Contentment with the new big East as a permanent home

[Ha Who]

Where is the data -- at least so far -- to counteract my statement? Don't have any? Don't call it lame ass or nonsense.

Northeast States

worldpopulationreview.com

 

[GoatHouse]

I'm "content" with the Big East right now, but I'd be lying saying that I wouldn't rather be in a P5 conference as the end-goal.

Don't get me wrong - renewed regional rivalries & MSG is amazing. But, as a school that aims to be at the highest of competition in every sport (football is slowly getting there), then we should be shooting for a P5 conference with other large, state flagship schools.

Loving being in the BE though, great to be home and to get our BB programs back where they need to be.

 

[Waquoit]

I'm "content" with the Big East right now, but I'd be lying saying that I wouldn't rather be in a P5 conference as the end-goal.

Of course it's the end goal. It's still the end goal. The argument is whether the former roadmap was better with it's destruction of the hoop teams and total lack of interest in the other conference teams by the fanbase; or the current plan featuring that featured the immediate rejuvenation of hoop.

 

[HuskyHawk]

The Big 12 is at worst the 3rd best football league and ranks as the #1 basketball conference.
There is no process to take away their autonomy designation. It's foolishness to think they'll lose status with those metrics.

As for the NBE, that option could have been initiated at any time. That league was never saying no to bringing in UConn, considering that all of their members are so much weaker than UConn. They don't get much money and UConn helps them more than the NBE helps UConn.
UConn could've easily waited to see what the AAC looks like coming out of realignment, to THEN decide if it was time to give up on P5 status, aka autonomy.

We did wait. We were all in and made our pitch to the Big 12. They said no to everybody. Since the AAC TV deal was a death sentence, and the league had killed our basketball enthusiasm and recruiting, we made the move. Then the SEC made its move and the Big 12 was forced to expand. Leaving the AAC was the right move at the time, and given the state of our football program I don't think we would have made the cut for the B12.

 

[nomar]

Boise State, Memphis, Cincinnati, UCF, Louisville, all P5 or bound for the P5.

Meanwhile, our fans crouch up in a corner and cry, "we are never going P5!!!11!1!"

Clearly, something is wrong.

Yes, our football program sucks.

 

[nomar]

You are a moron.

I admire your persistence in trying to prove it.

When I make a crappy argument that is almost immediately disproven, I hope people forget; I don't spend the next year reminding everyone on a daily basis about how stupid my argument was.

 

[ClifSpliffy]

Yes, our football program sucks.

Yes, our football program sucks
sucked. ftfy.
now, less sucky, moar like plucky. new and improved UConn football,
'less sucky, more plucky.'
can't wait til we get 'lucky' into that one too.

 

[Hans Sprungfeld]

This is getting weird, are you a Branch Davidian?

^ Good one.

I consider this thread @BapeKidd88 's 'coming out' party, and now he can go back in.

After posting strangely with a negative vibe, he's now revealed his angle and clearly knows that most here aren't buying what he's selling...particularly as we enter October with general excitement about the upcoming season.

Having conducted his research project, he can now repair to the FB & CR boards. Anything more from him is really just whining or trolling, and @freescooter has that market cornered.

 

[NoMansLand]

Here is where you argument really falls apart. The Big 12 payout with Oklahoma and Texas was $34.5 million apiece. Estimates are that the renegotiation will cut that by half to two thirds. If that is the case they are basically operating with the AAC contract. None of the remaining schools will be able to keep up with the true Power 4. They will hemorrhage money like all the AAC teams and die a slow death. The only question I have for you is what team do you actually root for? I’m truly curious.

That is how much they would get if they stayed at 8. Expanding to 12 with the schools that they added and with the Tier 3 rights likely pushes that payout back up to 25 to 30 million apiece.

 

[NoMansLand]

OU and UT were the entire conference. Anyone who disagrees is a fan of a Big XII team or doesn't pay any attention. They're going to be AAC+ not P5 lite

Not trying at all, that may be wishful thinking on your part. Right now the New Big 12 would have 4 ranked football teams and 3 more receiving votes. They're still a P5 conference.

 

[Slasher]

There is so much bad information in this thread.

1) There's no doubt of the available options, UConn in the NBE is the best outcome. The AAC is now terrible. Until one of the ACC, B1G or Big 12 come calling, this is the best option. Period.

2) The Big 12 will continue to be an A5 conference, did they lose brand name cachet? Of course. But it's still the 3rd best football conference most years.

3) Big 12 basketball will arguably be the #1 conference in basketball. The KenPom ratings show us that the new makeup only slightly lowers the prowess over the last 7+ years. If you dig into the numbers, UCF is what kills the new big 12 numbers, but they've been much better under Dawkins.

