Debate Over For Now

[chrissaran]

Yogi 13 World Series and Mariano 5.

 

[FairView]

Mo, who is the greatest reliever of all time and who's postseason career against the best teams was even more remarkable.
Again, I am not saying Yogi isn't great, he WAS but relative to his position and his teammates, he's not in the top 5, in my humble opinion.
DT, Stewie, Maya, Lobo, Bird are my top 5 (just to bring the thread back on point).

DT, Stewie, Maya, Bird, Tina ... if she'd won another championship I'd be considering Napheesa. The amazing thing about my five, or anyone's UConn top five, is the amazing talents you don't choose. Is a top 10 bette? Or is it the same problem when considering numbers 8-14. The trials and tribulations of fandom when your program is the best ever.

 

[cbraarj]

When Maya was a Sr.

What? Over Maya? No way. As the 1st true UConn Star, I get the adulation but to say she's better than Maya, Lobo or Stewie...you lost me. Yogi Berra was one of the greatest wa of all time, is in the Hall of Fame, but he swould be hard pressed to be included in the top 5 Yankees of all time as it is an AWESOME list. Same here for Ms. Bascom.

When Maya was a Sr. at UConn. Geno C.D. Shea and Marissa did a Dinner with the Coaches with a Q & A afterwards. One question given to Geno was who he would have taking the last shot? Before he could answer the audience shouted out Taurasi! He didn't have to answer but then he said Kerry Bascom because she had to hit those shots and handled it well like Diana! Maya or Stewie never hit those shots at UConn but Diana, Kerry and Sue did! It's not adulation because I never did that for any player! When I coached or played and especially a fan! No what you're talking about before commenting. You have a bad habit of doing that! I agree with Geno about Kerry! Write Geno and disagree!

 

[DefenseBB]

What are

When Maya was a Sr.
When Maya was a Sr. at UConn. Geno C.D. Shea and Marissa did a Dinner with the Coaches with a Q & A afterwards. One question given to Geno was who he would have taking the last shot? Before he could answer the audience shouted out Taurasi! He didn't have to answer but then he said Kerry Bascom because she had to hit those shots and handled it well like Diana! Maya or Stewie never hit those shots at UConn but Diana, Kerry and Sue did! It's not adulation because I never did that for any player! When I coached or played and especially a fan! No what you're talking about before commenting. You have a bad habit of doing that! I agree with Geno about Kerry! Write Geno and disagree!

As we are talking about a T-shirt and all the accolades that were listed and that morphed into Sue Bird as she was wearing that T-Shirt, you added Kerry, to which I simply responded Maya and noted how very good a player Kerry was but simply is not as accomplished as Maya who's T-shirt would be eerily similar to DTs.

• 4× WNBA champion (2011, 2013, 2015, 2017)
• WNBA Finals MVP (2013)
• WNBA MVP (2014)
• 6× WNBA All-Star (2011, 2013–2015, 2017–2018)
• 3× WNBA All-Star Game MVP (2015, 2017, 2018)
• 5× All-WNBA First Team (2013–2017)
• 2× All-WNBA Second Team (2012, 2018)
• 2× WNBA All-Defensive Second Team (2014, 2017)
• WNBA steals leader (2018)
• WNBA scoring leader (2014)
• WNBA Rookie of the Year (2011)
• WNBA All-Rookie Team (2011)
• WNBA Top 20@20 (2016)
• FIBA World Championship MVP (2014)
• 2× EuroLeague Women champion (2012, 2018)
• Liga Femenina champion (2012)
• 3× WCBA champion (2013–2015)
• 2× NCAA champion (2009–2010)
• 4× AP All-America First Team (2008-2011)
• 3× CoSIDA Academic All-America First Team (2009–2011)
• 4× WBCA Coaches' All-America Team (2008–2011)
• 4× USBWA All-America Team (2008–2011)
• 3× Wade Trophy (2009–2011)
• 2× Naismith College Player of the Year (2009, 2011)
• 2× John R. Wooden Award (2009, 2011)
• 2× AP College Player of the Year (2009, 2011)
• 2× USBWA Women's National Player of the Year (2009, 2011)
• 2x Honda Sports Award for basketball (2010, 2011)
• 3× Big East Player of the Year (2008, 2009, 2011)
• 2× Academic All-America of the Year (2010–2011)
• All-sports Academic All-America of the Year (2011)
• NCAA Tournament Most Outstanding Player (2010)
• USBWA National Freshman of the Year (2008)

So, not sure where you come up with "no" (?) vs. "know" what you're talking about". Maya's credentials for a T-shirt and what she's done for UConn and BB and LIFE all are deserving of top 3.

