End state relationship with and tax breaks for ESPN NOW

[ruskin]

Do you really think that UConn's TV contract revenue is that much of a priority for the state? Your comment at the end is exactly what it boils down to. The state gives them tax breaks because they create jobs and are still a major source of tax revenue. It has absolutely nothing to do with some quid pro quo relationship over a couple million bucks going to UConn every year.

UConn now has a $1.8 million contract. It had one for about $4 million. It could/should have had one for $14 million and higher.

If UConn's conference placement and TV revenue -- and all the intangible non monetary benefit -they bring to the state flagship university "isn't that much" of a priority for the state, then by all means let's cease the effort to find a better place.

You are aware that by doing so turns the Rent, the football facility, Gampel, the new hoop facility and the XL Center all into white elephants, right?

 

[WhereistheDove?]

States support schools with billions of dollars. If athletics is that important to a school's advancement, the state may indeed lean on ESPN rather than have ESPN hurt one of its units.

ESPN likes Connecticut for the same reason that NBC just moved to Connecticut. You have to be near Madison Avenue if you're a major TV player, and Conn. is cheaper than New Jersey and Manhattan.

You're blowing the scale of my statements way out of proportion. The athletic department is a net positive to the university. It helps with name recognition, attracting students, and in eliciting donations. That being said, ESPN is a big employer and taxpayer in CT and I assure you the standing of UConn athletics (especially when we're talking about a few million bucks a year or having to wait a little while longer for the next hammer of realignment to fall), is relatively minor compared to the state-wide economy. I think UConn athletics are a good thing for the university, but that doesn't mean I'm willing to strip ESPN of their tax advantages and potentially lose the money and jobs they bring in. I'm not sure how those seem to be mutually exclusive.

 

[upstater]

You're blowing the scale of my statements way out of proportion. The athletic department is a net positive to the university. It helps with name recognition, attracting students, and in eliciting donations. That being said, ESPN is a big employer and taxpayer in CT and I assure you the standing of UConn athletics (especially when we're talking about a few million bucks a year or having to wait a little while longer for the next hammer of realignment to fall), is relatively minor compared to the state-wide economy. I think UConn athletics are a good thing for the university, but that doesn't mean I'm willing to strip ESPN of their tax advantages and potentially lose the money and jobs they bring in. I'm not sure how those seem to be mutually exclusive.

I'd never expect the state to scare off ESPN and the hundreds of millions and more it brings to the economy. The $17 million in tax breaks are more interesting though because the state will suffer a lot more losses than that (maybe annually) because of UConn sports' predicament.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

UConn now has a $1.8 million contract. It had one for about $4 million. It could/should have had one for $14 million and higher.

If UConn's conference placement and TV revenue -- and all the intangible non monetary benefit -they bring to the state flagship university "isn't that much" of a priority for the state, then by all means let's cease the effort to find a better place.

You are aware that by doing so turns the Rent, the football facility, Gampel, the new hoop facility and the XL Center all into white elephants, right?

This is all working under the assumption that UConn academics will crumble and cease to exist at a meaningful level altogether due to us not being invited to the ACC, and that this can be completely controlled by the executives at ESPN. Bottom line is that more than likely UConn gets sucked up in the inevitable next round of realignment. UConn isn't going to end up in division 3 and the world is not going to end. So for a couple million bucks for a couple of years, no it's not worth potentially driving away a major employer and taxpayer. Your hysterics are getting a little over the top.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

I'd never expect the state to scare off ESPN and the hundreds of millions and more it brings to the economy. The $17 million in tax breaks are more interesting though because the state will suffer a lot more losses than that (maybe annually) because of UConn sports' predicament.

The original point I made in this thread (and what you responded to), was that it would be ridiculous to stop the tax breaks and potentially lose ESPN if they didn't pressure some conference into taking us or gives us a better contract... which you agree with? I'm really not sure what your point is here.

 

[upstater]

The original point I made in this thread (and what you responded to), was that it would be ridiculous to stop the tax breaks and potentially lose ESPN if they didn't pressure some conference into taking us or gives us a better contract... which you agree with? I'm really not sure what your point is here.

I would get a little nasty.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

I would get a little nasty.

