Big East DPOY Race | Page 2 | The Boneyard

Big East DPOY Race

auror said:
Providence's defense has been exactly the same with Minaya on and off the court during conference play. 94.7 adj D to the decimal. UConn's has been 11 points worse without Whaley.
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He has been off the court for a total of 36 minutes in 9 conference games so that seems like a pretty useless stat.
 
Hungryhusky99 said:
He has been off the court for a total of 36 minutes in 9 conference games so that seems like a pretty useless stat.
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That's basically a full game played without him. And there's been no dropoff in their defense (as of now it's been slightly better with him off the court). Even if the small sample size is concealing an effect, it's certainly not a large one.

He's a very good defender. But wing defenders are the least impactful defenders overall. He protects the rim a little bit and is versatile, but 1 versatile player doesn't help you as much as the value of having several, if that makes sense. A good wing defender can be somewhat avoided. And unlike say a shutdown NFL corner when you avoid them, that doesn't erase half the field, only 1/5. Locking down a wing player will only be relevant in certain matchups, unlike locking down the rim or disrupting the point of attack ballhandler.

For a wing defender to have a truly elite defensive value, they have to be disruptive (either help a ton at the rim or get in passing lanes/make steals, be part of a press, etc.)
 
navery12 said:
Well Morsell was outside the arena in quarantine while Martin was getting his 25, so not much he could do there
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I phrased that very poorly. Meant Minya didn’t stop Martin, and that I notice Morsell when I watch Marquette.
 
auror said:
That's basically a full game played without him. And there's been no dropoff in their defense (as of now it's been slightly better with him off the court). Even if the small sample size is concealing an effect, it's certainly not a large one.

He's a very good defender. But wing defenders are the least impactful defenders overall. He protects the rim a little bit and is versatile, but 1 versatile player doesn't help you as much as the value of having several, if that makes sense. A good wing defender can be somewhat avoided. And unlike say a shutdown NFL corner when you avoid them, that doesn't erase half the field, only 1/5. Locking down a wing player will only be relevant in certain matchups, unlike locking down the rim or disrupting the point of attack ballhandler.

For a wing defender to have a truly elite defensive value, they have to be disruptive (either help a ton at the rim or get in passing lanes/make steals, be part of a press, etc.)
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Ask Justin Lewis and Shaka Smart about Minaya. Smart specifically called him out in his presser.
 
Huskyforlife said:
I phrased that very poorly. Meant Minya didn’t stop Martin, and that I notice Morsell when I watch Marquette.
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He just won BE player of the week. If you don't notice him then you are absolutely not watching the games,
 
FriarJ said:
Ask Justin Lewis and Shaka Smart about Minaya. Smart specifically called him out in his presser.
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Locking down a wing player will only be relevant in certain matchups, unlike locking down the rim or disrupting the point of attack ballhandler.
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That's one of the few matchups in the conference where a good wing defender is very relevant, because Lewis plays a bit of a point power forward role, which is pretty rare in college basketball. St. John's the other really beneficial matchup.
 
auror said:
That's basically a full game played without him. And there's been no dropoff in their defense (as of now it's been slightly better with him off the court). Even if the small sample size is concealing an effect, it's certainly not a large one.

He's a very good defender. But wing defenders are the least impactful defenders overall. He protects the rim a little bit and is versatile, but 1 versatile player doesn't help you as much as the value of having several, if that makes sense. A good wing defender can be somewhat avoided. And unlike say a shutdown NFL corner when you avoid them, that doesn't erase half the field, only 1/5. Locking down a wing player will only be relevant in certain matchups, unlike locking down the rim or disrupting the point of attack ballhandler.

For a wing defender to have a truly elite defensive value, they have to be disruptive (either help a ton at the rim or get in passing lanes/make steals, be part of a press, etc.)
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I mean the only two games he sat for significant minutes were against us and Seton Hall. The defense holding up against us without Sanogo and with a rusty Martin doesn't really prove much. Seton Hall was also coming off a pause and a bit short handed that game as well so the argument that they are just as good without him on the court seems a bit lazy to me.
auror said:
He protects the rim a little bit and is versatile, but 1 versatile player doesn't help you as much as the value of having several, if that makes sense.
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Ground breaking stuff here as well. No way having multiple good defenders is better than having one.
 
