Berry Tramel: Analyzing the strengths and weaknesses of Big 12 expansion candidates

[UConnJim]

You brought up statistical data from different sites to refute the Fishy poster's claim that BC has "no support" . You were assailed for your data. BC is generally ranked 30th to 45th most years in TV watching " support " . Uconn is never in the top 50, no matter what their schedule is that year, nor their record that year. The fact is that BC football has had more " support " than Uconn football has.... in 48 out of the last 50 years in New England too.. BC has bigger home attendance the last 2 years than Uconn football has. And Uconn Football has no pro competition in its state like BC has, and Uconn has a bigger enrollment and more Alums. So when we hear that BC has no support in N.E., in is seen in the undeniable context that BC factually has more football " support " than Uconn football does.... which makes the charge then say more about the person attempting to make the false claim, than it does about BC or the other more sensible Uconn football fans, that would never attempt to make such a silly claim. There are a lot of good things to claim about Uconn football, but this was not one of them by this Fishy poster.

BC does not have more football fans than UConn. The only reason BC has higher attendance than UConn is the opponents. If UConn had home games with the like of Notre Dame, Florida St., Clemson, Syracuse, Virginia Tech, ... UConn would be expanding the Rent. As for TV ratings, BC's opponents drive the ratings as well. Honestly, don't you think BC/FSU is going to draw more viewers than UConn/USF? Of course. BC playing Notre Dame? I think ND is driving the ratings.

The only things BC has over UConn in football is that they have been playing high level football longer and they have a better conference affiliation. UConn football facilities far surpass BC. The state of Connecticut is behind UConn and BC does not have the same support. Finally, for fans, it is far easier for fans to attend a UConn football game than a BC football game. I live 7 miles from Alumni Stadium and it is easier for me to attend a game at the Rent.

 

[BoatShow]

1BCfan@hoopsgame.jpg

 

[whaler11]

Those Big 12 TV ratings aren't wrong. That's what happens when you get in bed with Fox.

 

[Yawkey Way]

There's no evidence that Boston College football has even marginal support in their own city, let alone the country.

Do you kids actually believe this nonsense or is this just a weak show of bravado to make yourselves feel better? It's kinda hard to watch.

He just gave you the data as evidence but you assailed him as well as his data. The fact that you are incapable apparently of absorbing the data is neither his, nor my fault. BC 's home game football attendance has been larger than Uconn's football home attendance for 48 out of the last 50 years. Those are just the facts. BC football has more " support " in N.E and the country than Uconn football has . I only bring this up as a frame of reference reply to your silly claim that BC football has " no support " beyond its campus. Making silly claims shouldn't make one feel better. Dealing with reality is far better, and healthier in the long run. You should try it.

 

[huskymedic]

 

[Fishy]

He just gave you the data as evidence but you assailed him as well as his data. The fact that you are incapable apparently of absorbing the data is neither his, nor my fault. BC 's home game football attendance has been larger than Uconn's football home attendance for 48 out of the last 50 years. Those are just the facts. BC football has more " support " in N.E and the country than Uconn football has . I only bring this up as a frame of reference reply to your silly claim that BC football has " no support " beyond its campus. Making silly claims shouldn't make one feel better. Dealing with reality is far better, and healthier in the long run. You should try it.

No, he gave me football ratings which he immediately qualified as not meaning anything given that he didn't know the opponents, etc. (Being the B-side to Florida State or Penn State doesn't exactly qualify as 'evidence' of relevance, sweet pea.)

But you haven't even done that much. At least he tried to make something stick to the wall - you're just here stamping your lil feet.

Boston College football has no support past campus. To try to put it another way - there is no place on this planet that can be considered a hot bed of Boston College support outside of that campus. For the love of God, if the city of Boston doesn't care, what makes you think the act plays better out of town? It's nonsensical.

But words are hard - perhaps you're a visual learner.

This is a map of Boston detailing Boston College's appeal to the various locales. As you can see, support fades once you get to the sidewalk lining campus.

I was going to do the rest of the world, but I'm playing catch up on True Detective tonight and you get the gist.

 

[itgoeslike]

He just gave you the data as evidence but you assailed him as well as his data. The fact that you are incapable apparently of absorbing the data is neither his, nor my fault. BC 's home game football attendance has been larger than Uconn's football home attendance for 48 out of the last 50 years. Those are just the facts. BC football has more " support " in N.E and the country than Uconn football has . I only bring this up as a frame of reference reply to your silly claim that BC football has " no support " beyond its campus. Making silly claims shouldn't make one feel better. Dealing with reality is far better, and healthier in the long run. You should try it.

