Bri Turner

[HuskyNan]

Turner was snakebit with injuries. It's hard to continue building skills when you have to keep starting over. Hopefully, she'll continue to develop and be a good pro but one has to wonder about her durability against bigger, stronger players.

 

[HuskylnSC]

Always have liked Bri Turner. She is the ND player I would most like to see at UConn. Smooth classy player who plays the game the right way. I have felt she could use a little more fire and thought UConn coaching could have provided it.

 

[UConnCat]

Interesting observation here. I highly recommend this guy's twitter feed - really enjoy his analysis.


Bri wasn't around for last year's zone-fest that occurred out of necessity. She's used to playing man and she's very good at it. On the other hand, Shepard got used to being hidden at the base of a zone last year.

I read some of his tweets last night. He made some interesting observations throughout the game.

 

[Ellie]

This post is why I keep coming back to the Boneyard. Thoughtful answers demonstrating basketball knowledge and insight into the collegiate women’s game! Enjoyable reading about the game.

 

[JordyG]

I feel bad for Bri, lateral moving she is a shadow of her former self. Bri had one of the most athletic looking strides in WCBB which has turned into a labored stride. Jessica Shepard should also be complimented for getting in drastically better shape. She has a completely different physique than she did just a few months at USA basketball trial (Sept 2018). When you put that much time in to weight loss in a few months that leaves less time to practice basketball skills. Call me skeptical, Jessica is in far better shape than she was just a few months ago, but is she a better basketball player? IDK. Both great kids and worthy UCONN opponents. I wish them well in life always and in basketball except when they suit up against UCONN.

The announcers said Shepard had lost 30 lbs. since September. However it didn't look as if any of that weight loss was replaced with muscle. Yeah, I too feel for Bri, a great person who has never gotten a break physically in her career.

 

[JordyG]

I had watched a couple of ND's games this year and thought Turner is not her former self. It's probably too soon post-surgery. It's a shame her college career has been hampered by injury. Still, her lack of a face-up game will limit her in the WNBA.

Tough to develop any game when you're injured all the time.

 

[CocoHusky]

Tough to develop any game when you're injured all the time.

True but missing bunnies as she did last night is something she should have corrected since her Freshmen year.

 

[UConnCat]

Tough to develop any game when you're injured all the time.

And when you don't enter college with those skills.

 

[Ellie]

Sometimes two bigs on the floor together just won't work. Maybe Shepard and Turner will never be a smooth tandem like Wilson and Coates never seemed to be, at least not when they played us, just like Z and Collier weren't. To make it work you need bigs who are somewhat interchangeable inside and out, the way Stewie and Stef were when they played together. Both could shoot out to the 3 point line, or they could play under the basket, defensively and offensively. That combo was deadly and impossible to stop, unfortunately not many bigs have that range of skills, so you end up with two players who both need to occupy the same small area on the floor to be effective.

Agree with your observation and thought of when Rebecca and Karla played together executing the high/low game. Never thought Karla stood out as well when Rebecca Lobo graduated ... of course who would!

 

[UcMiami]

This is also very early in Turners return to competition - practice is not the same no matter how much coaches try to make it so. Will be interesting to see if Turner's mobility improves over the year and one would hope ND chemistry improves as well.

One thing working against this is ND is not really playing with a PG - hard to integrate offense and especially two 'bigs' without an effective PG. Not a knock on the other starters, but PG is not exactly what you think when you read their names. Interesting comment by MM about getting the ball into Young's hands - reading that as feeling her best point in a point forward?

 

[CocoHusky]

This is also very early in Turners return to competition - practice is not the same no matter how much coaches try to make it so. Will be interesting to see if Turner's mobility improves over the year and one would hope ND chemistry improves as well.

One thing working against this is ND is not really playing with a PG - hard to integrate offense and especially two 'bigs' without an effective PG. Not a knock on the other starters, but PG is not exactly what you think when you read their names. Interesting comment by MM about getting the ball into Young's hands - reading that as feeling her best point in a point forward?

Turner ACL tear was March of 2017. Oct/November of 2017 was the decision to redshirt her for an entire season. The return to competition is accurate but improved mobility should have happened in the past 18 month, not over the next 12 that's assuming the surgery and rehab was done correctly.

 

[UConnCat]

Turner ACL tear was March of 2017. Oct/November of 2017 was the decision to redshirt her for an entire season. The return to competition is accurate but improved mobility should have happened in the past 18 month, not over the next 12 that's assuming the surgery and rehab was done correctly.