I have no idea what you're talking about

 

[ruskin]

This is all working under the assumption that UConn academics will crumble and cease to exist at a meaningful level altogether due to us not being invited to the ACC, and that this can be completely controlled by the executives at ESPN. Bottom line is that more than likely UConn gets sucked up in the inevitable next round of realignment. UConn isn't going to end up in division 3 and the world is not going to end. So for a couple million bucks for a couple of years, no it's not worth potentially driving away a major employer and taxpayer. Your hysterics are getting a little over the top.

There's a difference between "hysterics" and "getting tough at the bargaining table", the latter of which Connecticut as a whole is not real good at when it comes to big-time sports. Goes back to being played like hicks by Peter Karmanos (bribing Lowell Weicker with Compuware board spot), Robert Kraft. Malloy strolls into office and throws money at ESPN at almost the very same time they're telling the ACC to get two more teams which they knew was going to blow up the Big East.

Now maybe they were thinking that UConn was going to be one of the two and were surprised by BC's balloon knot-ness. But once it was clear UConn was out on an island they should have been working every single back-channel they had to help. There's zero evidence they have.

No one is saying "UConn academics will crumble". But all the advancement of the 1990s and 2000s will go in reverse if this doesn't end the right way, and we'll be back with URI, UMass, Vermont, New Hampshire and Maine sooner than you think.

ESPN isn't going anywhere. If they put their minds to fixing this it would get fixed. They just need to pushed a little bit.

 

[ruskin]

I have no idea what you're talking about

By nasty I believe talking to them as equals and not in a subservient way

 

[WhereistheDove?]

There's a difference between "hysterics" and "getting tough at the bargaining table", the latter of which Connecticut as a whole is not real good at when it comes to big-time sports. Goes back to being played like hicks by Peter Karmanos (bribing Lowell Weicker with Compuware board spot), Robert Kraft. Malloy strolls into office and throws money at ESPN at almost the very same time they're telling the ACC to get two more teams which they knew was going to blow up the Big East.

Now maybe they were thinking that UConn was going to be one of the two and were surprised by BC's -ness. But once it was clear UConn was out on an island they should have been working every single back-channel they had to help. There's zero evidence they have.

No one is saying "UConn academics will crumble". But all the advancement of the 1990s and 2000s will go in reverse if this doesn't end the right way, and we'll be back with URI, UMass, Vermont, New Hampshire and Maine sooner than you think.

ESPN isn't going anywhere. If they put their minds to fixing this it would get fixed. They just need to pushed a little bit.

I meant to say you're assuming that UConn athletics will crumble. Regardless, your hypothetical downside of UConn not being in the ACC (both academically and athletically) is way over the top, and until you realize that the world is not ending and UConn will not return to being a subpar school, there is really nothing to be talked about. I'm a little dumbfounded by your position.

 

[upstater]

I have no idea what you're talking about

I'd threaten them.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

I'd threaten them.

Do you think companies won't start moving jobs elsewhere if they can get more financially advantageous deals elsewhere? The concept of the state's leverage in this situation is so far blown out of proportion. Please though, just stop it. The net effect of UConn not being taken by a major conference YET is so minor compared to not only the state's, but UConn's budget as a whole. Just stop it, this is getting absurd.

 

[upstater]

Do you think companies won't start moving jobs elsewhere if they can get more financially advantageous deals elsewhere? The concept of the state's leverage in this situation is so far blown out of proportion. Please though, just stop it. The net effect of UConn not being taken by a major conference YET is so minor compared to not only the state's, but UConn's budget as a whole. Just stop it, this is getting absurd.

They're not increasing taxes on them... Subtle jabs of a lack of tax breaks in the future.

Sure they can move to New Jersey, and then what? Lose hundreds of millions in creating a new campus?

 

[WhereistheDove?]

They're not increasing taxes on them... Subtle jabs of a lack of tax breaks in the future.

Sure they can move to New Jersey, and then what? Lose hundreds of millions in creating a new campus?

I'm done with this. Your opinion on the priorities of this state right now are so far out of whack that there is just no point in saying the same things back and forth.

 

[06029]

Shouldn't some of this ire be directed to NBC Sports who is also receiving tax breaks. I mean, they were the one with the low ball offer that only required ESPN to match. So if you want to take away everything from ESPN, take away everything from NBC Sports too. Throw in the hedge fund, Jackson Labs and every other tax break for jobs while you are at it just because they must have some blame in all of this too.

