Behind the scenes of Brett Yormark’s yearlong push to get the Big 12 to 16 (The Athletic)

[billybud]

Zissou...

You don't seem to be bilingual...basketball your only tongue.

I do understand that for many that is so....

If basketball ever drives realignment and media money, you are on to something....and who knows ?

The world we have known for decades is changing rapidly.

 

[noeynox]

Do you think the Big East has helped UConn?

Has ACC membership hurt interest levels and recruiting at BC, Cuse, and Pitt?

Yes. Do you think UConn has helped the Big East? Because those schools have sucked with more resources doesn't mean UConn will as well. UConn BB was doing better than all of them when we were all in the Big East as well. Not like UConn "rose up" in their absence. I know that is the case for Nova, so maybe that is why you view it like that.

 

[CL82]

Do you think the Big East has helped UConn?

Has ACC membership hurt interest levels and recruiting at BC, Cuse, and Pitt?

I think that being in the Big East has helped Connecticut in terms of recruiting, donations and fan interest. Being in the American was an absolutely miserable experience and was slowly killing the program. But, that doesn't mean that Connecticut's success was so late due to the joining the Big East, nor does it mean that we wouldn't be successful elsewhere.

No doubt about it, that Syracuse and Pitt have lost relevance and fan interest in the ACC. I suspect that has more to do with on the court performance than conference affiliation, however. It's tough to say that BCU Was hurt by the move to the ACC since they weren't particularly world beaters in the original big east either.

If conference affiliation was what mattered, wouldn't there be more national championships in the Big East. Prior to Jay Wright retiring Villanova was carrying the water for the conference and that's now been handed on to us. And the reasonable conclusion to draw from that is that success is more closely affiliated with coaching than Conference affiliation.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the big east conference. It's good to go to games against opponents at the fanbase cares about and can drive to. But at $4 million a year in broadcast rights revenue, members of this conference operates at a significant disadvantage. Right now, Connecticut's success is masking that, but make no mistake about it we all are swimming upstream here.

 

[John]

Do you think the Big East has helped UConn?

Has ACC membership hurt interest levels and recruiting at BC, Cuse, and Pitt?

In basketball, yes. As a holistic athletic department? No, and it'll get worse.

Cuse and Pitt suffered from poor bb coaching and you know that. Fredo is Fredo.

 

[noeynox]

I think that being in the Big East has helped Connecticut in terms of recruiting, donations and fan interest. Being in the American was an absolutely miserable experience and was slowly killing the program. But, that doesn't mean that Connecticut's success was so late due to the joining the Big East, nor does it mean that we wouldn't be successful elsewhere.

No doubt about it, that Syracuse and Pitt have lost relevance and fan interest in the ACC. I suspect that has more to do with on the court performance than conference affiliation, however. It's tough to say that BCU Was hurt by the move to the ACC since they weren't particularly world beaters in the original big east either.

If conference affiliation was what mattered, wouldn't there be more national championships in the Big East. Prior to Jay Wright retiring Villanova was carrying the water for the conference and that's now been handed on to us. And the reasonable conclusion to draw from that is that success is more closely affiliated with coaching than Conference affiliation.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the big east conference. It's good to go to games against opponents at the fanbase cares about and can drive to. But at $4 million a year in broadcast rights revenue, members of this conference operates at a significant disadvantage. Right now, Connecticut's success is masking that, but make no mistake about it we all are swimming upstream here.

Like your post and agree with it, but what does Gonzaga get in media dollars vs the Big East? That is the closer comparison for the BE not the B1G.

 

[Zissou]

I think that being in the Big East has helped Connecticut in terms of recruiting, donations and fan interest. Being in the American was an absolutely miserable experience and was slowly killing the program. But, that doesn't mean that Connecticut's success was so late due to the joining the Big East, nor does it mean that we wouldn't be successful elsewhere.

No doubt about it, that Syracuse and Pitt have lost relevance and fan interest in the ACC. I suspect that has more to do with on the court performance than conference affiliation, however. It's tough to say that BCU Was hurt by the move to the ACC since they weren't particularly world beaters in the original big east either.

If conference affiliation was what mattered, wouldn't there be more national championships in the Big East. Prior to Jay Wright retiring Villanova was carrying the water for the conference and that's now been handed on to us. And the reasonable conclusion to draw from that is that success is more closely affiliated with coaching than Conference affiliation.