 

[Zanzman]

Except that, as an everyday catcher, Yogi was on the field a LOT more than the great Mariano. And arguably the greatest catcher of all-time. Finally, Berra had a higher career WAR. It's an interesting discussion.

How many of those was Berra in the outfield and not behind the plate

 

[cbraarj]

What are

As we are talking about a T-shirt and all the accolades that were listed and that morphed into Sue Bird as she was wearing that T-Shirt, you added Kerry, to which I simply responded Maya and noted how very good a player Kerry was but simply is not as accomplished as Maya who's T-shirt would be eerily similar to DTs.

• 4× WNBA champion (2011, 2013, 2015, 2017)
• WNBA Finals MVP (2013)
• WNBA MVP (2014)
• 6× WNBA All-Star (2011, 2013–2015, 2017–2018)
• 3× WNBA All-Star Game MVP (2015, 2017, 2018)
• 5× All-WNBA First Team (2013–2017)
• 2× All-WNBA Second Team (2012, 2018)
• 2× WNBA All-Defensive Second Team (2014, 2017)
• WNBA steals leader (2018)
• WNBA scoring leader (2014)
• WNBA Rookie of the Year (2011)
• WNBA All-Rookie Team (2011)
• WNBA Top 20@20 (2016)
• FIBA World Championship MVP (2014)
• 2× EuroLeague Women champion (2012, 2018)
• Liga Femenina champion (2012)
• 3× WCBA champion (2013–2015)
• 2× NCAA champion (2009–2010)
• 4× AP All-America First Team (2008-2011)
• 3× CoSIDA Academic All-America First Team (2009–2011)
• 4× WBCA Coaches' All-America Team (2008–2011)
• 4× USBWA All-America Team (2008–2011)
• 3× Wade Trophy (2009–2011)
• 2× Naismith College Player of the Year (2009, 2011)
• 2× John R. Wooden Award (2009, 2011)
• 2× AP College Player of the Year (2009, 2011)
• 2× USBWA Women's National Player of the Year (2009, 2011)
• 2x Honda Sports Award for basketball (2010, 2011)
• 3× Big East Player of the Year (2008, 2009, 2011)
• 2× Academic All-America of the Year (2010–2011)
• All-sports Academic All-America of the Year (2011)
• NCAA Tournament Most Outstanding Player (2010)
• USBWA National Freshman of the Year (2008)

So, not sure where you come up with "no" (?) vs. "know" what you're talking about". Maya's credentials for a T-shirt and what she's done for UConn and BB and LIFE all are deserving of top 3.

The question was about the last shot at UConn! That is what I responded to and because you are wrong! So keep being the guy who can never admit he's wrong! You add all this other stuff to make you feel good! The three players to take the last shot in UConn history are Dee, Bird and Bascom!!!

 

[bluedevil]

How many of those was Berra in the outfield and not behind the plate

260

 

[Zanzman]

I looked it up and saw that I always thought he played OF more To get Elston Howard’s bat in the lineup thou it was before my time

 

[Boreifs]

I looked it up and saw that I always thought he played OF more To get Elston Howard’s bat in the lineup thou it was before my time

Howard’s bat AND glove! He was a great catcher, even if he always stepped out of the box too soon on intentional walks! No ump ever called him on it, though.

 

[Zanzman]

Howard’s bat AND glove! He was a great catcher, even if he always stepped out of the box too soon on intentional walks! No ump ever called him on it, though.

But reading up on Berra he was considered a good catcher also

 

[JonathanXIV]

How many of those was Berra in the outfield and not behind the plate

262 games as an outfielder. And 1696 as a catcher. And 3 MVPs as a catcher.

 

[JonathanXIV]

The question was about the last shot at UConn! That is what I responded to and because you are wrong! So keep being the guy who can never admit he's wrong! You add all this other stuff to make you feel good! The three players to take the last shot in UConn history are Dee, Bird and Bascom!!!