CardiacAndre7 said:
Minaya has been a great defender. Very versatile. Whaley is that as well. No need to bash one or the other. I personally think Whaley was significantly better on defense last season, but he has been good this season as well.
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this is a rarity -- a reasonable, even-handed take on the-boneyard.com

i more-or-less agree. whaley is my favorite player on the team, but he hasn't had the same season as last year, at least in terms of counting stats. that being said, if he has a few of the "statement games" he had last year -- games where he has 5+ blocks, is terrorizing pick-and-roll ballhandlers all game, etc. -- he will become the favorite very quickly.
 
UcannUconn said:
He has a point.
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He’s not JC level as a coach but these New England guys just know how to tell it as it is. He does have the “what are they going to do to me” thing going though, just like JC.
 
Not sure if somebody has mentioned it already but the watchlist came out for the Naismith national defensive payer of the year. No Whaley. Posh Alexander is the only BE guy represented. Walker Kessler made the cut though, which makes me feel even better about Sanogo’s 30 that game.
 
Ronobro said:
Not sure if somebody has mentioned it already but the watchlist came out for the Naismith national defensive payer of the year. No Whaley. Posh Alexander is the only BE guy represented. Walker Kessler made the cut though, which makes me feel even better about Sanogo’s 30 that game.
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That's what the Cooley video is about. He states "only one player from the BE? That's some bull####!"
 
Cooley is great. A strong PC is great for the big east and I hope the rivalry continues to gain steam. It’s fun to play PC when they’re up. Watson is fun to hate. A- player, A+ yapper.
 
My views toward Cooley certainly changed since joining the league. He goes hard for the BE. I like it.
 
It amazes me that anyone cares who is Big East DPOY.
 
OkaForPrez said:
Cooley is great. A strong PC is great for the big east and I hope the rivalry continues to gain steam. It’s fun to play PC when they’re up. Watson is fun to hate. A- player, A+ yapper.
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The problem with Cooley is that his teams never do anything in March. He has been a head coach since 2006 and has one NCAA tournament win total. Honest.
 
The Big East will have a great opportunity this spring when they will be heavily represented in the tourney. I think we will do some damage.
 
CardiacAndre7 said:
Minaya has been a great defender. Very versatile. Whaley is that as well. No need to bash one or the other. I personally think Whaley was significantly better on defense last season, but he has been good this season as well.
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I think Minaya is a legitimate national defensive player of the year candidate, but also think he, Whaley, and Morsell should've joined Posh on the list. This doesn't even take into account a number of other high level defensive player in the conference like Andre Jackson, Rhoden, Aaron Thompson, Al Durham, etc.
 
auror said:
For a wing defender to have a truly elite defensive value, they have to be disruptive (either help a ton at the rim or get in passing lanes/make steals, be part of a press, etc.)
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If you're insisting he's not meeting any of those criteria, you're not watching the games.
 
Huskybass said:
The problem with Cooley is that his teams never do anything in March. He has been a head coach since 2006 and has one NCAA tournament win total. Honest.
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Nice smallie! The other problem that has a direct correlation to the problem you mentioned is we normally have gotten in while on the bubble. Those seeds are tough to have success with. They get you games like NC in NC two times and a stout Texas A&M squad with Robert Thompson as well as play in games. Finally when we had one decent seed (a 6) we drew Dayton in Columbus for a 10:00pm start Dayton home game. That’s why there is not a Friar fan alive complaining or worrying about our luck this year.
 
FriarJ said:
Nice smallie! The other problem that has a direct correlation to the problem you mentioned is we normally have gotten in while on the bubble. Those seeds are tough to have success with. They get you games like NC in NC two times and a stout Texas A&M squad with Robert Thompson as well as play in games. Finally when we had one decent seed (a 6) we drew Dayton in Columbus for a 10:00pm start Dayton home game. That’s why there is not a Friar fan alive complaining or worrying about our luck this year.
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PC fans must be elated this year. 18-2, take care of business over the next month and a nice seed should follow. Cooley seems like a great guy and the conference is better when PC is good.
 

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