If we don't make the tourney next year, does Ollie deserve to get fired?

[Stainmaster]

I don't want to get into a pissing match with you and don't disagree with anything you just said. However, if he can't develop a top 100 recruiting class than does it matter if 1 or all of them go elsewhere?

I would much rather be bringing in high-quality talent and hoping that their natural abilities are able to overcompensate for whatever deficiencies there are with the current staff's ability to develop talent than have a hypothetical new HC bring in a bunch of "AAC-level recruits" and coach them up slightly better. Sure that works in this conference, but all that will set us up to do is go 13-3 in conference yet fail to be competitive at a national level. The few marquee national wins we've had as a program in the past couple of years have happened when our top players perform at the level we expected them to coming in. That goes away if we think we can live without 5 and 4-star kids simply because Ollie may not be able to get the most out of them.

Furthermore, one of the things that stands in the way of evaluating the true skill level of these recruits is basketball IQ, a topic that's been brought up plenty of times here. Purvis was a Top 30 or 40 kid coming out of HS, yet he had all of his issues with traveling, the court's boundaries, and FT shooting last year. To his credit he has cut way down on them, but the number of dumb mistakes like that he should be making is really zero. Facey's another example; yes, ESPN did have him in their Top 100, but he was an extremely raw international big who was probably able to get by with his outstanding athleticism against Long Island HS competition. NY Gatorade POY is an impressive feat no matter who you are, but the accolades don't cover up that he starting playing the game much, much later than many of the players he is going up against. As I said in another thread, Enoch wasn't even a varsity player at Norwalk High until his junior year.

What makes me optimistic about the 2016 group of Top 100 guys as opposed to other years is that from what I glean, we don't have any guys who are terribly new to the game or have BBIQ issues. Alterique Gilbert would probably be the smartest player on this year's squad, and the videos and scouting reports we have of Diarra show that he has the intangible nose for the ball/ability to rip down a rebound and hold on to it that our current bigs have lots of trouble with. Basically, I see this group of 5 and 4 star players as not having the limitations in terms of court sense and things like that which have played a huge part in underdevelopment of similarly ranked players at UConn.

 

[UConn_Top_Dog]

I can't read the comments on this forum anymore. If I continue to read these idiotic comments my head is going to explode. This is a very dark place right now. I'm going to rewatch the Ohio St game to cheer me up.

 

[JimHurley]

I would much rather be bringing in high-quality talent and hoping that their natural abilities are able to overcompensate for whatever deficiencies there are with the current staff's ability to develop talent than have a hypothetical new HC bring in a bunch of "AAC-level recruits" and coach them up slightly better. Sure that works in this conference, but all that will set us up to do is go 13-3 in conference yet fail to be competitive at a national level. The few marquee national wins we've had as a program in the past couple of years have happened when our top players perform at the level we expected them to coming in. That goes away if we think we can live without 5 and 4-star kids simply because Ollie may not be able to get the most out of them.

Furthermore, one of the things that stands in the way of evaluating the true skill level of these recruits is basketball IQ, a topic that's been brought up plenty of times here. Purvis was a Top 30 or 40 kid coming out of HS, yet he had all of his issues with traveling, the court's boundaries, and FT shooting last year. To his credit he has cut way down on them, but the number of dumb mistakes like that he should be making is really zero. Facey's another example; yes, ESPN did have him in their Top 100, but he was an extremely raw international big who was probably able to get by with his outstanding athleticism against Long Island HS competition. NY Gatorade POY is an impressive feat no matter who you are, but the accolades don't cover up that he starting playing the game much, much later than many of the players he is going up against. As I said in another thread, Enoch wasn't even a varsity player at Norwalk High until his junior year.

What makes me optimistic about the 2016 group of Top 100 guys as opposed to other years is that from what I glean, we don't have any guys who are terribly new to the game or have BBIQ issues. Alterique Gilbert would probably be the smartest player on this year's squad, and the videos and scouting reports we have of Diarra show that he has the intangible nose for the ball/ability to rip down a rebound and hold on to it that our current bigs have lots of trouble with. Basically, I see this group of 5 and 4 star players as not having the limitations in terms of court sense and things like that which have played a huge part in underdevelopment of similarly ranked players at UConn.

Agree with the whole last paragraph. I'm not giving up on Ollie yet but if we tank next year with that class, then it's time to start questioning the coach.

 

[UConn_Top_Dog]

Wow we need Omar to play consistently. He lit it up against Ohio State. I miss Omar comin...

