Haven’t seen this mentioned about Hurley last night

[87Xfer]

Hurley is going to have to do something this season, and hopefully soon, that he hasn't had to do yet while at UConn.

He is going to have to tell players he recruited, and at the time of recruitment, players Hurley believed could be key players, that they are going to the bench. He has already done it with with Josh, but Josh wasn't his recruit.

I don't think mid-January Gaff, Cole and Bouk are all starting. And I'm highly confident Bouk is going to start. That leaves either putting Gaff or Cole on bench at the start of the game. And that's a tough conversation for a coach to have with one of his recruits. Even harder when each player has pros and cons and their biggest weakness (perimeter defense) is the same for both. Team needs a floor general and so far it's been awkward with Gaff and Cole on court together.

Same thing is going to happen with Martin now eligible and Akok soon returning. Minutes aren't there for everyone. Through two games looks like Whaley is good for 25 MPG and Sanogo has shown good offense and is going to get 15 mpg. That is 40 mpg at the 5 spot. Unlike others I don't see Whaley playing much 4.

At the 3 and 4 there is now Adams (who can also at some 2G), Martin and Jackson and at the 4 there is Polley and Akok.

Next week seems like first semester finals for the players- three games against different opponents. Time to see who has a versatile game and who is a match up type player.

truth

 

[Umami Zen]

Hurley is going to have to do something this season, and hopefully soon, that he hasn't had to do yet while at UConn.

He is going to have to tell players he recruited, and at the time of recruitment, players Hurley believed could be key players, that they are going to the bench. He has already done it with with Josh, but Josh wasn't his recruit.

I don't think mid-January Gaff, Cole and Bouk are all starting. And I'm highly confident Bouk is going to start. That leaves either putting Gaff or Cole on bench at the start of the game. And that's a tough conversation for a coach to have with one of his recruits. Even harder when each player has pros and cons and their biggest weakness (perimeter defense) is the same for both. Team needs a floor general and so far it's been awkward with Gaff and Cole on court together.

Same thing is going to happen with Martin now eligible and Akok soon returning. Minutes aren't there for everyone. Through two games looks like Whaley is good for 25 MPG and Sanogo has shown good offense and is going to get 15 mpg. That is 40 mpg at the 5 spot. Unlike others I don't see Whaley playing much 4.

At the 3 and 4 there is now Adams (who can also at some 2G), Martin and Jackson and at the 4 there is Polley and Akok.

Next week seems like first semester finals for the players- three games against different opponents. Time to see who has a versatile game and who is a match up type player.

Excellent points.. Chin.. There would appear to be some obvious candidates for the "discussion"..There is another way for a coach to communicate this to his players.. A little less subtle.. And that's to recruit over them (their position).. Dan Hurley is already doing this.. The candidates for the "discussion" also seem to be the players who are being recruited over.. Actions speak louder than words.. Players need to have a sense of urgency for PT..

 

[Chin Diesel]

Excellent points.. Chin.. There would appear to be some obvious candidates for the "discussion"..There is another way for a coach to communicate this to his players.. A little less subtle.. And that's to recruit over them (their position).. Dan Hurley is already doing this.. The candidates for the "discussion" also seem to be the players who are being recruited over.. Actions speak louder than words.. Players need to have a sense of urgency for PT..

The recruit over method has been done to the KO players. He is now in the position of telling players he recruited they aren't going to be rotational players going forward.
The poor comparison I would make is recruiting two QB's and telling one of them they are the back up. Eventually a football coach needs to name a starter for reps, consistency and leadership. The leadership is for the players on the field and to show the players the coach can make the tough call for the betterment of the team as a whole.
In basketball, it's about getting a starting five unit to gel and learn each other's tendencies and strengths/weaknesses within that group. This is the Cole/Gaff decision.
For the players relegated to the bench it's learning how to be an effective sub vice going in and playing like you are trying to prove you should start. This last point is what many posters are saying Adams looks like he is doing.

 

[HuskylnSC]

14 days off with no practice. A new coach who now has the players capable of executing a system that is still being integrated. 4 new players in the top 9 rotation. A brand new assistant coach integrating into the system. Covid restrictions. And some of the fans expect the team playing at midseason form. Complaining that the alpha player isn't demonstrative enough? I'm expecting a bumpy start. But I am expecting great things. So far Dan Hurley has been right on point. He's taking the heat by saying he has a lot of work to do. Expressing confidence in the players that they will get it together. They just have to grow as players and grow together as a team.

