B1G, ACC battle for New York

[itgoeslike]

We'll take you on. Sign us up! http://www.vapolo.org/

The NCAA needs to get with it! LOL!

Many moons ago I attended Foxfield at UVA, which is really tailgating with horses, instead of football. My girlfriend at the time required that I purchase a pink oxford. . .I'll leave it at that.

 

[upstater]

You won't catch me going over 70 on a NYS highway or thruway (especially upstate) anymore...NY State Troopers are a ticket happy bunch!

They are, but they never ticket unless you're going 10+ mph. I put it in cruise control, and they've driven right past me as I did 73 mph countless times.

 

[upstater]

You missed a thread on Buffalo re: Big Ten admission. Whether that ever happens is improbable. However, I will say this, they are really aggressive in their rebranding efforts to position SUNY Buffalo as simply "The State University of New York." I didn't realize it was the AD that was behind the initiative.

They aren't rebranding. The 4 SUNY centers are intent on becoming economic engines for their regions. The person heading Cuomo's "Billion" private enterprise investment pact is none other than the President of UB. The school wants to be synonymous with Buffalo, not New York. This tells you quite a lot about AD and academic relations nationwide.

If UB were smart, it would start a D1 Ice Hockey program ASAP. They could do it at a fraction of the cost, grab a huge amount of local and Ontario talent, and be a top program right away. But the AD is from down South. UB is also missing a historic opportunity right now because the billionaire owner of the Sabres is building a hotel/restaurant/entertainment complex next to the Arena with 4 ice rinks in it, 2 public rinks, 1 Sabres practice rink, and a 3,500 seat arena with an eye toward landing World Juniors and USA tournaments. Given the fact that his own investments in the region are tightly in lockstep with the state's investments, and the rather incestuous relationship between pols, billionaires, developers and the state university, UB could easily squat on that 3,500 arena if it had a team. It would be one of the most well supported teams in the country. Instead, Canisius is going to grab it.

 

[itgoeslike]

They aren't rebranding. The 4 SUNY centers are intent on becoming economic engines for their regions. The person heading Cuomo's "Billion" private enterprise investment pact is none other than the President of UB. The school wants to be synonymous with Buffalo, not New York. This tells you quite a lot about AD and academic relations nationwide.

If UB were smart, it would start a D1 Ice Hockey program ASAP. They could do it at a fraction of the cost, grab a huge amount of local and Ontario talent, and be a top program right away. But the AD is from down South. UB is also missing a historic opportunity right now because the billionaire owner of the Sabres is building a hotel/restaurant/entertainment complex next to the Arena with 4 ice rinks in it, 2 public rinks, 1 Sabres practice rink, and a 3,500 seat arena with an eye toward landing World Juniors and USA tournaments. Given the fact that his own investments in the region are tightly in lockstep with the state's investments, and the rather incestuous relationship between pols, billionaires, developers and the state university, UB could easily squat on that 3,500 arena if it had a team. It would be one of the most well supported teams in the country. Instead, Canisius is going to grab it.

They appear to be rebranding, and are the only SUNY school laying claim to "New York" in a demonstrative and overt manner.

http://gamedayr.com/gamedayr/buffalo-state-university-of-new-york-football-uniforms-2013/
http://gamedayr.com/gamedayr/buffalo-unveils-new-basketball-court-design/

I thought Buffalo had a D1 team.

http://ubicehockey.com/

 

[upstater]

They appear to be rebranding, and are the only SUNY school laying claim to "New York" in a demonstrative and overt manner.

http://gamedayr.com/gamedayr/buffalo-state-university-of-new-york-football-uniforms-2013/
http://gamedayr.com/gamedayr/buffalo-unveils-new-basketball-court-design/

I thought Buffalo had a D1 team.

http://ubicehockey.com/

They most definitely are not rebranding. They have made a huge effort over a decade to drop the State University of New York and emphasize Buffalo.

The hockey team is a club team, not NCAA.

