Clemson @ Notre Dame - 12/29/19

[MainefanSC]

Interesting post interview. No one mentioned coaching, so it can't possibly be that!?

 

[enigmatic]

I understand that people are licking their chops over ND's struggles this season but I do have sympathy for the frustration that MM is going through. I dont think she thought that it was going to be this daunting. One has to think if she has enough desire and motivation to be able to salvage the season especially with this particular group and their growing pains. I really think though that ND can still make the NCAAs but losing to Clemson to start the ACC is not quite the promising start.

 

[EricLA]

I understand that people are licking their chops over ND's struggles this season but I do have sympathy for the frustration that MM is going through. I dont think she thought that it was going to be this daunting. One has to think if she has enough desire and motivation to be able to salvage the season especially with this particular group and their growing pains. I really think though that ND can still make the NCAAs but losing to Clemson to start the ACC is not quite the promising start.

I have zero empathy and less sympathy for what Muffet is going thru. After her comments about Stewie winning the NPOY, her snarky comments about Geno, and her general comments about male coaches etc, she can't lose enough for my taste. Let's hope they go 14-18 and don't even make the NIT...

It's gotta be hard on the players. I feel for them on one hand, but on the other hand, they are the ones who chose ND.

 

[sivad40]

Wow rough season for ND. Probably no NCAAs this year. I cant imagine this is what Muffet envisioned for her team a few years ago. None of her strong 2015 class is still there, they'd be a top contender if they had Patberg, Boley and Young. Not to mention Danielle Patterson.

Their top 3 players are all freshmen and they have a strong class coming so I think theyll rebound in the next few years, but this is as stark a contrast as I've ever seen a program endure. 8 straight #1 seeds and back to back title games to likely a losing record and no NCAA tournament.

Ali Patberg was part of the 2014 class, and she wouldn't have been there this season if she had stayed at Notre Dame. I wouldn't write ND off yet because there's 17 more conference games left and the ACC doesn't look particular strong at the moment.

 

[Plebe]

Another delicious aspect is that every time Notre Dame loses, the value of Tennessee's best win continues to plummet

 

[Shades]

Let's hope they go 14-18 and don't even make the NIT.

Can you picture McGraw accepting a WNIT bid? I can’t.

 

[LETTERL]

I have zero empathy and less sympathy for what Muffet is going thru. After her comments about Stewie winning the NPOY, her snarky comments about Geno, and her general comments about male coaches etc, she can't lose enough for my taste. Let's hope they go 14-18 and don't even make the NIT...

It's gotta be hard on the players. I feel for them on one hand, but on the other hand, they are the ones who chose ND.

I am shocked that Notre Dame, 13 games into the season, still hasn't shown signs of rounding into form. Maybe it is, indeed, a lost cause, but there is still a lot of talent on the bench...and they do have MM to guide them. I haven't written them off completely, yet...but the Clemson game is disturbing.

 

[Shades]

I wouldn't write ND off yet because there's 17 more conference games left and the ACC doesn't look particular strong at the moment.

But ND is the biggest underperformer in the conference, so I’m not understanding the “ACC doesn’t look strong” theme.

 

[bballnut90]

Ali Patberg was part of the 2014 class, and she wouldn't have been there this season if she had stayed at Notre Dame. I wouldn't write ND off yet because there's 17 more conference games left and the ACC doesn't look particular strong at the moment.

2015 class but she redshirted in 2015-16 so even without the transfer she wouldve been eligible this year.

They're 5-8 which means theyll need to go at least 10-7 in conference and win their first ACC tourney game to be NCAA tournament eligible. They also have 7 combined games left against Florida State, Cuse, Louisville, NC State and Miami. NCAAs arent out of reach but isnt going to be easy either.


For that matter, Tennessee also could potentially have a tough road making the NCAAs depending on how the season pans out. They really havent played anyone good (besides Stanford where they lost by 27) and their entire tournament resume will be decided in conference play.

