How Important is +/- in the light of Tonight

[msf22b]

Looking at the +/- from the game...as posted by Nan
Morgan stood out outrageously with a +15, KK was next with +4

Is that because they mostly played mostly in the latter stages of the game
when UConn was making its big run? Or was their contribution the reason for the run?

Is it serendipitous or a true indication of talent and ability.

If one believes it is an indication of talent (and based on this one game) they would then start KK over Chen (of whom I'm very fond)
And ...for not the first time, Ice's +/- was far inferior to that of Jana.

I'm interested in what the group thinks...Is this a true indication of player value...

My guess: for one game...no, not too significant...but over several; weeks...a considerably important indicator.

 

[maple]

Is that because they mostly played mostly in the latter stages of the game when UConn was making its big run? Or was their contribution the reason for the run?

Yes.

Also, I agree with your last statement — I don’t necessarily believe one game is a true indicator of anything. But if a player is consistently getting + or - during their floor time, that to me is worth considering. Of course you have to look at who they were playing with when they got the +/- and go from there. But it definitely means something, long term.

 

[AJay11]

Looking at the +/- from the game...as posted by Nan
Morgan stood out outrageously with a +15, KK was next with +4

Is that because they mostly played mostly in the latter stages of the game
when UConn was making its big run? Or was their contribution the reason for the run?

Is it serendipitous or a true indication of talent and ability.

If one believes it is an indication of talent (and based on this one game) they would then start KK over Chen (of whom I'm very fond)
And ...for not the first time, Ice's +/- was far inferior to that of Jana.

I'm interested in what the group thinks...Is this a true indication of player value...

My guess: for one game...no, not too significant...but over several; weeks...a considerably important indicator.

This was absolutely Chen's worst game, and they would not start KK over Chen since she's always had a higher +/- then KK. The offense usually flows better with her on the floor (Although I really don't know why she doesn't take more shots when she can make them). I've wondered since they basically share the PG role. Same on the positive side for Morgan. She had a couple of solid games but she has to perform consistently.

 

[BRS24]

This was absolutely Chen's worst game, and they would not start KK over Chen since she's always had a higher +/- then KK. The offense usually flows better with her on the floor (Although I really don't know why she doesn't take more shots when she can make them). I've wondered since they basically share the PG role. Same on the positive side for Morgan. She had a couple of solid games but she has to perform consistently.

I see Chen starting as a way to set a tone. She directs, she assists, and perhaps that's her primary role. When KK comes off the bench, it creates a higher intensity, aka, be the menace (as reported), which can be beneficial against the opponents' first line of subs. If Chen, KK, and others are doing what Geno and staff have game planned for them to do, then that's good.

 

[HuskyNan]

I see Chen starting as a way to set a tone. She directs, she assists, and perhaps that's her primary role. When KK comes off the bench, it creates a higher intensity, aka, be the menace (as reported), which can be beneficial against the opponents' first line of subs. If Chen, KK, and others are doing what Geno and staff have game planned for them to do, then that's good.

Geno has always preferred a spark off the bench that can change the game after the opponent’s defense settles in

 

[NYCHUSKIES]

Geno has always preferred a spark off the bench that can change the game after the opponent’s defense settles in

Agree.. I just wished Geno would of left KK on the floor in all of the 4th qt. Even though we lost, this was one of those bittersweet ones. On one end, I'm so happy to see Azzi back (had she made one of her 3's last night, Uconn would of won). The downside is that this game was lost by, respectfully, dumb little mistakes like.missed free throws, or that strech where USC made two consecutive turnovers and uconn couldn't score on either of these possessions.

I love where we are and I rreeealllly do believe we will beat South Carolina.

Sarah Strong: Just WOW.. Completely unfazed by the magnitude of this game. Even her .missed final.shot looked good. I wish she would of known she had a little bit more.time on the clock and shifted a little.more.to the left of JuJu so she could have a clearer shot at the 3. Go Huskies!!!