Good point. I lost track of how much time has passed since her injury.

 

[JordyG]

True but missing bunnies as she did last night is something she should have corrected since her Freshmen year.

A truism. That's always been a part of her game, her inability to finish. It's certainly been a good thing for UConn though.

 

[Dillon77]

Good, thoughtful thread.

(More than) a few thoughts:

- I think a large portion of Bri's mobility has returned since March 2017. What I've noticed this season that seems to be missing/still in development is what I might call "twitch" speed: reacting to a quick lateral move or being able to burst by a defender. Now this could be something that will get better over the season: some athletes take longer to get back to full skills than others.

- Despite being good friends, Bri and Jess have never played together before. They're still getting used to it. As has been brought out, the Irish have not settled into one playing the high post and the other the low. It's a bit of a double low post at times; other times, no.

Last year, there was a high post, one Kat Westbeld, who knew the offense inside out and her role in it. Her job last last year (and the year before that) was to be the inside cog of the motion offense. She was superb at making decisions on the hi-low to Turner or Shepard, take that foul line jumper or dish to the weak side.

She also helped Mabrey quite a bit get used to orchestrating the offense.

- This year has been a bit strange with Mabrey's quad injury. Jordan Nixon (out under concussion protocol) started the first number of games and was taking a Lindsay Allen approach: orchestrate first, second and even third.
When she comes back, it will be the first time she and Mabrey will be on the floor together in a real game.

- And then one throws in the new look Shepard. She is not the "back into center" of last year who often used brute force and a deft touch. Once again, kind of a half and half approach.

Most teams are not going to expose this dichotomy. Geno examines it and has his team execute.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lastly, in regards to defense. I thought both teams started playing tougher D in the second quarter and it was not lost on me that Danielle Patterson was in the game for most of her 11 minutes during that time in the game. In fact, I would've like to have seen her stay in...she offered some good lateral quickness and got off her feet. This would've given UConn a different look.

 

[FanFromMaine]

Reading the comments here, I realize that I should have used Team Chemistry as the title.

Last year, UConn had some trouble integrating Crystal and Azura in with the other four players. There were four All-Americans on the floor who had won a ton of games together. Crystal and Azura played a different game in some ways, best seen in the fourth quarter of last year's ND game. With both Gabby and KLS out, the team took a 10 point deficit and turned it all around. And, to my mind, it looked like a different style: more point guard oriented. As I have offered previously, my take is that, if Crystal doesn't get hurt at the end of last season, UConn takes home the crown.

Two years ago and yesterday at ND, it seemed that the Irish had the same dilemma. The team that won the championship rested on the abilbity of three guards driving to the basket. There was no choice last year as Turner was injured. But Muffet has had terrific success with point guards running the show and using the bigs as the recipients of their passes. To me, they are a team trying to play two different styles at the same time. They, like UConn last year, have the talent to win a lot of games but, when pushed, which style will emerge.

I have to say that this what I so enjoy about UConn basketball: watching young people learn to play together. Not always an easy task...

 

[bballnut90]

I posted several times in the offseason that adding in Turner doesn't necessarily make Notre Dame a better team, even if Turner is a stud. From what I saw last night, I think Shepard is definitely the better low post player offensively with her strength, hands and good touch around the basket. She's better suited to catch entry passes, finish with contact and overall has better touch around the basket. She can also score well from the high post and is an excellent passer, but I think Notre Dame is going to be best with Shepard on the low block. Turner has never had good hands for catching entry passes or grabbing rebounds. When she goes up for a rebound it feels like it's 50/50 whether she'll actually get it or not, where with Shepard she's going to get the ball if she gets a finger on it. Not sure if Turner is cut out to play from the high post, but it's something Nd will have to work through and figure out if they're going to challenge UCONN in April.

 

[Orangutan]

Lastly, in regards to defense. I thought both teams started playing tougher D in the second quarter and it was not lost on me that Danielle Patterson was in the game for most of her 11 minutes during that game. In fact, I would've like to have seen her stay in...she offered some good lateral quickness and got off her feet.

Yes, the same thing occurred to me. Dani's quickness and defense matches UConn nicely and she can stretch the defense a bit with her midrange J.

She's not as good as Bri or Jess yet but she may have been a nice solution in this matchup. ND tried to beat them with size and it didn't work. Might as well go the other way and try to match athleticism as best as possible.

Now that this brutal season-opening non-conference stretch is over, I hope to see much more of Dani. She's been a bright spot and with consistent PT she could be a factor come tournament time.

