FGCU's Enfield to USC. Am I nuts or are some D-1 AD's losing | Page 2 | The Boneyard

FGCU's Enfield to USC. Am I nuts or are some D-1 AD's losing

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BigErnMcCracken said:
I was exaggerating for effect. I was going to say Pitzer.
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Wow - how do you even know about Pitzer? I went to Pomona College (not cal poly) and we were actually a team with Pitzer when I was in college (Pomona Pitzer Sagehens). My freshman year of college everyone was excited when we won our first football game in four years....

Funny when I see that reference on the Boneyard.
 
Huskies4ever said:
That's pretty much it............

I think most value 13 years as a backup pg in the NBA more than what Enfield has on his resume.
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I disagree completely. Coaching experience is much more valuable than playing experience. If Ollie wasn't a UConn guy, we would never have considered him. Enfield has done more as a coach, and like Ollie, has great intangibles and upside.
 
HuskyHawk said:
I disagree completely. Coaching experience is much more valuable than playing experience. If Ollie wasn't a UConn guy, we would never have considered him. Enfield has done more as a coach, and like Ollie, has great intangibles and upside.
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To actually steward a program, yes, I'd agree. But to recruit, I'd disagree. Playing in the NBA for 15 odd years carries a lot of weight. Being able to say you were brought in to mentor Lebron James does too. And recruiting is paramount without JC at the helm.

That said, I agree with your sentiment about KO (in reference to being UConn guy).
 
USC has had some of the most bizarre hirings of hoop coaches ever. Enfield is just the next. Bibby and Raveling stand out; the rest are an unbelievable dumpster pile.
 
Look ... Calhoun was right on Ollie. Jud Heathcote was right about Tom Izzo. The lack of HC experience would have, honestly, kept them from either of these Programs ... at the moment they were hired ... but you end up with a BIG WIN. Super hire and super loyal. (*or you go all-Keno)
 
Pudge said:
Look ... Calhoun was right on Ollie. Jud Heathcote was right about Tom Izzo. The lack of HC experience would have, honestly, kept them from either of these Programs ... at the moment they were hired ... but you end up with a BIG WIN. Super hire and super loyal. (*or you go all-Keno)
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I'm a KO supporter. I like him and think he will be great.

But we can't yet say that Calhoun was right. I mean, Matt Doherty was a 2-seed and won 2001 AP Coach of the Year at UNC before things fell apart.

Perspective. We need years before we know for a fact. That doesn't mean we don't like him or continue to think he will be a success. But it's premature to pat ourselves and JC on the back. If, in 5-years we haven't been to a E8 or S16, and we're struggling, people are going to have a very different POV of what happened last fall.
 
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tzznandrew said:
But we can't yet say that Calhoun was right. I mean, Matt Doherty was a 2-seed and won 2001 AP Coach of the Year at UNC before things fell apart.
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True, but Doherty might still be there if he wasn't such an obnoxious off the court. At least we know KO is cool as can be on AND off.

And comparing to Izzo is a bit much. 400+ wins, a Natty C and 6 Final Fours is a hell of a resume.
 
You're in trouble when freescootert agrees with you.

There are a lot of things that make Ollie unlike Doherty. Like experience.
 
upstater said:
You're in trouble when freescootert agrees with you.

There are a lot of things that make Ollie unlike Doherty. Like experience.
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I'm not following. Doherty was a long time assistant coach, was successful in his first (only) season at ND, and then successful at his first season at UNC. He had more experience on the bench than KO.

To reiterate my point: Season 1 was very good for Ollie. It seems to augur great things to come. Yet one season isn't enough to know what we got--good or bad.
 
tzznandrew said:
I'm not following. Doherty was a long time assistant coach, was successful in his first (only) season at ND, and then successful at his first season at UNC. He had more experience on the bench than KO.

To reiterate my point: Season 1 was very good for Ollie. It seems to augur great things to come. Yet one season isn't enough to know what we got--good or bad.
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This is true, and it shouldn't really be controversial. The biggest Ollie boosters in the world can't say for sure it will all pan out; there's too many variables.
By the way, I love the guy and am very glad we have him.
 
tzznandrew said:
I'm not following. Doherty was a long time assistant coach, was successful in his first (only) season at ND, and then successful at his first season at UNC. He had more experience on the bench than KO.

To reiterate my point: Season 1 was very good for Ollie. It seems to augur great things to come. Yet one season isn't enough to know what we got--good or bad.
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Experience as a PG in the NBA. And that translates. It translated this year. It translated to the drill's he was doing and the strategies he was using. The amount of work he puts in: basically, his credibility.

We have something incredibly special in Ollie.

I've been saying this for a long time now, obviously.
 
upstater said:
Experience as a PG in the NBA. And that translates. It translated this year. It translated to the drill's he was doing and the strategies he was using. The amount of work he puts in: basically, his credibility.

We have something incredibly special in Ollie.

I've been saying this for a long time now, obviously.
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I think will help his learning curve, if that's your point.

Otherwise, I'm not sure playing experience translates predicatively into success coaching.

Think of the best college coaches.

Most of them have no NBA playing experience.

Calhoun had none.

The best active coaches also have ABL experience at best:

Izzo: Division II
K: Army
Pitino: UMass
Pitino: ABL
 
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tzznandrew said:
I think will help his learning curve, if that's your point.

Otherwise, I'm not sure playing experience translates predicatively into success coaching.

Think of the best college coaches.

Most of them have no NBA playing experience.

Calhoun had none.

The best active coaches also have ABL experience at best:

Izzo: Division II
K: Army
Pitino: UMass
Pitino: ABL
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Billy Donovan? I think Ollie's experience playing PG in the NBA is invaluable compared to what he would have gained sitting on the bench as an assistant.
 
upstater said:
Billy Donovan? I think Ollie's experience playing PG in the NBA is invaluable compared to what he would have gained sitting on the bench as an assistant.
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Billy Donovan played 44 games for New York. Hardly something that gives him a leg up.

