who wants to still pretend major college sports have any relationship with academics, arguing against Louisville is pointless.

 

[dayooper]

Except that Louisville specifically has a really good fanbase.

There is no argument against Louisville being in a conference from an athletics standpoint. Unless you are a dinosaur who wants to still pretend major college sports have any relationship with academics, arguing against Louisville is pointless.

They have everything to do with academics. As I questioned in another thread, why do schools participate in big time athletics? Most run off of a deficit and it's against most of the mission statements of these schools. If it was just about student life, why couldn't they just go to the D3 model and spend much less money in the process?
Why, then, do schools participate when most university presidents could care less what happens in sports? Advertising their schools to a broader range of Gen Ed students. Academics.

 

[upstater]

Except that Louisville specifically has a really good fanbase.

There is no argument against Louisville being in a conference from an athletics standpoint. Unless you are a dinosaur who wants to still pretend major college sports have any relationship with academics, arguing against Louisville is pointless.

Mr. Strawman. When I discuss media markets, I discuss media markets. No one is saying Louisville shouldn't have been the ACC's choice. In post after post, you deliver another strawman, which explains your popularity.

 

[whaler11]

Mr. Strawman. When I discuss media markets, I discuss media markets. No one is saying Louisville shouldn't have been the ACC's choice. In post after post, you deliver another strawman, which explains your popularity.

LOL. If you aren't arguing that the ACC shouldn't have wanted Louisville than your bizarre obsession with their media market makes even less sense.

 

[upstater]

LOL. If you aren't arguing that the ACC shouldn't have wanted Louisville than your bizarre obsession with their media market makes even less sense.

Most people have brains that can hold two different facts at once.

The argument against UConn is that our fans and our market are not that numerous or intense. The recent numbers prove the opposite. While the ACC continues to go after smaller outfits like Pitt, BC, Cuse and Louisville, the B1G is grabbing big markets like Maryland, Rutgers and PSU. This doesn't mean anything about results on the field. In that respect, Ville is like Nebraska. What it does show though is that UConn's market and the fans in that market are better than Louisville's. UConn isn't Rutgers.

 

[whaler11]

They have everything to do with academics. As I questioned in another thread, why do schools participate in big time athletics? Most run off of a deficit and it's against most of the mission statements of these schools. If it was just about student life, why couldn't they just go to the D3 model and spend much less money in the process?
Why, then, do schools participate when most university presidents could care less what happens in sports? Advertising their schools to a broader range of Gen Ed students. Academics.

Ok guy with a Michigan helmet. Half the schools we are talking about pretty much don't even enroll players in legitimate classes.

So North Carolina is going to attract lesser students because Louisville is in their league?

UConn's incoming student profile is going to be different because the football team plays Memphis and East Carolina?

Sure thing.

 

[whaler11]

Most people have brains that can hold two different facts at once.

The argument against UConn is that our fans and our market are not that numerous or intense. The recent numbers prove the opposite. While the ACC continues to go after smaller outfits like Pitt, BC, Cuse and Louisville, the B1G is grabbing big markets like Maryland, Rutgers and PSU. This doesn't mean anything about results on the field. In that respect, Ville is like Nebraska. What it does show though is that UConn's market and the fans in that market are better than Louisville's. UConn isn't Rutgers.

How do you arrive at the conclusion that UConn's fans are better than Lousiville's. Based on a rating in NYC? So a game without UConn would have had no viewers? There is no way to make the conclusions you are jumping to based on the data.

 

[Yawkey Way]

[quote="NotreDameJoe, post: 934125, member: 4632".





And I couldn't stand forking over $800 a month for a run down one bedroom when half that much in the Midwest will get you covered parking and a complex swimming pool. And people care about college football.[/quote]

" $ 800 a month " ? There are no 1 bedroom Apt's in Boston... " rundown " or otherwise at that rate. You'd get the ability to rent a cardbox box to sleep in under a Storrow Drive overpass at this rental rate ( ..haha).That said, everybody chooses for themselves where to live, and what they want to charge others to live there, and others to pay to live there. Personally, given a choice, I'd much prefer to live in a small Apt in Boston than a mammoth Apt out in South Bend, Indiana,... like I said, I've been to South Bend twice too. But to each his own, of course.

 

[upstater]

How do you arrive at the conclusion that UConn's fans are better than Lousiville's. Based on a rating in NYC? So a game without UConn would have had no viewers? There is no way to make the conclusions you are jumping to based on the data.

UConn # of Fans x Intensity > Louisville # of Fans x Intensity

Louisville's fans are more intense, but they are very Creighton-like in that regard.

 

[Yawkey Way]

My thoughts on this thread after being away for a day and half:

- Holy crap!

- No matter the reason, the Louisville add was a black eye for The ACC reputation.
.

This talk of a "black eye for the ACC" by a Michigan football fan is of course viewed in the context of the Penn State gigantic national scandal that blew up there, re. the Big's " reputation " as a league.

 

[dayooper]

Ok guy with a Michigan helmet. Half the schools we are talking about pretty much don't even enroll players in legitimate classes.

So North Carolina is going to attract lesser students because Louisville is in their league?

UConn's incoming student profile is going to be different because the football team plays Memphis and East Carolina?

Sure thing.

When Alabama won their national championships in 2009 and again in 2011, they reported an increase in their national applications. They were able to more picky in who they admitted. When a school like Michigan, UConn, North Carolina, Texas, UCLA, ext play or are shown in a area consistently, their brand is advertised in that area. They can be more picky in who they choose. Universities love getting better qualified students in their incoming classes. When Michigan plays at Rutgers (or is shown in the NYC area more often because it's playing a team from the area) it's advertising for the school. If UConn plays Illinois or NW, an area where many highly qualified students are going out of state because they can't get into Illinois and NW, it's advertisement for the schools. When UConn associates itself with Michigan, Northwestern, UNC, or Duke, they are telling the world they are like them. It's advertisement for the schools.

Does Louisville joining the ACC reduce UNC's academic brand? Probably not as the brand is already very high. Would UNC playing in The NYC/NJ area put the UNC brand in more prospective students households? Absolutely. Would UConn playing in The Big10 help bring in a more national incoming student base? Absolutely. The advertising would be a boon for UConn. More prospective students watching UConn play football and basketball on a regular basis (not just in the tourney) puts more eyes on UConn's brand. The Big10 (or The ACC) provides a greater avenue to promote UConn's brand than The AAC does.

I may be off base, but I, for the life of me, can't figure out why schools participate in big time athletics other than place their brand in as many homes of prospective students as possible. You said it yourself, what does having players that don't attend classes that normal students don't attend have to do with academics? Why would UNC put their academic reputation on line with their athletes classes? Most schools don't have "Winning National Championships in Football and Men Basketball" on their mission statement.

If you can explain to me why these programs exist in the form they do and why else these schools put so much into their athletic programs, please help me. I know donations are part of it (a way to get rich alumni together and donate), but I just can't wrap my head around it.