 

[Shades]

there is still a lot of talent on the bench...and they do have MM to guide them.

Did you watch the postgame video? According to McGraw, there is no talent on the bench. The only place she will guide them is under the bus.

 

[bballnut90]

I am shocked that Notre Dame, 13 games into the season, still hasn't shown signs of rounding into form. Maybe it is, indeed, a lost cause, but there is still a lot of talent on the bench...and they do have MM to guide them. I haven't written them off completely, yet...but the Clemson game is disturbing.

I know it is ND but they're starting 3 freshmen and 2 transfers, they had literally zero chemistry coming into the season. Plus, only 2 active players on the roster are over 6-0 in Cosgrove and Brunelle and both are more perimeter oriented. Their top 2 returnees have been out almost the entire season and they have just 6 healthy scholarship players on the team. The entire bench is walk ons and Cosgrove. Very far from what I'd call "lots of talent on the bench." In fact, it might be the least talent any P5 team has coming off the bench.

All of this is a recipe for disaster. My guess is they'd be a lot more stabilized with Vaughn, Prohaska and Patterson. Not to mention #1 draft pick Jackie Young who Muffet had to assume was going to play her senior season. All 4 likely start, so Muffet essentially lost 4 starters she projected to have this season. Sort of the ultimate s*** hitting the fan type of season for her. My guess is they come back a lot stronger next season with a year under their belt.

 

[Plebe]

But ND is the biggest underperformer in the conference, so I’m not understanding the “ACC doesn’t look strong” theme.

Meaning that the ACC, in a relatively down year, offers lots of realistic opportunities for wins, enough so that ND could still finish above .500 on the season and, who knows, maybe even steal a bid.

ND plays Pitt and Boston College twice each. That *should* be 4 wins right there. They also *should* be able to beat Wake Forest, Virginia and (sorry to say) Duke. I still think they can win some of their games against Virginia Tech, North Carolina, Syracuse and Miami, none of which are particularly great this year either.

I'm savoring every last drop of every ND loss, believe me, but I'm also not counting them out until the fat lady sings. Remember a couple years ago when they got blown out by 40 by Louisville and everyone counted them out as a title contender? I'm not falling into that trap.

 

[JordyG]

I just caught up to watching the Clemson-ND game. I don't see what the fuss on this and the McGraw's Bench board is about. ND was outstanding in all phases. They were outstandingly poor at shooting, dribbling, passing, patience, execution, athleticism and defense. The best and most impressive thing for ND was McGraw's demeanor on the bench where she failed to give her best Linda Blair imitation. That however doesn't excuse her poor coaching through today. Yes, at practice they may execute, but their continued failure to execute in games is on Muffet, and no one else.

In all seriousness looking at the game I was surprised to see Brunelle take a mere 6 shots all game. She had a paltry 3 rebounds against an undersized and mediocre Clemson team. Vaughn returned and was in her limited side to side movement and with her acceleration. Every time Walker dribbled up the floor I cringed while waiting for either another bad shot or a turnover. They failed to put a hand in Sprays face until 4 mins. left in the 3rd quarter when they finally figured out she couldn't dribble. Their coverage in the 2/3 zone was so poor they allowed Thornton to score time after time from the elbow...and Clemson didn't even have to use ball movement or fakes to get the elbow entry pass. Thornton often just stood there and waited for the ball. Being a small, short armed team just kills their chances at closing out the passing lanes. Once again their team speed, which is negligible, killed them in transition and in the quarter court. Once again they got out rebounded, this time by a team roughly their size. Once again they showed little to no patience with their sets in the quarter court. Once again their poor passing, poor shooting, and poor decision making on offense was on display, Sniezek or no Sniezek.

