FSU and Clemson to Big XII?

[Carl Spackler]

Thanks for the link. I guess I disagree that bringing in Memphis is a sign that Marinatto is "making football a priority". It's clearly a basketball move. Houston, SMU, might be comparable to Louisville / USF for football. Maybe. But Memphis... no.

Yup, it's not primarily a football move, it's a basketball move, but it's also a football move. That's the key. It's definitely a move that makes sense to solidify the entire conference. There's absolutley nothing surprising about adding Memphis to the big east in the current environment, given the present circumstance and past history.

What' been surprising from teh big east, is that they've made football a priority in all decision making. THis isn't adding Depaul and Marquette.

I wrote elsewhere, the addition of Navy football, and exit fee increase, is a PHENOMENAL event in the course of events here. I wrote like hell about it. You won't hear about it from ESPN though.

Adding Memphis, the ESPN media, will put that on top headlines, and set up the big east as a conference of fools. Not true.

 

[Adios]

ESPN is saying Memphis is a good add, surprisingly. If that super conference happened, UConn might have been screwed. Surreal.

 

[Carl Spackler]

ESPN is saying Memphis is a good add, surprisingly. If that super conference happened, UConn might have been screwed. Surreal.

Now you understand why Lew Perkins and Harry Hartley were so concerned with upgrading UConn football in 1990. The new success the basketball programs had found, was in real danger of getting left out of the money pool.

 

[SubbaBub]

Not sure you want to compare travel time and cost between BDL and MIA and whatever the airport code is for Boise or San Diego.

There around 8 flights a day to Miami and another 8 to Fort Lauderdale and usually they are less than $300.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

 

[Carl Spackler]

BTW - read that link I posted, if you haven't. Read all of them.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Not sure you want to compare travel time and cost between BDL and MIA and whatever the airport code is for Boise or San Diego.

There around 8 flights a day to Miami and another 8 to Fort Lauderdale and usually they are less than $300.

Sent from my MB860 using Tapatalk

And thank you, for demonstrating completely, that the geographic proximity issue in today's intercollegiate world is no longer a primary concern. Travel time is now more important than distance. Air travel is just as common now, as ground travel. Not the case, 25 years ago.

edit: also, try flying into Morgantown from anywhere in big 12 country and getting to the football stadium.

 

[Fishy]

1. Because it consists of institutions with whom we have more in common,

2. In a much more compact and sensible geographic area,

3. Who play in front of bigger crowds,

4. Are better in basketball, and

5. Make more money?

Other than that, why would I prefer to be in the ACC? I guess I wouldn't.

Thank you.

Anyone who thinks the upcoming Big East is a better place for us is defective on a base level. Watching this Spackler nitwit trying to sell the new Big East is like watching a guy with no arms trying to tread water. Hopefully, his legs will get tired sooner rather than later...

 

[SubbaBub]

Houston, Dallas, Orlando and Baltimore/DC are doable. Boise, Memphis, and San Diego not so much. They are not better than Boston, Syracuse, Raleigh, Atlanta, Pittsburgh, Miami because you can still drive to three of them proximity does still matter.

BTW, 3 days of hyping a routine tobacco road game, ESPN? Really?

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[HartbeatHusky]

FSU and Clemson have to be seriously considering this if the Big 12 is really interested. The football is better and they make more money. It's really that simple. The SEC is not going to take schools in states where they are already represented so really this would be their only chance to move to a better conference before the SEC starts seriously sniffing around at the VA and NC schools.

The new ACC TV deal is going to lock them in for 3 more years with ESPN and they will only fall further behind the P12, B10, SEC, and B12 members if they don't take it. They'll probably wait to see what the finalized ACC deal is before they bolt, but if it's only $1-2M more per year I think they are out of there.

NC State and VA Tech probably end up in the SEC and UConn and Rutgers probably will be in the ACC eventually. Of course the B10 expanding could cause further defections from the ACC or B12 so who really knows.

