Fox Discussing Post-Season NIT Alternative w/ BE, Big 12, B10

[Fishy]

The sooner they break away and form their own conferences into which we may be invited, the better. This is the first step towards that. We’re never getting into the B1G, Big 12, or ACC under the NCAA

Those conferences are still going to be those conferences, no matter what the overarching entity is. If/when they do separate from the NCAA, we’ll simply be detached from wherever they’re going and we’ll remain with the group under the NCAA.

 

[Rico444]

Those conferences are still going to be those conferences, no matter what the overarching entity is. If/when they do separate from the NCAA, we’ll simply be detached from wherever they’re going and we’ll remain with the group under the NCAA.

It's certainly a possibility, but Fox is negotiating with the Big East for this tournament, so that leads me to believe in any break there would be consideration given to the Big East. We're not talking about $40-50 million a year payments but we do have some value otherwise they wouldn't even consider including the Big East in this.

 

[superjohn]

If UConn didn’t make the tournament but were playing a mini tournament with teams from the other two top basketball leagues on a similar level (top 35-41 for a 16-team tournament) and it was happening in Vegas in March, I could take that excuse to visit. Again, it’s a great time to go.

And if I didn’t want to pay to go to Vegas, I would absolutely watch on TV with nothing else going on in March. I feel like I would watch it over the final rounds of the NCAA tournament. Usually by then Cinderella is out, and I never really cared about Cinderella in the first place; I feel like mainly the general public and fans of schools outside the top 75 are those who care about Cinderella.

And once again it’s just a test. If it performs anywhere near as well as the NIT does, then they know they have something, the public isn’t necessarily beholden to NCAA events, and they could consider starting a new March Madness (and a new CFP).

We would watch because we're obsessive UConn fans but I don't think the casuals would tune in and people with no connection to the schools won't tune in. Do people watch the NIT? I think the last NIT game I watched was when UConn lost to Virginia Tech in 2009-2010.

 

[August_West]

Those conferences are still going to be those conferences, no matter what the overarching entity is. If/when they do separate from the NCAA, we’ll simply be detached from wherever they’re going and we’ll remain with the group under the NCAA.

Good. And then they will have the only 4X National Champion from THIS century excluded from THEIR league. Thats a bold strategy, lets see how that plays out. I could've gone back one solitary year and made it 5x But 4x is good enough.

 

[superjohn]

It's certainly a possibility, but Fox is negotiating with the Big East for this tournament, so that leads me to believe in any break there would be consideration given to the Big East. We're not talking about $40-50 million a year payments but we do have some value otherwise they wouldn't even consider including the Big East in this.

There's no way UConn and the Big East would be left out in basketball.

 

[superjohn]

Good. And then they will have the only 4X National Champion from THIS century excluded from THEIR league. Thats a bold strategy, lets see how that plays out. I could've gone back one solitary year and made it 5x But 4x is good enough.

It ain't happening, I have no idea why Fishy is still on this.

 

[Rocktheworld]

Those conferences are still going to be those conferences, no matter what the overarching entity is. If/when they do separate from the NCAA, we’ll simply be detached from wherever they’re going and we’ll remain with the group under the NCAA.

The idea/hope is that there will be fat trimmed from the conferences like a Wake Forest and that all-new conferences will be formed. Sure, most of the B1G will probably be invited into the new conference that Michigan and OSU start; but the idea is that, with the slate wiped clean, we are one of the invites out of the NCAA.

 

[Rocktheworld]

I don't think the casuals would tune in and people with no connection to the schools won't tune in. Do people watch the NIT?

Exactly; that’s already the case. Nobody should be expecting/hoping it’ll significantly outperform the NIT. But if it does about as well, then they have a proof of concept.

 

[Kitaman]

This is becoming Participation Trophy overload.

 

[Fishy]

It's certainly a possibility, but Fox is negotiating with the Big East for this tournament, so that leads me to believe in any break there would be consideration given to the Big East. We're not talking about $40-50 million a year payments but we do have some value otherwise they wouldn't even consider including the Big East in this.

It’s a dopey NIT replacement tournament.

It doesn’t speak to the Big East’s place at the table as a power conference because the Big East is not a power conference.

 

[superjohn]

It’s a dopey NIT replacement tournament.

It doesn’t speak to the Big East’s place at the table as a power conference because the Big East is not a power conference.

It is in basketball.

 

[Fishy]

It is in basketball.

Because some writers referred to a P6 in basketball does not make it so.

You’re either an autonomy conference or you are not.

 

[SubbaBub]

So teams not in the NCAA take 3 weeks off and then play meaningless games of questionable interest? All while players are entering the portal, preparing for the draft, and coaches are looking for next year's job.