 

[Athlete94]

Why is everyone bashing this guy. I admit firing KO would be silly at this point. This year isn't looking good, but not over yet. If we miss the tourney, make the NIT and get bounced early again, start scratching your head. Let's see how next year looks with the class coming in. If we miss the tourney or make the NIT with that class, making a change must be considered. Anyone on this board who still thinks KO is the man to lead this team at that point after 3 straight NIT appearances, should take a new poll, then apologize to the original poster.

 

[BoatShow]

It's been 26 years since we missed the tourney back to back years. I don't see this team making it this year and quite frankly I don't think they care.

 

[SouthBayHusky]

It's been 26 years since we missed the tourney back to back years. I don't see this team making it this year and quite frankly I don't think they care.

Believe me, they care tremendously. However they do need someone to lead them thru hard times, and that seems to be missing the most.

 

[Pudge]

This is NOT the time for this thread. Angry? Yes ... many of us are very discouraged. But, your hissy fits don't fit the Ollie record and the arc of this Program. Ollie has to get much better ... and I believe he will ... and these guys we depend on (Purvis and Hamilton) need to get far more consistent. Thank God - totally in the face of a few posters - that we did get Miller & Gibbs. They come up for us.

 

[Paesano]

For those hating on the OP and the thread itself, what if we missed the NCAAs four years in a row? Would you switch your vote from a no to a yes in that scenario?

For me, 2 bad years is not enough. Too impatient. But if they miss three years in a row, I go from hopeful to skeptical. The excuse will be that we lost our grad players and replaced them with freshman. I might be ok with that excuse justifying one more year. But if they miss four years straight? Yeah, you need to get rid of him and try another head coach. You just do.

 

[Towney007]

If he doesn't make the tournament next year he's fired. If you think otherwise you're completely hammered on the Kool aid. I love the guy but this team has been a disaster the last two years. Low margin for error in this conference. Also he's recruited reasonably well in picking off guys off lists but the results aren't there yet. We're still a bit early to be launching him out the door but three years in a row and he's done. No doubt about it.

 

[UConnSwag11]

For those hating on the OP and the thread itself, what if we missed the NCAAs four years in a row? Would you switch your vote from a no to a yes in that scenario?

For me, 2 bad years is not enough. Too impatient. But if they miss three years in a row, I go from hopeful to skeptical. The excuse will be that we lost our grad players and replaced them with freshman. I might be ok with that excuse justifying one more year. But if they miss four years straight? Yeah, you need to get rid of him and try another head coach. You just do.

I think next years incoming class is what he wants and needs. Not saying they'll be the greatest their first year but as they mature and learn they will give Ollie what he wants. Smart athletic skillful pgs, bigs who can pick and pop, shooters on the outside, etc. you see what he wants and can do when he gets the players he wants (bazz, boat, Daniels, giff). We have a lot of talent this year but we haven't imo been able to do 100% of what Ollie wants. We get out and run when we can and press but at the half court were missing some players

 

[CTBasketball]

For those hating on the OP and the thread itself, what if we missed the NCAAs four years in a row? Would you switch your vote from a no to a yes in that scenario?

For me, 2 bad years is not enough. Too impatient. But if they miss three years in a row, I go from hopeful to skeptical. The excuse will be that we lost our grad players and replaced them with freshman. I might be ok with that excuse justifying one more year. But if they miss four years straight? Yeah, you need to get rid of him and try another head coach. You just do.

If we miss the tournament in 2018 with a lineup of:

G: Jalen Adams
G: Alterique Gilbert/Hamidou Diallo
F: Daniel Hamilton/Vance Jackson
F: Mamadou Diarra/Juwan Durham
C: Steve Enoch/Zach Brown

Then Ollie should never get another coaching job as long as he lives. I wouldn't wish that torture on any other school.

 

[UCweCONN]

If we miss the tourney three years in a row, we can no longer be considered a top program and the decline many predicted when JC retired will have come to fruition.

 

[Towney007]

IMO there is plenty of talent in this team, this year. They're grossly underperforming. Between what they have here this year and what they have coming in next year there's no excuse not to make the tournament.

 

[Stinger92860]

Can we get Blaney to come back to the staff?

 

[UConnDad]

Well I guess KO at least gets a reprieve until Saturday!

 

[Paesano]

If we miss the tournament in 2018 with a lineup of:

G: Jalen Adams
G: Alterique Gilbert/Hamidou Diallo
F: Daniel Hamilton/Vance Jackson
F: Mamadou Diarra/Juwan Durham
C: Steve Enoch/Zach Brown

Then Ollie should never get another coaching job as long as he lives. I wouldn't wish that torture on any other school.