Why are you yelling? And I don’t understand your argument - only 3 UConn players took the last shot? It’s a shame that the teams that they didn’t play on had no one to take the last shot.

 

[Boreifs]

But reading up on Berra he was considered a good catcher also

Of course he was, but from 1961-63 he was 36-38 years old.

 

[ncteacher]

Yogi 13 World Series and Mariano 5.

I never prescribed to the, "Won Championships" determines if someone is great or not. If so, Frankie Crosetti would be one of sports greatest athletes. Hint: he isn't. However, he won 17 championships, 9 as a player and 8 as a coach. Other multiple championship winners that I can think of off the top of my head are Will Perdue and Curt Rambis who I believe won four and three respectively. Who is better Karl Malone or one of those two? Sometimes you just have to be lucky. You can be sitting on the far end of the bench and win a championship, or you could be the key component on a team that never got over the hump. People use the argument about Bill Russell winning eleven all the time. That was before my time, but it could be possible that he had a pretty good team around him. I have always considered Chamberlain the best based on shear individual numbers. Even that is subjective, because someone like Jordan (or DT) made those around them better, and that might be as important.

 

[bluedevil]

Only tennis players, golfers and chess players can truly be judged on wins alone and maybe bowlers too...

 

[j66kicker]

I never prescribed to the, "Won Championships" determines if someone is great or not. If so, Frankie Crosetti would be one of sports greatest athletes. Hint: he isn't. However, he won 17 championships, 9 as a player and 8 as a coach. Other multiple championship winners that I can think of off the top of my head are Will Perdue and Curt Rambis who I believe won four and three respectively. Who is better Karl Malone or one of those two? Sometimes you just have to be lucky. You can be sitting on the far end of the bench and win a championship, or you could be the key component on a team that never got over the hump. People use the argument about Bill Russell winning eleven all the time. That was before my time, but it could be possible that he had a pretty good team around him. I have always considered Chamberlain the best based on shear individual numbers. Even that is subjective, because someone like Jordan (or DT) made those around them better, and that might be as important.

Championships are certainly not the only criteria for greatness, but IMO they absolutely are a required one (So... Frankie Crosetti - no way. And Ted Williams - no way).

"It don't mean a thing if you ain't got that ring."

 

[JonathanXIV]

In a team sport where one individual, no matter how transcendent, has only a small impact on the final outcome, it's silly to make a championship a requirement when determining the "greatness" of a player. Take a look at Ted Williams page at Baseball Reference and then tell me he is not a top 10 all time player. And Willie Mays, perhaps the greatest of them all, only won 1 championship. Does that diminish his greatness? I don't think so.

 

[DefenseBB]

The question was about the last shot at UConn! That is what I responded to and because you are wrong! So keep being the guy who can never admit he's wrong! You add all this other stuff to make you feel good! The three players to take the last shot in UConn history are Dee, Bird and Bascom!!!

 

[j66kicker]

View attachment 58120

But, "Who from UConn would you have take the last shot?" is way too easy. No thought required. DT all the way!

Now can we get back to whether Ted Williams was a whiny loser?

 

[Steelerone]

Except that, as an everyday catcher, Yogi was on the field a LOT more than the great Mariano. And arguably the greatest catcher of all-time. Finally, Berra had a higher career WAR. It's an interesting discussion.

Jonathan, you are completely accurate. Anyone who has ever played organized baseball from Little Leage, Pony League, Babe Ruth League, to college or pro, knows that catcher is, without argument, the most difficult position in the game. He is responsible for knowing each hitter and where to defend him. He has to handle every pitch from a blazing fast ball to a "Where the hell is it" knuckler. It is no coincidence that the majority of players who move on to managerial positions are drawn from the catcher's ranks. They have to be not only tough but intelligent. Anyone who thinks that Yogi didn't possess these qualities in abundance probably only zeroed in on some of his gaffes while using the English language. Don't kid yourself. Many of these were thought out. He made a small fortune in endorsements when most other players were getting pennies on the dollar and was also one of the first players in any sport to have his own "museum."

 

[Steelerone]

View attachment 58120

Defense, I thinnk Strother Martin is one of the three or four greatest character actors ever. That line in "Cool Hand Luck" immortalized him.