 

[itgoeslike]

They most definitely are not rebranding. They have made a huge effort over a decade to drop the State University of New York and emphasize Buffalo. That bball court was a surprise to many.

The hockey team is a club team, not NCAA.

I don't disagree that they were trying to move away from "SUNY Buffalo" with University at Buffalo (Stoneybrook too). But, it looks like they are going in a different direction in the coming year. You're right about hockey, although I think D1 is in the works. It is surprising that they aren't grabbing low hanging fruit. But look at UCONN, there's no reason (providing there are resources) not to be competing in Men's Lacrosse.

 

[JaYnYcE]

Clearly, PSU+Rutgers+Md > PSU only in Philly. Mich+OSU+PSU+Rutgers > Mich+OSU+PSU in NYC.

But, what Rutgers football brings to the NYC DMA, UConn basketball brings -- just as big an audience and just as many months of the year. Rutgers carries NJ, UConn creates B1G interest in most of NE.

I don't see why we would downgrade what Rutgers brings. It brings a lot to the B1G. UConn brings something similar, just a little farther up the eastern seaboard. If Rutgers fails the B1G, then UConn probably would too. But I don't think Rutgers will fail.

I've lived in the metropolitan area all my life and have worked in NYC for years. UCONN basketball, though a national brand, I feel comes third to the B1G alums and the casual fan of the schools in the Carolinas in NYC. Some of the young people that I come in contact with are pro ACC with the Dukes and the North Carolina's of the world.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Hoophound]

I've lived in the metropolitan area all my life and have worked in NYC for years. UCONN basketball, though a national brand, I feel comes third to the B1G alums and the casual fan of the schools in the Carolinas in NYC. Some of the young people that I come in contact with are pro ACC with the Dukes and the North Carolina's of the world.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

UNC is definitely big in urban culture. I have found that to be true in Boston, NY and Miami.

 

[upstater]

I don't disagree that they were trying to move away from "SUNY Buffalo" with University at Buffalo (Stoneybrook too). But, it looks like they are going in a different direction in the coming year. You're right about hockey, although I think D1 is in the works. It is surprising that they aren't grabbing low hanging fruit. But look at UCONN, there's no reason (providing there are resources) not to be competing in Men's Lacrosse.

The school will not rebrand, not in the middle of a $1 billion upgrade that's all about its connection to Buffalo. This is a harebrained idea by people in charge of repainting hardwood. They also are not going to upgrade hockey, which is a crazy thing, because Buffalo loves hockey, and there is amazing hockey talent located both within Buffalo and over the river in Ontario.

 

[btstimpy]

Many moons ago I attended Foxfield at UVA, which is really tailgating with horses, instead of football. My girlfriend at the time required that I purchase a pink oxford. . .I'll leave it at that.

I've been many times, and I know it's a steeple chase, but most of the times I never saw a horse. I was too busy partying. Good stuff!

Virginia is big time horse country. There are steeple chase events all over the state in the spring and fall. The Commonwealth Cup Polo Match between the Virgnia Commonwealth Polo Association and the British Forces Polo Foundation is held every September. The Farm and Stables where Secretariat was born and raised is now the site of the State Fairgrounds.

I think that the NCAA now has an equestrian sport for women. I would not be surprised if UVA along with 3 other ACC schools added it at some point especially with Louisville joining.

 

[Gurleyman]

We'll take you on. Sign us up! http://www.vapolo.org/

The NCAA needs to get with it! LOL!

You'd have an edge on us now. Our women won 4 or 5 in a row from 2006-09.

But if you read up on the about the program link on the UConn website, it is hard not to come away impressed:

http://www.polo.uconn.edu/program/index.html

 

[adbern7]

I can tell you from living in Westchester and working in Manhattan UCONN and Rutgers are much more popular than Syracuse in NYC.

i can tell you from growing up in Brooklyn, living in Long Island, and working in Manhattan, that Syracuse is much more popular then UConn and Rutgers in NYC.
c'mon - send that ridiculous New York Post link to that laughable "fan" study...i'm just waiting for it.