Look. I don't think we're very far apart here about Ollie's abilities. But as for using NBA extrapolating NBA experience into coaching success, facts suggest you don't need to play at the highest level to be a good coach. It doesn't even suggest, at least on the college level, that it gives you a leg up.

There may be logical reasons to think a pro career helps. But there are logical reasons to believe all sorts of things are true, but in the real world they aren't.
 
tzznandrew said:
Billy Donovan played 44 games for New York. Hardly something that gives him a leg up.

Look. I don't think we're very far apart here about Ollie's abilities. But as for using NBA extrapolating NBA experience into coaching success, facts suggest you don't need to play at the highest level to be a good coach. It doesn't even suggest, at least on the college level, that it gives you a leg up.

There may be logical reasons to think a pro career helps. But there are logical reasons to believe all sorts of things are true, but in the real world they aren't.
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Played pro ball for 5 years.

I never said you have to be a PG to have coaching success. I think in Ollie's case it gives him a leg up. He knows what it takes at that position. He drills them to that end. We saw it this year with the team using new ways to improve. Now, if you'd said that it remains to be seen how Ollie can teach the bigs, I would have agreed with you. But guards and swingmen are going to continue the UConn tradition precisely because of Ollie.
 
CAHUSKY said:
Were you incensed that they threw a boat load of $ at JC and stole him away from Northeastern before he accomplished anything (Calhoun never made the sweet 16 did he?) ?
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He won 250 games and developed Reggie Lewis.
 
Husky25 said:
He won 250 games and developed Reggie Lewis.
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And went to the NCAAs 5 out of 6 years. And won a couple of tournament games too.

He was quite impressive. He didn't have the resume of Shaka Smart or Brad Stevens, but if college basketball was as diluted then as it is now, he quite probably could have pulled off something similar. By which I mean: if mid-majors did what they do now, he'd be the near-equivalent in desirability.
 
upstater said:
Played pro ball for 5 years.

I never said you have to be a PG to have coaching success. I think in Ollie's case it gives him a leg up. He knows what it takes at that position. He drills them to that end. We saw it this year with the team using new ways to improve. Now, if you'd said that it remains to be seen how Ollie can teach the bigs, I would have agreed with you. But guards and swingmen are going to continue the UConn tradition precisely because of Ollie.
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Hmm. His wikipedia page (I know, a bastion of accuracy) said that after that season in New York, he worked at an investment firm for a year, and then became an assistant with Pitino at Kentucky in 1989.
 
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tzznandrew said:
Hmm. His wikipedia page (I know, a bastion of accuracy) said that after that season in New York, he worked at an investment firm for a year, and then became an assistant with Pitino at Kentucky in 1989.
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No, you're right. I thought he had a longer career.
 
HuskyHawk said:
I disagree completely. Coaching experience is much more valuable than playing experience. If Ollie wasn't a UConn guy, we would never have considered him. Enfield has done more as a coach, and like Ollie, has great intangibles and upside.
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Good points. I just think in Ollie's case, as a backup, learning from HOF coaches, has helped him in the absence of coaching experience. But to Ollie's credit, you have to want to learn and be a leader, which he is.
 
Huskies4ever said:
Good points. I just think in Ollie's case, as a backup, learning from HOF coaches, has helped him in the absence of coaching experience. But to Ollie's credit, you have to want to learn and be a leader, which he is.
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It's the whole package: a guy that people swore by on the pro level, players, coaches AND also the front office. He was clearly a heady guy who knew well what it took to play. He brings a different set of skills and knowledge to the college game. Calhoun was a backer. Everything wrapped up together tells you he's got a lot of background and a lot of special skills.
 
Funny thing Calhoun mentioned USC hiring Enfield after him winning only 2 NCAA Tournament games. He said it's ridiculous that guys get hired by big schools now with so little success. Said it took him 6 NCAA Tournament appearances with Northeastern before he got big job offers. Mentioned he turned down Northwestern, Stanford and Texas before accepting the UConn job mostly because he wanted to stay in New England and close to his family in the Boston area. I knew about the Northwestern offer (Bobby Knight told him it was a bad job) but didn't know about Stanford and Texas. Have we heard that from him before?
 
BigErnMcCracken said:
It's Ollie's personality, character, work ethic, and intelligence more than the fact that he played point guard in the NBA for 13 years. No one is knocking down Jamal Tinsley's door to coach a college team after he retires.
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And if I'm USC, that's what I see in Enfield. Ivy league smart, built his own software company, worked on Wall St., seems a very solid guy who knows what it takes to succeed. He quit a lucrative career because he wanted to coach. He reportedly recruited well at FSU, and obviously found some hidden gems at FGCU. His model wife will fit in in LA, and generate press.
 
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HuskyHawk said:
And if I'm USC, that's what I see in Enfield. Ivy league smart, built his own software company, worked on Wall St., seems a very solid guy who knows what it takes to succeed. He quit a lucrative career because he wanted to coach. He reportedly recruited well at FSU, and obviously found some hidden gems at FGCU. His model wife will fit in in LA, and generate press.
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He didn't build his own software company. He invested money in a friends company and was a minority owner.
 
Whose USC's best alum? Cheryl miller? A school with so little tradition/expectations might as well swing for the fences.
As far as Ollie, he's got rare qualities that allowed him to stay in the league for so long, mainly leadership. Ray Allen called him the best leader hes been around. I don't think this season was a flash in the pan.
 
intlzncster said:
And he still has to work! Utter failure from this corner.
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Not what i was suggesting.just pointing out that the initial narrative wasnt accurate.
 
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