ACC rumor from the Fat White Guy

[pj]

There had been a mini war going on in the ACC for several years....the feeling, by some programs like FSU, that the Tobacco Road mob wanted to control the conference....and UConn might have been colllateral damage in that guerilla war.

This impression of North Carolina control was abetted by the fact that Swofford was an ex UNC athletic director and had a building on campus named for him.

The crap hit the fan when it was FSU always traveling to a Thursday night game, year after year...including all the way to Boston, while UNC rarely was assigned such a game and when they did play on Thursday night, it was a short hop down the road. The whole schedulling by the ACC was getting under folks' skin. FSU always had a conference game before the Florida game while Florida played their subs against Jacksonville State, FIU. the Citadel, etc. the week before.

It was also the appearance of biased officiating (finally FSU did a 5 year study on calls on FSU vs Carolina schools and published the info), and it was out right war between Coach K and the football factions regarding which sport should take precedence in future planning.

Coach K, Roy Williams, and John Swofford were seen as a ruling triumvirate. FSU made a lot of noise, played a bluff card or two, built its own voting block...and decided that there would be another voice in the conference.

Exactly. And given the petty constituencies and rivalries in the ACC, that always seem to lead to hostility to UConn, can it surprise that many UConn fans have become more interested in the B1G? Whether we're collateral damage or one of the targets, why go to a conference where people will shoot at us?

 

[btstimpy]

There had been a mini war going on in the ACC for several years....the feeling, by some programs like FSU, that the Tobacco Road mob wanted to control the conference....and UConn might have been colllateral damage in that guerilla war.

This impression of North Carolina control was abetted by the fact that Swofford was an ex UNC athletic director and had a building on campus named for him.

The crap hit the fan when it was FSU always traveling to a Thursday night game, year after year...including all the way to Boston, while UNC rarely was assigned such a game and when they did play on Thursday night, it was a short hop down the road. The whole schedulling by the ACC was getting under folks' skin. FSU always had a conference game before the Florida game while Florida played their subs against Jacksonville State, FIU. the Citadel, etc. the week before.

It was also the appearance of biased officiating (finally FSU did a 5 year study on calls on FSU vs Carolina schools and published the info), and it was out right war between Coach K and the football factions regarding which sport should take precedence in future planning.

Coach K, Roy Williams, and John Swofford were seen as a ruling triumvirate. FSU made a lot of noise, played a bluff card or two, built its own voting block...and decided that there would be another voice in the conference.

I'm surprised that FSU fans didn't like Thursday night games. They offer more visibility. Virginia Tech holds up their hand every year to play Thursday night games, sometimes 3 a season. UVA has had to go play them in Miami and Atlanta many times. The only home ones I can remember are against Clemson 10 years ago and against UNC 2 years ago.

The ACC was slow to recognize what the SEC was doing by giving their schools a week off before playing the in state ACC rival. I think that's now corrected.

The officiating bias perception and strong personalities with agendas are in all the major conferences. I read the Penn State Board sometimes, and they see the Big Ten officials making all the calls in favor of Ohio State and Michigan. Apparently the Penn State fans got an unsportsmanlike penalty for noise one time while playing Ohio State in State College. They see Jim Delaney as biased toward Michigan and Ohio State. The same is perceived in the Big XII. Texas and Oklahoma rule the roost. And the PAC 12 does what UCLA and USC want. Alabama throws its weight around in the SEC, and LSU is tired of it.

I don't think the ACC is unique in that regard. The calls you're talking about are football related. Coach K gets all the calls in basketball especially at home. Dean Smith used to get them before Coach K. There is an art to working the officials that those coaches mastered.

 

[WestCoastHusky]

I dont like how the acc treated uconn, but geographically, the acc makes the most sense, and who wouldn't want to see uconn play duke, unc and cuse yearly in bball? it just makes too much sense, but on the flip side playing mich, ohio st and penn st in football would be equally appealing. This will be a dance with the devil if it ever comes down to both conferences suiting uconn. herbst and warde will make the right call.

ultimately, I think it will come down to the large pile of cash that the 10 will throw our way. This will happen someday, and it will be so nice to watch how it unfolds and I'll enjoy watching Swofford put lipstick on the acc pig.

There had been a mini war going on in the ACC for several years....the feeling, by some programs like FSU, that the Tobacco Road mob wanted to control the conference....and UConn might have been colllateral damage in that guerilla war.