Uconn's best hope, and best chance for longer term success and winning, is still the ACC - one way or another. The ACC powers don't give a rat's rear what BC wants. Ask Missouri how it feels to be teased and teased by the B1G.

PS - enough with all the references to "Ped" State. It's such a nasty thing that happened there, creeps me out even typing about it. No need to keep bringing it up on a sports msg board.

 

[upstater]

i can tell you from growing up in Brooklyn, living in Long Island, and working in Manhattan, that Syracuse is much more popular then UConn and Rutgers in NYC.

Mike Tranghese and a lot of other people disagree with you. Tranghese is on record on this issue.

And then there's this: http://syracusefan.com/threads/looks-like-the-prov-game-will-be-tape-delayed.40752/

A Syracuse men's game against Providence is less popular in NYC than a UConn women's bball game. You got bumped.

 

[Gurleyman]

As I pointed out in another thread, St John's had to invent various protections in their ticket policies to prevent MSG from turning into Gampel South. Jarvis was tired of playing road games at home.

 

[itgoeslike]

i can tell you from growing up in Brooklyn, living in Long Island, and working in Manhattan, that Syracuse is much more popular then UConn and Rutgers in NYC.
c'mon - send that ridiculous New York Post link to that laughable "fan" study...i'm just waiting for it.

If we are talking pre-1990's I would agree with you regarding Syracuse's popularity. For decades NY State didn't have any big time athletics outside of Syracuse (St. Johns and some hockey programs made some noise). Additionally, Syracuse's specialization in advertising and public relations drove a lot of graduates to the city. But many things have changed since the 1980's. UCONN has not only caught up to Syracuse in popularity, in part by winning numerous championships, but is positioned to put distance between itself and Syracuse in the coming years. Outside of Connecticut, NYC is the #1 location for UCONN grads and as the university expands its enrollment, you'll see a greater number of graduates relocating to NYC. If you choose to look at NYC in terms of its DMA, then Syracuse falls further behind both UCONN and Rutgers. Hey, I think Syracuse still has a fan following in NYC, especially for basketball, but the times are a changing. Consider, more recently, Syracuse's poor turnout at the NYC-based Pinstripe Bowl.

This is coming from someone who owned a business in Manhattan, lived in Brooklyn, Jersey City (Newport Center), Long Island and Westchester County. . .and even once considered going to Syracuse.

 

[Adios]

People below the Mason-Dixon line and elsewhere (and Syracuse fans) have very little knowledge of educational trends here. Seen it multiple times, "UConn doesn't deliver much."

 

[woomba]

Syracuse has probably been one of the biggest losers from the rise of publics in the NE like UConn and Rutgers. Still a good school, but it's not quite the brand it used to be back in the 80s and early 90s from either a sports or academic perspective.

 

[uconnell]

As I pointed out in another thread, St John's had to invent various protections in their ticket policies to prevent MSG from turning into Gampel South. Jarvis was tired of playing road games at home.

So did RU for women's games.

 

[Sea Goat]

UVA is not interested in the Big Ten Conference. The Big Ten has already approached UVA with an offer to join, and UVA said "Thanks, but No Thanks." Then UVA signed the Grant of Rights to the ACC. With the demographic shift nationally and population growth rates in the Southern part of the ACC footprint, the ACC has the potential to become second to only the SEC regarding football because the ACC has access to many of the same states as the SEC for high school recruiting. The population is shifting away from the Big Ten footprint and into the ACC, SEC, and Pac 12 footprints. That's why the Big Ten was trying to reach into the ACC footprint for members. Only Maryland took the bait because Maryland's athletic program is once again broke. They went broke in the 80s, again in the 90s, and again now. They will be broke in the Big Ten at some point.