4) UConn should and would take a Big 12 invite if it came. Better basketball league, schools that would be considered peers and obviously more money.

5) Big 12 is going to take a pay cut, but not that big of one. Remember, TV deal is only a portion of the payout of a P5 conference. They get huge sums of money from bowls, the playoff and ncaa tournament. Also, the Big 12 DOES NOT own tier 3 rights. So those distributions that the teams getting exclude that important piece of revenue.

 

[UCSouth]

Do you ever talk about anything constructive or just linger around and take potshots at everyone who thinks differently than you - looking for laughs and likes?
Babetwit88, Moronscooter, Chief00 digger - you have way too much time on your hands

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to offend you and the high moral ground you preach from. But, don't you get tired of their antics? Use the ignore feature and you'll be able to enjoy your time here without me ruining it for you. As far as too much time on my hands...retirement has a way of doing that for you. Can you suggest a hobby?

 

[The Shot]

There is so much bad information in this thread.

I agree but you’ve added to it. Below is testimony from the Baylor AD speaking specifically about Texas and Oklahoma leaving.

Rhoades said the financial implications could put into question upcoming projects -- including the building of a new basketball arena -- and affect academic opportunities for students. Rhoades said the school, like others impacted, will also struggle to attract and keep talent on the field and in coaching staffs.

"The economic impact is real," Rhoades said less than four months after the men's basketball team won the NCAA championship. "If we are no longer a member of a Power Five, we will sell less tickets, we will sell less merchandise, we will raise less money and we will have less corporate sponsorship."

You cannot lose your two best assets and backfill with schools who were previously deemed to dilute the value of the league. The Big 12 already makes nearly less than half of what the SEC makes and then halve that number again. You are no longer power 5 if you make roughly $18 million and other schools are making $70 million. If you think bowl revenue and tier 3 rights make up for it you’ve never actually looked into it. For instance, the SEC which is the best football conference, took home $80 million to be spilt amongst there members.

Link

So at best the Big 12 will get $6-$7 million a year. And estimated tier 3 rights in 2018 were between $6-$8 million for the remaining teams in the Big 12.

Link

The best scenario is that they will be making $30 million all in per year and likely with the drop off in football quality, closer to $25-28 million. Better than us but not power 5 money.

If you are a private university like Baylor with AD budget of roughly $110 million how the heck do you keep afloat on $28 million per year? There are no public subsidies to prop you up. Tickets don’t get you there. You better have amazing boosters I guess?

 

[GoatHouse]

Of course it's the end goal. It's still the end goal. The argument is whether the former roadmap was better with it's destruction of the hoop teams and total lack of interest in the other conference teams by the fanbase; or the current plan featuring that featured the immediate rejuvenation of hoop.

I wouldn't say that's the complete argument lol, he's asking about the future of UConn not the past. The OP explicitly asks in the opening of the post:

If UConn never leaves Xavier, St John’s, Butler, Villanova, DePaul, Georgetown, Creighton, Marquette, Seton Hall, and Providence, is everyone fine with that?

I said: No, we should be aiming for higher. In fact he doesn't even reference the AAC in that post, but it obviously comes up indirectly by the nature of the situation.

 

[UCDaveD]

Well then, help be a part of the solution.

Does @nomar have eligibility left?

 

[JMick]

Not trying at all, that may be wishful thinking on your part. Right now the New Big 12 would have 4 ranked football teams and 3 more receiving votes. They're still a P5 conference.

no one cares. it's a bunch of schools no one wants to watch. their media deal is going to be awful compared to the current Big XII deal. lets see how the schools not named UCF and Cinci deal with highly reduced media money. no matter what the talking heads will tell you, being "P5" isn't about anything other than money.

 

[Slasher]

So at best the Big 12 will get $6-$7 million a year. And estimated tier 3 rights in 2018 were between $6-$8 million for the remaining teams in the Big 12.

The best scenario is that they will be making $30 million all in per year and likely with the drop off in football quality, closer to $25-28 million. Better than us but not power 5 money.

If you are a private university like Baylor with AD budget of roughly $110 million how the heck do you keep afloat on $28 million per year? There are no public subsidies to prop you up. Tickets don’t get you there. You better have amazing boosters I guess?

I don't disagree that the current Big 12 schools will be hurting. But the new additions are getting a lot more money. And I seriously doubt the TV contract is only going to pay $6-7M. That's what the AAC is getting with crap schools like Tulsa, ECU, and Tulane. BYU isn't Texas or Oklahoma but they're a national program with a large following. I expect the TV payout to be in the $12-$15M per school per year.

EDIT: Also remember a lot those "estimates" were made based on just the remaining eight with no net new additions. BYU, Cincinnati and UCF are likely more valuable to TV then some of the existing members of the Big 12.

