BY25 preseason poll: *Results are in*

[Plebe]

Idaho State feels very left out. Even though they received one vote, Plebe doesn't want to include them on the list of teams receiving only one ballot.



On the bright side, the teams receiving only one ballot really should just thank me for getting their name thrown out in a thread of this repute on the Boneyard.

Honestly, early in the season, I tend to give Mid-majors the benefit of a doubt and rank them higher than P5 programs because the P5's will get a million chances to pick up one marquee victory somewhere along the road. I feel that with the knowledge that the boost that the name recognition Ohio State etc brings they will get extra votes regardless of whether they are actually decent. So, that means I can rebel slightly. Idaho State actually has a pretty great chance tomorrow if they can work some magic against Oregon who may be without Pao-Pao and Rogers. In looking at their schedule now, they actually have a tough few tests with Gonzaga, Missouri, UCF, and Toledo on the schedule.

My sincere apologies, @Lorcan . I don't know how Idaho State got left out of that post. And unfortunately, the short time limit on edits prevents me from correcting my post.

As you say, Idaho State was among the teams listed on one ballot. Confirming that the teams appearing on only one ballot are Seton Hall, Stephen F. Austin, Michigan State, Idaho State, South Dakota State, Cal Baptist, and High Point.

As I read your email, I can't help but wonder when was the last time a Big Sky team was ranked in the AP top 25 of WCBB? Any idea?

 

[triaddukefan]

I commend your transparency and, above all, bravery. Plus this is great fodder for discussion. Others are welcome to follow suit (wink wink).

 

[undersized]

Someone (@undersized) is smoking something real good to put Maryland ahead of both Stanford and UConn.

 

[Lorcan]

To answer your Big Sky Question.......as far as I can tell.....Plebe....it's been a minute.

Montana was ranked #17 in 1994, RV in 2009. The 2009 squad went 28-5, and lost to Zellous and Pittsburgh in NCAA's. The only other losses that year were to Courtney Vandersloot's Gonzaga, Kristi Toliver's Maryland, South Dakota State, and Portland State.
Idaho was ranked #20, January 19th, 1986.

Northern Colorado should have been ranked on November 21, 2017 with wins over #20 DePaul and LSU to their name, but they didn't get the respect they deserved.

 

[Plebe]

I'm disappointed at the lack of respect for the mid-majors in this poll. Not a single mid-major included in the Top 25. It's almost as if the name recognition of Ohio State and West Virginia means something despite Missouri State, Florida Gulf Coast, and South Dakota being perfectly fantastic teams with a lot going for them this year.

To be fair, the mid-majors on the whole didn't do so hot in the 2021 NCAA tournament — and it should have been their opportunity to shine, with all games played on neutral courts. NCAAT results undoubtedly have some influence on the subsequent preseason polls.

Notable exceptions were Missouri State (2nd consecutive Sweet 16), Wright State (upset Arkansas) and BYU (upset Rutgers). Stephen F. Austin had Georgia Tech on the ropes but collapsed horribly down the stretch.

But Gonzaga, FGCU, and both South Dakota teams — probably 4 of the 5 most talked-about mid-major teams last season, along with Missouri State — had forgettable showings.

2021 NCAAT performance of non-power 5 teams (excluding UConn) seeded 13 or better:

• #5 Gonzaga was upset by #12 Belmont (64-59).
• #5 Missouri State beat #12 UC Davis (70-51) and #13 Wright State (64-39), lost to #1 Stanford (89-62).
• #8 South Florida beat #9 Washington State (57-53), lost to #1 NC State (79-67).
• #9 South Dakota State lost to #8 Syracuse (72-55).
• #10 Marquette lost to #7 Virginia Tech (70-63).
• #10 UCF lost to #7 Northwestern (62-51).
• #11 South Dakota lost to #6 Oregon (67-47).
• #11 BYU upset #6 Rutgers (69-66), lost to #3 Arizona (52-46)
• #11 FGCU lost to #6 Michigan (87-66).
• #11 Bradley lost to #6 Texas (81-62).
• #12 Stephen F. Austin lost to #5 Georgia Tech (54-52 OT).
• #12 Central Michigan lost to #5 Iowa (87-72).
• #12 Belmont beat #5 Gonzaga (64-59), lost to #4 Indiana (70-48).
• #13 Wright State upset #4 Arkansas (66-62), lost to #5 Missouri State (89-62).
• #13 Idaho State lost to #4 Kentucky (71-63).
• #13 Lehigh lost to #4 West Virginia (77-53).