 

[ERWUC65]

Looking at the plusses, Ash played a lot and did well. Once Azzi gets her game back that will be a dynamic duo as will the duo of KK and Kaitlyn. That's 4 good players for 2 positions, add Paige and you have 3 positions covered, add Sarah you have 4 positions covered, leaving only the 5 as the team weakness, and 11 games to figure it out. I hope we see a lot of Jana as she is more of the pro-typical post player, leaving Ice and Morgan competing for the alternate to her. While our strength right now is the 4 guard with Sarah at the 5 that should be put in the bank, hoping the other system will work in March.

 

[PvP]

Looking at the +/- from the game...as posted by Nan
Morgan stood out outrageously with a +15, KK was next with +4

Is that because they mostly played mostly in the latter stages of the game
when UConn was making its big run? Or was their contribution the reason for the run?

Is it serendipitous or a true indication of talent and ability.

If one believes it is an indication of talent (and based on this one game) they would then start KK over Chen (of whom I'm very fond)
And ...for not the first time, Ice's +/- was far inferior to that of Jana.

I'm interested in what the group thinks...Is this a true indication of player value...

My guess: for one game...no, not too significant...but over several; weeks...a considerably important indicator.

Could you please provide a link to where plus-minus stats for individual games as well as seasonal totals can be found. It would be much appreciated. Thanks....

 

[HuskyNan]

Could you please provide a link to where plus-minus stats for individual games as well as seasonal totals can be found. It would be much appreciated. Thanks....

I get them from the live stats

 

[Monte]

Only Time will tell!

 

[Bigboote]

I also saw Morgan’s huge +/-. I absolutely think she had an outsize impact on the game.

But it’s this one game, in which much of the team was struggling. I don’t think it’s indicative of how Morgan will impact every game, but I‘d be surprised if she hasn’t played her way into 15-20 minutes a game.

 

[maple]

I also saw Morgan’s huge +/-. I absolutely think she had an outsize impact on the game.

But it’s this one game, in which much of the team was struggling. I don’t think it’s indicative of how Morgan will impact every game, but I‘d be surprised if she hasn’t played her way into 15-20 minutes a game.

Between this and last game, I’m feeling very optimistic about Cheli. She reminds one of the classic scrappy UConn player. She’s already showing huge upside. The more playing time/experience she gets — I think she’s really going to be a key player.

 

[Rb335]

I also saw Morgan’s huge +/-. I absolutely think she had an outsize impact on the game.

But it’s this one game, in which much of the team was struggling. I don’t think it’s indicative of how Morgan will impact every game, but I‘d be surprised if she hasn’t played her way into 15-20 minutes a game.

I thought she held her own and proved she belongs. She is exactly the type of player who will benefit from extended minutes over the next 11 games to increase her comfort level. A few examples of how that could help.

1. The game slows down. She rushed an interior post move and traveled, but made the basket. Feeling comfortable and not rushed, that’s a 2 point basket.

2. On the fast break, she got swatted attempting a right handed layup on the left side of the basket. Go up with the left and it’s likely either a layup or free throws.

3. She got a good rebound or steal and started to push the pace. I was yelling slow down because it was 2 on 3/4. She turned the ball over trying to push tempo.

More experience cleans up these small mistakes, which she’ll do. When you compound that down the roster, it has a big impact on a full 40 minute game.

 

[PvP]

I get them from the live stats

View attachment 105638

Thanks Nan, but I don't know how to access "live stats", could you provide a link or the web address, please? Thanks. Also is there a source of season plus/minus for each player?

 

[CONNCAN]

In the long term this season, tonight's loss can only make this team stronger. Remember, UCONN played without essentially 2 "Huge" pieces of this team in Aubrey Griffin and essentially Azzi Fudd (who really wasn't part of the team last night). Those 2, healthy and playing to their already shown and proven capabilities, will take this team to a National Championship

 

[HuskyNan]

Thanks Nan, but I don't know how to access "live stats", could you provide a link or the web address, please? Thanks. Also is there a source of season plus/minus for each player?

Live stats are available during games only. If there’s an archive or compilation for year to date, I don’t know where it is.

To find live stats during a home game go to the UConn schedule and click on the bars as you see highlighted in yellow below. For road games, go to the opponent’s schedule and look for the live stats link

 

[CONNCAN]

Live stats are available during games only. If there’s an archive or compilation for year to date, I don’t know where it is.

