Bouknight arrested?

[runner11]

Sure, but it certainly seems like things are beyond just that at this point. He worked very hard to get where he is at and has the opportunity to live out his dream. When a person is in a position like that and continues to act in ways that are damaging to themselves and others, it certainly could signify a much bigger problem. That doesn’t mean there shouldn’t be consequences- there should be, but there should also be available help to get at what is going on.

Again, he is not my client and it would be unethical of me to throw out specific ideas. In general, substance use disorder and other mental illness shouldn’t be immediately dismissed for people in that situation. People do dumb stuff everyday and they can just be throwaway things chalked up to nonsense, but patterns of poor and reckless decision-making should be setting off alarm bells, no matter who is doing it.

He’s lucky in that he has resources, financial and otherwise, available to him and has people who love and care about him. We’ve seen people in the public eye who have had all that and still can’t overcome whatever is going on. I wish him well.

Driving drunk and passing out in one’s car can also pretty easily explained by being drunk. I can’t ascribe logic or intent to any decision made by someone so clearly intoxicated (and probably not just on booze).

As for not renewing his contract, it would be exceedingly rare. I think 3 lotto picks have been let go after 2 years in the past decade. All the Suns. And one of these guys is now a starter a year out for another team, Jalen Smith. Meanwhile, young guys getting in trouble is not rare. Look at how many chances Kevin Porter received, granted, he was drafted much later and was traded. But now he is a 22 year old with an 80 million dollar contract. If they cut Bouk I think it will be because they see him in practice every day and don’t believe he is actually good.

 

[husky429]

And sometimes “I’m going to kill myself” ends in suicide.

Not sure what your point is here.

 

[ucp990411]

Not sure what your point is here.

Reading between the lines it seemed like you were saying that when someone says "I'm going to kill myself" it usually does not mean they will and that it should not be taken seriously. If I am wrong I apologize.

 

[husky429]

Reading between the lines it seemed like you were saying that when someone says "I'm going to kill myself" it usually does not mean they will and that it should not be taken seriously. If I am wrong I apologize.

Nah. I'm saying Bouk hasn't said he's going to kill himself, but sometimes people don't say it if they're suicidal. When somebody starts doing risky things out of the blue, it can be a sign.

I also don't think calling the kid suicidal is warranted at this point, as the person I responded to implied. His family and friends would have a better grasp on that. Plenty of people crash their car drunk and keep a gun in their lap.

 

[BigErnMcCracken]

Reading between the lines it seemed like you were saying that when someone says "I'm going to kill myself" it usually does not mean they will and that it should not be taken seriously. If I am wrong I apologize.

I don't think that's what he was saying at all. I think he was saying that someone can be "suicidal" without expressing an overt desire to kill themselves. They can just conduct themselves in a manner that indicates that they don't value their life.

 

[husky429]

I don't think that's what he was saying at all. I think he was saying that someone can be "suicidal" without expressing an overt desire to kill themselves. They can just conduct themselves in a manner that indicates that they don't value their life.

You articulated it better than I did. I can see why they made you a bigshot LA lawyer.

 

[superjohn]

Ultimately, you're right. They don't owe him anything. He's a grown man with plenty of resources and support at his disposal, and it's not some huge moral failure on the part of the organization to expect him to show up to work every day - particularly in the absence of any direct plea for help from Bouknight. Basketball coaches aren't psych counselors, and we shouldn't expect them to be.

But we're not talking about painting fences here. This is a job that requires him to fully reciprocate whatever physical and mental investment the organization has made in him - and they, by extension, aren't doing their jobs if they can't recognize how these issues make it impossible for him to do his.



I've tried to stop short of calling him suicidal, but let's just think about it. He:

- Got behind the wheel of a car in a public setting, surely knowing he was well above the legal limit...

- Parked said car in such a way as to block an exit, thereby maximizing whatever disruption he'd caused and ensuring that someone would notice him...

- Left the car running, with a gun in his hand, as he dozed off...

All two days before the start of the season.

I don't like to make assumptions, but it doesn't exactly require a master's in behavioral science to piece this one together. He's putting it on a tee for us, and the only reason he's still going through the motions of playing is that he can't make the horse drink.

I don't think you're on your own in the NBA. Out of all the professional sports leagues from what I know of it, it's the most family like. I don't think the Hornets will flat out kick him to the curb without trying to help him or the NBA will kick him to the curb without trying to help him. If he's accepting of help and going through the process he'll have a helping hand but like everyone he needs to want to do it. I shudder at how many people I've known in my life that shut off and didn't do it, they're no longer with us.

There's an unbelievable amount of young guys and not so young guys who are struggling like crazy. From personal experience the people I lost in my life hit a dead zone around their mid-30's, not so young but that's when it ended. There were plenty of issues and warning signs leading up to it but that was the age where it ended for a lot of them.

Champs99and04 explained it well but stopped short, I think he's pretty clearly suicidal.

He didn't slit is wrists or do what our society seems to expect but this is somewhere along the lines of how suicidal behavior seems to manifest itself in guys.

This stuff is not talked about nearly enough in our society but there's an epidemic.