 

[Umami Zen]

The recruit over method has been done to the KO players. He is now in the position of telling players he recruited they aren't going to be rotational players going forward.
The poor comparison I would make is recruiting two QB's and telling one of them they are the back up. Eventually a football coach needs to name a starter for reps, consistency and leadership. The leadership is for the players on the field and to show the players the coach can make the tough call for the betterment of the team as a whole.
In basketball, it's about getting a starting five unit to gel and learn each other's tendencies and strengths/weaknesses within that group. This is the Cole/Gaff decision.
For the players relegated to the bench it's learning how to be an effective sub vice going in and playing like you are trying to prove you should start. This last point is what many posters are saying Adams looks like he is doing.

All part of the natural evolution of a program on the rise.. After a few down years.. With the perpetual infusion of better talent over time.. Dan Hurley/staff will need to keep the bench players engaged and committed.. Part of the process..Some bench players buy in..Some don't..

 

[HuskylnSC]

All part of the natural evolution of a program on the rise.. After a few down years.. With the perpetual infusion of better talent over time.. Dan Hurley/staff will need to keep the bench players engaged and committed.. Part of the process..Some bench players buy in..Some don't..

I like Geno's attitude towards the bench; If you're not engaged on the bench and if you're not happy for your teammates, you don't play because it is all about the process. Notice his girls at a timeout, they run onto the floor to high five the girls playing.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Hurley is going to have to do something this season, and hopefully soon, that he hasn't had to do yet while at UConn.

He is going to have to tell players he recruited, and at the time of recruitment, players Hurley believed could be key players, that they are going to the bench. He has already done it with with Josh, but Josh wasn't his recruit.

I don't think mid-January Gaff, Cole and Bouk are all starting. And I'm highly confident Bouk is going to start. That leaves either putting Gaff or Cole on bench at the start of the game. And that's a tough conversation for a coach to have with one of his recruits. Even harder when each player has pros and cons and their biggest weakness (perimeter defense) is the same for both. Team needs a floor general and so far it's been awkward with Gaff and Cole on court together.

Same thing is going to happen with Martin now eligible and Akok soon returning. Minutes aren't there for everyone. Through two games looks like Whaley is good for 25 MPG and Sanogo has shown good offense and is going to get 15 mpg. That is 40 mpg at the 5 spot. Unlike others I don't see Whaley playing much 4.

At the 3 and 4 there is now Adams (who can also at some 2G), Martin and Jackson and at the 4 there is Polley and Akok.

Next week seems like first semester finals for the players- three games against different opponents. Time to see who has a versatile game and who is a match up type player.

He may also need to realize that he doesn’t have the 2018 Villanova roster. This team isn’t going to win playing that way.

My main criticism of Hurley so far is that he seems to be less willing to adapt to the team he has than is ideal. He may never have the idea roster for his system, so he better start adapting it to the guys he has. I’m really curious to see what happens when Akok comes back. We should probably start Whaley, Akok and Martin up front. But if you waste that length standing on the 3 point line, that lineup will stink. Damned few teams can handle that team in the inside though, and interior D would be stellar.

The simple truth is that our guards are going to get beat on D, so rim protection has to be a defensive priority. What the Celtics called the “hey Bill” defense. I really want to see us use length and athleticism to dominate the defensive boards, look for outlet passes and run at every opportunity. That’s the identity I think this team needs.

 

[cohenzone]

I loved the floor stomp and then the dressing down while the crowd was quiet. Once you heard the stomp, you knew what was coming. I remember him doing that with Hilton Armstrong a few times. Also, the timeout immediately after a lazy play. Loved it

Yeah, but he did get carried away. I was at a Civic Center game where he drop kicked the scorers table. There happened to be a guy sitting on the other side of the table. I would not have been too happy with JC if I were in that chair. Nor would any of us.

 

[mauconnfan]

Right now he was hoping the 2 Point guard line up would work like JCs teams of the past. I’m guessing by now 2 games in against less than stellar offensive teams he now realizes this won’t work on either end of the floor. At least not very often.