Meanwhile the announcers were going on about how the ACC is the best conference in WCBB, as if they couldn't see Louisville struggling again, against an unranked team. At least this time it didn't take 2 OT's to beat them. Anyone with eyeballs can see that the PAC 12 is the best conference overall, although Oregon is really the team I respect, far and well over the others. Sadly, this year is clearly taking years off of Muffet lifespan: her coaching life and her personal one. Some people here are dancing and gloating, but I really fail to see how this benefits WCBB as ND with its poor recruiting will continue to sink further in the ACC. I mean, I don't see great recruiting classes on the horizon for Walz or Wes Moore either. On a good note, with UConn piling up the great recruits it's hard to see how ND has a chance to beat UConn over the next 8 years.

 

[oldude]

I am shocked that Notre Dame, 13 games into the season, still hasn't shown signs of rounding into form. Maybe it is, indeed, a lost cause, but there is still a lot of talent on the bench...and they do have MM to guide them. I haven't written them off completely, yet...but the Clemson game is disturbing.

What talent is on the bench? ND plays 2 frosh, 3 sophs, 1 RS jr, 2 grad transfers & 5 walk-ons. The RS jr just came back from a knee injury after missing all last season with a knee injury. One of the sophs is out indefinitely with a serious medical condition. A second soph was too slow to put in the game vs DePaul (MM’s explanation). One of the RS seniors didn’t play today for some unknown reason, while being the subject of a uniquely snarky comment from MM.

MM has bashed this team repeatedly in postgame comments and imo there is a very real possibility that this ND team may quit on her.

 

[Rb335]

I think it’s going to take some really creative coaching to turn this season around. Doesn’t seem like she’s really interested in it, which doesn’t send the best message. Their recent recruiting and attrition rate is starting to make sense. Hopefully this group weathers the storm because Brunelle, People’s, and Gilbert can be a solid core for the next few years. I’ll be interested to see how their 2021 class turns out.

I’m definitely happy every time I see the Irish lose, but I also know the value a good Irish squad brings to the women’s game.

 

[jennyo70]

I have been hearing “rumblings” of something awry at ND going on 3+ years now. When I ask for specifics, those same people won’t offer any specifics. It certainly seems as if there may be something to these rumblings.

there is no love lost between myself and ND, and I don’t mind seeing them struggle, specifically MM. that being said, it does not benefit our conference strength with ND’s steep drop off.

Oh, to be a fly on the wall.

 

[DefenseBB]

Meaning that the ACC, in a relatively down year, offers lots of realistic opportunities for wins, enough so that ND could still finish above .500 on the season and, who knows, maybe even steal a bid.

ND plays Pitt and Boston College twice each. That *should* be 4 wins right there. They also *should* be able to beat Wake Forest, Virginia and (sorry to say) Duke. I still think they can win some of their games against Virginia Tech, North Carolina, Syracuse and Miami, none of which are particularly great this year either.

I'm savoring every last drop of every ND loss, believe me, but I'm also not counting them out until the fat lady sings. Remember a couple years ago when they got blown out by 40 by Louisville and everyone counted them out as a title contender? I'm not falling into that trap.

Umm, I watched the BC-NC State game today and BC will not be a pushover, much like Clemson was not a pushover. I also watched a lot of the Wake Forest at Miami game and while Miami won, WF played really well. I think this could a more troubling sign for MM and ND than most realize. In reviewing the schedule, they could be hard pressed to finish .500 and my guess is 6-10 and ND will not qualify for either an NCAA or NIT bid. Rebounding is still a major issue and they have ZERO outside shooters. This is the gift that will keep on giving this year, keep those pressers coming!

 

[DaBball]

What talent is on the bench? ND plays 2 frosh, 3 sophs, 1 RS jr, 2 grad transfers & 5 walk-ons. The RS jr just came back from a knee injury after missing all last season with a knee injury. One of the sophs is out indefinitely with a serious medical condition. A second soph was too slow to put in the game vs DePaul (MM’s explanation). One of the RS seniors didn’t play today for some unknown reason, while being the subject of a uniquely snarky comment from MM.

MM has bashed this team repeatedly in postgame comments and imo there is a very real possibility that this ND team may quit on her.