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the big east conference. It's good to go to games against opponents at the fanbase cares about and can drive to. But at $4 million a year in broadcast rights revenue, members of this conference operates at a significant disadvantage. Right now, Connecticut's success is masking that, but make no mistake about it we all are swimming upstream here.

I agree that UConn winning last year wasn’t just a boost from conference affiliation. Coaching is everything and UConn was already on the rise.

Without overstating the impact, UConn benefits from the Big East in ways that the ACC doesn’t boost Cuse or Pitt. (The money is the big factor though in conference membership and UConn obviously takes the cash given the opportunity).

Conference affiliation does matter, but it’s only one factor for a program.

So, if the Big East helps boost your position and provides the schedule and rivalry juice to prep for post season, and it supports one interest and recruiting, would you rather put that all together and have a title or come up a little short but have the ACC cash?

 

[Zissou]

Yes. Do you think UConn has helped the Big East?

Without a doubt.

 

[billybud]

Why would UConn come up short in the ACC ?

The ACC has had three teams (combined) in the last two Final Fours...you think UConn couldn't make it to the Finals in another conference ?

 

[Zissou]

Zissou...

You don't seem to be bilingual...basketball your only tongue.

I do understand that for many that is so....

If basketball ever drives realignment and media money, you are on to something....and who knows ?

The world we have known for decades is changing rapidly.

I’m a football fan and that cash drives CR.

My teams are
SEC - UGA
ACC - Miami, Wake
B1G - Penn State

I also like to see the service academies compete.

It’s all a little less interesting with NIL and the portal.

 

[John]

I agree that UConn winning last year wasn’t just a boost from conference affiliation. Coaching is everything and UConn was already on the rise.

Without overstating the impact, UConn benefits from the Big East in ways that the ACC doesn’t boost Cuse or Pitt. (The money is the big factor though in conference membership and UConn obviously takes the cash given the opportunity).

Conference affiliation does matter, but it’s only one factor for a program.

So, if the Big East helps boost your position and provides the schedule and rivalry juice to prep for post season, and it supports one interest and recruiting, would you rather put that all together and have a title or come up a little short but have the ACC cash?

it's really stretching it to think a basketball title couldn't come with membership in a premier basketball conference like the ACC.

 

[Zissou]

Why would UConn come up short in the ACC ?

The ACC has had three teams (combined) in the last two Final Fours...you think UConn couldn't make it to the Finals in another conference ?

The northeast doesn’t connect with the ACC in the same way as the Big East.

 

[Zissou]

it's really stretching it to think a basketball title couldn't come with membership in a premier basketball conference like the ACC.

No one said it couldn’t

 

[John]

No one said it couldn’t

what's this mean then?

"would you rather put that all together and have a title or come up a little short but have the ACC cash"

 

[CL82]

Like your post and agree with it, but what does Gonzaga get in media dollars vs the Big East? That is the closer comparison for the BE not the B1G.

Disagree. No one is suggesting that Connecticut leave the big east to join the West Coast conference. This debate was expressly about the prospect of joining the ACC. Their per school share of median money is roughly 8-9 times what the biggest gets. That's the comparison.

 

[CL82]

I agree that UConn winning last year wasn’t just a boost from conference affiliation. Coaching is everything and UConn was already on the rise.

Without overstating the impact, UConn benefits from the Big East in ways that the ACC doesn’t boost Cuse or Pitt. (The money is the big factor though in conference membership and UConn obviously takes the cash given the opportunity).

Conference affiliation does matter, but it’s only one factor for a program.

So, if the Big East helps boost your position and provides the schedule and rivalry juice to prep for post season, and it supports one interest and recruiting, would you rather put that all together and have a title or come up a little short but have the ACC cash?

Well, your concluding alternative assumes assumes that Connecticut being in the ACC would not continue to be able "prep" Connecticut "for the postseason". Personally, I don't believe that joining the ACC hurts our chances to pursue a national championship anymore than Syracuse or Pitt joining the big east would enhance their chance for a national championship. I'll go further and say that annual conference distributions of $32 million + a year would be of benefit to Connecticut and it's continued pursuit of national championships. Additionally facing off home and away against quality schools like Duke and North Carolina, help us to maintain a high national profile, which helps for seeding, and in recruiting. Further, having games on ESPN and ABC does the same.

That said, we're not going anywhere in the near term, particularly the ACC. So the discussion is moot.

 

[Zissou]

what's this mean then?

"would you rather put that all together and have a title or come up a little short but have the ACC cash"

It’s an opinion that the Big East helps a bit with interest levels, rivalries, and recruiting. The Big East hoops juice is stronger in the northeast.