 

[Justavisitor]

Turner ACL tear was March of 2017. Oct/November of 2017 was the decision to redshirt her for an entire season. The return to competition is accurate but improved mobility should have happened in the past 18 month, not over the next 12 that's assuming the surgery and rehab was done correctly.

She may never be as mobile as she once was. Also, improved mobility can be hindered by simply trusting her knee and body. With all the times her body has failed her, trust will not come easy.

 

[Justavisitor]

Good, thoughtful thread.

(More than) a few thoughts:

- I think a large portion of Bri's mobility has returned since March 2017. What I've noticed this season that seems to be missing/still in development is what I might call "twitch" speed: reacting to a quick lateral move or being able to burst by a defender. Now this could be something that will get better over the season: some athletes take longer to get back to full skills than others.

- Despite being good friends, Bri and Jess have never played together before. They're still getting used to it. As has been brought out, the Irish have not settled into one playing the high post and the other the low. It's a bit of a double low post at times; other times, no.

Last year, there was a high post, one Kat Westbeld, who knew the offense inside out and her role in it. Her job last last year (and the year before that) was to be the inside cog of the motion offense. She was superb at making decisions on the hi-low to Turner or Shepard, take that foul line jumper or dish to the weak side.

She also helped Mabrey quite a bit get used to orchestrating the offense.

- This year has been a bit strange with Mabrey's quad injury. Jordan Nixon (out under concussion protocol) started the first number of games and was taking a Lindsay Allen approach: orchestrate first, second and even third.
When she comes back, it will be the first time she and Mabrey will be on the floor together in a real game.

- And then one throws in the new look Shepard. She is not the "back into center" of last year who often used brute force and a deft touch. Once again, kind of a half and half approach.

Most teams are not going to expose this dichotomy. Geno examines it and has his team execute.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lastly, in regards to defense. I thought both teams started playing tougher D in the second quarter and it was not lost on me that Danielle Patterson was in the game for most of her 11 minutes during that game. In fact, I would've like to have seen her stay in...she offered some good lateral quickness and got off her feet.

Mabrey appears to be out of shape right now and Turner's lacking lateral quickness. This does not bode well for good defense. Also, transition defense was not there. I'm guessing some of this is due to those two players and Geno exploited the lack of quickness by pushing hard in transition and also by using the dribble drive. Now that this has been exposed, what other teams can exploit it?

This will be interesting to see, as Notre Dame's offense is not the same as it was last season. There is an obvious lack of ball movement in the offense. Maybe getting by without a point guard last season was masked by the play of Westbeld.

 

[UcMiami]

Turner ACL tear was March of 2017. Oct/November of 2017 was the decision to redshirt her for an entire season. The return to competition is accurate but improved mobility should have happened in the past 18 month, not over the next 12 that's assuming the surgery and rehab was done correctly.

She has certainly had ample time for recovery (though knees are notoriously difficult to put time frames on - especially for someone who does not have an NFL running back kind of leg musculature) but there can be a huge difference between being medically cleared and having the mental trust that your body will perform - where there is any doubt there is hesitation. A lot of athletes coming back from knee surgery take most of or a full season of playing to get back to full strength.

 

[Boreifs]

Shepard and Turner did not play together last year. Now that Turner has returned, the chemistry of the entire team is different. Shepard is a better passer and has a better shooting range. Turner has not shown she is a decent passer and her shooting range is limited to within 8 feet of the basket.

ND should be using the high/ low offense and they are not. Shepard should be out by the foul line. She can hit that jumper and she can drive the lane. But its not happening. That's on the coaching staff and Muffet.

As has been noted beforehand, a high-low game doesn’t always work well if the same players are always low and high. It works best when the two are interchangeable.

 

[Boreifs]

Agree with your observation and thought of when Rebecca and Karla played together executing the high/low game. Never thought Karla stood out as well when Rebecca Lobo graduated ... of course who would!

Really?! Then how come she was Player of the Year?!!!

 

[eebmg]

Really?! Then how come she was Player of the Year?!!!

Kara was, Karla was not.

 

[mhshuskies]

I had watched a couple of ND's games this year and thought Turner is not her former self. It's probably too soon post-surgery. It's a shame her college career has been hampered by injury. Still, her lack of a face-up game will limit her in the WNBA.

Maybe it was the injuries, but she never appeared to improve season by season.

 

[Boreifs]

Kara was, Karla was not.

I was trying to be charitable!