He’s on the Brendan Adams train for first guy off the bench which is ok when he’s good. He’s solid when he’s making shots, not forcing things. He doesn’t realize he’s not great offensively and needs to just come in play hard D and hit the boards, take open shots. I’m sorry but I had a huge issue with seeing him reporting to the table to come in so often the other night especially on the 2nd half. What was Danny thinking he was dreadful? He has so many other options in creating line ups this was very strange.

Sanogo needs to play more than 11 minutes and Jackson 5 not sure why those numbers were even real. I get Jackson did get in foul trouble but please 5? Sanogo I don’t need to explain, he’s not even an Enoch on D he moves his feet well works hard on that end. Get him in throw him the rock let’s see more right an left hand jump hooks for chrissakes.

Bouk needs to have a little more fun I agree with above. He’s very very serious which is more than likely his attempt at leadership but I’m not sure that’s him. He’s a better defender than his first 2 games so that needs to get that back on track, use his length annoying ofensive players. Offensively he will be fine just needs to let things come to him and take advantage of the defense when allowed space. Not to worried about him but really good teams will be taking him out of his game as much as possible and when that is happening we can’t afford to have 2 PGs on the court who aren’t really dynamic that’s for sure. We need Martin, Polley, Jackson out there or a line up that allows us to throw it on to Sanogo and make them react.

Akok returning? Yeah won’t be easy as he adds to the defensive end of things in a big way and if he added a more consistent jumper or mid range game things will get tough on the minutes for players.

Not easy for Dan Hurley and because he has so many impact potential players that 2 PG line up needs to be the first move he makes, end it. I’m not sure who gets more or who starts but it needs to end. Gaff with 1 TO with edge but he’s been standing still on D. Cole can shoot but has thrown a few wth passes and his D is limited. Adams is either good or bad and well, he cant play the point anyway. Remember when we went through those games last year mid season where we couldn’t make a play, threw the ball away etc the one stable and solid thing we had was defense we were always in those games. I’m nervous with our inability to guard on top, wondering if more zone is in our future.

Anyway so many concerns but so many positive ways for all of this to go still the next 3 games will be interesting and informative for all of us as well as Danny. Can’t wait, as long as it’s not the team that played the last 25 minutes the other night.

 

[Kitaman]

Hurley is going to have to do something this season, and hopefully soon, that he hasn't had to do yet while at UConn.

He is going to have to tell players he recruited, and at the time of recruitment, players Hurley believed could be key players, that they are going to the bench. He has already done it with with Josh, but Josh wasn't his recruit.

I don't think mid-January Gaff, Cole and Bouk are all starting. And I'm highly confident Bouk is going to start. That leaves either putting Gaff or Cole on bench at the start of the game. And that's a tough conversation for a coach to have with one of his recruits. Even harder when each player has pros and cons and their biggest weakness (perimeter defense) is the same for both. Team needs a floor general and so far it's been awkward with Gaff and Cole on court together.

Same thing is going to happen with Martin now eligible and Akok soon returning. Minutes aren't there for everyone. Through two games looks like Whaley is good for 25 MPG and Sanogo has shown good offense and is going to get 15 mpg. That is 40 mpg at the 5 spot. Unlike others I don't see Whaley playing much 4.

At the 3 and 4 there is now Adams (who can also at some 2G), Martin and Jackson and at the 4 there is Polley and Akok.

Next week seems like first semester finals for the players- three games against different opponents. Time to see who has a versatile game and who is a match up type player.

May be too early to talk about this, but Hurley's biggest challenge (to me) is to keep the bigs happy. If he continues to play only one big at a time, then I think he will hurt his future recruiting of bigs. Other coaches will use that against him. I'm expect it will change when Akok returns, but I do wish he would experiment more with 2 bigs on the floor. Lets see when Akok returns if Hurley stays committed to small ball.

Just saying if I were a big man (or the parent) and observed Hurley's style/tendencies I would think long and hard before committing to UConn if small ball becomes our identity. Not saying Hurley won't be successful, just making the observation of its future big man recruiting impact or our attraction to them.

Anyway our roster seems well suited for conventional lineup (PG/SG/SF/PF/C).