Some Pitt and Cuse fans have lamented that the interest level is less and being out of the Big East hurts recruiting.

If you accept that scenario, even hypothetically, would you rather have a title in the Big East, or have missed it but have the ACC cash and a better home for football?

I’m not saying that it would be impossible to be in the ACC and win a title.

 

[Zissou]

Well, your concluding alternative assumes assumes that Connecticut being in the ACC would not continue to be able "prep" Connecticut "for the postseason". Personally, I don't believe that joining the ACC hurts our chances to pursue a national championship anymore than Syracuse or Pitt joining the big east would enhance their chance for a national championship. I'll go further and say that annual conference distributions of $32 million + a year would be of benefit to Connecticut and it's continued pursuit of national championships. Additionally facing off home and away against quality schools like Duke and North Carolina, help us to maintain a high national profile, which helps for seeding, and in recruiting. Further, having games on ESPN and ABC does the same.

That said, we're not going anywhere in the near term, particularly the ACC. So the discussion is moot.

First point on ACC vs Big East supporting hoops for title runs is the discussion.

Second point on $32M…. UConn takes the cash and joins the ACC without question if offered. Cash, home for football.

If the difference is small between finishing tied for 4th in conference and peaking in March to win a title, vs losing in the E8, and hypothetically if the Big East boost was enough to make the difference (recruiting, prep), would you trade the title for the cash and for football to be in the middle of the pack outside the P2 but in a Top 4 conference?

 

[Zissou]

Why would UConn come up short in the ACC ?

The ACC has had three teams (combined) in the last two Final Fours...you think UConn couldn't make it to the Finals in another conference ?

3 ACC schools from the south made it. 2 BE schools for the northeast made it.

0 ACC schools from the northeast made it.

Some Cuse, Pitt, and BC fans thinks that the ACC is less conducive to top level recruiting.

Maybe it all changes again with NIL auctions for players. Maybe that cash becomes the big differentiator.

 

[noeynox]

Disagree. No one is suggesting that Connecticut leave the big east to join the West Coast conference. This debate was expressly about the prospect of joining the ACC. Their per school share of median money is roughly 8-9 times what the biggest gets. That's the comparison.

What you're basically saying is CT is different than all Big East schools and i agree. Big East schools sans football should not expect to be in the same stratosphere as the ACC or any other P5 league. I just do not view the Big East as underpaid compared to those leagues. You have to compare the BE to conferences that don't play FBS football.

 

[CL82]

If the difference is small between finishing tied for 4th in conference and peaking in March to win a title, vs losing in the E8, and hypothetically if the Big East boost was enough to make the difference (recruiting, prep), would you trade the title for the cash and for football to be in the middle of the pack outside the P2 but in a Top 4 conference?

Again, just because you imagine Connecticut won't be successful in the ACC doesn't mean that will happen. those of us who are old enough to remember will recall that many thought that Connecticut couldn't compete in the big east. Instead, it became its preeminent program. The notion keep putting forth is that the choices between physical security and continued athletic dominance. I will respectfully suggest that that is a false premise.

That said, they haven't offered us and our unlikely to, so the conversation is a moot one. Feel free to have the last word on it

 

[AzHusky]

If UConn were in the ACC they would be playing Cuse, Pitt and BC. I believe that would create as much fan interest as being in the BE does. The added money would help the football team and basketball would not suffer.

 

[Patman]

Uconn right now, in basketball transcends regions. BC, Syracuse, and Pitt have not had that power in sports (BC Hockey is not germane to this). With the last title UConn in hoops. So UConn basketball to the ACC won't have that problem. That being said, it was a mistake on the other schools part because they didn't transcend their region and that the ACC was always going to be a southern marketed league for southern teams. The NE schools were just television sets to them. Their staff (normal every day folks, personnel is policy) were always going to be focused on classical territorial areas.

 

[CL82]

What you're basically saying is CT is different than all Big East schools and i agree. Big East schools sans football should not expect to be in the same stratosphere as the ACC or any other P5 league. I just do not view the Big East as underpaid compared to those leagues. You have to compare the BE to conferences that don't play FBS football.

[Shrugs]. It doesn't matter. The expenses to be competitive on the national level are going to continue to increase. It doesn't matter if we make more than the other schools that aren't going to be competitive. That's not our mark. In the end we will either be able to afford being a competitive school or not. And the fact that we make more more money than most of the other schools who can't afford to compete, really won't matter one way or another?

Feel free to have the last word. I don't think I can explain it any better.