 

[auror]

Let’s talk hoops. 0-5 in 14 minutes after shooting terribly in preseason. Who goes G league first. Bouk or Tyrese?

Hornets are bad and have a ton of injuries and need to make a decision on Bouk's option, so it's unlikely Bouk goes down to G League.

 

[RayRay]

Driving drunk and passing out in one’s car can also pretty easily explained by being drunk. I can’t ascribe logic or intent to any decision made by someone so clearly intoxicated (and probably not just on booze).

As for not renewing his contract, it would be exceedingly rare. I think 3 lotto picks have been let go after 2 years in the past decade. All the Suns. And one of these guys is now a starter a year out for another team, Jalen Smith. Meanwhile, young guys getting in trouble is not rare. Look at how many chances Kevin Porter received, granted, he was drafted much later and was traded. But now he is a 22 year old with an 80 million dollar contract. If they cut Bouk I think it will be because they see him in practice every day and don’t believe he is actually good.

I think you’re probably correct on this assessment about the reason for not picking up the 3rd year option. If the kid has talent and just needs fine tuning on the personal stuff, I think it’s worth the investment to try and make the effort to better the kid and see if you can get him on the right track.

Now, as for Bouks current play, I’m honestly pretty shocked at how bad he’s looked so far this year. I mean, this guy just looks like he has absolutely 0 confidence, and I have to imagine last year has destroyed his confidence and his mental state. Cliff coming in and being high on him has to be helping I would imagine, but it seems he’s still in a “you have to prove it to us that you’re good and can get a rotation spot” and for a guy with a potentially big ego, that could spell trouble. Obviously I’m speculating like most of us here, but it makes sense that’s what could be happening.

Hopefully Cliff, Mitch, MJ see what’s happening and don’t give up on him, but right now it’s tough to watch. I just hope it suddenly clicks for him and he starts playing well and with confidence. It just feels like that’s the solve for everything. That will lead to more pt, a defined spot in the rotation, and hopefully less antics and legal issues if basketball is going well for him.

 

[Palatine]

Did you read his coaches comments? They are about as deep as drek happens.

 

[dennismenace]

---

I must be missing something here….how do you get arrested sleeping in your car… he wasn’t driving?

The engine was running according to the Hartford Courant today. In CT that would qualify as DUI; NC?

 

[huskymedic]

I must be missing something here….how do you get arrested sleeping in your car… he wasn’t driving?

The engine was running according to the Hartford Courant today. In CT that would qualify as DUI; NC?

Similar discussion from this morning's Charlotte Observer: Could James Bouknight still have been charged with a DWI if his car wasn’t running?

 

[Travelman6]

This is sad. I wanted to say maybe someone like Oakfor or Gordon could talk to him but when I looked up Gordon he was arrested this week for punching his son at La Guardia.

 

[husky429]

Similar discussion from this morning's Charlotte Observer: Could James Bouknight still have been charged with a DWI if his car wasn’t running?

I'm going to go with "yes" considering he woke up and slammed into multiple police cruisers lol

 

[ucp990411]

Somebody said he needs Maurice Clarett. I second that

 

[huskymedic]

I'm going to go with "yes" considering he woke up and slammed into multiple police cruisers lol

Best line buried in the article... "... But, suppose Bouknight didn’t crash into other vehicles and his car was parked and turned off. Would he still have been arrested for driving under the influence? Several legal experts in North Carolina say yes."

 

[topogigio]

Ya know, I've worked with thousands of kids at my job, and met dozens of formerly incarcerated people in my life through my wife's pro bono work... I can't say I've ever met a "bad seed."

Bad environment? Yup.
Bad coping skills? Yup.
Bad mental health? Yup.
Bad substance abuse? Yup.
Bad seed? Nah.

Are there people out there who just aren't wired the right way? I'm sure. Are they few and far between? Definitely.

Every item mentioned above is another excuse to justify poor behavior. When your poor behavior is excused your entire life, you become entitled, and believe you can get away with continued poor behavior. Classic case in point right here!

 

[ClifSpliffy]

I think you’re probably correct on this assessment about the reason for not picking up the 3rd year option. If the kid has talent and just needs fine tuning on the personal stuff, I think it’s worth the investment to try and make the effort to better the kid and see if you can get him on the right track.

Now, as for Bouks current play, I’m honestly pretty shocked at how bad he’s looked so far this year. I mean, this guy just looks like he has absolutely 0 confidence, and I have to imagine last year has destroyed his confidence and his mental state. Cliff coming in and being high on him has to be helping I would imagine, but it seems he’s still in a “you have to prove it to us that you’re good and can get a rotation spot” and for a guy with a potentially big ego, that could spell trouble. Obviously I’m speculating like most of us here, but it makes sense that’s what could be happening.

Hopefully Cliff, Mitch, MJ see what’s happening and don’t give up on him, but right now it’s tough to watch. I just hope it suddenly clicks for him and he starts playing well and with confidence. It just feels like that’s the solve for everything. That will lead to more pt, a defined spot in the rotation, and hopefully less antics and legal issues if basketball is going well for him.