This impression of North Carolina control was abetted by the fact that Swofford was an ex UNC athletic director and had a building on campus named for him.

The crap hit the fan when it was FSU always traveling to a Thursday night game, year after year...including all the way to Boston, while UNC rarely was assigned such a game and when they did play on Thursday night, it was a short hop down the road. The whole schedulling by the ACC was getting under folks' skin. FSU always had a conference game before the Florida game while Florida played their subs against Jacksonville State, FIU. the Citadel, etc. the week before.

It was also the appearance of biased officiating (finally FSU did a 5 year study on calls on FSU vs Carolina schools and published the info), and it was out right war between Coach K and the football factions regarding which sport should take precedence in future planning.

Coach K, Roy Williams, and John Swofford were seen as a ruling triumvirate. FSU made a lot of noise, played a bluff card or two, built its own voting block...and decided that there would be another voice in the conference.

Because of this, you ended up with Louisville the commuter school. FSU got a school it can finally feel superior to academically so congrats. Like many said, ACC's expansion was reactionary and we will see how this will play out long term. As a flagship state university, UCONN is a better for the B1G now that conference is coming to the East.

 

[HawkHusky]

There had been a mini war going on in the ACC for several years....the feeling, by some programs like FSU, that the Tobacco Road mob wanted to control the conference....and UConn might have been colllateral damage in that guerilla war.

This impression of North Carolina control was abetted by the fact that Swofford was an ex UNC athletic director and had a building on campus named for him.

The crap hit the fan when it was FSU always traveling to a Thursday night game, year after year...including all the way to Boston, while UNC rarely was assigned such a game and when they did play on Thursday night, it was a short hop down the road. The whole schedulling by the ACC was getting under folks' skin. FSU always had a conference game before the Florida game while Florida played their subs against Jacksonville State, FIU. the Citadel, etc. the week before.

It was also the appearance of biased officiating (finally FSU did a 5 year study on calls on FSU vs Carolina schools and published the info), and it was out right war between Coach K and the football factions regarding which sport should take precedence in future planning.

Coach K, Roy Williams, and John Swofford were seen as a ruling triumvirate. FSU made a lot of noise, played a bluff card or two, built its own voting block...and decided that there would be another voice in the conference.

All I want for Christmas (besides UCONN in the B1G) is for the Auburn Tigers to maul the Seminoles in the National Championship.

 

[dayooper]

All I want for Christmas (besides UCONN in the B1G) is for the Auburn Tigers to maul the Seminoles in the National Championship.

I wouldn't mind having UConn in the Big10 (along with some other teams). I understand why you would want FSU to lose, but I couldn't stomach another SEC championship and the hype to go with it.

 

[btstimpy]

Exactly. And given the petty constituencies and rivalries in the ACC, that always seem to lead to hostility to UConn, can it surprise that many UConn fans have become more interested in the B1G? Whether we're collateral damage or one of the targets, why go to a conference where people will shoot at us?

The only real hostility toward UConn that I've seen has come from Boston College. We've discussed it here, and I don't think it makes sense because it is petty. And I think Jim Calhoun caused some of it too along with the lawsuit. As an ACC fan who likes the idea of UConn as a member, I'd like to see Boston College get over it.

The rivalry between football and basketball in a league that is good at both is going to happen. I don't think anyone else in the ACC is shooting at UConn other than BC, and they can't block UConn alone. UConn is however perceived as a basketball school. Tons of basketball national championships will do that to a school. That's a good thing IMO. The 2002 additions were related to football. The 2011 additions were chosen by the basketball schools. Louisville by the football schools. Hopefully the next choice will be for basketball, and UConn will be chosen. Continued improvement in football will help alleviate the football faction's concerns. Changing divisional allignment to PODS that locallize more of the travel will alleviate concerns too.

 

[dayooper]

The only real hostility toward UConn that I've seen has come from Boston College. We've discussed it here, and I don't think it makes sense because it is petty. And I think Jim Calhoun caused some of it too along with the lawsuit. As an ACC fan who likes the idea of UConn as a member, I'd like to see Boston College get over it.

