Has Baylor's recruiting fallen off?

[EricSD]

i know they have Griner, Destiny Williams, Chandler, Hayden, Madden, Pope, Simms and Washington - all of who are sophomores or juniors, but they only got 1 very lightly regarded recruit as a freshman (understandable given the depth)...

But for 2012 so far, they have 3 kids, and none are in the top 40. Chardonae Fuqua (great name), is about 45, Higgens 56, and Brown is outside the top 100. i've not heard them linked to any of the top 20 recruits left in 2012... but ESPN does list #16 Alexis Prince as considering Baylor, among 5 or so other schools...

it would seem they will need to load up on 2013 kids who would be freshmen after Griner et al. graduate, but the only top 30 kid from Texas has already verbaled to Texas. i did read on their forum (not on scout either - something called "baylorbears.com") that they are also looking at Kuanishia Baker, #96, but that's all i could see.

they obviously can get kids outside of Texas, but i'd be a tad concerned with 4 recruits in the past 2 years, none in the top 40... and possibly needing to rely on kids making an impact as freshmen when the 2013 kids arrive. obviously they will still have Simms, Washington, and Robertson to go along with current freshman Agbuke, but add Fuqua, Higgens, and Brown and it's not exactly an intimidating core group...

 

[UConnCat]

Baylor already has a commitment from a 2014 point guard from Texas (Caldwell). She is ranked #8 by Hoopgurlz.

 

[wire chief]

i know they have Griner, Destiny Williams, Chandler, Hayden, Madden, Pope, Simms and Washington - all of who are sophomores or juniors, but they only got 1 very lightly regarded recruit as a freshman (understandable given the depth)...

But for 2012 so far, they have 3 kids, and none are in the top 40. Chardonae Fuqua (great name), is about 45, Higgens 56, and Brown is outside the top 100. i've not heard them linked to any of the top 20 recruits left in 2012... but ESPN does list #16 Alexis Prince as considering Baylor, among 5 or so other schools...

it would seem they will need to load up on 2013 kids who would be freshmen after Griner et al. graduate, but the only top 30 kid from Texas has already verbaled to Texas. i did read on their forum (not on scout either - something called "baylorbears.com") that they are also looking at Kuanishia Baker, #96, but that's all i could see.

they obviously can get kids outside of Texas, but i'd be a tad concerned with 4 recruits in the past 2 years, none in the top 40... and possibly needing to rely on kids making an impact as freshmen when the 2013 kids arrive. obviously they will still have Simms, Washington, and Robertson to go along with current freshman Agbuke, but add Fuqua, Higgens, and Brown and it's not exactly an intimidating core group...

FYI, eric, the first time a Fuqua emerges into prominance is as lead singer of the esteemed doo wop group, The Moonglows. Sadly, he had a much more pedestrian first name compared to Chardonae--Harvey.

 

[EricSD]

FYI, eric, the first time a Fuqua emerges into prominance is as lead singer of the esteemed doo wop group, The Moonglows. Sadly, he had a much more pedestrian first name compared to Chardonae--Harvey.

HA! i did not know that.

 

[Drumguy]

Baylor already has a commitment from a 2014 point guard from Texas (Caldwell). She is ranked #8 by Hoopgurlz.

Good luck to them, knowing what early verbal commitments are worth.

 

[VAUConnFan]

FYI, eric, the first time a Fuqua emerges into prominance is as lead singer of the esteemed doo wop group, The Moonglows. Sadly, he had a much more pedestrian first name compared to Chardonae--Harvey.

IIRC, Harvey Fuqua was married to one of Berry Gordy's sisters.

There was a football player named "Frenchy" Fuqua; played for either the Steelers or the Giants, IIRC.

 

[Icebear]

IIRC, Harvey Fuqua was married to one of Berry Gordy's sisters.

There was a football player named "Frenchy" Fuqua; played for either the Steelers or the Giants, IIRC.

