Hurley Needs to Find Lineups w/ Sanogo & Clingan | Page 3 | The Boneyard

Hurley Needs to Find Lineups w/ Sanogo & Clingan

Anyone stumping for Adama getting significant minutes at the four needs to look around the Big East at the fours we'll be facing and then think about whether they want Sanogo guarding that person on the perimeter. I'll save you some time. The answer is no. That is a recipe for immediate foul trouble and opposing coaches would be gameplanning to do exactly that.
 
Bad idea- 2 big men on the floor at the same time changes the team dynamic. It changes interior spacing on the offensive side and limits ball movement from your wings. I agree with most - Sanogo is beast inside- you wear down your opponent then bring in the big guy. Also- it stretches out the potential foul issues
 
Just for fun let’s try a lineup of Clignan, Sanogo, Johnson, Hassan, and Karraban that would a sight to see lol.
 
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We’re 8-0 with 8 blowout wins including 2 top 25 teams. I think whatever Hurley is doing with lineups is just fine lol

Having both on the same floor has been used in some situational lineups like Oregon when we needed size

The fact that we’re trying to get our freshman backup C more minutes while our starting C is the BE preseason POY and on the KAJ watch list means we have something special!
 
So you are calling Jackson a shooter?
No … but running out high caliber players with those varied skills at 7’2”, 6’9”, 6’7, 6,7” and 6’5” would be pretty intimidating.
 
The Sanogo hot takes after he hovered between really good and completely dominant during every other game this year are bad even by fan message board standards.
I think its totally fair criticism. 6 points and 4 fouls in a big game?!!! He is overrated and should be put at the end of the bench!!! Inexcusable!!!! :D
 
There will be games where it is needed, like against Oregon. But mostly I like how Hurley has things set up.
I think in a game against a team like Purdue.....Clingan and Sanogo may both need to be on the floor together most of the time to counteract the Boilermakers massive frontline full of several huge players which includes a 7'4" 290 pound mountain named Zach Edey.
 
No reason for them to be on the court together. What we're doing now is working very well.
 
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As long as there's 3 shooters on with the two bigs I suspect it'll work. Can be any three of Newton, Hawkins, Calcaterra, Karaban, and possibly Alleyne/Diarra. I think you need the three out to be dangerous from outside to clear space for the two bigs to operate. So I don't think having Jackson with them works.

On the other hand, wouldn't a lineup of Sanogo, Clingan, Karaban, Jackson and Newton be downright scary? Would we ever give up a rebound?

That's not to say I'd do either of them, but if Hurley wants time in the lab to experiment, fine.
Goal #1 - Don’t screw up a good thing. Having said that I don’t have a problem with Sanogo and Clingan playing together in spots when and if circumstances call for it.
 
I don't see any way Sanogo averages 30 minutes per this season. He's averaging 24 per now and it still feels like Clingan isn't playing enough. We'll also get Samson back soon.

I think his average is going to be creeping upwards.

That assumes that we’re not going to continue to win by an average of 26 points a game.
 
Hurley can afford against certain teams in situations put them both out there at the same time and see what happens. No one will die if he does that. Newton, Karaban and maybe Diarra out there, that’s 2 handlers or AJAX. Gives us ball handling, shooting, boards, defense. What could be bad for 4 minutes?
 
I think his average is going to be creeping upwards.

That assumes that we’re not going to continue to win by an average of 26 points a game.
Objection! Assuming facts not in evidence, your honor.
 
It's this.

Clingan still doesn't have the conditioning to go 30 mpg. Sanogo wore down at the end of last year under heavy usage.

The solution is obvious and it's exactly what you suggest. Let Clingan dominate in spurts, ride him here and there. Keep Sanogo fresh.

It also mitigates concern about foul trouble.

Playing them together might also make both worse.
The biggest coaching mistake of Calhouns career ( he didn’t make many) was trying to play Oriakhi and Drummond together. That caused one of the most disappointing seasons ( in regards to expectations) that we ever had.

Hurley is playing this perfect right now. DC came here knowing he was waiting for his turn. Donovan is wildly exceeding everyone’s expectations early on and his play warrants minutes. Enjoy it. It’s a luxury no team in the country has. Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water.

Unbelievable.
 
I think his average is going to be creeping upwards.

That assumes that we’re not going to continue to win by an average of 26 points a game.
I think it stays the same or Clingan's minutes creep up a bit.
 
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I think his average is going to be creeping upwards.

That assumes that we’re not going to continue to win by an average of 26 points a game.
Totally agree. Creeping the operative word, because it will be slow because Donovan earned minutes. But again, Donovan came here knowing that he might get 5 minutes a game. Hurley smart enough to know Donovan can help us now and won’t hesitate to use him. But the 5 spot is Adamas this year, Donovan is the heir apparent. Playing them together for any extended period would be coaching malpractice considering the makeup of this team and system.
 