 

[RayRay]

Speaking of these early season challenges, we were suppose to know yesterday if we were in fact going to Mohegan, but there’s been no announcement. Is that a good or a bad thing? I get practice is important but there’s nothing like actual games to see how players react and to play with these rotations so you can have your solid 7-8-9 for big east play.

 

[Waquoit]

.... and nicknamed himself “Clamps,” at least partly sarcastically.

Anyone else remember that?

During a particularly good late defensive stop at the Trop, I started yelling "Clamps!" I was heartened by the fact that many around be laughed in recognition.

 

[HuskylnSC]

What is that? Please say he's not pressing already.

I think the only ones pressing are some of the Boneyard brethren and sistren. Lets face it not too many of us really know what Hurley is doing. What he is trying to develop as a team and what skills he is developing in his players. He really hasn't had the opportunity to do the work he would have in a normal season and then there is the regression of a 14 day layoff. Now he has to play games instead of developing his team. We don't know what's going on and we have had 80 minutes of game time to make these astute detailed analysis based on assumptions and presumptions. How many times down court has AJ got into good defensive posture? Have they developed the switch on weak side screens? Whose been going under ball screens and not fighting through? What's KFree telling Adama is the first thing he needs to develop? How much is Brendan's foot holding him back. Is he having issues with quick cuts or getting up? Heck If you've watched closely you will have seen players directing players about where they need to be on offense. Give these guys some time to develop.

 

[JB75]

It’s just bouks demeanor , hes laid-back and chill - what do you want him to do? jump around and talk trash every time he makes a layup kind of like how Ezekiel Elliott does for Dallas when he gets a 5 yard gain through wide-open hole? Nothing more annoying. There’s no Khaled or rips on this squad ——yet. God, I still miss those guys. Cole reminds me of khaled a bit. Khaled had a one of his own personality and was more fearless but see some similarities

 

[HuskyHawk]

Right now he was hoping the 2 Point guard line up would work like JCs teams of the past. I’m guessing by now 2 games in against less than stellar offensive teams he now realizes this won’t work on either end of the floor. At least not very often.

He’s on the Brendan Adams train for first guy off the bench which is ok when he’s good. He’s solid when he’s making shots, not forcing things. He doesn’t realize he’s not great offensively and needs to just come in play hard D and hit the boards, take open shots. I’m sorry but I had a huge issue with seeing him reporting to the table to come in so often the other night especially on the 2nd half. What was Danny thinking he was dreadful? He has so many other options in creating line ups this was very strange.

Sanogo needs to play more than 11 minutes and Jackson 5 not sure why those numbers were even real. I get Jackson did get in foul trouble but please 5? Sanogo I don’t need to explain, he’s not even an Enoch on D he moves his feet well works hard on that end. Get him in throw him the rock let’s see more right an left hand jump hooks for chrissakes.

Bouk needs to have a little more fun I agree with above. He’s very very serious which is more than likely his attempt at leadership but I’m not sure that’s him. He’s a better defender than his first 2 games so that needs to get that back on track, use his length annoying ofensive players. Offensively he will be fine just needs to let things come to him and take advantage of the defense when allowed space. Not to worried about him but really good teams will be taking him out of his game as much as possible and when that is happening we can’t afford to have 2 PGs on the court who aren’t really dynamic that’s for sure. We need Martin, Polley, Jackson out there or a line up that allows us to throw it on to Sanogo and make them react.

Akok returning? Yeah won’t be easy as he adds to the defensive end of things in a big way and if he added a more consistent jumper or mid range game things will get tough on the minutes for players.

Not easy for Dan Hurley and because he has so many impact potential players that 2 PG line up needs to be the first move he makes, end it. I’m not sure who gets more or who starts but it needs to end. Gaff with 1 TO with edge but he’s been standing still on D. Cole can shoot but has thrown a few wth passes and his D is limited. Adams is either good or bad and well, he cant play the point anyway. Remember when we went through those games last year mid season where we couldn’t make a play, threw the ball away etc the one stable and solid thing we had was defense we were always in those games. I’m nervous with our inability to guard on top, wondering if more zone is in our future.

Anyway so many concerns but so many positive ways for all of this to go still the next 3 games will be interesting and informative for all of us as well as Danny. Can’t wait, as long as it’s not the team that played the last 25 minutes the other night.

