Dartmouth basketball team is unionizing

[HuskyNan]

 

[CTBballfan243]

If I’m Dartmouth I announce that we are terminating the men’s basketball program.

 

[HooperScooper]

So if you aren't getting paid then how are you an employee? Any labor relation experts on here?

 

[huskymedic]

So if you aren't getting paid then how are you an employee? Any labor relation experts on here?

Assisted access <

The Athletic’s view w/ backstory: Dartmouth men’s basketball players file NLRB petition to unionize

 

[Inyatkin]

If I’m Dartmouth I announce that we are terminating the men’s basketball program.

History shows that's a flawless strategy with no downsides

 

[Viet Vet]

If I’m Dartmouth I announce that we are terminating the men’s basketball program.

It's been on life support for decades.

In the last 25 years this "program" has had one winning season, an overall record of 220-453 (.327), an Ivy League record of 100-236 (.298). BTW, that one winning season was 25 years ago.

 

[auror]

So if you aren't getting paid then how are you an employee? Any labor relation experts on here?

Whether or not NCAA athletes are employees is extremely disputed territory. Courts have been hearing it off and on for years now. The NLRB thinks they are, but the courts have often sided with NCAA. The 3rd Circuit is due to hear on it soon I think.

 

[uconngb]

It's been on life support for decades.

In the last 25 years this "program" has had one winning season, an overall record of 220-453 (.327), an Ivy League record of 100-236 (.298). BTW, that one winning season was 25 years ago.

Sounds more like they have been out on strike for decades........

 

[krinklecut]

Hell yeah, this is awesome. Huge proponent of everyone being in a union.

 

[superjohn]

Hell yeah, this is awesome. Huge proponent of everyone being in a union.

Why? Can't tell if you're serious or not.

 

[navery12]

If I’m Dartmouth I announce that we are terminating the men’s basketball program.

Tell me you paid zero attention in history class without telling me

 

[upstater]

Whether or not NCAA athletes are employees is extremely disputed territory. Courts have been hearing it off and on for years now. The NLRB thinks they are, but the courts have often sided with NCAA. The 3rd Circuit is due to hear on it soon I think.

NLRB has ruled 3 ways on the issues of students as employees, but almost always they only address private universities, not public ones. I think public U's are covered by state laws. In some states, public employees have the right to unionize, in others they don't.

1st decision:
"In its decision in New York University (NYU), 332 NLRB 1205 (2000), the NLRB held that certain university graduate students were statutory employees. Applying the common-law agency test, the NLRB concluded that these students fell within the statutory definition of employee and noted that the collective bargaining process was feasible in the university context. "

2nd decision: "NLRB decision says graduate students are not statutory employees. The National Labor Relations Board has upheld Brown University's argument on appeal that graduate teaching assistants are students – not statutory employees – and are therefore not an appropriate unit for collective bargaining. The NLRB overruled NYU in Brown University, 342 NLRB 483 (2004). In Brown University, the NLRB held that the graduate students, teaching assistants and research assistants did not fall under the statutory definition of employee. The NLRB reasoned that these individuals have a predominantly academic relationship with the school and their job positions arise only because the individual is a student."

3rd decision: "In 2016, the NLRB changed positions again in Columbia University, 364 NLRB No. 90 (2016), overruling Brown University, reinstating NYU, and asserting its jurisdiction over colleges and universities, indicating that an employment relationship can still exist even though the employee is also a student."

Then in 2020, the NLRB issued a new rule to cut through matters. They stated that students who received tuition remission should, as a matter of course, sign waivers affirming that they are NOT employees and that they are students.

The 2020 declaration would need to be legally tested, and I'm not sure that any university has used that language in the offering of scholarships. If they have, the NLRB has already said they would recognize its validity.

 

[andy34]

Why? Can't tell if you're serious or not.

OP is certainly welcome to share his own thoughts, but I believe everyone deserves to be empowered with a democratic say in all avenues of life. Certainly in the workplace, but also in government and in civil society as well. When union participation was much higher in the post-WWII era, wages were much higher (adjusted for inflation) and the American "middle class" was created. Union participation has declined in recent decades, and income inequality has correspondingly risen.

 

[QuickDraw]

Unions suck, their appeal is to the least of us. If you have more talent or drive than the next guy you command a higher wage and deservedly so, period. I have left 2 in my life & would only recommend it to those who had to ride the short bus.

