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Not a sport?
Athlete or Not? Ten Questions
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Discus? Shotput? Swimming?
Well, duh, they run less than a mile spread out over a 3.5 hour time span.
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discus and shotput require quick movements for distance. Got me on the swimming
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Also saw Nichlaus when he was fat, pudgy , smoked and dominated the tour.
Waquoit
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It's athletic, but so is ballet dancing. A sport is a competition that has an objective way to measure victory. Score more points, run fastest, jump highest, etc. Even lacrosse is a sport. Things that are exclusively judged like gymnastics, figure skating, X-games and the like aren't true sports, IMO.
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jleves
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How about boxing?
Waquoit
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The way I justify boxing making the cut although it frequently involves judging is that the sport itself involves a head-to-head competition. An athlete applying his skills directly against another competitor.
You said "run fast or quickly" being and "asset," which is not the case for either discus or shotput.
So, basically, you just don't want gymnastics to be considered a sport and you will make exceptions just to make it so in your mind.
Waquoit
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Nah, do you really think it's the same thing? Boxing didn't have judging at the beginning. It came about with public outcry against brutal matches going into incredible numbers of rounds.
I don't think of it as same or different.
I think that anything requiring mastery of a certain physical action for a competitive activity is a sport. Anyone participating in said sport, who thus has a mastery of a given skill that is important in that sport, is automatically an athlete.
I think that anything requiring mastery of a certain physical action for a competitive activity is a sport. Anyone participating in said sport, who thus has a mastery of a given skill that is important in that sport, is automatically an athlete.
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mets1090
Probably returning some video tapes...
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Gymnasts are clearly ridiculous athletes. I wouldn't classify gymnastics as a sport though - I agree with the whole objective measure thing. The main point is that you can be a freak athlete and never play a sport in your life. Was a guy who didn't play sports until his senior year of high school and suddenly received 20 D1 football scholarship offers not an athlete until he stepped on the field? I wouldn't say so.
I also bowl and wouldn't consider it a sport. It's very difficult to perform at a high level. It is a competition and a game, yes. But not a sport. The discussion between what makes a game and what makes a sport is a frivolous discussion that will never end (much like the rest of what is discussed on message boards). In general I agree that the overall level of exertion and the objectivity of the scoring is the best measure but once you get past the ones that are obviously sports (football/basketball/baseball/hockey/soccer) each individual case is a judgment call. Boxing clearly requires insane endurance, strength and quickness but you could argue either side. Same goes for gymnastics and cheerleading. Of course people who never played them are more likely to say they aren't sports and people who did play them are likely to be defensive of the idea that they are sports. Except bowling, it just isn't a sport and I can comfortably say that even though I bowl competitively all the time. Probably because I've played other sports and am not insecure about playing something that is a game and not a sport, whatever that means.
I also bowl and wouldn't consider it a sport. It's very difficult to perform at a high level. It is a competition and a game, yes. But not a sport. The discussion between what makes a game and what makes a sport is a frivolous discussion that will never end (much like the rest of what is discussed on message boards). In general I agree that the overall level of exertion and the objectivity of the scoring is the best measure but once you get past the ones that are obviously sports (football/basketball/baseball/hockey/soccer) each individual case is a judgment call. Boxing clearly requires insane endurance, strength and quickness but you could argue either side. Same goes for gymnastics and cheerleading. Of course people who never played them are more likely to say they aren't sports and people who did play them are likely to be defensive of the idea that they are sports. Except bowling, it just isn't a sport and I can comfortably say that even though I bowl competitively all the time. Probably because I've played other sports and am not insecure about playing something that is a game and not a sport, whatever that means.
But you have activities that go both ways. Golf and bowling have objective scoring but obviously have minimal physical exertion required, and baseball doesn't have much more. Gymnastics, cheerleading, figure skating and diving (all Olympic events minus cheerleading [which is considered a variant of gymnastics anyway], mind you) have subjective scoring but insane physical exertion and/or precision is required. So, which is more important?
Waquoit
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Is Cirque de Soleil a sport?
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So having physical gifts that you only dream of isn't enough if they don't run in the game they are playing? Hand-eye coordination not important? Mental toughness overrated?
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I wouldn't say mental toughness is a characteristic that should help define something as a sport. You have to be mentally tough in school or work also, but obviously school is not a sport. Hand-eye coordination is obviously an important characteristic for nearly every athlete, but just because hand-eye coordination is a crucial element in a certain game/event does not necessarily make it a sport.
I'm not sure there is one definition that's going to make sense when defining a sport. I look at as, "Does this pass the eye test?", which is obviously subjective.
Another note: How athletic the general population of people participating in a certain event is does not make it any more or less of a sport than any other sport, if that makes sense. Things like gymnastics, weightlifting, eating, figure skating, etc. are more competitons than sports, IMO. To excel in gymnastics, you have to maintain tip top physical condition, but you could say the same for many other impressive, rarely seen spectacles that people manage to do with their bodies. To people could compete in front of an audience to see who has the ability to complete more consecutive backflips. That's obviously incredibly athletic, but I don't think anybody watching this would consider these two people to be engaging in a sport.