That would be running back John "Frenchy" Fuqua who did play with the Steelers. He was drafted by the Giants in 1969 as a graduate of Morgan State. He played for the Steelers throughout the early 70s in the same backfield with Franco Harris. He was one flashy dude.

 

[EricSD]

Good luck to them, knowing what early verbal commitments are worth.

well it's true u never know how a kid that far out will develop (see Avant who was #1 or so when she was in 8th grade), but she seems to be a good player. i still go back to their recruiting for 2011 and 2012. one kid outside the top 100 for 2011 - understandable given the anaconda class including Griner are juniors this year. but next year they will be seniors and so far they have no one (yet) coming in who's inside the top 40.

so when 2013 comes in, Sims will be a senior and a team comprised of Simms, Mackenzie Robertson, Shanay Washington, Agbuke, Fuqua, Higgens and Brown has exactly 1 player over a 3 year period in the top 40 (Washington is a RS sophomore in Simms class and was #64 in her class. seems like they really may be relying on 2013 freshmen to make an impact and could see a starting lineup of Simms, Robertson, Washington, Fuqua, and Higgens.

i don't doubt they will be fine, and getting a top 10 guard from 2014 is great. but when you consider they currently have Pope, Chandler, Griner and Simms - all top 15 or so kids, it's odd that in 2 years they may well only have 1 top 40 kid.

 

[Drumguy]

well it's true u never know how a kid that far out will develop (see Avant who was #1 or so when she was in 8th grade), but she seems to be a good player. i still go back to their recruiting for 2011 and 2012. one kid outside the top 100 for 2011 - understandable given the anaconda class including Griner are juniors this year. but next year they will be seniors and so far they have no one (yet) coming in who's inside the top 40.

so when 2013 comes in, Sims will be a senior and a team comprised of Simms, Mackenzie Robertson, Shanay Washington, Agbuke, Fuqua, Higgens and Brown has exactly 1 player over a 3 year period in the top 40 (Washington is a RS sophomore in Simms class and was #64 in her class. seems like they really may be relying on 2013 freshmen to make an impact and could see a starting lineup of Simms, Robertson, Washington, Fuqua, and Higgens.

i don't doubt they will be fine, and getting a top 10 guard from 2014 is great. but when you consider they currently have Pope, Chandler, Griner and Simms - all top 15 or so kids, it's odd that in 2 years they may well only have 1 top 40 kid.

It shows you how difficult it is to maintain a program. Unfortunately Baylor really doesn't have a whole lot going for it.... Storrs makes Waco look like Shangra La!

 

[mets1090]

A friend of mine that now goes to UConn transferred here from Baylor. He said the schools are similar in that they are difficult to recruit for based on their respective campuses. He did say that there were a lot more things that you could walk to off campus at Baylor though.

 

[DaddyChoc]

if they get a title (or 2) that will all change

 

[bertieboy]

Frenchy Fuqua was involved with the 'immaculate reception' in a super bowl game of Pittsburgh versus Oakland. That's when Franco Harris grabbed the deflected ball almost off his shoe tops and ran it in for the winning score on the last play of the game.

 

[CamrnCrz1974]

Sorry, but "Fuqua" means this...

 

[Icebear]

Actually, it means "guardian folk."

 

[EricSD]

Sorry, but "Fuqua" means this...

i thought Fuqua was the ruler of Duloc in the Shrek movies...

 

[Wonkster]

I thought Fuqua was the ruler of Duloc in the Shrek movies...

At the risk of inviting OSB's wrath, you're thinking of 'Farquaad.' Farquaad was also an habitué of the outer reaches of the Baylor campus.

 

[alexrgct]

A friend of mine that now goes to UConn transferred here from Baylor. He said the schools are similar in that they are difficult to recruit for based on their respective campuses. He did say that there were a lot more things that you could walk to off campus at Baylor though.

This is true. There is absolutely nothing in Storrs. There are things in Waco. Boring things, but things.