 

[auror]

NLRB has ruled 3 ways on the issues of students as employees, but almost always they only address private universities, not public ones. I think public U's are covered by state laws. In some states, public employees have the right to unionize, in others they don't.

1st decision:
"In its decision in New York University (NYU), 332 NLRB 1205 (2000), the NLRB held that certain university graduate students were statutory employees. Applying the common-law agency test, the NLRB concluded that these students fell within the statutory definition of employee and noted that the collective bargaining process was feasible in the university context. "

2nd decision: "NLRB decision says graduate students are not statutory employees. The National Labor Relations Board has upheld Brown University's argument on appeal that graduate teaching assistants are students – not statutory employees – and are therefore not an appropriate unit for collective bargaining. The NLRB overruled NYU in Brown University, 342 NLRB 483 (2004). In Brown University, the NLRB held that the graduate students, teaching assistants and research assistants did not fall under the statutory definition of employee. The NLRB reasoned that these individuals have a predominantly academic relationship with the school and their job positions arise only because the individual is a student."

3rd decision: "In 2016, the NLRB changed positions again in Columbia University, 364 NLRB No. 90 (2016), overruling Brown University, reinstating NYU, and asserting its jurisdiction over colleges and universities, indicating that an employment relationship can still exist even though the employee is also a student."

Then in 2020, the NLRB issued a new rule to cut through matters. They stated that students who received tuition remission should, as a matter of course, sign waivers affirming that they are NOT employees and that they are students.

The 2020 declaration would need to be legally tested, and I'm not sure that any university has used that language in the offering of scholarships. If they have, the NLRB has already said they would recognize its validity.

Also this:

NLRB files complaint vs. NCAA, Pac-12, USC

The National Labor Relations Board issued a complaint against the NCAA, the Pac-12 and USC for unfair labor practices.

www.espn.com

"The conduct of USC, the Pac-12 conference, and the NCAA, as joint employers, deprives their players of their statutory right to organize and to join together to improve their working and playing conditions if they wish to do so," said NLRB general counsel Jennifer Abruzzo. "Our aim is to ensure that these players, as workers like any other, can fully and freely exercise their rights."
...
The decision by Abruzzo's staff to pursue all three groups as joint employers creates the possibility that all college athletes could be granted the right to unionize as a result of this case. The NLRB doesn't have jurisdiction over public universities, so the courts would need to determine that conferences and the NCAA act as an employer in order for their decision to apply to all schools competing in college sports.

Not an expert on this, but I think it would be a tough sell to say the Pac-12 or NCAA are the employers.

 

[Chin Diesel]

 

[John]

Unions suck, their appeal is to the least of us. If you have more talent or drive than the next guy you command a higher wage and deservedly so, period. I have left 2 in my life & would only recommend it to those who had to ride the short bus.

the least of us including those who fought for the safer working conditions that you currently enjoy?

 

[krinklecut]

Unions suck, their appeal is to the least of us. If you have more talent or drive than the next guy you command a higher wage and deservedly so, period. I have left 2 in my life & would only recommend it to those who had to ride the short bus.

Wrong.

 

[krinklecut]

Why? Can't tell if you're serious or not.

I’m very serious. Any group of people whose labor is being used to enrich others deserve to bargain collectively.

Power belongs to the workers.

 

[krinklecut]

OP is certainly welcome to share his own thoughts, but I believe everyone deserves to be empowered with a democratic say in all avenues of life. Certainly in the workplace, but also in government and in civil society as well. When union participation was much higher in the post-WWII era, wages were much higher (adjusted for inflation) and the American "middle class" was created. Union participation has declined in recent decades, and income inequality has correspondingly risen.

✊✊

 

[superjohn]

OP is certainly welcome to share his own thoughts, but I believe everyone deserves to be empowered with a democratic say in all avenues of life. Certainly in the workplace, but also in government and in civil society as well. When union participation was much higher in the post-WWII era, wages were much higher (adjusted for inflation) and the American "middle class" was created. Union participation has declined in recent decades, and income inequality has correspondingly risen.

I think I believed this in my 20's. They sound great in theory but seeing them up close in practice I recognized they're everything that's wrong with today's politics and littered with the same corruption.

 

[Fishy]

It’s just grievance cosplay.

Go ahead and unionize, Darthmouth basketball players. Right those wrongs.