 

[Pudge]

if the UT Austin budget is $255m - as was stated in the Texas legislative session, at what time do like Programs look at the Dog Dish and say: "why the hell are we feeding Vanderbilt?"

Why Missouri. Why this why that. AND you cut it to have 8 Elite U's. See this is a decade away or not? The idea that the SEC is gonna just keep these free riders in ... is not the way the world works.

 

[olehead]

Funny how they actually committed to football and are going to be in a basketball conference we can only dream about. Of course MSG. The NOOB has fewer top 25 preseason teams than THE AAC in the 24-7 preseason rankings, and don’t even compare it with the B12. Villanova is to the NOOB what Gonzaga is to the west coast conference. The NOOB is a nice regional league with a single great team. If it is our long term home it means UConn has essentially given up being a major athletic power and is content being a regional program, essentially UMass. That, fellas and gals is reality.

While AAC hoops might be surging a bit, remember its preseason. Penny has yet to put his guys on the floor against DI 3rd, 4th, and 5th year vets. This is where Penny folds and inevitably loses to teams with experience, depth, and a hardened edge to them. The AAC is not deep enough to have six or seven conference losses and make the tournament, not even this year.

So, imma take a wait and see approach with the AAC. Penny's had mad talent before. If he folds, that will obviously hurt bids. Let's see how the AAC looks when its Houston winning the conference and WSU and maybe SMU or somebody like that, battling it out for second.

 

[Ratso]

This is our future conference schedule had we stayed in the AAC:

Wichita
Tulsa
SMU
Tulane
Colorado State
Air Force
Temple
Memphis
USF
ECU
UAB

If you rather share a basketball conference with this mess, I don't know what to tell ya...

 

[Ratso]

 

[nomar]

Does @nomar have eligibility left?

This sounds like a pitch for the straight-to-video sequel of Necessary Roughness

 

[ClifSpliffy]

I agree but you’ve added to it. Below is testimony from the Baylor AD speaking specifically about Texas and Oklahoma leaving.

Rhoades said the financial implications could put into question upcoming projects -- including the building of a new basketball arena -- and affect academic opportunities for students. Rhoades said the school, like others impacted, will also struggle to attract and keep talent on the field and in coaching staffs.

"The economic impact is real," Rhoades said less than four months after the men's basketball team won the NCAA championship. "If we are no longer a member of a Power Five, we will sell less tickets, we will sell less merchandise, we will raise less money and we will have less corporate sponsorship."

You cannot lose your two best assets and backfill with schools who were previously deemed to dilute the value of the league. The Big 12 already makes nearly less than half of what the SEC makes and then halve that number again. You are no longer power 5 if you make roughly $18 million and other schools are making $70 million. If you think bowl revenue and tier 3 rights make up for it you’ve never actually looked into it. For instance, the SEC which is the best football conference, took home $80 million to be spilt amongst there members.

Link

So at best the Big 12 will get $6-$7 million a year. And estimated tier 3 rights in 2018 were between $6-$8 million for the remaining teams in the Big 12.

Link

The best scenario is that they will be making $30 million all in per year and likely with the drop off in football quality, closer to $25-28 million. Better than us but not power 5 money.

If you are a private university like Baylor with AD budget of roughly $110 million how the heck do you keep afloat on $28 million per year? There are no public subsidies to prop you up. Tickets don’t get you there. You better have amazing boosters I guess?

'You better have amazing boosters I guess?'
u guessed right, their $1.4 billion endowment has been sending out around $70 million annually.
that ad's shpiel was just another recognition that football cash drives the college sports bus, and he just won the men's bball championship.

 

[Goatmeat]

The Big 12 is at worst the 3rd best football league and ranks as the #1 basketball conference.
There is no process to take away their autonomy designation. It's foolishness to think they'll lose status with those metrics.

This is 100% correct. The big 12 will continue to be an autonomous power 5 conference, whether people here like it or not. The discussion of UConn getting into the big 12 is independent of that…but there will still be 5 power conferences and the big 12 is included. There is zero evidence to suggest otherwise - it is an interesting talking point though.

 

[Zissou]

I’m content with UConn in the Big East.

if somehow the BIG Ten came calling you’d take it as a great move for football and money, even though the hoops would be a downgrade.

The ACC you would take solely for the cash. It’s not a great fit, but a sustainable financial fit.

UConn would have been a misfit in the old Big12, but again you’d take it just for the cash. The new Big12 still would offer a geographical misfit, but without the cash. It’s P5 spending without P5 revenue, and won’t be sustainable.

I’m content with UConn in the Big East. If the BIG Ten or ACC invites come, you take them. You don’t pass on winning the lottery, but it’s not likely. Be content with where you are and don’t dream of the lottery as your path to happiness.