No. The thread was discussing general fandom as it relates to New England. Your attempt at misdirection could stem from not having any real data to counter the claim(s). According to this InfoGraphic Harvard is the #1 college football team in the state of Massachusetts. This article does a great job in expanding upon BC's lack of a following in New England and Massachusetts. Nothing's more damning than this Interactive Map that breaks down College Football Fandom by zip code. It reveals an immediate drop off of BC support outside of Boston (they don't even make the top 3). Conversely, it shows how UConn fandom spills over into Massachusetts, Eastern New York, Rhode Island and even into Long Island. Again, this is College Football. Imagine what the map looks like if it included basketball and general fandom. UConn has a following throughout the region. BC does not.

 

[Yawkey Way]

No. The thread was discussing general fandom as it relates to New England. Your attempt at misdirection could stem from not having any real data to counter the claim(s). According to this InfoGraphic Harvard is the #1 college football team in the state of Massachusetts. This article does a great job in expanding upon BC's lack of a following in New England and Massachusetts. Nothing's more damning than this Interactive Map that breaks down College Football Fandom by zip code. It reveals an immediate drop off of BC support outside of Boston (they don't even make the top 3). Conversely, it shows how UConn fandom spills over into Massachusetts, Eastern New York, Rhode Island and even into Long Island. Again, this is College Football. Imagine what the map looks like if it included basketball and general fandom. UConn has a following throughout the region. BC does not.

You had me laugh when you said that Harvard has more interest in football in Massachusetts than BC does. Thats like saying that Yale has more support in Connecticut because every 2 years the Harvard - Yale game is played in New Haven and they get a good crowd and local TV audience, and that audience and fan attendance is good every 2 years for that annual game. So is Yale, because of this, have more support than does Uconn football ? Using the same " logic " ?

I don't pretend to tell people that reside in Connecticut, how much support there is for Uconn Football. I'll take stats on home game attendance, tv ratings, and what they tell me. Conversely, when people who weren't born and don't live in Greater Boston tell me that Harvard U. Football has more support than BC football, these outsiders really don't know what they are talking about. Harvard football home attendance is not even half that of BC. Its Ivy league football games have such disinterest that the games are not even televised in Boston... nor in any part of Massachusetts. If there was interest, the games would be televised. The networks would want it. They have no media covering their games either. Its a 2 paragrah coverage in the Globe. I could go on, but its silly to even be discussing this Harvard Football silliness. Their Yale game in Cambridge brings out the Harvard U. Brahmins every 2 years so they can get hammered before the game. The notion that these are college football fans is really a stretch to say the least. They don't even remember the game by halftime as many of them are too drunk. And even with the large attendance for that one game, it still pales to the interest that BC football has in the area, compared to Harvard, as BC easily outdraws Harvard for its home games ( as presumably Uconn football does in Connecticut vs. Yale's home game annual attendance figures ).

 

[auggie22]

You had me laugh when you said that Harvard has more interest in football in Massachusetts than BC does. Thats like saying that Yale has more support in Connecticut because every 2 years the Harvard - Yale game is played in New Haven and they get a good crowd and local TV audience, and that audience and fan attendance is good every 2 years for that annual game. So is Yale, because of this, have more support than does Uconn football ? Using the same " logic " ?

I don't pretend to tell people that reside in Connecticut, how much support there is for Uconn Football. I'll take stats on home game attendance, tv ratings, and what they tell me. Conversely, when people who weren't born and don't live in Greater Boston tell me that Harvard U. Football has more support than BC football these outsiders really don't know what they are talking about. Harvard football home attendance is not even half that of BC. Its Ivy league football games have such disinterest that the games are not even televised in Boston. They have no media covering the games. Its a 2 paragrah coverage in the Globe. I could go on, but its silly to even be discussing this Harvard Football silliness. Their Yale game in Cambridge brings out the Harvard U. Brahmins every 2 years so they can get hammered before the game. The notion that these are college football fans is really a stretch to say the least. They don't even remember the game by halftime as many of them are too drunk. And even with the large attendance for that one game, it still pales to the interest that BC football has in the area, compared to Harvard, as BC easily outdraws Harvard for its home games ( as presumably Uconn football does in Connecticut vs. Yale's home game annual attendance figures ).

Then take my word for it. I have lived in greater Boston for over twenty years, half of that downtown. I have a diploma from BC. Harvard has a bigger following in Boston. So does BU. I'm not sure UCONN doesn't either, at least during BBall season.