As for New York City, the ACC will be well represented with Notre Dame football and Syracuse basketball. Rutgers hasn't been a factor in college sports for the 35 years I've been following college sports. I don't know if being a doormat in that Big Ten Eastern football division will change this. I don't know how well the average New York City sports fan will view supporting a doormat. It's the same for Maryland in Washinton, DC. At least Maryland can play men's basketball. How many men's basketball championship games did Rutgers play in while they were in the Big East? Did they even play in any semifinal games?

I would like to see Connecticut in the ACC someday. We are all waiting to see what Notre Dame is going to do longer term. For the next dozen years, Notre Dame football will be playing in the ACC. Right now it is 5 games per year. Maybe this Division 4 move will have an impact on them, and they will increase to 8 games and be eligible to play for the ACC Championship. Then the ACC will need another member.

Agreed that the B1G could have done better with their adds. However, if the ACC really wanted a serious NYC presence then they blew it by not adding UConn. Thanks for wanting us in the ACC someday. "Someday" doesn't work for UConn, however. UConn has to be working feverishly to get out of the horrid AAC now. They are doing it on the academic front and have to continue to be relevant on the athletic front. UConn deserves to be placed now. That it isn't creates resentment and the consequent determination on our part to get situated now.

Another observation, UConn has a lot more in common with the better schools in the ACC than Louisville. I think that the Louisville choice will come back to haunt the ACC/Swofford. The UVA's and UNC's of the world had to hold their collective noses to go for Louisville. I believe conferences with such wide divergence of academic standards among schools are headed for trouble. Louisville is riding high athletically now and they have the best AD in the game, but the juxtaposition of the likes of Duke et al in a conference with Louisville will create issues.
(Louisville accepts approx. 72% of its applicants and only graduates approx. 51% after 6 years! How does that stack up with UVA?)

As far as ND is concerned; they won't go anywhere on a permanent basis and this will create friction within your ranks soon enough. Consider that the ACC is the first and the only "P-5 conference" to give "favored nations" status to only one school. (The BE's deal with ND is irrelevant. They didn't have football at its start and when it started, half the schools didn't field a team anyways.) The ND situation will, like it or not, create resentment. (It already has outside your conference in the SEC.)

Right now, UConn is very well positioned to help either conference gain real traction in NYC. Obviously, we would go to either conference over the gulag we are stuck in. However, I hope it will be the B1G that comes calling, because long term, I believe it will be the most stable and academically consistent conference.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

You won't catch me going over 70 on a NYS highway or thruway (especially upstate) anymore...NY State Troopers are a ticket happy bunch!

I know many of the speed traps on the Thruway. That said, NY State Cops have nothing on CT cops. I have been driving between NYC and Boston for 15+ years and I can count the number of times on one hand that I did not see a CT State Cop somewhere near the CT/MA border on I-84.

 

[cardsfan123]

Another observation, UConn has a lot more in common with the better schools in the ACC than Louisville. I think that the Louisville choice will come back to haunt the ACC/Swofford. The UVA's and UNC's of the world had to hold their collective noses to go for Louisville. I believe conferences with such wide divergence of academic standards among schools are headed for trouble. Louisville is riding high athletically now and they have the best AD in the game, but the juxtaposition of the likes of Duke et al in a conference with Louisville will create issues.
(Louisville accepts approx. 72% of its applicants and only graduates approx. 51% after 6 years! How does that stack up with UVA?)

Yes, we get it. Louisville's academics aren't good. But they have a lot of room for improvement, and have been every year since Dr. Ramsey took over. Do you really think Duke and Virginia fans are more excited about a top 25 football team coming to town or a top 100 academic school coming to town? At some point you just have to hang up your hat and admit you got beat by a school that has much more to offer in virtually every other facet.

Clemson and FSU would've bolted for greener pastures had UConn been added, so at best going forward you'd be stuck in some deformed AAC/ACC combination of leftover schools in which case you could proudly boast you were the sole cause of the ACC's destruction. Since Louisville was added the ACC has increased its TV deal and unanimously signed a GoR, solidifying itself as a power 5 conference for the next 15 years. I think Duke and UVa can suffer through that, don't you?

