End Game 101

[PAHusky]

Hindsight is 20/20

That's less hindsight and more common sense in a common situation at the end of the game. What's the other team going to do? Try to foul your worst free throw shooter and try to stop the clock whenever possible. What does the team with the lead have to do? Hit free throws and not turn the ball over. Pretty basic stuff that has nothing to do with hindsight

 

[Stainmaster]

And yet under Ollie, we were perfect in endgame play in the 2014 tourney.

JC was sending semaphore signals to the players from the crowd. Check the tapes.

 

[Tuna]

And yet under Ollie, we were perfect in endgame play in the 2014 tourney.

I remember the play they ran against St. Joe's at the end of regulation. They didn't score but was one of the best full court inbounds plays I'v seen.

 

[Ewekon]

Vital makes mistakes like the rest of the team. I will take him in a heartbeat. He is my favorite player even last year coming off the bench as a freshman playing with the big boys. He charges to the basket, steals, rebounds. Sure I agree he does make some bonehead mistakes. He doesn't stop playing. He makes it his business to try and do it all. He is missing 3 point shots, Huge slump. However how many times this year he went off and played a great game?

But he isn't more than a 7th man on a good UConn team. I love his heart. He just isn't that good.

 

[UConn_Top_Dog]

That's less hindsight and more common sense in a common situation at the end of the game. What's the other team going to do? Try to foul your worst free throw shooter and try to stop the clock whenever possible. What does the team with the lead have to do? Hit free throws and not turn the ball over. Pretty basic stuff that has nothing to do with hindsight

KO trusts all his players to hit free throws. Bottom line is everyone should hit their free throws. If KO doesn't put his players in difficult situations now how are they going to react when the game is on the line in a bigger game when they need to hit their free throws. Or he can baby them and sit them down and let CV take all the free throws.

 

[uconnfan68]

Well perhaps its simply a game situation that is unfamiliar to Ollie (and the players).

I see what you did there.

 

[nomar]

Hindsight is 20/20

Maybe the problem is our players aren't?

 

[gtcam]

It is hard to overstate the travesty of last night's game. In order to eke out a homecourt win over one of the worst teams in D1, we had to sit down all four freshmen in the final minutes -- Carlton, Whaley, Polley and Diarra -- and go with four guys who probably have 7-8 games left to play in a UConn uniform. It's February, remember, our freshmen are no longer "freshmen." They're supposed to be contributing members of the team. Their development is supposed to be a top priority. In a season that's going absolutely nowhere, it's time to win with these guys or go down trying. If it were not laughable to say that KO does anything "systematically," one could say that KO is systematically turning what's left of this season into a total irrelevancy, void of purpose or interest.

Tell that to Jay Wright who was forced to play a bunch of freshmen due to foul trouble and lost the game last night because of that.
Playing freshmen who aren't ready for crunch time is not an easy thing to do
Your "no longer freshmen" is a great argument for those who start and play a ton of minutes - not kids who haven't
If he kept them in and they lost last night you and the rest of the hang KO gang would be out for blood with a different argument.

 

[gtcam]

And yet under Ollie, we were perfect in endgame play in the 2014 tourney.

There's lots of people who forget about this because it doesn't fit their current argument
And then there are some who think JC was sending smoke signals to the players from the stands
Not saying that KO is blameless but you can only go as far as the current talent level (due to inexperience or just talent) allows you.

 

[crazyUCfan23]

When you have a late lead and you’re looking to run the clock and get out with the W, your main goals are hitting your free throws and not fouling to stop the clock. It’s so simple in theory.

UConn, with 1:42 left and an eight-point lead, instead keeps a guy in the game who can’t hit free throws and cannot stop himself from fouling. True to form, that player misses the front end of a one and one and he commits his fourth and fifth fouls which sends USF to the line where they score four points.

By 1:03, that player is on the bench with five fouls and the lead is cut in half.

This is like watching an AAU team.

i watched Trinity Catholic almost blow an 8 point lead to Warde last week with 50 sec left. They fouled ward near midcourt twice not even 20 sec apart.

 

[Fishy]

Hindsight is 20/20

No, it’s math.

And simple math at that.

 

[Chief00]

When you have a late lead and you’re looking to run the clock and get out with the W, your main goals are hitting your free throws and not fouling to stop the clock. It’s so simple in theory.

UConn, with 1:42 left and an eight-point lead, instead keeps a guy in the game who can’t hit free throws and cannot stop himself from fouling. True to form, that player misses the front end of a one and one and he commits his fourth and fifth fouls which sends USF to the line where they score four points.

