If we don't make the tourney next year, does Ollie deserve to get fired?

[RayIsTheGOAT]

This is one of the most ridiculous statements I've heard on this board in 2016. Name all the American born players in the UConn program that have ever left early to go play European pro basketball.

It's not exactly leaving early-he has had four years of education. Plus, he doesn't have a realistic shot at the NBA. It's not like he's shown significant growth over the last 4 years going back to NC State. He might as well cash in ASAP on his abilities, especially with the statements about helping his family out.
And I don't know about you, but I would rather Purvis graduate and see our chances of bringing in Diallo or another high profile guard a year early.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

It's not that absurd. He'll have spent 4 years in school and have graduated. He'll be 23. It's not really leaving early. And he's hinted a number of times that he's not coming back.

It's not a ridiculous statement at all, and I stand by it. You're just riled up after a loss. He'll graduate this spring, he's made statements about not being able to play with next year's recruiting class, and he comes from a single-parent household. Just because "we're high and mighty UConn" doesn't mean something like this won't end up happening.

I'm not going to bash either of you because you both generally have solid points, but please explain how you see a guy who got relegated to the bench in what you think is his final season for a team that might not make the field of 68 is making 6-figures playing overseas next year?


Obviously he can make some x-amount of dollars playing somewhere next season, but what is pressing him to do that now vs waiting 1 more year and trying to leverage a higher profile and a program resurgence into making more money? How is his mother in need of money now more so than at any point in the last 4 years, or when he was a top 20 guy 4 years ago and could have gone overseas then if money were the main issue...

 

[ahk07003]

If KO is gone then who will replace him? Lets face it he needs to rebuild the program after all the roster turnover and mediocre recruiting over the past years and that's a tall task. If we lose KO (who won a national championship) then what reason would recruits have to come to UConn? Were stuck with Ollie for better or for worse. At least his recruiting has been good and we know that he can coach from watching him in 2012-14 if he has the right personnel. Give the guy a break he's young. If not please name a good head coaching candidate that we would be sure to get.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

It's not exactly leaving early-he has had four years of education. Plus, he doesn't have a realistic shot at the NBA. It's not like he's shown significant growth over the last 4 years going back to NC State. He might as well cash in ASAP on his abilities, especially with the statements about helping his family out.
And I don't know about you, but I would rather Purvis graduate and see our chances of bringing in Diallo or another high profile guard a year early.

Just to shorten my last post, but if his family were so in need of money to where someone of his level declared before his eligibility expired, why does he leave now vs after next year, or to evade the transfer process, or straight out of high school?

And as a more offensive non-PC statement, I've never seen anything from Purvis that doesn't make me believe that he doesn't think the NBA is an impossibility for him.

 

[Stainmaster]

I'm not going to bash either of you because you both generally have solid points, but please explain how you see a guy who got relegated to the bench in what you think is his final season for a team that might not make the field of 68 is making 6-figures playing overseas next year?


Obviously he can make some x-amount of dollars playing somewhere next season, but what is pressing him to do that now vs waiting 1 more year and trying to leverage a higher profile and a program resurgence into making more money? How is his mother in need of money now more so than at any point in the last 4 years, or when he was a top 20 guy 4 years ago and could have gone overseas then if money were the main issue...

Given the documented issues with lineup and rotation management, I don't know if he should be coming off the bench. He's a very good shooter and has improved tremendously on defense, on both ends I can see him being a satisfactory overseas professional. As to why this year and not next year? Maybe he's worried about being injured, maybe he doesn't want to go to graduate school, maybe he feels this is as high as his stock will get.

 

[RayIsTheGOAT]

Just to shorten my last post, but if his family were so in need of money to where someone of his level declared before his eligibility expired, why does he leave now vs after next year, or to evade the transfer process, or straight out of high school?

And as a more offensive non-PC statement, I've never seen anything from Purvis that doesn't make me believe that he doesn't think the NBA is an impossibility for him.

That last sentence was like a double-double negative. The more you wait, the longer the risk for injury. From his perspective, he's healthy, he has a college degree, his mom is struggling financially, and he could instantly make 60k+ playing basketball. Sounds like a very tempting situation for me.
If you think Purvis is a legitimate NBA prospect, I think you are mistaken. I have never seen him string together any level of consistency that makes me say, wow, he has a shot in the NBA.

 

[PcketknfNiels]

That last sentence was like a double-double negative. The more you wait, the longer the risk for injury. From his perspective, he's healthy, he has a college degree, his mom is struggling financially, and he could instantly make 60k+ playing basketball. Sounds like a very tempting situation for me.
If you think Purvis is a legitimate NBA prospect, I think you are mistaken. I have never seen him string together any level of consistency that makes me say, wow, he has a shot in the NBA.