 

[triaddukefan]

Guess I'll go ahead and release my poll.... an unbiased poll I might add. There was a Bernie Mac line that came to mind to add to this post, but I ain't trying to get banned the first week of the season.

1) Stanford
2) South Carolina
3) UCONN
4) NC State
5) Maryland
6) Baylor
7) Louisville
8) Oregon
9) Indiana
10) Arizona
11) Iowa
12) Florida State
13) Michigan
14) Iowa State
15) Georgia
16) Kentucky
17) Notre Dame
18) Oregon State
19) Virginia Tech
20) South Dakota
21) South Florida
22) UCLA
23) West Virginia
24) Duke
25) High Point

 

[Zanzman]

Guess I'll go ahead and release my poll.... an unbiased poll I might add. There was a Bernie Mac line that came to mind to add to this post, but I ain't trying to get banned the first week of the season.

1) Stanford
2) South Carolina
3) UCONN
4) NC State
5) Maryland
6) Baylor
7) Louisville
8) Oregon
9) Indiana
10) Arizona
11) Iowa
12) Florida State
13) Michigan
14) Iowa State
15) Georgia
16) Kentucky
17) Notre Dame
18) Oregon State
19) Virginia Tech
20) South Dakota
21) South Florida
22) UCLA
23) West Virginia
24) Duke
25) High Point

Duke above high point really?

 

[sweetspot]

We need transparency on the "N.C. State is No. 1" vote. Namely... huh?

 

[LoTrader]

Plebe, you are the best! Thanks for all the effort to publish the Boneyard WCBB Poll. Love the results and all the banter. I'll do better and get my poll in next time.

 

[JonathanXIV]

Guess I'll go ahead and release my poll.... an unbiased poll I might add. There was a Bernie Mac line that came to mind to add to this post, but I ain't trying to get banned the first week of the season.

1) Stanford
2) South Carolina
3) UCONN
4) NC State
5) Maryland
6) Baylor
7) Louisville
8) Oregon
9) Indiana
10) Arizona
11) Iowa
12) Florida State
13) Michigan
14) Iowa State
15) Georgia
16) Kentucky
17) Notre Dame
18) Oregon State
19) Virginia Tech
20) South Dakota
21) South Florida
22) UCLA
23) West Virginia
24) Duke
25) High Point

Didn’t have to give your name. The High Point vote was enough to identify you.

 

[triaddukefan]

Didn’t have to give your name. The High Point vote was enough to identify you.

 

[Bigboote]

I did my part. I had South Dakota and Missouri State on my pre-season ballot.

Me too.

 

[Plebe]

For those (like me) like to geek out over the vote distributions:

These tables show how many votes each team received for each ranking position. For example, South Carolina was #1 on 8 ballots, #2 on 11 ballots, and #3 on 7 ballots.

For teams 1-5 (each of these teams appeared on all 26 ballots):

	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8
1. S. Carolina	8	11	7	-	-	-	-	-
2. Stanford	10	4	11	1	-	-	-	-
3. UConn	7	10	7	2	-	-	-	-
4. Maryland	-	1	1	11	9	4	-	-
5. NC State	1	-	-	9	12	1	2	1

A bit more dispersion in the balloting of teams 6-11 (each of these teams also appeared on all 26 ballots):

Team	4	5	6	7	8	9	10	11	12	13	14	15	16	17	18	19
6. Louisville	1	2	9	7	3	1	3	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-
7. Indiana	-	-	5	3	7	6	4	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	1
8. Iowa	-	1	3	3	4	11	1	2	-	-	-	-	-	1	-	-
9. Oregon	2	-	-	7	4	1	7	3	-	1	-	-	1	-	-	-
10. Baylor	-	2	3	2	3	2	4	4	4	-	2	-	-	-	-	-
11. Michigan	-	-	1	1	3	3	3	6	4	2	1	1	-	1	1	-

 

[eebmg]

Stanford 10-4-11 is pretty weird.