By 1:03, that player is on the bench with five fouls and the lead is cut in half.

This is like watching an AAU team.

Look what an Ivy League degree will do for you. On second thought they must have some UNC type classes.

 

[CL82]

And yet under Ollie, we were perfect in endgame play in the 2014 tourney.

I can think of three things that have changed since then:

 

[Fishy]

As for Dave O vs Carlton, going into the game, Dave O was shooting 64% from the line and Carlton was shooting 68%.

I understand that using his career numbers works against your argument, but good god, Onuorah had converted all of four free throws going into last night’s game. Four. He’s now made four of nine. (Carlton was 21-31.)

He should not have been in the game. Thank you for the laugh.

 

[Pudge]

Gosh

We now see the confluence of Glen Miller & TJ Weist fan boys. Let’s be clear ... replacing Miller is not the cause of this seasons malaise. He was just OK in the first chair; and Ollie needed to make a change. I’m not sure he selected the right guy for gameday.

 

[MuchoDogYears]

Tell that to Jay Wright who was forced to play a bunch of freshmen due to foul trouble and lost the game last night because of that.
Playing freshmen who aren't ready for crunch time is not an easy thing to do
Your "no longer freshmen" is a great argument for those who start and play a ton of minutes - not kids who haven't
If he kept them in and they lost last night you and the rest of the hang KO gang would be out for blood with a different argument.

If the freshmen aren’t good enough to play against the worst team in the league then who are they good enough to play against?

If the freshmen aren’t good enough to beat out DO and AA for minutes, then who are they good enough to beat out for minutes?

If not now, when? What exactly is the goal? For Nova, it’s to get a #1 seed. So sure, you may not want PT for their freshmen.

But UConn? What are we playing for? Avoiding playing the first night of the AAC tourney?

At this point shouldn’t it be to get the freshmen experience this year so they are ready for next?

Nothing personal against DO and AA but they’re marginal D1 players, and 5th year grad transfers to boot. How does playing them improve next years team, or even for that matter, this years?

 

[DMIL]

Sometimes I wonder if all of us were watching the same game. Clearly, UConn is a more skilled basketball team, but USF absolutely killed us inside all night. They out rebounded us 36-27 and they had 15 offensive rebounds to our 5. Their 4 front court guys were 10/14 from 2 point range! USF's front court was too big and strong for UConn's as they go 7'2'' 250 lbs, 6'10" 247 lbs, 6'11" 214 lbs, and 6'6" 223 lbs.

Manderson, a 6'10" 247 lbs senior, had his way inside. He was 6/7 shooting with 8 rebounds in 30 minutes. None of our bigs could cover him, although Onuorah seemed to be the only one who could body him. I'm not arguing that Dave O is a good big, but he is the strongest big we have right now. This was a game in which we needed Cobb.

Our freshmen forwards are not physically ready to compete. Whaley and Polley are listed at 6'8' and 190 lbs, Diarra is listed at 6'8" (doubtful) and 213 lbs, and Carlton is listed at 6'9" and 242 lbs, but he is not strong yet. Dave O is listed at 6'9" and 249 lbs and he is noticeably the strongest big we have without Cobb who is listed at 6'9" and 280 lbs.

You can't double down on USF's bigs without giving them wide open 3s. USF did have some good looks from 3, but they only shot 21%. So, we relied on our bigs to defend USF's bigs and it did not work.

Our guards have more talent than USF's, but even USF's guards were physically stronger than our guards as their 4 guards outweighed our 4 guards by >20lbs. per player.

Just love when folks criticize without facts like this. Coaches and folks in the profession get it. This is just physics. USF has a much bigger, stronger front court and we get significantly outrebounded. What a freakin’ surprise! These outcomes are predictable with this group.

Of course Coach Ollie says we teach them how to rebound, box out and be physical but just have to actually do it in the game. Well....we were outrebounded by a much, bigger and stronger team and that is why this game was close. If our front court guys were a little more experienced, mentally tougher and a bit stronger we win this game by 15 to 20 points. Certainly some of this rebounding gap was just simply players being completely out of position consistently.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

Is it possible that this was all a setup for Terrence Samuel's Senior Night and Brian Gregory was the bone head coach?