Seems highly suspect to me.

 

[Hurleyman216]

A much better idea would be to take the losers of the first 2 rounds of the NCAA tournament and have a “redemption bracket”. It would at the very least have more viewer interest even though it’s still probably a bad idea.

 

[HuskyHawk]

Because some writers referred to a P6 in basketball does not make it so.

You’re either an autonomy conference or you are not.

I think theirs is a middle ground. The P4 realize cutting out the little guys weakens the appeal. So they’d cut the Big East in on the BB money, so long as nobody else ever actually has a chance.

 

[Rico444]

It’s a dopey NIT replacement tournament.

It doesn’t speak to the Big East’s place at the table as a power conference because the Big East is not a power conference.

So why is Fox including them? They also have the rights for the Mountain West and they're not a part of it.

 

[HuskyHawk]

So why is Fox including them? They also have the rights for the Mountain West and they're not a part of it.

See my comment above.

 

[AZHuskiePop]

It doesn’t strike anybody as odd that Fox is pushing this idea the same time the NCAA is talking about expanding the conference tournament , because of some type of fictitious increase in conference size .
At the same time thev NCAA is negotiating a new package deal that covered D1 championships , The NIT ,and the Women’s BB tournament .
,and foreign rights to the men’s tournament
All. Coincidence. If tournament expands does Fox get in on it or somehow end up with the women’s tournament or could it be the NiT is out of the deal ending that tournament and Fox is picking up the pieces. This tournament, The NIT continuing and , expansion all are not mutually exclusive.
ESPN currently pays $35 million a year with the projected value of the women’s tournament nearly triple that amount
I Don’t trust Fox , ESPN ,or the NCAA.
The only hope for survival is not tournament expansion but the 360 d1 schools getting a minimum of 50% of the tourney earnings
I’ve modeled some expansion numbers and it could work but getting each unit to a min of $1million and magically UConn is a national player . That would require increasing the pot from $178,000,000 to a bit over $500,000,000
From a Tournament that makes $1 billion from an organization that will have total revenue will be $1.4 Billion that’s an extremely reasonable proposition.

 

[Waquoit]

A much better idea would be to take the losers of the first 2 rounds of the NCAA tournament and have a “redemption bracket”. It would at the very least have more viewer interest even though it’s still probably a bad idea.

That's a clever wrinkle. And the winner gets a free ticket to the Dance the following season. You should suggest it to Fox. Personally I hate the idea of the entire endeavor, but once you cracked the seal I think it would create more interest.

 

[Samoo]

Like the adults giving participation trophies to whoever plays, NOW everyone in college basketball will play in a postseason tournament.

It's all about the money - they don't give a crap how the schools feel - so not really comparable.

 

[Rico444]

I think theirs is a middle ground. The P4 realize cutting out the little guys weakens the appeal. So they’d cut the Big East in on the BB money, so long as nobody else ever actually has a chance.

I think we're generally saying the same thing. The Big East has a strong brand in basketball. I would be surprised if TV stations cut them out.

 

[ConnHuskBask]

I still don't see how you run a tournament of only p4 participants.

You'd have every team make the field, which who wants to see 8-23 Georgia tech take on 14-16 northwestern in the 7 vs 10 game, you kill the entirety (or what's left anyway) of the regular season, kill the p4 conference tournaments, and make the casual viewer tune out the opening weekend which is the weekend that makes it the cultural phenomenon it is today.

UConn being in a precarious position in the big East is independent of a breakaway tournament.

Much more likely to see an extended "first 4" that starts that Sunday (would be low major conference winners) so those auto bids and games could be played in advance of the main bracket reveal that Sunday evening.

 

[HuskyHawk]

I think we're generally saying the same thing. The Big East has a strong brand in basketball. I would be surprised if TV stations cut them out.

Yes. Big East has won too many recent titles and is too competitive. Leaving the Big East out makes it illegitimate. Instead, they include the Big East and do what they can to minimize everyone else. They still need the small schools people love to root for, but you expand the tournament in a way that all but ensures they all get knocked out early, while piling up credits for the big conferences.

 

[superjohn]

Yes. Big East has won too many recent titles and is too competitive. Leaving the Big East out makes it illegitimate. Instead, they include the Big East and do what they can to minimize everyone else. They still need the small schools people love to root for, but you expand the tournament in a way that all but ensures they all get knocked out early, while piling up credits for the big conferences.

You can't ensure small schools get knocked off. That's what makes the tournament so great.

 

[Fishy]

So why is Fox including them? They also have the rights for the Mountain West and they're not a part of it.

Probably because CBS Sports is the Mountain West’s primary hoop rights holder.