Baylor's bread and butter is going to be recruiting Texas, and A&M's ascent has hurt them in that regard. UConn coming in and having a presence in Texas is also a huge problem for them. If you're relying on Texas talent (which was already being split multiple ways) and UConn comes in and scoops up a potential difference maker like Moriah Jefferson, what's your Plan B?

No one can offer what UConn can in women's ball. Yes, Storrs is a cow town in the middle of nowhere, but it's the only place where all your games will be televised, where you have the most visible face in WBB for a head coach, etc. If you're not UConn or Tennessee, you're selling a vision of a perennial power you're hoping you can build. Those are the only two programs who have actually done it.

A national title with Griner may help, but the 2005 title didn't result in consistent conference title and NC contention-type success for them.

Suffice it to say a lot of pressure is on Baylor to win it all this year. If they don't, the field will be tougher in 2013.

 

[VAUConnFan]

What is this, Coach Mulkey's 12th season? Baylor is doing fine. They will be OK down the line.

 

[RoyDodger]

This is true. There is absolutely nothing in Storrs. There are things in Waco. Boring things, but things.

Baylor's bread and butter is going to be recruiting Texas, and A&M's ascent has hurt them in that regard. UConn coming in and having a presence in Texas is also a huge problem for them. If you're relying on Texas talent (which was already being split multiple ways) and UConn comes in and scoops up a potential difference maker like Moriah Jefferson, what's your Plan B?

No one can offer what UConn can in women's ball. Yes, Storrs is a cow town in the middle of nowhere, but it's the only place where all your games will be televised, where you have the most visible face in WBB for a head coach, etc. If you're not UConn or Tennessee, you're selling a vision of a perennial power you're hoping you can build. Those are the only two programs who have actually done it.

A national title with Griner may help, but the 2005 title didn't result in consistent conference title and NC contention-type success for them.

Suffice it to say a lot of pressure is on Baylor to win it all this year. If they don't, the field will be tougher in 2013.

I spent a week in Waco a few years back and it's not exactly a hot spot of cultural activity. Have never been in Storrs, but I do know one thing. It's a lot easier to get to Boston or New York from Storrs than it is from Waco.

 

[semper]

Best recruitment tactic: We have Geno and they don't. And CD. I know it's OK not Baylor...but I often wonder what would have happened to the Paris twins if they had come to UCONN. They almost did, remember. The ways in which players transform for the better here, under the leadership of amazing coaches and their staff is superior to any other place.

 

[connboy77]

Once Griner graduates Baylor will be in a freefall! They need to find themselves a new power conference as all the top teams are leaving or about to leave.

 

[alexrgct]

I spent a week in Waco a few years back and it's not exactly a hot spot of cultural activity. Have never been in Storrs, but I do know one thing. It's a lot easier to get to Boston or New York from Storrs than it is from Waco.

There is that to be said for Storrs (I live 25 minutes from UConn's campus myself, and go to Boston frequently), though campus life and immediate community are important. I'm not sure how much travelling to NYC or Boston a student-athlete would be able/would want to do given the other demands on their time. But yes, Waco is not the most exciting place to spend four years.

 

[VAUConnFan]

Best recruitment tactic: We have Geno and they don't. And CD. I know it's OK not Baylor...but I often wonder what would have happened to the Paris twins if they had come to UCONN. They almost did, remember. The ways in which players transform for the better here, under the leadership of amazing coaches and their staff is superior to any other place.

I thought we liked Sherri Coale here at the Boneyard.

One would suppose that Courtney Paris' college achievements did not impress you. I, for one, am quite impressed:
1. Four time All American
2. NCAA season and career record for rebounds
3. Season and career record for double doubles
4. NCAA record holder for consecutive double doubles in a season and in a career
5. Prior record holder for career games scoring double figures(Maya Moore broke the record in the first duke game last season)
6. Averaged 14.8 rebounds over her 4 year career at Oklahoma
7. 13th quickest to reach 1,000 points

If the Paris twins had come to UConn? They and UConn both made out quite well.

 

[Icebear]

Best recruitment slogan, "Our Associate coach is better other head coaches so what do you think our head coach is like."