Must be clear East Coast (assume #3) - West Coast split (assume #1)

 

[Plebe]

Stanford 10-4-11 is pretty weird.

Must be clear East Coast (assume #3) - West Coast split (assume #1)

Maybe, but I read it more as a divide between those who showed deference to Stanford as the reigning champs and those who didn't.

I did my part. I had South Dakota and Missouri State on my pre-season ballot.

Missouri State appeared on 11 out of 26 ballots, two of which had them at #15 and #16.

FGCU was also on 11 ballots, with #15 being its highest ballot position.

South Dakota appeared on 10 ballots, with a high of #17.

 

[D J B]

Someone (@undersized) is smoking something real good to put Maryland ahead of both Stanford and UConn. They will most likely win the Big Ten, but will not go undefeated within their conference. Then they have NC State, Stanford, South Carolina, and Baylor in non-conference play. I believe at best they will split those four games.

I agree that the Terps should not be placed above Stanford and UConn. But I would never, ever bet against Brenda Frese. She is a pure talent, and can turn a sow's ear into a silk purse using only a needle and thread.

 

[undersized]

For those (like me) like to geek out over the vote distributions:

These tables show how many votes each team received for each ranking position. For example, South Carolina was #1 on 8 ballots, #2 on 11 ballots, and #3 on 7 ballots.

For teams 1-5 (each of these teams appeared on all 26 ballots):

	1	2	3	4	5	6	7	8
1. S. Carolina	8	11	7	-	-	-	-	-
2. Stanford	10	4	11	1	-	-	-	-
3. UConn	7	10	7	2	-	-	-	-
4. Maryland	-	1	1	11	9	4	-	-
5. NC State	1	-	-	9	12	1	2	1

A bit more dispersion in the balloting of teams 6-11 (each of these teams also appeared on all 26 ballots):

Team	4	5	6	7	8	9	10	11	12	13	14	15	16	17	18	19
6. Louisville	1	2	9	7	3	1	3	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-
7. Indiana	-	-	5	3	7	6	4	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	-	1
8. Iowa	-	1	3	3	4	11	1	2	-	-	-	-	-	1	-	-
9. Oregon	2	-	-	7	4	1	7	3	-	1	-	-	1	-	-	-
10. Baylor	-	2	3	2	3	2	4	4	4	-	2	-	-	-	-	-
11. Michigan	-	-	1	1	3	3	3	6	4	2	1	1	-	1	1	-

For as much as we fans like to sit on the outside and criticize the AP voters etc., this lines up pretty much exactly with the AP poll. The only difference is having Baylor down a few spots. I think this means that collectively, we're all more "sheep-like" than we'd like to admit.

 

[MSGRET]

My sincere apologies, @Lorcan . I don't know how Idaho State got left out of that post. And unfortunately, the short time limit on edits prevents me from correcting my post.

As you say, Idaho State was among the teams listed on one ballot. Confirming that the teams appearing on only one ballot are Seton Hall, Stephen F. Austin, Michigan State, Idaho State, South Dakota State, Cal Baptist, and High Point.

As I read your email, I can't help but wonder when was the last time a Big Sky team was ranked in the AP top 25 of WCBB? Any idea?

I wonder who put them on their ballot? Hey @triaddukefan do you know anything about that inclusion?

 

[Gamecockfan77]

It's interesting how knowledge of injuries now would definitely change some votes. For instance, would Oregon be as high without Pao Pao and Rogers? Probably not.

I'm disappointed at the lack of respect for the mid-majors in this poll. Not a single mid-major included in the Top 25. It's almost as if the name recognition of Ohio State and West Virginia means something despite Missouri State, Florida Gulf Coast, and South Dakota being perfectly fantastic teams with a lot going for them this year.