I hear what you are saying and I do agree. However, I think a lot of people are grossly overrating our recruits from both the 2015 and 2016 classes. In both classes combined there isn't a single consensus 5 star player. Adams, Durham and Gilbert are all borderline 4/5 star players. Durham had the most potential but he is a questionmark now with all the injuries. Adams is a solid player as is Gilbert but neither should have been thought to be instant impact players. In all seriousness, if UK or Duke recruited either of them as the "gem" of their recruiting classes, their fans would have a panic attack. Someone posted recently about KO having to grab these grad players because of all his recruiting misses. That was actually pretty accurate. If KO wants to run the team like an NBA team, he needs NBA talent. And THAT, folks, is the root of the problem. As someone once told me, we can't and won't do what it takes to win those recruiting battles.

 

[Stainmaster]

I hear what you are saying and I do agree. However, I think a lot of people are grossly overrating our recruits from both the 2015 and 2016 classes. In both classes combined there isn't a single consensus 5 star player. Adams, Durham and Gilbert are all borderline 4/5 star players. Durham had the most potential but he is a questionmark now with all the injuries. Adams is a solid player as is Gilbert but neither should have been thought to be instant impact players. In all seriousness, if UK or Duke recruited either of them as the "gem" of their recruiting classes, their fans would have a panic attack. Someone posted recently about KO having to grab these grad players because of all his recruiting misses. That was actually pretty accurate. If KO wants to run the team like an NBA team, he needs NBA talent. And THAT, folks, is the root of the problem. As someone once told me, we can't and won't do what it takes to win those recruiting battles.

So it was okay when JC got borderline 4/5 star recruits, but it's not good enough for KO? I can name maybe 2-3 of JC's classes in 25 years that were better than our '16 group on paper. People have been hard on KO and the amount that he deserves it is varying, but holding him to a higher recruiting standard than JC is just absolute BS.

 

[CTBasketball]

So it was okay when JC got borderline 4/5 star recruits, but it's not good enough for KO? I can name maybe 2-3 of JC's classes in 25 years that were better than our '16 group on paper. People have been hard on KO and the amount that he deserves it is varying, but holding him to a higher recruiting standard than JC is just absolute BS.

I believe the issue is developing players, which Calhoun was a master at.

 

[JellyBean]

I voted "No". Coach Ollie is doing a decent job of coaching our beloved Huskies. He has, depending on website, a top 10-20 recruiting class for 2016. He has the players playing and competing at a high clip. Even players that normally not that competitive, coach and his staff are developing competitors and it is always a process that takes time and patience. So I voted "No". Coach is the man for the job and he has my full support. Like it really manners. But he has my support.

 

[Stainmaster]

I believe the issue is developing players, which Calhoun was a master at.

Calhoun is IMO the absolute best to ever coach in the college game. Sure people on here have their frustrations with Ollie, but as long as Jim Calhoun isn't our coach then we are not going to see the same results, regardless of whether it's KO or whomever the flavor du jour is in the minds of the "Fire KO" crowd.

 

[cordeodato]

If Ollie were to leave we would slip back into pre-Calhoun obscurity.
Kids want to play for him. My sense is that a few years without Ollie and/or a P5 conference and
we are doomed. We would aspire to be Indiana.

 

[Paesano]

So it was okay when JC got borderline 4/5 star recruits, but it's not good enough for KO? I can name maybe 2-3 of JC's classes in 25 years that were better than our '16 group on paper. People have been hard on KO and the amount that he deserves it is varying, but holding him to a higher recruiting standard than JC is just absolute BS.

Yeah, it was ok because he didn't run the team like an NBA team. Remember, that was the excuse why he lost recruits to the squid...because they played an "NBA" style. Calhoun developed his players to play more of a blue collar style that did slowly evolve over the years to be a little NBA-like. And even saying that, we did recruit a few guys over the years that were consensus 5 star players. Some names that come to mind are Donyell Marshall, Khalid El-Amin, Richard Hamilton, Kemba Walker and Andre Drummond. I believe you could also include Deandre Daniels, Stanley Robinson and a few others but my memory is fuzzy as to whether or not they were consensus 5 star guys. Don't get me wrong, Adams, Gilbert and Durham are great players. They just aren't the super studs everyone is making them out to be.

 

[UC990411]

Curios to see if the numbers rise tonight

 

[uconnphil2016]

I'd say yes. As a program, you're always either getting better or getting worse. We're clearly trending downward--that's very difficult to deny. He deserves next year to see what his new recruiting class can do, but if he doesn't make the tournament next year then he doesn't deserve to coach the program. Three straight non-appearances would be too much to excuse