Game of Thrones - Season 4

[John]

Have you read all of the books yet? I'm afraid that the books themselves become fluffier and fluffier from here on out. Fatso starts to loose control of his series, and indulges in writing about new tangential characters and food. Lots and lots of verbiage about the different types of food the non-essential characters are eating and tasting. Meanwhile, everyone important is wandering or ping-ponging about doing nothing. Sometimes things happen to them, but mostly by accident, kinda like earthquakes or bolts of lightning from the sky.

I just finished Feast for Crows, and I agree. I'm sorely tempted to stop reading the series, but I have so much time invested now that I feel like have to move on to Dance with Dragons. I do love the food descriptions (sarcasm), "roast fowl with a garnish of goat cheese and pine nuts smothered in a sauce of capers and red wine."

and while I'm no prude, he's getting pretty crude in his wordings, describing the finer details of female anatomy in terms of the "c-word"

 

[ZooCougar]

Have you read all of the books yet? I'm afraid that the books themselves become fluffier and fluffier from here on out. Fatso starts to loose control of his series, and indulges in writing about new tangential characters and food. Lots and lots of verbiage about the different types of food the non-essential characters are eating and tasting. Meanwhile, everyone important is wandering or ping-ponging about doing nothing. Sometimes things happen to them, but mostly by accident, kinda like earthquakes or bolts of lightning from the sky.

Only the first. Is he pulling a Robert Jordan?

 

[SubbaBub]

I just finished Feast for Crows, and I agree. I'm sorely tempted to stop reading the series, but I have so much time invested now that I feel like have to move on to Dance with Dragons. I do love the food descriptions (sarcasm), "roast fowl with a garnish of goat cheese and pine nuts smothered in a sauce of capers and red wine."

and while I'm no prude, he's getting pretty crude in his wordings, describing the finer details of female anatomy in terms of the "c-word"

He needed to replace the characters he's killed off. I disagree with the choice to have FFC and DWD cover the same timeline with different groups of characters. Seems like a lazy attempt to fill pages with half stories. Read DWD, the amount of new characters, while annoying does get easier to absorb and DWD goes back to more of the original characters.

Also, if you are watching TV only, Season 4 is pulling content from books 3-5 so if you are watching a season then reading the next book you will find any spoilers coming in Season 5 if you read book 4.

 

[Scalito]

Only the first. Is he pulling a Robert Jordan?

He's trying much harder to pull a Jordan than Jordan ever did. Jordan published his first novel in 1990 and died seven years ago from a freak disease you normally only hear about in a House episode. In that 17-year timespan he published 11 large tomes. Yeah, he lost control, but it wasn't for lack of effort and he didn't die from a slovenly lifestyle. Fatso published his first book in 1991 and is currently writing book number six. There's no promised publishing date, but we know it won't be this year. Meanwhile, he's old, fat and spends his time blogging about chickenwings and teenage actresses.

Jordan spent his last months, after learning about his disease, dictating an outline and writing the last chapters of the series. Fatso can't even be bothered to publish a book every 5 years nowadays.

I just finished Feast for Crows, and I agree. I'm sorely tempted to stop reading the series, but I have so much time invested now that I feel like have to move on to Dance with Dragons.

I have a love hate relationship with the series. Wish I never started it, but can't stop now that I've started. I am constantly trying to warn people off, kinda like Darth Vader on the Dark Side: It's too late for me, son. Save yourself.

Now that you're invested, I can't tell you to stop reading. I think of the last few books as tantamount to Godfather III. A comparatively awful movie, with the director's daughter thrown in to make an awful storyline even worse, but with just enough Michael Corleone to drag me back in every time it's on TV.