In any case, thanks as always, Plebe for putting this together.

I voted for all three mid majors that you mentioned and not OSU and WVU.

 

[triaddukefan]

Duke above high point really?

Yeah.... I went to the Duke exhibition, didn't make it to High Point's. Perhaps if I did I may have reversed my vote.

I wonder who put them on their ballot? Hey @triaddukefan do you know anything about that inclusion?

Mildly disappointed they didn't get more votes. They return everybody off of a squad that held UConn to 102 points... thought that would give them a bit more respeck on here.

 

[Plebe]

For as much as we fans like to sit on the outside and criticize the AP voters etc., this lines up pretty much exactly with the AP poll. The only difference is having Baylor down a few spots. I think this means that collectively, we're all more "sheep-like" than we'd like to admit.

Collectively, it's true. I also think the previously published preseason polls (AP, especially) exert a strong gravitational pull since no one's been able to actually see the teams play actual games.

FWIW there are some bigger discrepancies in the teams ranked 12 and below, especially for UCLA, Arizona, and Georgia.

Team	Points​	# of ballots​	High​	Low​	AP poll​	Coaches poll​
12. Iowa St	305​	25​	8​	-​	12​	16​
13. UCLA	251​	26​	11​	22​	20​	14​
14. Arizona	225​	25​	9​	-​	22​	15​
15. Ore. St	222​	22​	10​	-​	14​	18​
16. KY	219​	22​	12​	-​	13​	13​
17T. Tenn.	216​	24​	11​	-​	15​	12​
17T. GA	216​	23​	7​	-​	RV-1​	19​
19. G. Tech	161​	20​	10​	-​	17T​	20​
20. TAMU	158​	23​	13​	-​	23​	17​
21. FL St	143​	18​	12​	-​	16​	24​
22. Texas	111​	15​	10​	-​	25​	21​
23. OH St	103​	14​	16​	-​	17T​	25​
24. WV	94​	15​	11​	-​	19​	23​
25. V. Tech	68​	13​	14​	-​	24​	RV-3​
RV. MO St	52​	11​	15​	-​	RV-4​	RV-1​
RV. N. Dame	52​	12​	17​	-​	RV-10​	RV-22T​
RV. S. Fla.	51​	13​	19​	-​	21​	22​
RV. FGCU	49​	11​	15​	-​	RV-3​	RV-4​
RV. S. Dak.	44​	10​	17​	-​	RV-5​	RV-22T​
RV. Duke	23​	6​	14​	-​	--​	--​
RV. Ark.	8​	3​	21​	-​	--​	RV-5​

.

 

[LowkeyX]

Number of 1st-place votes shown in parentheses:

View attachment 70838

Also receiving votes (on at least two ballots): Missouri State 52, Notre Dame 52, South Florida 51, Florida Gulf Coast 49, South Dakota 44, Duke 23, Arkansas 8, LSU 4, BYU 3, North Carolina 2.

Thank you to all who voted. Twenty-six ballots were submitted.

The next poll will be Monday, November 22, 2021.

I had everybody except West VA & Texas. I’m not sure what the hype is behind West VA but I didn’t see much of them last year so I wouldn’t know. I put Florida Gulf Coast & South Florida in their place.

2 teams that might eventually get ranked (BY, AP & Coaches)… Duke depending on how all their transfers jell in Kara’s system & Arkansas if Goforth/Ramirez/Daniels leads them with Wolfenbarger lives up to her potential.

 

[triaddukefan]

To the person who voted Duke at 14... May I have a word with you??

 

[Lorcan]

To the person who voted Duke at 14... May I have a word with you??

Can I have whatever they are smoking?

 

[Lorcan]

Plebe, quick question. Is the Boneyard Poll planning to be bi-weekly as it was last year, so the next edition will roll out on Monday the 22nd? Just wanted to be sure I didn't have to wait to add some good teams to the poll that nobody else votes for.