You keep talking about attendance. Don't. Harvard does not get home games with USC, ND, FSU, etc. What was your home attendance for the Maine game this year? I bet it was under 30,000.

 

[Yawkey Way]

No, he gave me football ratings which he immediately qualified as not meaning anything given that he didn't know the opponents, etc. (Being the B-side to Florida State or Penn State doesn't exactly qualify as 'evidence' of relevance, sweet pea.)

But you haven't even done that much. At least he tried to make something stick to the wall - you're just here stamping your lil feet.

Boston College football has no support past campus. To try to put it another way - there is no place on this planet that can be considered a hot bed of Boston College support outside of that campus. For the love of God, if the city of Boston doesn't care, what makes you think the act plays better out of town? It's nonsensical.



But words are hard - perhaps you're a visual learner.

This is a map of Boston detailing Boston College's appeal to the various locales. As you can see, support fades once you get to the sidewalk lining campus.

I was going to do the rest of the world, but I'm playing catch up on True Detective tonight and you get the gist.

That map is so childish as a creation, its clearly meant for a simple laugh, but it really has no basis in any reality. I think that deep down you know this isn't true eiyher.

 

[itgoeslike]

You had me laugh when you said that Harvard has more interest in football in Massachusetts than BC does. Thats like saying that Yale has more support in Connecticut because every 2 years the Harvard - Yale game is played in New Haven and they get a good crowd and local TV audience, and that audience and fan attendance is good every 2 years for that annual game. So is Yale, because of this, have more support than does Uconn football ? Using the same " logic " ?

I don't pretend to tell people that reside in Connecticut, how much support there is for Uconn Football. I'll take stats on home game attendance, tv ratings, and what they tell me. Conversely, when people who weren't born and don't live in Greater Boston tell me that Harvard U. Football has more support than BC football, these outsiders really don't know what they are talking about. Harvard football home attendance is not even half that of BC. Its Ivy league football games have such disinterest that the games are not even televised in Boston... nor in any part of Massachusetts. If there was interest, the games would be televised. The networks would want it. They have no media covering their games either. Its a 2 paragrah coverage in the Globe. I could go on, but its silly to even be discussing this Harvard Football silliness. Their Yale game in Cambridge brings out the Harvard U. Brahmins every 2 years so they can get hammered before the game. The notion that these are college football fans is really a stretch to say the least. They don't even remember the game by halftime as many of them are too drunk. And even with the large attendance for that one game, it still pales to the interest that BC football has in the area, compared to Harvard, as BC easily outdraws Harvard for its home games ( as presumably Uconn football does in Connecticut vs. Yale's home game annual attendance figures ).

Based upon your response, it appears you've finally conceded that BC doesn't have much of a following in New England once you leave Boston.

 

[Yawkey Way]

Then take my word for it. I have lived in greater Boston for over twenty years, half of that downtown. I have a diploma from BC. Harvard has a bigger following in Boston. So does BU.

.

You are just kidding youself. I don't even think the majority of Uconn football fans believe this. The comment that BU football has a bigger following in Boston than BC football is fall down funny. I'd imagine even most of the Uconn football fans here ( that did not live in Boston for " over 20 years " as you tell us you did ) know that BU dropped football decades ago ( lol! ).

 

[Fishy]

As a point of fact, he didn't say Harvard was more popular than Boston College - the article in the Globe did. As did this article that ran on ESPN.

Here's TicketCity's methodology...

To determine which college football team is the most popular in each state, we factored in four pieces of data for all Division I football teams (FBS and FCS). The first two data points were culled from social media; the number of Facebook fans and Twitter followers that each football team’s official page has. Next, we used Google Tools to pull the monthly average number of searches conducted for each team by users in that team’s state. Lastly, we used the median price of tickets on the secondary market for the upcoming season. As the price of tickets is a strong indicator of demand, we weighed that factor heavier than the other three. We then indexed the data points and ranked the teams accordingly.

So there was a metric and using that metric, Harvard was more popular than Boston College in Massachusetts. Damned data.

And here's their map...really looks like it holds form, doesn't it? Every state is about what you'd expect - even I'd guess that BC is more popular than Harvard, but this doesn't help. It even has you trying to attribute the motivations of people heading to Harvard games. ("They just wanna get drunk!") At a minimum, it certainly lends weight to the premise that Boston College has no fan support outside of its own campus. (Which it doesn't - see previously posted map.)

 

[Yawkey Way]

Based upon your response, it appears you've finally conceded that BC doesn't have much of a following in New England once you leave Boston.