 

[ZooCougar]

He's trying much harder than Jordan ever did. Jordan published his first novel in 1990 and died, after publishing 11 large tomes, four years ago from a freak disease you normally only hear about in a House episode. Yeah, he lost control, but it wasn't for lack of effort and he didn't die from a slovenly lifestyle. Fatso published his first book in 1991 and is currently writing book number seven. There's no promised publishing date, but we know it won't be this year. Meanwhile, he's old, fat and spends his time blogging about chickenwings and teenage actresses.

Jordan spent his last months, after learning about his disease, dictating an outline and writing the last paragraphs of the series. Fatso can't even be bothered to publish a book every 5 years nowadays.



I have a love hate relationship with the series. Wish I never started it, but can't stop now that I've started. I am constantly trying to warn people off, kinda like Darth Vader on the Dark Side: It's too late for me, son. You don't know the power of the Dark Side. Save yourself.

Now that you're invested, I can't tell you to stop reading. I think of the last few books as tantamount to Godfather III. A comparatively awful movie, with the director's daughter thrown in to make an awful storyline even worse, but with just enough Michael Corleone to drag me back in every time it's on TV.

You should read The Expanse series. It's written by two GRRM protégés. They publish a book a year and novella in between. It's the best space sci fi/opera done in years. I am purposefully a book behind so that I can read 3 and 4 together.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I rate the books as follows:

1) A Storm of Swords (Book 3)
2) A Dance with Dragons (Book 5)
3) A Clash of Kings (Book 2)
4) A Game of Thrones (Book 1)

gap

5) A Feast for Crows (Book 4)

I really like all the books but AFFC. I think the problems with AFFC are primarily the result of terrible editing. The book is too long for what happens in it, and he should have just stuck to the chronology instead of over-lapping ADWD and AFFC. It is not so much a bad book as I think that AFFC doesn't stand on its own in any way. It is just a lot of chapters mushed together that with better editing would have been about 300 pages less.

ADWD has some of the best scenes in the entire series. It also starts to tie the far flung plotlines together a little.

 

[UConnMike04]

My girlfriends uncle is Frank Doelger, one of the main producers. Haven't met him yet though, lives in France but she already has this whole season on DVD bc he sends anyone in the family the DVDs at the beginning of the season.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Interesting episode. It would appear that the show is starting to give spoilers on the books.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

The last scene was definitely a surprise for me. I would have thought the White Walkers would aim a little higher than recruiting third generation incest babies for their army of demons, but that is just me.

 

[Scalito]

It would appear that the show is starting to give spoilers on the books.

That's preceisely what I was thinking during the last scene.

 

[SubbaBub]

It's unavoidable given the overlap in the final two books, but they appear to be accelerating certain events and inventing a few others.

 

[ZooCougar]

Good episode. Interested to see how Jon's raid is going to turn out.

 

[Penfield]

As a reader of the books, I am thoroughly confused on where they are going with a couple things. Not sure how I feel about it all yet, but I will say that it is nice to have a couple of surprises. Makes things a little more interesting.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

That's preceisely what I was thinking during the last scene.

There is some buzz about this now. Apparently HBO referred to the creature that turned the baby into a White Walker as "the Night King" on a website or something. Martin had never put the Night King in the books, or confirmed that such a creature even exists. I wonder if this is a subtle dig by HBO to encourage Martin to get his ass in gear and finish the next two books or HBO will release more spoilers on the books. Martin won't sell a ton of copies of a book that was already a TV show.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I have wondered about how long they could hold on to the main actors in the show as they become stars. A lot of the character actors like Charles Dance (Tywin), Stephan Dillane (Stannis) and Liam Cunningham (Davos) are not going anywhere. But a few of the actors have lead potential.

Emelia Clarke is short, but she is slated to be Sarah Conner in the next round of Terminators. If those gross $300MM+ as they probably will, she could become an A lister and be hard to hold onto.

Nicolaj Coster Waldau (Jaime) is close too. He was pretty good in Oblivion and could start getting major movie roles too.

Lena Headey will probably stick around because she has managed to get typecast as a swords and sandles queen character. Steady work, but not the kind that will ever make her an A lister.