The rivalry between football and basketball in a league that is good at both is going to happen. I don't think anyone else in the ACC is shooting at UConn other than BC, and they can't block UConn alone. UConn is however perceived as a basketball school. Tons of basketball national championships will do that to a school. That's a good thing IMO. The 2002 additions were related to football. The 2011 additions were chosen by the basketball schools. Louisville by the football schools. Hopefully the next choice will be for basketball, and UConn will be chosen. Continued improvement in football will help alleviate the football faction's concerns. Changing divisional allignment to PODS that locallize more of the travel will alleviate concerns too.

The problem with UConn to the ACC is Notre Dame and the fact that I don't think the ACC wants to get any bigger than 16. They will save a space for ND and won't expand unless they go all in. 15 would be such an awkward number I can totally understand. Since I believe that the only way ND joins a conference all in is if they have to to get a seat the football playoff table and that they will have a seat, they won't be expanding until their next media deal is up.

 

[Fishy]

The ACC is not expanding.

The Big East has been wiped out and ESPN has put the checkbook away.

 

[pj]

The problem with UConn to the ACC is Notre Dame and the fact that I don't think the ACC wants to get any bigger than 16. They will save a space for ND and won't expand unless they go all in. 15 would be such an awkward number I can totally understand. Since I believe that the only way ND joins a conference all in is if they have to to get a seat the football playoff table and that they will have a seat, they won't be expanding until their next media deal is up.

With scheduling for Notre Dame already part of the deal, 15+Notre Dame is no more cumbersome than 14+Notre Dame. Either way Notre Dame is half an ACC school.

The ACC is not expanding.

The Big East has been wiped out and ESPN has put the checkbook away.

With ESPN having UConn's TV rights for $2 mn a year, they have no need to spend money -- now. But when the AAC contract comes up for renewal, it could be a different story. If UConn was in line for a B1G invitation, it would be a different story.

 

[dayooper]

With scheduling for Notre Dame already part of the deal, 15+Notre Dame is no more cumbersome than 14+Notre Dame. Either way Notre Dame is half an ACC school.



With ESPN having UConn's TV rights for $2 mn a year, they have no need to spend money -- now. But when the AAC contract comes up for renewal, it could be a different story. If UConn was in line for a B1G invitation, it would be a different story.

IIRC, those 5 games are treated as OCC games. They don't count toward the conference championship and they don't take up any of the ACC teams conference schedules. 14 is much easier to schedule than 15. You can split into divisions where as with 15, those divisions would be unequal. I could be wrong, but that's how I remember it.

 

[billybud]

You are right...

 

[buddy]

With scheduling for Notre Dame already part of the deal, 15+Notre Dame is no more cumbersome than 14+Notre Dame. Either way Notre Dame is half an ACC school.



With ESPN having UConn's TV rights for $2 mn a year, they have no need to spend money -- now. But when the AAC contract comes up for renewal, it could be a different story. If UConn was in line for a B1G invitation, it would be a different story.

Based on these comments, seems like UConn is pretty much stuck for decades to come. No ACC

 

[NEforceUConn]

ND and the ACC, we all know how that one plays out.

I thought ND would steal a better bowl from the ACC, and instead they opt for the Pinstripe. Hell I thought if ND ended at 9-3 they would have insisted on the Chick-Fil-A or Russel Athletic bowl.

 

[SAMCRO]

Help us Jim Delaney, you're our only hope.

ACC has no reason to split the pie unless ND is forced to go all in w/ FB (which ain't happening). So essentially they are done. It is B1G or bust. In the meantime, UConn needs to make hay over the next couple of years. Exit fee and BB credits will help to offset the crappy TV contract for a little bit, but it is important to get AAU invite and start winning FB games.

 

[SouthronCross]

There had been a mini war going on in the ACC for several years....the feeling, by some programs like FSU, that the Tobacco Road mob wanted to control the conference....and UConn might have been colllateral damage in that guerilla war.

That is as sensible a take on things as I've heard.

This impression of North Carolina control was abetted by the fact that Swofford was an ex UNC athletic director and had a building on campus named for him.

And that is all that it was. An impression. A false one. Just like the one where Clemson folks blame him for their 3rd year of probation back in the early '80s.

The crap hit the fan when it was FSU always traveling to a Thursday night game, year after year...including all the way to Boston, while UNC rarely was assigned such a game and when they did play on Thursday night, it was a short hop down the road. The whole schedulling by the ACC was getting under folks' skin. FSU always had a conference game before the Florida game while Florida played their subs against Jacksonville State, FIU. the Citadel, etc. the week before.