If UConn had been added to the ACC it would've been the first instance of a school being added solely for academics. Football? Appalling. Basketball? Clearly on a downward spiral. TV market? Syracuse and Boston College have it covered. You guys were playing in FCS not too long ago. Swofford had one last chance to save his conference and he knew UConn wasn't going to cut it. THAT'S why you guys were left behind.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Thus making Villanova New York's team.

U. Buffalo's AD seems to think the state should get behind it. The school spent a decade or more rebranding itself as University at Buffalo instead of SUNY Buffalo, then the Duke AD's kid comes in and decides to call it the University of New York. ADs are apparently not the marketing geniuses many believe them to be.

Buffalo will never be New York’s team. Maybe western NY as far east as Syracuse; but, that is it. Heck, most folks in NYC believe anything above Westchester County is ‘Upstate’ New York. Which is not quite as bad as locals from Boston who believe anything West of I-495 is not part of Massachusetts, Albany is out by Chicago somewhere, and Buffalo overlooks the Pacific.

 

[Hoophound]

Yes, we get it. Louisville's academics aren't good. But they have a lot of room for improvement, and have been every year since Dr. Ramsey took over. Do you really think Duke and Virginia fans are more excited about a top 25 football team coming to town or a top 100 academic school coming to town? At some point you just have to hang up your hat and admit you got beat by a school that has much more to offer in virtually every other facet.

Clemson and FSU would've bolted for greener pastures had UConn been added, so at best going forward you'd be stuck in some deformed AAC/ACC combination of leftover schools in which case you could proudly boast you were the sole cause of the ACC's destruction. Since Louisville was added the ACC has increased its TV deal and unanimously signed a GoR, solidifying itself as a power 5 conference for the next 15 years. I think Duke and UVa can suffer through that, don't you?

If UConn had been added to the ACC it would've been the first instance of a school being added solely for academics. Football? Appalling. Basketball? Clearly on a downward spiral. TV market? Syracuse and Boston College have it covered. You guys were playing in FCS not too long ago. Swofford had one last chance to save his conference and he knew UConn wasn't going to cut it. THAT'S why you guys were left behind.

You are insufferable. You act like you have some sort of powerhouse football program. You don't. UL is a crappy school in a crappy market that won a few football games at the exact right time. The ACC is a crappy football conference that needed to add a school and UL was the prettiest girl available that month for football credibility. Nothing more, nothing less. We know UL has a win at all costs AD (Dyer, really?) and frankly, many of us wish we did too sometimes. However, we don't need to hear all your UL drivel, you have nothing to add. Your sole purpose here is to put lipstick on the big, fat, sweaty pig that is UL.

 

[Hoophound]

P.S. UConn basketball is in a downward spiral? I think you are the one that needs to worry about that. We have a great young coach and you are the ones with the old guy whose days are numbered. Hiring great coaches isn't always easy. I'd much rather have KO than Slick Rick right now. We hit a homerun with our new coach.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

@CardsFan123

And here I thought that UConn fans are the one known for elitism and entitlement. Let’s look at some of your points.

· Florida State and Clemson were going to bolt for the XII. Yes, it was rumored, just as much as UNC and UVA were going to bolt for the B1G. But, where is the proof? If anything, the ACC bending over the ND and their special arrangement saved the ACC, not Louisville.

· As for Academics, it is a major factor; just ask the B1G and the ACC, at least on Mondays, Thursdays, and some Sundays. I am sure there are brilliant students at Louisville, just like any college. But, it is a fact that UConn’s (US News #63) academics are a lot more aligned with the ACC (US news average of 58) than Louisville (#160). And remember, why sports are important, academics are huge as the research $$ they attract are equal or greater than the $$ sports bring in.