 

[JohnUnitas]

I don't blame WV for jumping to B12, although I wish they'd be a more adult about how they handle themselves. I would not blame the Ville either. But I remain adamant that the B12 is a dead man walking. TX is the 800 lb elephant in the room, and they will continue to put themselves above the conference. All the while, OU continues to pine for the days when they regularly see the Pacific Ocean. OSU is tied to OU; TTU to TX. The Pac12 is not staying at 12, period and they have limited places to turn. TX will eventually try to play off the Pac12,BIG and SEC against each other in search of a sweetheart deal. They might even try to go independent. But they will continue to play with their conference mates for only as long as they are allowed to live by different rules - they are to the B12 what ND is to the BE, a royal pain in the arse who sets its own terms. The B12 is the midwest version of the BE - they are mere hunting grounds for other conferences. The only difference is that they have bigger names in their conference, for the moment. IMO by the time the toothless hillbillies from coal country learn how to spell B12, they'll realize they found fool's gold and that the water of plenty Oliver sold them on was merely a mirage. AND NO WAY IN HELL DO FSU OR CLEMSON jump on that sinking ship - they would go to the SEC in a heartbeat; they are not B12 bound, period.

Pick this all up from the East Coast?

From someone that actually follows the B12 and lives in B12 territory, the league itself is actually quite fine. It's quieter and more peaceful than it has been in the last 10 years. As much as people want to see the B12 explode, it's not going to. The league weathered a storm that has been brewing since 1996, took some hits, came out the other side.

Thinking that the B12 is going to fall apart is nothing but naive, wishful thinking.

 

[Jericho]

Because the ACC has become the Big East. The Big East has become CUSA. We've been demoted except the name hasn't changed.

Pretty much this. Would you rather be in the circa 2003 Conference USA or be in the circa 2003 Big East? Because the Big East is now what Conference USA used to be plus a few basketball only schools. The ACC is still the ACC plus the best parts of the former Big East.

If you're telling me in 2003 that you'd rather be in Conference USA than the Big East, then I understand wanting to stay in the "new" Big East. Otherwise I don't get it.

 

[Carl Spackler]

Thank you.

Anyone who thinks the upcoming Big East is a better place for us is defective on a base level. Watching this Spackler nitwit trying to sell the new Big East is like watching a guy with no arms trying to tread water. Hopefully, his legs will get tired sooner rather than later...

Sticks and stones. Come up with some facts, that being a slave to ESPN for the next quarter century in the ACC is so much more desireable to be, and we might have something to talk about, otherwise piss off.

You know, I would have been ecstatic to be invited to the ACC with Syracuse 6 months ago. Because at the time, the big east conference, deserved to die, and I trully believe that UConn and Syracuse to the ACC would have destroyed the big east by 2014. It took Syracuse and Pitt, to pull the backstabbing back room act, for Providence to finally get what it's all about, and it nearly was too late for the conference to continue.

Athletic conferences come and go people, competition does not. The names on the backs of the jersey's change often, the names on the fronts of the jerseys, change less often, but competition is always the same.

It didn't happen, the conference lived, and trust me on this, there are people in Syracuse, drowning themselves in scotch right now, and asking myself, what have I done????

But, wait, I'm the crazy one.

 

[Jericho]

Why wouldn't they go? If the article is correct, FSU and Clemson would be doubling their revenue and that's AFTER the TV revenue increase as a result of Cuse and Pitt joining.
If those TV revenue projections are in fact correct for the Big XII, I would be suprised if they did not go. Then we wouldn't have to worry about FSU not wanting us in due to our football shortcomings.

Because it sounds bogus. How exactly are the Big 12 teams supposed to go from 17 to 35 million per team? None of the biggest players, i.e. the Big 10 or SEC, can touch that figure. That does not pass the smell test to me

 

[Fishy]

The administration and fan base of Syracuse University is over the moon happy that they are going to the ACC. Everything from donations to sales to alumni interest immediately went positive for them.

And, yeah, you're crazy.

 

[Fishy]

Because it sounds bogus. How exactly are the Big 12 teams supposed to go from 17 to 35 million per team? None of the biggest players, i.e. the Big 10 or SEC, can touch that figure. That does not pass the smell test to me

Here's the thing - something named 'ecdawg' wrote that Clemson and FSU are considering the Big 12 and we actually treat it like the New York Times wrote it?

Call me a skeptic, but I'm gonna call BS on it.

 

[Carl Spackler]

The administration and fan base of Syracuse University is over the moon happy that they are going to the ACC. Everything from donations to sales to alumni interest immediately went positive for them.

And, yeah, you're crazy.

Funny, you'll blast somebody for accepting what they read somebody write on a message board as truth, but then you go and make a statement like this, all actual evidence to the contrary.