There is really no broad, across the scope definition that anybody is going to be able to provide. I'd just say you know a sport when you see one, just like somebody once said about pornography.
My final verdict is this: NASCAR, gymnastics, competitve cheerleading, weight lifting, competitive eating, golf, bowling, and horse racing are all competitions, while basketball, football, soccer, hockey, lacrosse, baseball, and others are sports. I couldn't give you a tangible reason why, it's just my opinion really. I wouldn't blame anybody for considering any of the above a sport besides competitive eating, which is by any definition, not a sport.
I'm not sure there is one definition that's going to make sense when defining a sport. I look at as, "Does this pass the eye test?", which is obviously subjective.
Another note: How athletic the general population of people participating in a certain event is does not make it any more or less of a sport than any other sport, if that makes sense. Things like gymnastics, weightlifting, eating, figure skating, etc. are more competitons than sports, IMO. To excel in gymnastics, you have to maintain tip top physical condition, but you could say the same for many other impressive, rarely seen spectacles that people manage to do with their bodies. To people could compete in front of an audience to see who has the ability to complete more consecutive backflips. That's obviously incredibly athletic, but I don't think anybody watching this would consider these two people to be engaging in a sport.
There is really no broad, across the scope definition that anybody is going to be able to provide. I'd just say you know a sport when you see one, just like somebody once said about pornography.
My final verdict is this: NASCAR, gymnastics, competitve cheerleading, weight lifting, competitive eating, golf, bowling, and horse racing are all competitions, while basketball, football, soccer, hockey, lacrosse, baseball, and others are sports. I couldn't give you a tangible reason why, it's just my opinion really. I wouldn't blame anybody for considering any of the above a sport besides competitive eating, which is by any definition, not a sport.
Last I heard, it isn't a competition.
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Let's try to work towards one (or start a whole new debate, depending on your answer)
Would you say that those who play sports (however you choose to define "sport") are automatically athletes?
Waquoit
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So for you Dancing with the Stars is a sport.
Waquoit
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Skateboarding, halfpipe, moguls, no. BMX, motocross, street luge, yes.
Why can't competitive dance be considered a sport? Why can't competitive dancers be considered athletes? Have you seen what some of those crazy breakdancers can do?
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Fishy
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Sometimes, I read this board and I think I am being overly critical of the people here - there's just no way you're all stupid enough to actually cause my head to ache.
And then there's thread like this that just spirals into the abyss and I'm snapped back to reality - it's you, not me.
And then there's thread like this that just spirals into the abyss and I'm snapped back to reality - it's you, not me.
Waquoit
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I have to close the loop. Dancers are athletes, dancing is not a sport.
sport
[spawrt, spohrt] Show IPA
[spawrt, spohrt] Show IPA
noun
1.
an athletic activity requiring skill or physical prowess andoften of a competitive nature, as racing, baseball, tennis,golf, bowling, wrestling, boxing, hunting, fishing, etc.2.
a particular form of this, especially in the out of doors.3.
diversion; recreation; pleasant pastime.
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In technicality, yes. But when I think of an "athlete" I think of somebody who posseses the physical traits that define the term "athlete". As we've pointed out in this thread, there are many professinal athletes who have beer bellies but are able to play sports at the highest level because their positions do not require them to maintain top cardiovascular condition.
Tom Brady is obviously one of the best athletes in the world, but he's not an athlete in the same sense that Michael Vick is an athlete. Some people are able to play professional sports because they have one characteristic that sets them apart from the rest of the field. In the case of Tom Brady, it's the ability to read a defense and deliver a football with precision and velocity in the process of being hammered by three 250 pound men. That's an admirable skill, one that has made him famous. While he has to keep himself in adequate physiccal condition, I doubt he has the type of flexibility, speed, leaping ability, strength, hand-eye coordination, or agility you'd like to see in a prototypical world class athlete.
I don't have the nerve to say Tom Brady or CC Sabathia is not an athlete, because they obviously are in a fundamental sense. But to me, a truly remarkable athlete is a freak of nature, somebody like LeBron James who posseses several of the traits I listed above, and does not simply specialize in one area.
Ah, but Brady and CC do essentially specialize in one area (in their respective sports)! In fact, that specialization is what, in my opinion, makes football the greatest, truest team sport in existence!
And you have to remember that the ultimate root translation of "athlete" comes from the Greek word that is used to describe someone who competes for a prize. I understand that that translation can (and probably does) force one to allow that certain participants in certain activities are "athletes" regardless of the physical intensity/scoring objectivity of said activity, and it may cause some kind of disagreement with one's self-determined definitions, but, I mean, that's where the word comes from. Can't really contest that.
PS I'm not contending the fact that Brady or Manning are elite athletes, I was simply using them as counter-examples to ruin someone's (either Waquiot of Frank Ivy, I forget at this point) sub-par trolling.
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