The biggest coaching mistake of Calhouns career ( he didn’t make many) was trying to play Oriakhi and Drummond together. That caused one of the most disappointing seasons ( in regards to expectations) that we ever had.
Yes, JC thought he could have the same success with Roscoe Smith/Oriakhi/Drummond that he had earlier with Rudy Gay/Villanueva (or Armstrong)/Boone, despite the fact that:
  • the former trio were much less skilled
  • the game was changing and coaches had a much easier time defending multi-big lineups, and JC was stubborn in thinking he could defy the trend (kind of ironic, too, given that the 2011 team had tremendous success with smaller lineups)
 
I would love to see Sanogo play 30 minutes a game and Clingan get like 15 minutes a game to keep the overlap at like 5 minutes a game and if we do well in that overlap time then we could creep it up to 10 minutes a game
 
Totally agree. Creeping the operative word, because it will be slow because Donovan earned minutes. But again, Donovan came here knowing that he might get 5 minutes a game. Hurley smart enough to know Donovan can help us now and won’t hesitate to use him. But the 5 spot is Adamas this year, Donovan is the heir apparent. Playing them together for any extended period would be coaching malpractice considering the makeup of this team and system.
I don’t think Clingan ever thought 5 minutes or he wouldn’t have come. Keeping him fresh at 18 minutes is fine, though I’d like to see 25.
 
The biggest coaching mistake of Calhouns career ( he didn’t make many) was trying to play Oriakhi and Drummond together. That caused one of the most disappointing seasons ( in regards to expectations) that we ever had.

Hurley is playing this perfect right now. DC came here knowing he was waiting for his turn. Donovan is wildly exceeding everyone’s expectations early on and his play warrants minutes. Enjoy it. It’s a luxury no team in the country has. Don’t throw the baby out with the bath water.

Unbelievable.
Agree with all this. I brought up the Drummond and AO debacle with my friend the other day. There is no reason to play Sanogo and Clingan together for the hell of it. Maybe if the situation calls for it, for a brief bit. We have a great flow and chemistry with the current lineup. No need to change it.
 
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We’re 8-0 with 8 blowout wins including 2 top 25 teams. I think whatever Hurley is doing with lineups is just fine lol

Having both on the same floor has been used in some situational lineups like Oregon when we needed size

The fact that we’re trying to get our freshman backup C more minutes while our starting C is the BE preseason POY and on the KAJ watch list means we have something special!

I am really confused why anyone would be advocating for a significant shake-up in our lineups when we're undefeated and #8 in the country. It doesn't make a lot of sense.
 
Agree with all this. I brought up the Drummond and AO debacle with my friend the other day. There is no reason to play Sanogo and Clingan together for the hell of it. Maybe if the situation calls for it, for a brief bit. We have a great flow and chemistry with the current lineup. No need to change it.
This kind of touches upon one of the quiet secrets of success for this year‘s team. Somehow Dan Hurley and his staff have been successful in creating buy in so that guys are willing to take fewer minutes and more limited roles. That often is a telltale sign of very good teams. I think it speaks both to the character of the young men we have playing for us, and the quality of the coaching.
 
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I don’t think Clingan ever thought 5 minutes or he wouldn’t have come. Keeping him fresh at 18 minutes is fine, though I’d like to see 25.


Sure he did. He knew he was coming in to back up one of the top 5 Centers in the country who is a junior and preseason BigEast player of the year and is auditioning for the NBA. Adama is going to get his minutes. It's part of coaching these days be honest with recruits and current players about playing time. It wouldn't be a good look for future recruits to see Adama riding pine this year. Donovans rapid rise is an unexpected bonus to this season. He will get his minutes, but the lions share is as Sanogo's back up. Some games that may look like 8-10 minutes. Some games that may look 18-20 minutes and everything in between. But it will all be dictated on Sanogo's foul trouble and our matchups that game. Donovan is a good, smart kid. He's there for the team and will be here for us.
 
I think the return of Samson opens up that possibility but for now id say no. It puts too much pressure on other teams. Sanogo is a load to deal with then he sits and now you have to deal with a 7 footer whos a another load to deal with.
As I have watched the games this year is that we are very good and very deep. No let up all game, and our opponents are ready to tap out some time in the final 5 minutes of the game.

Iowa State had the air going out of their tires at the end of that game. You could see it.

Sanogo is a load to deal with. At least 2 of the defenders are on heightened alert to switch, defend collapse and double (triple?) on him every minute he is in.

Then he sits and DC comes in. And the game continues but now at a higher altitude.

Exhausting to have to play that way. And as the game winds down, and the defenders are starting to really suck air, Sanogo comes back in, refreshed and ready to speed things back up.

And the defensive game plan is in pieces.

There may be some opportunities to present that dominant double post look, but we have a tremendous endurance advantage platooning them as we are doing now.

And until we start to have issues with this approach, we're I Coach Hurley, it would take some triggering event, a game where this current approach demonstrably failed, to get me to change.

Imagine if we had 2 exceptional PGs, and they were being effectively platooned, would we be craving the opportunity to see both on the court at the same time?

After all, you can only score once on each possession, no matter who is on the floor together.
 
This kind of touches upon one of the quiet secrets of success for this year‘s team. Somehow Dan Hurley and his staff have been successful in creating buy in so that guys are willing to take fewer minutes and more limited roles. That often is a telltale sign of very good teams. I think it speaks both to the character of the young men we have playing for us, and the quality of the coaching.
Also, it looks like Hurley is doing less micromanaging from the sidelines. Over the past 4 years, the team would look to Hurley for want to do next. This year it seems the team is just playing and we're playing faster.
 
IMO playing Clingan at the 5 and Sanogo at the 4 will be necessary against teams with a skilled BIG man like Eddy of Purdue and Kalkbrenner of Creighton, simply because Adama showed this weekend that he is unable to score and is overwhelmed when he is double teamed, while Clingan does not appear to suffer that problem when he is in the middle.
 
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