There is a nice public face being put on right now, any mechandise sales info you can find showing an increase in teh past 6 months has to do directly with the Orange's #1 ranking in bball, and alumni, are very much concerned with future of Syracuse University athletics, and that their administration, that has led to the complete demise of the football program in the past decade, is also leading the entire athletic department down the same road that BC has gone.

But, yup I'm the crazy one.

UConn is in good hands, internally. and as long as the big east keeps prioritizing football, as they have for the first time in the conference's entire existence in the past 6 months.....externally too.

 

[HartbeatHusky]

The rumor may not we well sourced but the B12 TV contract is up after 2015-16. If they expand in time for that they will be getting a huge increase compared to the ACC which will be locked in until 2026 at about $14-15M per school. The B12 already gets about $19-20M per school. You guys do the math and tell me it's really absurd to think that the ACC could be raided by the B12.

*edit corrected the ACC contract end date to 2026 reflecting the expected 3 year extension

 

[bristol rises]

I miss the Drunken Friar. He was great in threads like these.

 

[Jericho]

Here's the thing - something named 'ecdawg' wrote that Clemson and FSU are considering the Big 12 and we actually treat it like the New York Times wrote it?

Call me a skeptic, but I'm gonna call BS on it.

I'm stealing directly from Frank the Tank (a very good blog by the way), when he says...

"Let’s put it another way: once you get past Texas and Oklahoma, is there any other current Big 12 school that is more valuable than Virginia Tech,Virginia, Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, Miami, Maryland, Georgia Tech or N.C. State? Heck, is there any other non-UT/OU Big 12 school that would be picked by the Big Ten or SEC (who have more poaching power than anyone) over any ACC school besides maybe Wake Forest?"

More of his thoughts here...
http://frankthetank.wordpress.com/2...his-to-the-big-east-and-b1g-playoff-proposal/

 

[Jericho]

The rumor may not we well sourced but the B12 TV contract is up after 2015-16. If they expand in time for that they will be getting a huge increase compared to the ACC which will be locked in until 2023 at about $14-15M per school. The B12 already gets about $19-20M per school. You guys do the math and tell me it's really absurd to think that the ACC could be raided by the B12.

This report

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2012/02/06/Colleges/ACC-TV.aspx

has the Big 12 at around $15 and the Pac 12/Big 10 both at around $21 million

 

[HartbeatHusky]

I'm stealing directly from Frank the Tank (a very good blog by the way), when he says...

"Let’s put it another way: once you get past Texas and Oklahoma, is there any other current Big 12 school that is more valuable than Virginia Tech,Virginia, Florida State, Clemson, North Carolina, Miami, Maryland, Georgia Tech or N.C. State? Heck, is there any other non-UT/OU Big 12 school that would be picked by the Big Ten or SEC (who have more poaching power than anyone) over any ACC school besides maybe Wake Forest?"

More of his thoughts here...
http://frankthetank.wordpress.com/2...his-to-the-big-east-and-b1g-playoff-proposal/

Doesn't matter if the ACC is stuck in a bad deal until the middle of the next decade while the B12 will be on the open market in 3 years.

 

[Fishy]

Funny, you'll blast somebody for accepting what they read somebody write on a message board as truth, but then you go and make a statement like this, all actual evidence to the contrary.

Here's the thing, sport.

I actually know the people I'm talking about.

 

[HartbeatHusky]

This report

http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/Journal/Issues/2012/02/06/Colleges/ACC-TV.aspx

has the Big 12 at around $15 and the Pac 12/Big 10 both at around $21 million

I've seen it reported higher but for the sake of argument even if it's $15M now that is the same thing the ACC is going to lock themselves into until 2026 when they finalize with ESPN. The B12 has the potential to make way more money in the near term. When the B12 signs a new contract in 2015 they'll easily be in the ballpark with the P12 and B10.

 

[businesslawyer]

Here's the thing, sport.

I actually know the people I'm talking about.

And in a nutshell, that is what is so unbelievable about people's use of the internet. Every sentence people read is given the same credibility, whether it's a lunatic talking about genetic science, a Syracuse administrator talking about what Syracuse wants, or a business lawyer talking about business law. For reasons I don't get, some want to believe that all words online have the same credibility/chance of being correct.