BC has more interest for its football games in N.E. than Uconn football does. And has for 48 out of the last 50 years. The home game football attendance and both the national and N.E. TV ratings confirm this. I don't know what else yo tell you. I will concede that Uconn has more interest in its football games than BC in the state of Connecticut alone. But othger than that, the evidence of football game home attendance for BC and for Uconn is readily available.. as are the national and N.E. annual TV ratings for both football programs. Its all there as concrete, verifiable data for those genuinely interested. For those just interested in make believe, thats cool too.

 

[auggie22]

You are just kidding youself. I don't even think the majority of Uconn football fans believe this. The comment that BU football has a bigger following in Boston than BC football is fall down funny. I'd imagine even most of the Uconn football fans here ( that did not live in Boston for " over 20 years " as you tell us you did ) know that BU dropped football decades ago ( lol! ).

You are dense. I said BU has a bigger following, as does Harvard. I said nothing about football. They have more fans rooting for their varioas endeavors.

Also, you are kind of a penis. Go insult me on your own board.

 

[The Viking]

Congrats on BC getting better football ratings so far. I'm sure you BC fanboys are proud.

Do you really think at some point if the B1G were to take a chance on the market/potential of UConn, that we will even be having a ratings argument in say 2025-2030?

We just have to get that lifeboat....

 

[Yawkey Way]

As a point of fact, he didn't say Harvard was more popular than Boston College - the article in the Globe did. As did this article that ran on ESPN.

Here's TicketCity's methodology...

the number of Facebook fans and Twitter followers that each football team’s .

" twitter followers... facebook fans "... haha!... that is too funny. Maybe we can set up our own methodology and include Linked fans, and Gmail subscribers, cell phone users, and Abercrombie clothing store buyers, etc... lol!. So in other words, a twitter account fan talking about the Harvard- Columbia football game counts as much as a fan in paid attendance at a BC football game vs FSU ( or even Umass ) ?. Someone can make up any outcome they want if they utilize a goofy methodology that would not pass muster at Central Connecticut State College, let alone BC, Harvard, or Uconn. Com'on Man, even you have to admit that we immediately throw out any methodology to gauge college football interest between Yale- Uconn, or BC- Harvard with " twitter account " tweets, facebook postings, and that utter stupidness. Even saavy network advertisers would disregard that bogus methodology. If they thought it had ANY merits, Harvard football games would be on TV, and the Boston Media would have beat reporters covering their football games... as they'd want to make a buck. But they don't. Thats tells you more than " Twitter tweets ". ( lol!)

 

[Yawkey Way]

Congrats on BC getting better football ratings so far. I'm sure you BC fanboys are proud.

Do you really think at some point if the B1G were to take a chance on the market/potential of UConn, that we will even be having a ratings argument in say 2025-2030?

We just have to get that lifeboat....

I would love to see BC and Uconn play a football game every few years. I don't see why they can't, and why BC won't relent. Maybe then we could compare the fan interest. But right now, the evidence seems pretty clear according to legitimate sources that have been doing this for decades.. ie, TV ratings, and home game annual football attendance. Those are primarily the conventional yardsticks utilized for years and years to properly gauge a football programs interest in a geographical region.

 

[Fishy]

Someone can make up any outcome they want if they utilize a goofy methodology....

We know.

We've been watching you flap around for hours now...

 

[Yawkey Way]

You are dense. I said BU has a bigger following, as does Harvard. I said nothing about football. They have more fans rooting for their varioas endeavors.

Also, you are kind of a . Go insult me on your own board.

Well, you did get kinda get lost here with your comments... as we were talking about FOOTBALL on here on this thread. Naturally then, one presumed your comments about BU were about football, otherwise, why bring it up, as we certainly were not talking on this thread about Uconn hockey, BC Hockey, BU Hockey. Thats for another thread, and perhaps for another forum side on this Board. I did not " insult " you. I took your comments as a football generated one.. and why would I not ?

 

[Yawkey Way]

We know.

We've been watching you flap around for hours now...

Yes, well, its generally understood in most quarters that you've probably lost the high ground on your arguments, logic, and reasoning abilities, etc when you decide to drift into the personal attack mode. Thats generally a sign that you've got nothing else left... but an insult. And who is " we " ? One read here and its clear that there is diversity of thought, and few posters take on the mantle of thinking they speak for all Uconn football fans. You don't speak for all Uconn football fans. The ones I know are far more civil, gracious, than you are. And I don't speak for other BC football fans either. Thats not my call either.