Sophie Turner (Sansa) has the look and the talent to take Amanda Seyfried's bubblegum tween romance roles now that Seyfried is too old for them.

I read somewhere that Jack Gleeson (Joffrey) is going to retire. I think he is incredibly talented. He is too short to be a huge star, but he could make $5MM+ a year playing movie villains for the rest of his life. Malcolm McDowell did it.

Kit Harrington's (Jon Snow) Pompeii made me think of this post. Pompeii, which got terrible reviews, still grossed $85MM and counting, which is good enough to get him another crack at leading role in a studio film.

Other top shows have faced this, but GoT has a problem in that the actors can actually act. The Sopranos avoided this because outside of the two leads, the cast was either character actors or simply not that talented (see Robert Iler). What other roles are the guys who played Bobby Baccala or Vito Spatafore going to get? Outside of Jeremy Piven, Kevin Dillon and the guest stars, the cast of Entourage can't even act. I have been surprised that Shameless has been able to hold onto Emmy Rossum for this long.

It is interesting that Mad Men has held onto Jon Hamm so long, because he is a solid B list movie actor now. Friends seemed to stick together out of loyalty to each other, because Jennifer Aniston was already one of the biggest stars on the planet by the last few seasons of that show.

 

[Scalito]

It is interesting that Mad Men has held onto Jon Hamm so long, because he is a solid B list movie actor now.

I dunno. Why would he leave? He makes a small fortune filming 13 episodes a year and can do whatever he wants the other 10+ months of the year.

I really don't think there is as much incentive for most actors to jettison popular cable television shows that make them rich stars these days. Most of them work on shows with shorter seasons than the old sitcoms, leaving them plenty of time to do other things, and Hollywood's less driven by movie star names than ever before. It's all about brands and franchises now. Build up TV fandom, and you can easily get inserted into whatever comic book role needs a semi-known actor/actress (see January Jones in the X-Men or, as you noted, Clarke in the upcoming Terminators).

 

[nelsonmuntz]

I dunno. Why would he leave? He makes a small fortune filming 13 episodes a year and can do whatever he wants the other 10+ months of the year.

I really don't think there is as much incentive for most actors to jettison popular cable television shows that make them rich stars these days. Most of them work on shows with shorter seasons than the old sitcoms, leaving them plenty of time to do other things, and Hollywood's less driven by movie star names than ever before. It's all about brands and franchises now. Build up TV fandom, and you can easily get inserted into whatever comic book role needs a semi-known actor/actress (see January Jones in the X-Men or, as you noted, Clarke in the upcoming Terminators).

I agree on the short seasons for filming. The problem the old sitcoms and dramas had was that the TV actors only had a few months to do anything else between seasons. That is why Harrison Ford was Indiana Jones and not Tom Selleck. So when they got to the end of a contract, the old TV stars had to think very hard about renewing.

The problem is that Mad Men does not pay that well at all. I think Hamm makes $250k per episode for a 12 or 13 episode season. Once he is done paying advisers and the government, that is not much for a star. The supporting cast gets much less. I don't imagine Game of Thrones pays much either with the size of its cast.

 

[BlueHen]

There is some buzz about this now. Apparently HBO referred to the creature that turned the baby into a White Walker as "the Night King" on a website or something. Martin had never put the Night King in the books, or confirmed that such a creature even exists. I wonder if this is a subtle dig by HBO to encourage Martin to get his ass in gear and finish the next two books or HBO will release more spoilers on the books. Martin won't sell a ton of copies of a book that was already a TV show.

I haven't read the books, but I was told that the "Night King" is mentioned as part of a legend that was told to the Stark children in the first book. I don't know if mention of him appears in print anywhere else, but HBO has now confirmed his existence. I hope that is part Martin's plan for the series.