 

[junglehusky]

Carl, the NNBE could get a contract worth double the ACC's, but UConn would still jump ship if they got an offer. You may like a stable Big East but the thing is it would be a stable relationship WITH FRIKKIN MEMPHIS AND SAN DIEGO STATE AND SMU AND HOUSTON. You could make a personal guarantee to Herbst and the bigwigs that UConn would be a perrenial .500 team and make minor bowls for the rest of eternity and they'd take it because it would beat being stuck forever with FRIKKIN MEMPHIS ETC.

UConn may never get an offer, but if it does, the academic reputation of the ACC will Trump whatever football cachet Boise etc. can bring. Even if Marinatto gets his dream NBC contract, it will STILL get trumped by academics. Memphis just sealed the deal.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I think everybody needs to drop this knee jerk reaction of wanting to go to the ACC. What really makes you think the ACC is better than the Big East moving forward? Seriously? It's not. The only reason the ACC would be an attractive home for UConn athletics is if the Big East conference stops doing business. There's a very powerful force out there in intercollegiate athletics, that doesn't want the Big East to go away. N.D.

Notre Dame is not going to the ACC. The only way Notre Dame ever joins a conference,any conference, in football, happens for one of two reasons. The creation of a national playoff system for a national champion that is based entirely on conference champions (and it would be so freaking easy to put it in place, if not for all the money that flows through the current BCS system). and #2, if the Big East conference fails to provide a home foe all of the other sports that Notre Dame needs to field, to maintain division 1-A status as a football program.

If the Big East conference stops playing football as a 1-A conference, and the 1-A teams all go elsewhere, Notre Dame would be forced to find another home for their sports, or go back to the headaches that drove Penn State and Miami to the Big East conference so many years ago. PSU didn't get in, Miami did. Notre Dame, 4 years after Miami, manged to join the Big East, but keep football separate with an individual broadcasting contract with NBC and bulding an individual relationship with the BCS.

Notre Dame, clearly, being in position they are with the Big East, is not going to let the Big East conference fail.

Seriously?

The University of Virginia. Possibly the top public school in America, steeped in tradition...or Boise State, one of the worst. Duke or Houston, a commuter school a step above a commuter college. North Carolina, another great institution, or San Diego State. Georgia Tech, another great school, or perhaps Memphis? Wake Forest another top University, or maybe a commuter school in Tampa called USF. It goes on and on. The ACC is full of some of the best, most prestigious universities in America. I don't give a crap about whether a bunch of guys who couldn't even get into those schools can beat them at football, you want to associate with quality institutions, not the dregs of American colleges.

 

[zls44]

Id like to throw in that, like Fishy, I too know folks high up on the Syracuse food chain. Theyre thrilled, donations are way up, and it's because of the move, NOT the number one ranked team.

Carl is so deep in denial, it's sad. He seems like a genuinely nice chap. Hes just wrong on this. Completely.

 

[junglehusky]

Hawk, I couldn't agree more. I was OK with Cincinatti, Louisville and USF as you could make a case those institutions were in the process of beefing up their academics, perhaps a few years behind UConn's trajectory but with a bit lower ceiling for the forseeable future. SMU, good reputation, smaller religious school with a different mission, sort of like a Texas version of Villanova. The case is weaker for Houston. They have to compete more directly with other good state schools for resources and students. Boise, Memphis, are just not peer institutions with UConn. They're good at one sport each, but they don't have much else to offer.

 

[Adios]

We just became academically prominent recently. Our exposure through sports was a factor that helped catapult our academic status. The campus looks nothing like what it did 20 years ago. The purpose of the Big East seems to have been developing schools and athletic departments, riding the backs of some powerful Catholic schools. We need a tournament involving ND, SMU and BYU. That would be interesting, too.

It's unreal how much UConn has developed over the last 25 years. We were a friggin' agricultural school!

 

[brasssbonanzaa]

The only relevant fact here is that if the BCS removes all auto bids and the BCS bowls go to open season bidding, the Big East is effectively a useless piece of junk. Virtually no Big East team will ever get selected to a BCS bowl in this scenario, and thus if the ACC move opens, it is an absolute must that we take it. That football conference wouldn't be the best, but it'd be FAR more stable, travel would be much easier, it would have a stranglehold on the major northeast media markets and the eastern seaboard, and will have enough name recognition that teams would get some BCS invites. Staying with UCF, San Diego State, and SMU is not a ticket to long term success.