To find live stats during a home game go to the UConn schedule and click on the bars as you see highlighted in yellow below. For road games, go to the opponent’s schedule and look for the live stats link

View attachment 105642

ESPN also provides Live Stats

 

[PvP]

Live stats are available during games only. If there’s an archive or compilation for year to date, I don’t know where it is.

To find live stats during a home game go to the UConn schedule and click on the bars as you see highlighted in yellow below. For road games, go to the opponent’s schedule and look for the live stats link

View attachment 105643

Thanks, Nan....now I know why I had no idea how to get the plus/minus numbers and to think they disappear into the night if you aren't quick....someone really doesn't want us to know who is plus and who is minus!

 

[Zarathustra]

IMHO, like most Stats, +/-, must be taken in context.
I do not look at them in any greater context than
the game to which they are attached (no summarizing
over multiple games). My informal "take" on Morgan
Cheli's 21 minutes and +15 was that Geno needed some
one quicker and Jana and ICE to match with Kiki (I did not
check to see if this was "really" the case). Also, as we all
know now, Geno likes to insert "intensity off the bench" and
someone who can add "havoc" to the Husky defense (like KK).
ALSO, note also that Morgan only had two fouls in the USC game
as opposed to 9 fouls in her previous two game. Improvement!
Does anyone have an idea (or fact) of Morgan's wing
span? I think she performs (in passing lanes, etc.) like someone
who is TALLER (more "reach" etc., than I would expect in someone
listed as 6'2"). KIND OF, but, of course, not exactly!!, like Stewie.

 

[PvP]

IMHO, like most Stats, +/-, must be taken in context.
I do not look at them in any greater context than
the game to which they are attached (no summarizing
over multiple games). My informal "take" on Morgan
Cheli's 21 minutes and +15 was that Geno needed some
one quicker and Jana and ICE to match with Kiki (I did not
check to see if this was "really" the case). Also, as we all
know now, Geno likes to insert "intensity off the bench" and
someone who can add "havoc" to the Husky defense (like KK).
ALSO, note also that Morgan only had two fouls in the USC game
as opposed to 9 fouls in her previous two game. Improvement!
Does anyone have an idea (or fact) of Morgan's wing
span? I think she performs (in passing lanes, etc.) like someone
who is TALLER (more "reach" etc., than I would expect in someone
listed as 6'2"). KIND OF, but, of course, not exactly!!, like Stewie.

I have to believe that a consistancy in plus/minus performance over a large number of games has to have prohibitive value so having access to such numbers for each player over as many games as possible does have import.

If anyone knows where such results are available, I am sure many BYers would appreciate knowing.

Thanks....

 

[oldhusky]

I have to believe that a consistancy in plus/minus performance over a large number of games has to have prohibitive value so having access to such numbers for each player over as many games as possible does have import.

If anyone knows where such results are available, I am sure many BYers would appreciate knowing.

Thanks....

Like many, I would like to know if there is anywhere we can find that stat for a season. It should be part of the mix of comprehensive stats like PER, win share, offensive and defensive ratings, and several others. It does need to be taken with a great deal of context however.

Your Plus/Minus stat depends greatly on who you are on the floor with, and who your replacement is. If your time on the floor is generally with other very good players with chemistry, your stat will be better, as it will be if the player that replaces you is much worse than you.

Anyway Uconn varies the lineups enough that those effects get diluted, but Plus/Minus is a valuable stat to be used with several others IMO to form an opinion, then combined with the obvious eye test.

 

[luvgiraf]

The +/- for every game are listed in the Box Score (PDF) on the UConn Women's Basketball 2024-2025 schedule site: 2024-25 Women's Basketball Schedule - University of Connecticut Athletics

It is the PDF version of the box score, not the other one.

Interesting to note that Juju had a -4 for the game.

 

[CL82]

The +/- for every game are listed in the Box Score (PDF) on the UConn Women's Basketball 2024-2025 schedule site: 2024-25 Women's Basketball Schedule - University of Connecticut Athletics

It is the PDF version of the box score, not the other one.

Interesting to note that Juju had a -4 for the game.

+/- stats are a tool for evaluating player impact, but they're not the only tool. I've always thought of them as measuring "fit" and player impact that may not otherwise show up in the box score.