'Cliff coming in and being high on him has to be helping'

dang, looks like i got the juice. noice. get well soon, james. or at least get it together.
u could still drink at home, a lot, like sooooo many here.
ok haters, pretend otherwise. it's a free country and what youse do in ur crib ain't none of my business, other than to poke fun at.

pro tip:

i like this version as i used to crew in uni.

 

[NJHoops]

Every item mentioned above is another excuse to justify poor behavior. When your poor behavior is excused your entire life, you become entitled, and believe you can get away with continued poor behavior. Classic case in point right here!

I believe you’re lost, in more ways than one.

 

[husky429]

Every item mentioned above is another excuse to justify poor behavior. When your poor behavior is excused your entire life, you become entitled, and believe you can get away with continued poor behavior. Classic case in point right here!

I wouldn't say I am excusing Bouknight at all. I believe he should have mandated rehab, hefty fines, and possibly even jail time if the gun ends up being illegally owned. I would say it's fairly obvious that Bouk is being effected by addiction, mental health, and his tough upbringing.

You don't help someone be a productive member of society if you say "you're a bad seed" and then assume they will never function as a normal human. You help them when you talk about where there bad habits come from, how to change our habits and environment, how to make better decisions in the moment, how to seek help, etc.

Like I've said a million times. I've got 3 brothers and a sister-in-law who are felons. My SIL murdered someone when she was high on meth. She's well aware that what she did is unforgivable. But when her time in prison was up, she had to go back into the real world. If all she has been told for her 7 years in prison was "you're a bad seed"... she's just going to break the law again and be right back in a cell after hurting someone else.

Instead, she got extensive therapy, got clean, moved out of the trailer park, and was able to get an accounting degree in lockup.

I don't expect anyone to forgive her. Shoot, I don't forgive her for what she put my wife through. But she needs to be a productive member of society and saying "you're just a bad egg" isn't a helpful conversation in the least.

 

[husky429]

I believe you’re lost, in more ways than one.

Sad that people would think of anyone that way.

 

[Get a Job]

I wouldn't say I am excusing Bouknight at all. I believe he should have mandated rehab, hefty fines, and possibly even jail time if the gun ends up being illegally owned. I would say it's fairly obvious that Bouk is being effected by addiction, mental health, and his tough upbringing.

You don't help someone be a productive member of society if you say "you're a bad seed" and then assume they will never function as a normal human. You help them when you talk about where there bad habits come from, how to change our habits and environment, how to make better decisions in the moment, how to seek help, etc.

Like I've said a million times. I've got 3 brothers and a sister-in-law who are felons. My SIL murdered someone when she was high on meth. She's well aware that what she did is unforgivable. But when her time in prison was up, she had to go back into the real world. If all she has been told for her 7 years in prison was "you're a bad seed"... she's just going to break the law again and be right back in a cell after hurting someone else.

Instead, she got extensive therapy, got clean, moved out of the trailer park, and was able to get an accounting degree in lockup.

I don't expect anyone to forgive her. Shoot, I don't forgive her for what she put my wife through. But she needs to be a productive member of society and saying "you're just a bad egg" isn't a helpful conversation in the least.

@topogigio, your point of view is so naïve and cruel that the guy who called Bouknight an " stain of a human being" needed to set you straight!

 

[topogigio]

@topogigio, your point of view is so naïve and cruel that the guy who called Bouknight an " stain of a human being" needed to set you straight!

Let's see here; while a frosh in Storrs' steals a car, crashes car (probably under the influence), runs from scene/police - gets a pass from coach, light wrist slap from court and charges eventually disappear. In the past year, arrested at least 3 additional times for speeding, reckless driving, and failure to comply. This fourth incident; passed out in running car at intersection for over an hour while police use loudspeaker to try to wake him up, finally gets up, eats a snack, drives car intentionally into 2 police cars as he attempts to evade, all under the influence of something certainly more than the 4 shots of tequila which he claims. What is so naive and cruel when there is a very high possibility that some innocent could/would be maimed or killed due this habitual wanton, reckless, behavior? There are way too many boneyarders here are willing give him another pass and buy the excuse nonsense, ad nauseum - sorry, not me!

 

[dennismenace]

Apology:

https://www.heraldonline.com/sports/nba/charlotte-hornets/article267432222.html

 

[8893]

Let's see here; while a frosh in Storrs' steals a car, crashes car (probably under the influence), runs from scene/police - gets a pass from coach, light wrist slap from court and charges eventually disappear. In the past year, arrested at least 3 additional times for speeding, reckless driving, and failure to comply. This fourth incident; passed out in running car at intersection for over an hour while police use loudspeaker to try to wake him up, finally gets up, eats a snack, drives car intentionally into 2 police cars as he attempts to evade, all under the influence of something certainly more than the 4 shots of tequila which he claims. What is so naive and cruel when there is a very high possibility that some innocent could/would be maimed or killed due this habitual wanton, reckless, behavior? There are way too many boneyarders here are willing give him another pass and buy the excuse nonsense, ad nauseum - sorry, not me!

No one here is giving him a pass or buying excuses.

The point some are making is that no one (or almost no one) is irredeemable.