Some of your grades are off I believe (not 100%). I think Gilbert is a RS Freshman, and Vaughn is a RS Sophomore. Vaughn missed the 17-18 season, but played last season. Regardless, agreed, there sure isn’t much talent on the bench

Also, Sniezek has been dealing with Plantar Fasciitis. Rude of Muffet to be making those kind of comments in regards to Sniezek. It can be extremely painful:

 

[oldude]

Some of your grades are off I believe (not 100%). I think Gilbert is a RS Freshman, and Vaughn is a RS Sophomore. Vaughn missed the 17-18 season, but played last season. Regardless, agreed, there sure isn’t much talent on the bench

Also, Sniezek has been dealing with Plantar Fasciitis:

The way MM minimized Sniezek’s problem at the postgame presser, it sounded more like she chose not to play because of an ingrown toenail.

 

[sivad40]

But ND is the biggest underperformer in the conference, so I’m not understanding the “ACC doesn’t look strong” theme.

Plebe's response your post is what I was trying to say.

2015 class but she redshirted in 2015-16 so even without the transfer she wouldve been eligible this year.

Thanks for correcting me on Patburg's class.

The way MM minimized Sniezek’s problem at the postgame presser, it sounded more like she chose not to play because of an ingrown toenail.

It's sounds like she was trying to infer that it was a matter of pain tolerance with the "it's up to her" quote. Sylvia Hatchell in her final seasons, often thought her players injuries were just a matter of pain tolerance and the player just didn't want to tough it out.

 

[JordyG]

What talent is on the bench? ND plays 2 frosh, 3 sophs, 1 RS jr, 2 grad transfers & 5 walk-ons. The RS jr just came back from a knee injury after missing all last season with a knee injury. One of the sophs is out indefinitely with a serious medical condition. A second soph was too slow to put in the game vs DePaul (MM’s explanation). One of the RS seniors didn’t play today for some unknown reason, while being the subject of a uniquely snarky comment from MM.

MM has bashed this team repeatedly in postgame comments and imo there is a very real possibility that this ND team may quit on her.

If she hasn't lost it already. I just watched her postgame and Muffet continues to throw every player under the bus. Who wants to play for a coach like that? Compared to Muffet, Holly was a cheerleader with a megaphone.

 

[eebmg]

I have zero empathy and less sympathy for what Muffet is going thru. After her comments about Stewie winning the NPOY, her snarky comments about Geno, and her general comments about male coaches etc, she can't lose enough for my taste. Let's hope they go 14-18 and don't even make the NIT...

It's gotta be hard on the players. I feel for them on one hand, but on the other hand, they are the ones who chose ND.

I doubt Muffet would accept a WNIT bid if it gets to that.

 

[eebmg]

I have been hearing “rumblings” of something awry at ND going on 3+ years now. When I ask for specifics, those same people won’t offer any specifics. It certainly seems as if there may be something to these rumblings.

there is no love lost between myself and ND, and I don’t mind seeing them struggle, specifically MM. that being said, it does not benefit our conference strength with ND’s steep drop off.

Oh, to be a fly on the wall.

Muffet would swat any fly on a wall. I prefer my info second hand and watered down. Could never watch a train wreck directly.

 

[RowdyFan]

Who are our walk-ons?

Exactly.

 

[enigmatic]

I have zero empathy and less sympathy for what Muffet is going thru. After her comments about Stewie winning the NPOY, her snarky comments about Geno, and her general comments about male coaches etc, she can't lose enough for my taste. Let's hope they go 14-18 and don't even make the NIT...

It's gotta be hard on the players. I feel for them on one hand, but on the other hand, they are the ones who chose ND.

Opinion understood.

I'm aware of the comments she has made in the past and me myself personally has had many nerves struck but it's her own saying so I'm just gonna leave it as that and let her opinions be. I still though respect her coaching ability so I do give her that slight bit of sympathy but as aforementioned she really has her work cut out for her with this group. If the season inevitably becomes a bust then I do expect with this young core along with its 2020 recruits that they'll make better strides next season.