· Appalling football? OK, granted, UConn had a poor AD who made a poor football coaching hire and Louisville did the opposite. But, what ‘history’ of success does Louisville have? The Card’s historical winning record in football is 51% (UConn’s is 49%) with an 8-8-1 Bowl record (UConn is 3-2). Most of the success that Louisville has had has been in the last 20 years under Smith (98-02), Petrino (03-06), and Strong (10 -?). You also went 15 and 21 under Kragthorpe (07-09). Did I mention that historically Louisville is 5-4 against UConn and one win was in 2000, before UConn made the jump to 1A? Oh, and of course, UConn’s appalling team, which indeed had no offense, did beat Louisville at Louisville last year. Louisville made a good hire in Strong and got lucky with CR timing. Louisville is not Alabama, ND, or heck, not even BC (winning percentage of 58%, 13-9 in bowls).

· Basketball on a downward spiral? Really. Both UConn and Louisville men have won 3; last year’s was Louisville’s first since 1986. UConn’s rookie head coach won 20 games in the Big E with a team that had nothing to play for and a team that had no depth due to NCAA violations (don’t say anything, Louisville had a 1 year ban itself in the 90’s). They lead NCAA champion Louisville at the half by 6 points before fading down the stretch. Once back to a full team, KO should do very well. As for the women, UConn has 8, Louisville has 0. And congrats to Louisville for making the final last year, before getting crushed by UConn 93-60. If that is a downward spiral, no one, including Louisville, wants to see UConn going upwards.

· As for TV markets, in NY, Rutgers is the #1 team due to geographic reasons followed by ND, Penn St, and then UConn. Syracuse follows UConn at #5. As for Boston, the only BC sport people care about in Boston is Hockey, which is not an ACC sport.

So, don’t trash my school and I will not trash yours. Simply stated, Louisville’s timing was better than UConn and that is the reason that Louisville is in the ACC and UConn is in the AAC, at least today…

 

[caw]

Yes, we get it. Louisville's academics aren't good. But they have a lot of room for improvement, and have been every year since Dr. Ramsey took over. Do you really think Duke and Virginia fans are more excited about a top 25 football team coming to town or a top 100 academic school coming to town? At some point you just have to hang up your hat and admit you got beat by a school that has much more to offer in virtually every other facet.

Clemson and FSU would've bolted for greener pastures had UConn been added, so at best going forward you'd be stuck in some deformed AAC/ACC combination of leftover schools in which case you could proudly boast you were the sole cause of the ACC's destruction. Since Louisville was added the ACC has increased its TV deal and unanimously signed a GoR, solidifying itself as a power 5 conference for the next 15 years. I think Duke and UVa can suffer through that, don't you?

If UConn had been added to the ACC it would've been the first instance of a school being added solely for academics. Football? Appalling. Basketball? Clearly on a downward spiral. TV market? Syracuse and Boston College have it covered. You guys were playing in FCS not too long ago. Swofford had one last chance to save his conference and he knew UConn wasn't going to cut it. THAT'S why you guys were left behind.

UNC fans may care that UL is a top 25 team (who actually knows, but I'll play along and assume). UVA fans probably care more about the academics.

UL and UConn were basically hot girls, but UL had bigger while UConn had a prettier face, ACC were into .

 

[Nostical]

UL had bigger while UConn had a prettier face, ACC were into .

Tom Jurich ma-nipple-ated the process better than we did.

 

[caw]

Tom Jurich ma-nipple-ated the process better than we did.

I find it hard to believe anyone could out man-nipple-late Manuel and his box of doughnuts.

 

[UConn9604]

Football? Appalling.

You know you've split against us in Big East history, right? Like, .500?

TV market? Syracuse and Boston College have it covered.

I'm guessing you've never turned on a television north of the Mason-Dixon Line.

 

[caw]

You know you've split against us in Big East history, right? Like, .500?




I'm guessing you've never turned on a television north of the Mason-Dixon Line.

Considering what he said about UVAs fanbase I think he's even more closeted.