You very clearly misread my post. I never said that I think Purvis is a legit NBA prospect right now, my main question to you, or anyone else that thinks he's leaving is why now? Why does he leave now vs straight out of high school or especially instead of waiting 1 year due to the transfer policy? Why does he leave now vs wait until after next year and hope the team and his standing within the team are better to make his case?

 

[RayIsTheGOAT]

You very clearly misread my post. I never said that I think Purvis is a legit NBA prospect right now, my main question to you, or anyone else that thinks he's leaving is why now? Why does he leave now vs straight out of high school or especially instead of waiting 1 year due to the transfer policy? Why does he leave now vs wait until after next year and hope the team and his standing within the team are better to make his case?

"I've never seen anything from Purvis that doesn't make me believe that he doesn't think the NBA is an impossibility for him." That to me is a just a very confusing way to say you think Purvis might think he can make it to the NBA. That's great if Rodney thinks that, but it's not very realistic.

To answer you question, as Stairmaster also stated, injury. What if he blows out an ACL next season with UConn? His stock in 2017 -being an inconsistent 23/24 year old coming off a big injury- would drop immensely. It's just risk. If he needs the money, he shouldn't wait on it. I'm not saying that's what he is definitely going to do, I'm just saying that is what I would do in his situation.
First of all, he couldn't leave for the NBA straight out of high school. Second of all, he probably didn't have a high enough profile coming out of high school to sign a European contract right away. Thirdly, after this season he will have his degree. That's why people go to school after all, right?

 

[djct1999]

Just to get a sense where we are as a program:
Would Chris Mack leave Xavier to coach UConn?

 

[willie99]

rut roh

seriously, I'm not looking at other coaches right now, I'm giving Ollie two more years to find his oats

it takes time for coaches to mature and this year's team's talent was vastly overrated

throw in the fact that it was the first season for 3 rotation players, and there become plausible reasons for our demise other than coaching

 

[polycom]

Stop this.

 

[UConnTrumbull]

Maybe if we go to the Big 12. He's in a better (at least equivalent) basketball conference than us.

 

[djct1999]

Stop what? You are to sensitive. This was a simple question to see where Uconn is as a program. I am not suggesting to fire Ollie and remain a supporter of his. I always have put uconn on a pedestal and viewed it as a top job. I used to think we could get anybody. Today I am not so sure. Was wondering what people thought.

 

[jibsey]

To me KO gets 3 more years with him own recruits. Let's see what he can do. It's not like we're dealing from a position of power in the conf we are in, but there is a limit.

 

[tykurez]

I've said it elsewhere ...

Yea no kidding. How many times will you post this between now and Ollie's review cycle with you in 2018?

 

[intlzncster]

I'm not going to bash either of you because you both generally have solid points, but please explain how you see a guy who got relegated to the bench in what you think is his final season for a team that might not make the field of 68 is making 6-figures playing overseas next year?


Obviously he can make some x-amount of dollars playing somewhere next season, but what is pressing him to do that now vs waiting 1 more year and trying to leverage a higher profile and a program resurgence into making more money? How is his mother in need of money now more so than at any point in the last 4 years, or when he was a top 20 guy 4 years ago and could have gone overseas then if money were the main issue...

Hey, I never said he'd make six figures, just that he'd try to make it happen. Hell, could have been China for all I knew. As you say, he's definitely not ready. I wholeheartedly agree with that.

And according to another thread, it looks like he is staying. So I was wrong and you were right about this anyway. C'est La Vie.

 

[intlzncster]

Yea no kidding. How many times will you post this between now and Ollie's review cycle with you in 2018?

lmao. And I personally feel he needs another 2 years on top of tens projection. I'm more patient with coaches than most, and feel it takes some real time for them to grow into the role. The coaching carousel gets you nowhere in the long run, unless you are dead lucky.

 

[amory]

This thread is like herpes

 

[Deepster]

lmao. And I personally feel he needs another 2 years on top of tens projection. I'm more patient with coaches than most, and feel it takes some real time for them to grow into the role. The coaching carousel gets you nowhere in the long run, unless you are dead lucky.

I feel the same....and I'll add that the leash is a LOT shorter on him than I would have ever thought a few years ago. I most certainly can envision a UConn w/out KO.

 

[Paesano]

To me KO gets 3 more years with him own recruits. Let's see what he can do. It's not like we're dealing from a position of power in the conf we are in, but there is a limit.