 

[USNA90]

Since the topic of rebounding position has come up, I wanted to mention a play from the USF game which stood out in my mind as being a microcosm of UConn’s rebounding troubles. Larrier took a three point corner jumper, and Vital was standing in the opposite corner when the shot went up. When the shot went long and bounced off the rim, it was predictably rebounded on the opposite side of the basket by the player who was guarding Vital, while Vital was still standing in the same spot as if he was nailed there. I have no idea what he was doing. I can understand it if UConn was pulling back after shots, rather than crashing the boards, in order to defend breaks, but he was in no position to do that. Similarly, he was not going to grab a rebound standing in the corner 20 feet away from the rim. I understand he’s a guard, but long shots lead to long rebounds, and he could have had one if he weren’t unfocused/lackadaisical/unprepared (pick one). I see that and I question how much emphasis they put on rebounding.

 

[Kathy]

Since the topic of rebounding position has come up, I wanted to mention a play from the USF game which stood out in my mind as being a microcosm of UConn’s rebounding troubles. Larrier took a three point corner jumper, and Vital was standing in the opposite corner when the shot went up. When the shot went long and bounced off the rim, it was predictably rebounded on the opposite side of the basket by the player who was guarding Vital, while Vital was still standing in the same spot as if he was nailed there. I have no idea what he was doing. I can understand it if UConn was pulling back after shots, rather than crashing the boards, in order to defend breaks, but he was in no position to do that. Similarly, he was not going to grab a rebound standing in the corner 20 feet away from the rim. I understand he’s a guard, but long shots lead to long rebounds, and he could have had one if he weren’t unfocused/lackadaisical/unprepared (pick one). I see that and I question how much emphasis they put on rebounding.

Vital is currently the leading rebounder on this team with 5 a game. I don't think lackadaisical/unfocused/unprepared fits him. He busts ass out there every game. Some nights he is more productive than others but his energy and effort should not be questioned.

 

[imno1]

Sometimes I wonder if all of us were watching the same game. Clearly, UConn is a more skilled basketball team, but USF absolutely killed us inside all night. They out rebounded us 36-27 and they had 15 offensive rebounds to our 5. Their 4 front court guys were 10/14 from 2 point range! USF's front court was too big and strong for UConn's as they go 7'2'' 250 lbs, 6'10" 247 lbs, 6'11" 214 lbs, and 6'6" 223 lbs.

Manderson, a 6'10" 247 lbs senior, had his way inside. He was 6/7 shooting with 8 rebounds in 30 minutes. None of our bigs could cover him, although Onuorah seemed to be the only one who could body him. I'm not arguing that Dave O is a good big, but he is the strongest big we have right now. This was a game in which we needed Cobb.

Our freshmen forwards are not physically ready to compete. Whaley and Polley are listed at 6'8' and 190 lbs, Diarra is listed at 6'8" (doubtful) and 213 lbs, and Carlton is listed at 6'9" and 242 lbs, but he is not strong yet. Dave O is listed at 6'9" and 249 lbs and he is noticeably the strongest big we have without Cobb who is listed at 6'9" and 280 lbs.

You can't double down on USF's bigs without giving them wide open 3s. USF did have some good looks from 3, but they only shot 21%. So, we relied on our bigs to defend USF's bigs and it did not work.

Our guards have more talent than USF's, but even USF's guards were physically stronger than our guards as their 4 guards outweighed our 4 guards by >20lbs. per player.

The strength argument has some validity but our guys are just not active enough. Often getting beat for a rebound or loose ball. Lots of watching and standing around with no instincts or anticipation. We could rebound better if the desire was there.

 

[USNA90]

Vital is currently the leading rebounder on this team with 5 a game. I don't think lackadaisical/unfocused/unprepared fits him. He busts ass out there every game. Some nights he is more productive than others but his energy and effort should not be questioned.

Be that as it may, for whatever reason, he basically stood in the corner while the ball was in the air. While he usually hustles, I saw this play as being a microcosm of UConn’s rebounding effort and IQ.

 

[Doctor Hoop]

Vital is currently the leading rebounder on this team with 5 a game. I don't think lackadaisical/unfocused/unprepared fits him. He busts ass out there every game. Some nights he is more productive than others but his energy and effort should not be questioned.

Vital plays hard, and that effort gets him props and some rebounds. He also is one of our more effective offensive weapons (I realize that may be damning with faint praise, but still ..). OTOH, when will he ever realize that once he gets that defensive rebound he should look upcourt, instead of taking it coast to coast every damn time. Twice in the first half he did that, and predictably charged/turned it over, wasting offensive opportunities. In the second half I did see him kick it out to Larrier on the wing on one of these, but he did a lousy job of making the D commit, and Larrier was closed out on rapidly and couldn't get a clear shot.