 

[Creaky]

Frenchy? Come on! We of all people should know that the first prominent Fuqua was Ivan, who won a gold medal running the 4x400 for the US in the 1932 LA Olympics and was the national 440 champ in '33 and '34. He coached track at Connecticut State College (which, of course, became UConn) for a few years. After the war, he became the track and cross-country coach at Brown until the early '70s. He (lightly) recruited me in what was, back in the '60s, the comically casual Ivy style (which happened also to be precisely appropriate to my talents), and I ran against his teams.

 

[True Colors]

Baylor fan here......

Over the years we have gotten some awesome individual recruits. We have even had some awesome classes. I think that we had the #1 ranked class in the nation a couple of times(or close to it).

However, even despite our success on the court, our recruiting classes have not been ranked super high every year. From that standpoint we have been somewhat inconsistent.

There are probably a couple of main reasons for this.

First and foremost, the demands that are put on our players by our head coach are extremely high. Our fans all love Coach Mulkey, and she is amazing. But there are some recruits out there who are afraid of the tremendous amount of work that she requires. Mulkey demands extreme effort on the court and she also requires her players to go to class and to stay out of trouble off the court. When you add everything up it is a lot of commitment. Mulkey is a super tough woman. Some people can handle that, some cannot.

Also, it can sometimes be tough to recruit certain positions when you already have a lot of talent on your roster to begin with. In particular, I am thinking of point guard and post. We have Odyssey Sims and Brittney Griner. Both of them had sensational freshman seasons(both were national frosh of the year) and both are going to be around for a while. Prospective recruits do look at depth charts.

Mulkey does like to recruit the top ranked recruits, and we were in on several of them this year, but she is also fine taking players who do not have all the accolades and building them up in her system. Back when we won the national championship a few years ago, most of the players on that team were not highly regarded. In fact, almost none of them were the big name, 5 star types. But we still won the title game in blowout fashion.

Hopefully we can win another national championship this year and we can reinforce our ability to recruit more of the really highly ranked prospects.

TC

 

[EricSD]

thanks for the heads up from a true Baylor fan. do you know what kids you are still recruiting from 2012? or what kids in 2013 are being focused on?

 

[Outside Shot]

It's still astounding to me that UConn can go into Texas and pluck one of the very best players out of there. There are a lot of good choices in Texas and between here and there.

One problem will be that Griner will be a very tough act to follow when it comes to recruiting. Where do you find another one? Baylor got some recruiting bump when they hired a coach from a prominent Texas AAU program, which I heard didn't make Pat too happy. I think that was around the same time that Mulkey's daughter was playing on the AAU team with Griner and/or Sims (I can't exactly remember). So Baylor had a few connections work in their favor. Clearly they're riding high right now and maybe they can capitalize on the momentum.

 

[Icebear]

It will only be worse when Griner returns to Texas and tells everyone how great it was to play for Geno. Hee, hee, hee.

 

[RoyDodger]

It's still astounding to me that UConn can go into Texas and pluck one of the very best players out of there. There are a lot of good choices in Texas and between here and there.

One problem will be that Griner will be a very tough act to follow when it comes to recruiting. Where do you find another one? Baylor got some recruiting bump when they hired a coach from a prominent Texas AAU program, which I heard didn't make Pat too happy. I think that was around the same time that Mulkey's daughter was playing on the AAU team with Griner and/or Sims (I can't exactly remember). So Baylor had a few connections work in their favor. Clearly they're riding high right now and maybe they can capitalize on the momentum.

Why do you assume that a player is automatically likely to stay in their home state? Some kids want to explore other places and some are attracted to a particular college for a particular reason. From what I've heard, Storrs isn't the most exciting place in the world, but for a female basketball player, it's Times Square.