I want to be sure I understand. Are you saying three years beyond, not including, this year? If so, and, if he fails to produce an NCAA team 5 years straight, I don't think you simply fire him. I think you shoot his arse out of a cannon at that point.

For me, if he fails to get us into the NCAAs three years straight, he either gets the axe then or you give him one more year to not only make the dance but at least make it to the second weekend. No way do you let this go more than 4 years.

 

[intlzncster]

I want to be sure I understand. Are you saying three years beyond, not including, this year? If so, and, if he fails to produce an NCAA team 5 years straight, I don't think you simply fire him. I think you shoot his arse out of a cannon at that point.

For me, if he fails to get us into the NCAAs three years straight, he either gets the axe then or you give him one more year to not only make the dance but at least make it to the second weekend. No way do you let this go more than 4 years.

So basically, no coach but like 5 or 6 in the country should be fired after a few years of coaching? That's preposterous. You realize your expectations are so far out of wack with reality, you'll never, ever be happy with the program again.

There's only 11 current coaches with NCs on their resume:
Bill Self;Jim Boeheim;John Calipari;Kevin Ollie;Larry Brown;Mike Krzyzewski;Rick Pitino;Roy Williams;Steve Fisher;Tom Izzo;Tubby Smith

Most of these guys are HOF coaches. And most fail your incredibly stringent championship requirement.

And here's the ALL TIME list for coaches with multiple NCs--only 13 ever. There's only two active. And Ollie would be one of these if he won another.

John Wooden 10 1964, 1965, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1975
Adolph Rupp 4 1948, 1949, 1951, 1958
Mike Krzyzewski 4 1991, 1992, 2001, 2010
Bob Knight 3 1976, 1981, 1987
Jim Calhoun 3 1999, 2004, 2011
Dean Smith 2 1982, 1993
Roy Williams 2 2005, 2009
Denny Crum 2 1980, 1986
Billy Donovan 2 2006, 2007
Ed Jucker 2 1961, 1962
Henry Iba 2 1945, 1946
Phil Woolpert 2 1955, 1956
Branch McCracken 2

 

[jibsey]

The problem is the short leash in this conference. In Calhoun's waning years in the Big East we could beat anyone on any given night and we could also lose to anyone on any given night. That drove me insane, but in the end we'd almost always still end up firmly in the tournament field.

I see the same things with this team. The problem is we're playing down to our opponents far more often than we play up, because the competition is inferior.

Calhoun never seemed to prioritize the regular season and he could get away with it. Ollie needs to prioritize every single damn game and make sure the team does too.

I agree except for one thing. OK we're playing down to inferior conference opponents, right? Bob Wenzel on SportsTalk TIC said the conference is stronger top to bottom than perceived with 4 bids awaiting. In this scenario it's like losing games in the OBE. I understand that this is a hard concept to sell on this board and one we rarely hear.

 

[Stainmaster]

If these threads are popping up at the beginning of March, I shudder to think of what this offseason will bring...

 

[CardiacAndre7]

Yes, then Glen Miller would leave to coach Xavier

 

[Paesano]

So basically, no coach but like 5 or 6 in the country should be fired after a few years of coaching? That's preposterous. You realize your expectations are so far out of wack with reality, you'll never, ever be happy with the program again.

There's only 11 current coaches with NCs on their resume:
Bill Self;Jim Boeheim;John Calipari;Kevin Ollie;Larry Brown;Mike Krzyzewski;Rick Pitino;Roy Williams;Steve Fisher;Tom Izzo;Tubby Smith

Most of these guys are HOF coaches. And most fail your incredibly stringent championship requirement.

And here's the ALL TIME list for coaches with multiple NCs--only 13 ever. There's only two active. And Ollie would be one of these if he won another.

John Wooden 10 1964, 1965, 1967, 1968, 1969, 1970, 1971, 1972, 1973, 1975
Adolph Rupp 4 1948, 1949, 1951, 1958
Mike Krzyzewski 4 1991, 1992, 2001, 2010
Bob Knight 3 1976, 1981, 1987
Jim Calhoun 3 1999, 2004, 2011
Dean Smith 2 1982, 1993
Roy Williams 2 2005, 2009
Denny Crum 2 1980, 1986
Billy Donovan 2 2006, 2007
Ed Jucker 2 1961, 1962
Henry Iba 2 1945, 1946
Phil Woolpert 2 1955, 1956
Branch McCracken 2

WTF are you talking about?!?!?! What championship requirement? I just don't think a coach at UConn should ever fail to make the NCAA tournament three years straight. And if he does, and if we want to be generous and give him a fourth shot, he had better do more than just squeak in.