Can anyone on this team run a fast break properly?

 

[Palatine]

We don't attack the offensive boards because our transition defense is such a liability.

Other teams attack the offensive board because our fast break self destructs on many occasions so there is little price to pay.

 

[mauconnfan]

Vital is currently the leading rebounder on this team with 5 a game. I don't think lackadaisical/unfocused/unprepared fits him. He busts ass out there every game. Some nights he is more productive than others but his energy and effort should not be questioned.

The only thing is he needs some fundamentals thrown into his game. I mean the next time he slows down on a fast break with the ball, stops at the foul line to deliver a pass to a cutter will be ummm......his first! He isn't a real smart player for now, but he's a tough SOB who plays hard. As mentioned above a solid first guard off the bench of a good team is what he should be, it fits his game. But you are correct, energy and effort should not be questioned with CV.

 

[Travelman6]

The only thing is he needs some fundamentals thrown into his game. I mean the next time he slows down on a fast break with the ball, stops at the foul line to deliver a pass to a cutter will be ummm.his first! He isn't a real smart player for now, but he's a tough SOB who plays hard. As mentioned above a solid first guard off the bench of a good team is what he should be, it fits his game. But you are correct, energy and effort should not be questioned with CV.

Not possible to question his effort. But does effort supercede BBIQ? I am not sure. I just really like CV so I am not the one to ask.

 

[RichZ]

Does anyone remember just how damned good CV played last year - particularly in the 2nd half of the season?

 

[UConnNick]

If the freshmen aren’t good enough to play against the worst team in the league then who are they good enough to play against?

If the freshmen aren’t good enough to beat out DO and AA for minutes, then who are they good enough to beat out for minutes?

If not now, when? What exactly is the goal? For Nova, it’s to get a #1 seed. So sure, you may not want PT for their freshmen.

But UConn? What are we playing for? Avoiding playing the first night of the AAC tourney?

At this point shouldn’t it be to get the freshmen experience this year so they are ready for next?

Nothing personal against DO and AA but they’re marginal D1 players, and 5th year grad transfers to boot. How does playing them improve next years team, or even for that matter, this years?

There's an angry mob of Husky fans who want to see Ollie launched into a perpetual outer space orbit. Does anybody think he's not aware of this fact?

In this context, does anybody really think he's focused on developing the freshmen for next year's team? He's likely not too sure whether he's even going to be here next year. In that mindset, I'd say he's putting the players on the floor at crunch time in a tight game that he thinks give us the best chance to win those type games. If that means he uses two grad transfers because they have the most experience in such situations, then that's what he's going to do. It may be right, it may be wrong, but that's him coaching for wins so he can try to hang on to his job.

 

[Chief00]

Since the topic of rebounding position has come up, I wanted to mention a play from the USF game which stood out in my mind as being a microcosm of UConn’s rebounding troubles. Larrier took a three point corner jumper, and Vital was standing in the opposite corner when the shot went up. When the shot went long and bounced off the rim, it was predictably rebounded on the opposite side of the basket by the player who was guarding Vital, while Vital was still standing in the same spot as if he was nailed there. I have no idea what he was doing. I can understand it if UConn was pulling back after shots, rather than crashing the boards, in order to defend breaks, but he was in no position to do that. Similarly, he was not going to grab a rebound standing in the corner 20 feet away from the rim. I understand he’s a guard, but long shots lead to long rebounds, and he could have had one if he weren’t unfocused/lackadaisical/unprepared (pick one). I see that and I question how much emphasis they put on rebounding.

Quite frankly, I agree the work done before the ball hits the rim will often decide who gets the rebound. Chief always loved rebounding when a bad shooting teammate took a shot because it was likely there would be a reward. So this team has no excuse not to hit the offensive glass.

 

[Chief00]

Vital plays hard, and that effort gets him props and some rebounds. He also is one of our more effective offensive weapons (I realize that may be damning with faint praise, but still ..). OTOH, when will he ever realize that once he gets that defensive rebound he should look upcourt, instead of taking it coast to coast every damn time. Twice in the first half he did that, and predictably charged/turned it over, wasting offensive opportunities. In the second half I did see him kick it out to Larrier on the wing on one of these, but he did a lousy job of making the D commit, and Larrier was closed out on rapidly and couldn't get a clear shot.

Can anyone on this team run a fast break properly?

Good points - but who is that point guard who gets the ball?