 

[EricSD]

Why do you assume that a player is automatically likely to stay in their home state? Some kids want to explore other places and some are attracted to a particular college for a particular reason. From what I've heard, Storrs isn't the most exciting place in the world, but for a female basketball player, it's Times Square.

very true. some kids have wanderlust at an early age and like to travel far away for college. others know that they will have plenty of time to travel after they graduate, and prefer to stay semi close to home for whatever reason, partly to be close to family and partly so family can come see them easily.

one of the biggest ways a coach can show interest is by physically showing up at the recruits' high school games, whether it's the HC or an assistant. recruiting in state kids gives the local school a big advantage because even during "quiet periods" where coaches can't actually call or contact, a coach could still go to "watch" a game. you know the kid is well aware of who is in the stands.

so for a lot of reasons, good in state programs have an innate advantage over schools who recruit kids from far away. Xy McDaniel, for example, is receiving pressure of varying sorts to stay close to home and attend South Carolina. at least that's what we read. and schools in the states for top kids really want to keep them close to home for lots of reasons.

so it's not that people are "assuming" these kids are more likely to stay in their home states, but there is often family and external pressure not to mention easy access from the coaches of local program recruiting them.

UCONN has not traditionally mined the talent rich pool of players from Texas. we've gone after a few, but Jefferson is the first big time recruit to come to Storrs from the big state. and we hope the conduit continues as Breanna Turner is from Texas as well...

 

[True Colors]

To be honest with you I do not know for sure which recruits Baylor is mainly going after for 2012 or 2013. I know that Alexis Prince is supposed to be here soon but I have not checked lately where we stand with the others.

For those of you saying that we will fall apart after Griner leaves.....that is not going to happen. It is true that Griner will be tough to replace, but as long as Kim Mulkey is here we will never be terrible.

Obviously Moriah Jefferson was a tremendous pickup for you. Our fans thought that we had a good chance with her. She fits the profile of what Baylor likes to recruit. She is a home school kid and she lives very close to our campus(just 75 miles straight up the interstate). She could have stayed near her family and they could have come to see her play literally every single home game. But you cannot blame any kid for choosing such a prestigious program as Uconn. And as someone mentioned, some kids PREFER to get away from home and see new things.

We were really hoping to get Jefferson and Alexis Jones. But unfortunately we did not get either one of them.

TC

 

[EricSD]

well any recruits you can land that tennessee was going after is fine with me!!!

 

[Outside Shot]

Certainly one size doesn't fit all, but I feel pretty sure that most recruits choose a school that allows their family a reasonable chance to travel to see them on a regular basis.
Obviously there are plenty of examples of kids who didn't follow that plan.

 

[RoyDodger]

Certainly one size doesn't fit all, but I feel pretty sure that most recruits choose a school that allows their family a reasonable chance to travel to see them on a regular basis.
Obviously there are plenty of examples of kids who didn't follow that plan.

Seems to me that if college athletes stayed reasonably near home most of the time, UConn wouldn't have much of a team. Think Diana Taurasi and Kaleena Mosqueda-Lewis from California (also Lauren Engeln), Renee Montgomery from West Virginia, Maya Moore from Georgia, Kelly Faris from Indiana, and Tiffany Hayes from Florida, to name just a few. Of course, there's also the local girls, such as Sue Bird, Tina Charles, and Stefanie Dolson from NYC or NY State, and Maria Conlon and Heather Buck from CT. But in the time I've followed the Huskies, most of the players have come quite a distance. And it's because, as Geno has said, they want to come to UConn. I imagine that the reason Moriah Jefferson decided on UConn.

 

[Icebear]

Certainly one size doesn't fit all, but I feel pretty sure that most recruits choose a school that allows their family a reasonable chance to travel to see them on a regular basis.
Obviously there are plenty of examples of kids who didn't follow that plan.

The higher the quality and the higher their aspirations the less likely that is to be the dominant concern.

 

[connboy77]

The recruits that really want to come to UCONN will regardless of where they live. These are the type of recruits that Geno and UCONN want.

 

[easttexastrash]

UConn is an incredible program. I would never be surprised to see any player choose to go there, no matter where they are from. You know there is almost a guarantee of getting to the Final Four and a good chance of winning a national championship.