 

[Jumper33]

Thanks, Nan....now I know why I had no idea how to get the plus/minus numbers and to think they disappear into the night if you aren't quick....someone really doesn't want us to know who is plus and who is minus!

The website that includes the live stats in the screenshot HuskyNan posted above is called Stat Broadcast. In addition to finding it linked to the schedule on the UConn website, you can also just google search “UConn statbroadcast”

Then click the top result it should say “Events for UConn”. You should be able to find the game in question as well as a calendar with all the other sporting events for UConn. And you can go back and access an archive of past events where they will have a PDF of the results.

If you have it pulled up during the game, heads up - the live stats are usually ahead of the television! It is way ahead of ESPN’s box score for live stats.

 

[HuskyNan]

+/- stats are a tool for evaluating player impact, but they're not the only tool. I've always thought of them as measuring "fit" and player impact that may not otherwise show up in the box score.

Basketball is such a game of matchups, too. A Husky guard might be +30 against a team with poor guard play but be -5 against a team with strong guards. Without analyzing the opponent’s strengths and weaknesses, the +/- is meaningless

 

[HuskyNan]

I have to believe that a consistancy in plus/minus performance over a large number of games has to have prohibitive value so having access to such numbers for each player over as many games as possible does have import.

If anyone knows where such results are available, I am sure many BYers would appreciate knowing.

Thanks....

Here is your grid showing +/- by player by game. I'm not going to do the math for +/- for year to date because it means analyzing the boxes for every game.

I just want to be sure you're clear on what the +/- means. If a player has a +10, it means her team scored 10 more points than the other team while she's on the court. I don't know how useful this info is in a compilation. A player could be on the court for 10 minutes, have 0 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists and steals and have 10 turnovers and 4 fouls but if her team goes on a 20-0 run while she's on the court, she would have a +20 +/- score. However, if she scores 30 points with 10 rebounds but her team is outscored by 1 in the time she's on the court, her +/- will be -1. What does that tell you about the player?

 

[msf22b]

What does that tell you about the player?

Nan:

I started looking into the questions that I initially raised....
and the answer to your question is:

At least: somewhat more than you are accounting for:

The following two articles were informative:

What Does +/- Mean in Basketball? | Hoops Addict

Have you ever scoured a box score and noticed something in the far right column that says +/-? This post can help you understand what this stat means.

www.hoopsaddict.com

I was blown away by the 2nd...with the increased use of analytics in sports
+/- is being broken down into different categories:

NBA Plus-Minus & Impact Metrics in Basketball Explained

NBA Plus-minus and all derived +/- player impact metrics explained. Plus/minus basically tracks the net changes in the score when a player is on or off

www.nbastuffer.com

 

[Zarathustra]

Basketball is such a game of matchups, too. A Husky guard might be +30 against a team with poor guard play but be -5 against a team with strong guards. Without analyzing the opponent’s strengths and weaknesses, the +/- is meaningless

Stats are 'Stats" (numbers)... Context is "everything". Needless to
say I agree with HuskyNan. N.B. I have looked at +/- ratings for
a long time...they are interesting... for one game.

 

[CL82]

Basketball is such a game of matchups, too. A Husky guard might be +30 against a team with poor guard play but be -5 against a team with strong guards. Without analyzing the opponent’s strengths and weaknesses, the +/- is meaningless

Yep, and you also have to analyze the sub pattern. Who did she come in with? Who was on the floor while she was on the floor? It's not something that you can look at in isolation, but over the course of the season it does give useful information.

The flipside of +/- is the "eye test" where you just look at a player and get a sense of how they looked on the floor. Did they seem to be in sync on offense and defense? Did the opposing team single them out as an opportunity for isolation matchups? In my opinion, Morgan passed the eye test as well. She looked good out there, entirely confident and not overwhelmed by the moment. That's a great sign for the rest of the season.

 

[Rowdy831]

This was absolutely Chen's worst game, and they would not start KK over Chen since she's always had a higher +/- then KK. The offense usually flows better with her on the floor (Although I really don't know why she doesn't take more shots when she can make them). I've wondered since they basically share the PG role. Same on the positive side for Morgan. She had a couple of solid games but she has to perform consistently.

Against poor competition maybe but whe the lights are the brightest you see why UConn recruited KK.