 

[Scalito]

I haven't read the books, but I was told that the "Night King" is mentioned as part of a legend that was told to the Stark children in the first book. I don't know if mention of him appears in print anywhere else, but HBO has now confirmed his existence. I hope that is part Martin's plan for the series.

There is a Night King in the series, I think, but I am fairly certain that was a title given to a rogue leader of the Night's Watch. It wasn't in reference to an Other.

 

[BlueHen]

There is a Night King in the series, I think, but I am fairly certain that was a title given to a rogue leader of the Night's Watch. It wasn't in reference to an Other.

That's the one. The legend is that he married a woman with cold white skin and blue eyes.

 

[August_West]

" the greatest swordsmen whoever lived killed by Meryn F@ckin' Trant ?"

I'm still laughing

The arya and hound scenes are worth the whole series. So good. They should do a spinoff called " the adventures of Arya and the hound"

 

[nelsonmuntz]

" the greatest swordsmen whoever lived killed by Meryn F@ckin' Trant ?"

I'm still laughing

The arya and hound scenes are worth the whole series. So good. They should do a spinoff called " the adventures of Arya and the hound"

That was awesome. Good episode overall last night.

The show is at its strongest with the cat and mouse 1-on-1 scenes, and there were some great ones last night. Cersei and Margaery was awesome. Cersei is clearly suspicious about the Tyrell's and their role in the death of Joffrey, but Tywin and her need them. Tywin trying to pin Cersei down to a date to marry Loras was really good too, when both know that Cersei has no intention of ever marrying him.

The show has absolutely nailed the Lysa Arryn character. The only problem I had with that scene is that Littlefinger would never allow a halfwit like Robin to know such a big secret.

I liked the Locke character a lot even though he wasn't in the books. While I knew he would have to go, I was hoping he would last a little longer. It was pretty cool how the show had Snow and Bran dispose of a threat to the Starks without either knowing the other's role in doing it.

 

[babysheep]

Just kinda wish we got a liiiittle more detail on what exactly Danny wants to do. Seems like she's staying put for now, but for how long?

I was distracted by some herb and a female, during the conversation between Lysa and Baelish... so we now know that Baelish did have a big hand in Joffrey's death? Did he not mention orchestrating the younger brother becoming king when he and Sansa first got to Lysa? Also in that conversation, Lysa mentioned something about writing a letter to Cat about something about the Lannisters like she was deceiving Cat or something, then Baelish cut her off I guess because they were in front of Sansa and Robin. What was that?

 

[Deepster]

Just kinda wish we got a liiiittle more detail on what exactly Danny wants to do. Seems like she's staying put for now, but for how long?

I was distracted by some herb and a female, during the conversation between Lysa and Baelish... so we now know that Baelish did have a big hand in Joffrey's death? Did he not mention orchestrating the younger brother becoming king when he and Sansa first got to Lysa? Also in that conversation, Lysa mentioned something about writing a letter to Cat about something about the Lannisters like she was deceiving Cat or something, then Baelish cut her off I guess because they were in front of Sansa and Robin. What was that?

It came out that Lysa (per Littlefinger's doing) is the one who poisoned her own husband when he was Hand to King Robert. Then she wrote a letter to Cat to blame it on the Lannisters. While I am jealous of your herb/girl Sunday night combo platter, you should probably go back and rewatch that scene!

 

[SubbaBub]

Just kinda wish we got a liiiittle more detail on what exactly Danny wants to do. Seems like she's staying put for now, but for how long?

I was distracted by some herb and a female, during the conversation between Lysa and Baelish... so we now know that Baelish did have a big hand in Joffrey's death? Did he not mention orchestrating the younger brother becoming king when he and Sansa first got to Lysa? Also in that conversation, Lysa mentioned something about writing a letter to Cat about something about the Lannisters like she was deceiving Cat or something, then Baelish cut her off I guess because they were in front of Sansa and Robin. What was that?

Dany's storyline is the most true to the page in the series. She is right where she is supposed to be. Unsure about a lot of things.