 

[itgoeslike]

BC has more interest for its football games in N.E. than Uconn football does. And has for 48 out of the last 50 years. The home game football attendance and both the national and N.E. TV ratings confirm this. I don't know what else yo tell you. I will concede that Uconn has more interest in its football games than BC in the state of Connecticut alone. But othger than that, the evidence of football game home attendance for BC and for Uconn is readily available.. as are the national and N.E. annual TV ratings for both football programs. Its all there as concrete, verifiable data for those genuinely interested. For those just interested in make believe, thats cool too.

 

[Yawkey Way]

The only reason BC has higher attendance than UConn is the opponents.

Perhaps thats true, hard to say one way or the other. BC football did outdraw Uconn football in the 60's, 70's too however. And BC played a lot of Eastern only opponents most years, same as Uconn football did. But its true that BC's football opponents are more attractive for fans than Uconn's football opponents are, and that this has had an effect on Uconn's football attendance. I can understand that.

 

[uconndogs]

" twitter followers... facebook fans "... haha!... that is too funny. ( lol!)

I don't get the humor. I have our marketing folks watch that stuff like duck*ing hawks. Glad I got my business degree at UCONN.........

 

[whaler11]

I was watching the BC fixing 30 for 30 the other night and it was striking the crowds at the basketball games compared to today.

 

[uconndogs]

I was watching the BC fixing 30 for 30 the other night and it was striking the crowds at the basketball games compared to today.

Between you and Fishy............lol!

I still can't figure out if Yawkee is trying to duckk with us or if he's really as dim as he posts. Seriously can't figure that one out.

 

[whaler11]

Between you and Fishy..lol!

I still can't figure out if Yawkee is trying to duckk with us or if he's really as dim as he posts. Seriously can't figure that one out.

I wasn't trying to troll him. It's a little before my time and the Garden was rocking.

 

[uconndogs]

..........the Garden was rocking.

Well, given the money on the line they probably had the entire North End in the place

 

[DarthGrumpy]

. Most N.E. casual sports fans think very highly of the Basketball programs at Uconn. Men's and Woman's. Even in Boston, where I live it is applauded for its many accomplishments . But when the topic turns to football, Uconn football is viewed by many as having waited too long to decide it wanted to play at the highest levels. As a result, Uconn football has less interest in N.E. than BC does.... which is no surprise as BC has been at it since the last 70's, and much longer than Uconn has. BC home football attendance has been larger than Uconn's home football attendance 48 out of the last 50 years.... and BC's football games annual TV ratings in N.E. have outstipped Uconn's TV ratings in N.E., 48 out of the last 50 years too. Those are just the incontrovertible and verifiable facts on N.E. college football " support " in the region. The rest is just talk that essentially attempts to make one feel better, but has no bearing in any reality, really.

Comparing BC football to UConn football prior to 1999 when UConn made the jump to D1 football makes no sense. Then again, many folks in BC still compare their football program to Holy Cross, even though that school went in the opposite direction in 1986.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

You brought up statistical data from different sites to refute the Fishy poster's claim that BC has "no support" . You were assailed for your data. BC is generally ranked 30th to 45th most years in TV watching " support " . Uconn is never in the top 50, no matter what their schedule is that year, nor their record that year. The fact is that BC football has had more " support " than Uconn football has.... in 48 out of the last 50 years in New England too.. BC has bigger home attendance the last 2 years than Uconn football has. And Uconn Football has no pro competition in its state like BC has, and Uconn has a bigger enrollment and more Alums. So when we hear that BC has no support in N.E., in is seen in the undeniable context that BC factually has more football " support " than Uconn football does.... which makes the charge then say more about the person attempting to make the false claim, than it does about BC or the other more sensible Uconn football fans, that would never attempt to make such a silly claim. There are a lot of good things to claim about Uconn football, but this was not one of them by this Fishy poster.

In 2014, BC has 7 home games, including marquee matches with USC, a highly ranked Clemson team, and their ACC 'rival' in Syracuse and averaged 34,000 at their 44,000 seat stadium while going 7 & 6 in a bowl season for them. UConn has one of its worst seasons in history at 2 & 10 with 7 home games; but, only one brand name game at home (BYU) and averaged 27,500 to their 40,000 seat stadium. That does not look like dominance to me. Let's look at 2010 instead as both programs did well that season. BC went 7 & 6 and went bowling with home games against V Tech and ND resulting in an average home attendance of 38,400. UConn went 8 & 5 and also went bowling (BCS Fiesta) with Vanderbilt and W Virginia visiting resulting in an average home attendance of 38,200. That's not dominance. That's a key reason why BC's leadership blackballed UConn within the ACC when the Big E fell apart.

http://fs.ncaa.org/Docs/stats/football_records/Attendance/2010.pdf