Agreed on all counts. Two PG is killing us. Neither is good off the ball and both are weak points on defense. Stop. Please.

Sanogo needs at least 15. I think we need to figure out who we pair with him. If he's mistake prone on D, maybe Martin covers that up? I think Martin should be starting, but it may be that we need him with Sanogo more than Whaley.

As for Jackson, don't worry. I think that was just a lesson/message game. It's the last bunny game we have and so his only chance to sit Andre, make him watch and understand how he needs to play. He was incredibly disruptive on D against CCSU and we need that. Can't have 3 fouls in 5 minutes.

Adams is a useful player despite the whining about the last game. Our best defensive guard by a lot, Hurley just needs to have a quick hook when he gets out of control. I would be very happy with the Adams we saw vs CCSU.

Way more minutes: Martin
More minutes: Jackson, Sanogo
Fewer minutes: Polley, Adams
Slightly fewer minutes: Cole, Gaff

 

[Excalibur]

If you play two bigs on the floor at the same time, one of them needs to be able to play out of the high post. Otherwise all you are doing is clogging the lane, preventing your own guards from penetrating, and resticting the ability of either big to impact the game offensively from the low post. Neither Whaley nor Sanogo has shown that ability. Martin can, but he is a small 4.

Assuming he comes back healthy and ready to handle 20 minutes/game, adding Akok solves a lot of this. But a lineup of Cole/Gaffney, Bouknight, Martin, Akok and Whaley/Sanogo is going to struggle to score.

 

[HuskyHawk]

If you play two bigs on the floor at the same time, one of them needs to be able to play out of the high post. Otherwise all you are doing is clogging the lane, preventing your own guards from penetrating, and resticting the ability of either big to impact the game offensively from the low post. Neither Whaley nor Sanogo has shown that ability. Martin can, but he is a small 4.

Assuming he comes back healthy and ready to handle 20 minutes/game, adding Akok solves a lot of this. But a lineup of Cole/Gaffney, Bouknight, Martin, Akok and Whaley/Sanogo is going to struggle to score.

I can't argue with this really based on how we play. But I would say, perhaps, that we shouldn't be focusing our offense on guards scoring in the paint, instead of actually having bigs score in the paint. Just a thought. Josh was dominant at times when we fed him in the paint in his sophomore year. Akok, I thought, spent way too much time outside, and not enough time making himself available for passes inside.

I'm a big believer that passing the ball down low is superior to dribble drive penetration overall. You need both, but our current offense eliminates almost all passing to the interior altogether. That's a mistake. A big who can catch lobs, and either make a strong move or pass back out for open looks, is critical. It's probably our best way to get Polley involved. Definitely agree we need Akok, Martin type players catching the ball in the high post, where they are a threat, rather than Sanogo/Whaley, who need to stay on the blocks. Martin is a "bigger" 4 (height and strength combined) than Polley, who is a tall wing and a terrible 4.

 

[Excalibur]

I can't argue with this really based on how we play. But I would say, perhaps, that we shouldn't be focusing our offense on guards scoring in the paint, instead of actually having bigs score in the paint. Just a thought. Josh was dominant at times when we fed him in the paint in his sophomore year. Akok, I thought, spent way too much time outside, and not enough time making himself available for passes inside.

I'm a big believer that passing the ball down low is superior to dribble drive penetration overall. You need both, but our current offense eliminates almost all passing to the interior altogether. That's a mistake. A big who can catch lobs, and either make a strong move or pass back out for open looks, is critical. It's probably our best way to get Polley involved. Definitely agree we need Akok, Martin type players catching the ball in the high post, where they are a threat, rather than Sanogo/Whaley, who need to stay on the blocks. Martin is a "bigger" 4 (height and strength combined) than Polley, who is a tall wing and a terrible 4.

My belief is that there is nothing more disruptive to a defense than dribble penetration, whether against a zone or man defense. You have to make defenders react to the ball. That doesn't mean you need to get to the rim, but most college defenders struggle with helping on penetration and that makes driving and passing underneath very effective (and it's something that Hurley's URI teams excelled at -- using dribble penetration to draw defenders and then passing to baseline cutters for layups). Add to that the fact that bigs who can pass with their back to the basket are like unicorns in the college game.