 

[Fishy]

CBS is only paying $2M for some Tier 2 basketball stuff - I say we scramble their signal inside the state of Connecticut.

 

[nelsonmuntz]

Do you think companies won't start moving jobs elsewhere if they can get more financially advantageous deals elsewhere? The concept of the state's leverage in this situation is so far blown out of proportion. Please though, just stop it. The net effect of UConn not being taken by a major conference YET is so minor compared to not only the state's, but UConn's budget as a whole. Just stop it, this is getting absurd.

I want $100MM in state subsidies for my business, and I promise not to do anything to hurt UConn. Therefore, my business is more deserving than ESPN, right?

 

[ruskin]

The net effect of UConn not being taken by a major conference YET is so minor compared to not only the state's, but UConn's budget as a whole. Just stop it, this is getting absurd.

Let me ask you this: other than employing people, does ESPN have any other responsibilities to the state when it accepts tax benefits? You know, like being a good neighbor and helping the flagship university?

Your position seems to be that ESPN's presence in Connecticut is of such vital importance that we even must sacrifice our own self-interest lest we piss them off and they pick up stakes and leave. If anything is overstated here, it's the idea that ESPN would pick up and move at the drop of a hat if we dared to ask them what in their universe is a relatively small favor.

The larger issue is that Malloy made all these deals with already highly profitable and stable companies that weren't considering leaving. If I were king I would have given the $$ to smaller, less stable business which are leaving the state. But now that the deal has been made, we ought to get something for our money. If this state loses big-time college football and basketball -- which is more at risk than some here think (take YET out of the first sentence above) -- it will lose one of the few things which make living here bearable.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

Let me ask you this: other than employing people, does ESPN have any other responsibilities to the state when it accepts tax benefits? You know, like being a good neighbor and helping the flagship university?

No, they don't.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

I want $100MM in state subsidies for my business, and I promise not to do anything to hurt UConn. Therefore, my business is more deserving than ESPN, right?

That is the state's plan. Give out lots of tax breaks so they can get a fraction of it back through UConn's TV contract.

 

[CL82]

I want $100MM in state subsidies for my business, and I promise not to do anything to hurt UConn. Therefore, my business is more deserving than ESPN, right?

I don't know. How many people do you employ and where are you currently situated? I'd probably need see your financials or at least 5 years tax returns.

 

[CL82]

BTW, I doubt that the state was sufficiently forward thinking to put in "if you cause the demise of the conference to which UConn is affiliated, the deal is off" clause in it's contract, but I'd definitely agree that ESPN should never, ever get another dollar from the state, or any break anywhere in CT. He'll I'd do a state tax audit on them to make sure they don't have unreported out of state purchases that they didn't pay tax on. Hold them to the letter of law from here on out.

 

[CTBballfan243]

What the State of CT should do is tell ESPN that they have to retract ESPN's tax break because they need to give the taxes they collect from ESPN to UCONN Athletics to help makeup for the lousy conference TV contract. That would be hilarious

 

[ruskin]

That is the state's plan. Give out lots of tax breaks so they can get a fraction of it back through UConn's TV contract.

I love how you minimize the value of UConn being in a stable conference compared to the worth of being the home of the great vaunted World Wide Leader If you want to sneeze at $12-$15 million a year, go ahead. You know that's just a starting point, right? Compare the economic impact of Michigan coming here compared to, oh, say, South Florida and Memphis? Maryland vs. Buffalo? And that's just football. And that's not counting the non-athletic donations a successful big-time college program brings in.

 

[WhereistheDove?]

I love how you minimize the value of UConn being in a stable conference compared to the worth of being the home of the great vaunted World Wide Leader If you want to sneeze at $12-$15 million a year, go ahead. You know that's just a starting point, right? Compare the economic impact of Michigan coming here compared to, oh, say, South Florida and Memphis? Maryland vs. Buffalo? And that's just football. And that's not counting the non-athletic donations a successful big-time college program brings in.

You think I'm minimizing the value of UConn not being in a stable athletic conference and I think you're severely overstating the benefits of not being in a stable athletic conference for the next couple of years until there is another inevitable round of realignment. And yes, $12-15 million a year is something to scoff at when compared with the economic benefit of ESPN to the state.