Polley and/or Martin should be fill that high post slot for now, but Polley has shown that he's not really healthy yet.

 

[HuskyHawk]

My belief is that there is nothing more disruptive to a defense than dribble penetration, whether against a zone or man defense. You have to make defenders react to the ball. That doesn't mean you need to get to the rim, but most college defenders struggle with helping on penetration and that makes driving and passing underneath very effective (and it's something that Hurley's URI teams excelled at -- using dribble penetration to draw defenders and then passing to baseline cutters for layups). Add to that the fact that bigs who can pass with their back to the basket are like unicorns in the college game.

Polley and/or Martin should be fill that high post slot for now, but Polley has shown that he's not really healthy yet.

I think that's the old school isolation view. It's how we won in 2011 and 2014, but it's not the way Hurley is supposedly trying to play now. Now the idea is to dribble less and move the ball in the air all over the court. That's the trend, motion of both people and the ball, without the bounce.

In that kind of offense, 4 out shouldn't be based just on lanes for dribble penetration, but also for cutters, and constant motion through the lane. In short the same 4 shouldn't be "out" all the time. It really should look like 4 who go out, but 2-3 of them are also moving in and through the post area and back out.

Sadly, our offense looks like some kind of Frankenstein's monster with ISO concepts being blended with ball movement concepts.

 

[Excalibur]

I think that's the old school isolation view. It's how we won in 2011 and 2014, but it's not the way Hurley is supposedly trying to play now. Now the idea is to dribble less and move the ball in the air all over the court. That's the trend, motion of both people and the ball, without the bounce.

In that kind of offense, 4 out shouldn't be based just on lanes for dribble penetration, but also for cutters, and constant motion through the lane. In short the same 4 shouldn't be "out" all the time. It really should look like 4 who go out, but 2-3 of them are also moving in and through the post area and back out.

Sadly, our offense looks like some kind of Frankenstein's monster with ISO concepts being blended with ball movement concepts.

When I speak of dribble penetration, I'm not talking of iso where someone takes 10 seconds to break their man down. Nobody wants a black hole. Maybe the whole thing starts with a ball screen, but after that it's players making decisive moves off the catch. There is no modern offense where dribble penetration is not a major component.

 

[olehead]

I think the only ones pressing are some of the Boneyard brethren and sistren. Lets face it not too many of us really know what Hurley is doing. What he is trying to develop as a team and what skills he is developing in his players. He really hasn't had the opportunity to do the work he would have in a normal season and then there is the regression of a 14 day layoff. Now he has to play games instead of developing his team. We don't know what's going on and we have had 80 minutes of game time to make these astute detailed analysis based on assumptions and presumptions. How many times down court has AJ got into good defensive posture? Have they developed the switch on weak side screens? Whose been going under ball screens and not fighting through? What's KFree telling Adama is the first thing he needs to develop? How much is Brendan's foot holding him back. Is he having issues with quick cuts or getting up? Heck If you've watched closely you will have seen players directing players about where they need to be on offense. Give these guys some time to develop.

My post was in response to this from @WeAreUCONN. He’s always talking to himself and looking down at the court. He needs to just play hard and have fun.

When you are talking to yourself, looking down, shaking your head, these are typically indicators of a player pressing and bad body language. Positive body language from Bouk is important. Obviously he is capable. As captain though, he has to understand his role as a leader. So, the bad body language as captain is a no go. Talent is great. This is brand new for Bouk, but we need talent and leadership. As basketball fans we can look to the bubble and the Clips to see what talent without leadership can get you.

 

[Umami Zen]

Bouk is evolving right in front of our eyes..He's a quiet and introverted young man whose God-given athletic talents require him to come out of his shell and be an extroverted and vocal leader(for this UConn team)...He'll do it his way.. No one knows this better than Dan Hurley and his staff.. Getting out of your comfort zone takes time.. Part of the maturation process..

 

[UChusky916]

they called him “Effortless James” for a reason in high school, he is just not a very demonstrative guy on the court. Just his personality. Not everyone is gonna dance and go nuts when they make a play.

Agreed. And even if he did go nuts and dance, posters here would find a way criticize him for that too.