I was with FSU on this one. They got the short end of the stick on it. IMO, each team would play no more than ONE Thursday game a season. And, if you play at home in 2013, you go on the road in 2014, etc.

It was also the appearance of biased officiating (finally FSU did a 5 year study on calls on FSU vs Carolina schools and published the info), and it was out right war between Coach K and the football factions regarding which sport should take precedence in future planning.

Believe it or not, FSU has allies in the UNC fanbase. But, the administration here is stuck in the 1980s, still thinking basketball pays the bills.

Coach K, Roy Williams, and John Swofford were seen as a ruling triumvirate. FSU made a lot of noise, played a bluff card or two, built its own voting block...and decided that there would be another voice in the conference.

I only wish you all could have done this back when Dean Smith was around. That would've not only been a fun confrontation, but, also the best thing that could've happened to the league.

 

[Stinger92860]

HFD may have taken the rumor from FWG.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

The only real hostility toward UConn that I've seen has come from Boston College. We've discussed it here, and I don't think it makes sense because it is petty. And I think Jim Calhoun caused some of it too along with the lawsuit. As an ACC fan who likes the idea of UConn as a member, I'd like to see Boston College get over it.

The rivalry between football and basketball in a league that is good at both is going to happen. I don't think anyone else in the ACC is shooting at UConn other than BC, and they can't block UConn alone. UConn is however perceived as a basketball school. Tons of basketball national championships will do that to a school. That's a good thing IMO. The 2002 additions were related to football. The 2011 additions were chosen by the basketball schools. Louisville by the football schools. Hopefully the next choice will be for basketball, and UConn will be chosen. Continued improvement in football will help alleviate the football faction's concerns. Changing divisional allignment to PODS that locallize more of the travel will alleviate concerns too.

Syracuse would be very happy if UConn sports were no longer carried by SNY and if the basketball teams never stepped foot in NYC again because, after all, Syracuse is NYC's college team...

 

[CTMike]

HFD may have taken the rumor from FWG.

Also possible they may have heard same chatter through similar channels.

 

[HuskyHawk]

IIRC, those 5 games are treated as OCC games. They don't count toward the conference championship and they don't take up any of the ACC teams conference schedules. 14 is much easier to schedule than 15. You can split into divisions where as with 15, those divisions would be unequal. I could be wrong, but that's how I remember it.

Yes, but that's football. Every other sport, which Notre Dame plays as a full member, is unequal. So is it easier to deal with a perfect 16 in every sport but football plus 15 for football along with 6 ND games on the schedule? I'm not sure what the answer is, but it isn't clear cut, that's for sure. Football could be split into three 5 team pods, with the CCG game just going to the two teams with the best record. It would probably help avoid the situation where Clemson and FSU should be in the CCG, but instead Duke or somebody else wins the other division. Louisville, FSU and Clemson are all in the "Atlantic" division...so that's the three best football teams unless VT or Miami return to past glory or UNC finally capitalizes on its potential.

 

[jostar1]

every other week the same old BC vs. UConn argument gets rehashed. Fellas:

1) BC did not want UConn
2) #1 doesn't matter, because BC has no stroke within the ACC. If UNC, UVA, and FSU wanted UConn, you'd be in.

Thursday, September 22, 2011 6:29 PM EDT
Source: Boston College working to keep UConn out of ACC
By Ed Daigneault Republican-American

According to sources, BC is not willing to allow UConn into the ACC without a major fight and is working to garner enough votes to block a move if and when it is considered. Herbst has attempted to smooth that rift by reaching out to BC President the Rev. William P. Leahy recently, a source said.

 

[junglehusky]

Also possible they may have heard same chatter through similar channels.

FWG, as a former football player, I believe could have contacts in the know in the UConn athletic department. HFD, who wasn't a student at UConn, probably doesn't have contacts above the level of, say, a student equipment manager. Just trying to think about what's plausible.

 

[SouthronCross]

Yes, but that's football. Every other sport, which Notre Dame plays as a full member, is unequal. So is it easier to deal with a perfect 16 in every sport but football plus 15 for football along with 6 ND games on the schedule? I'm not sure what the answer is, but it isn't clear cut, that's for sure. Football could be split into three 5 team pods, with the CCG game just going to the two teams with the best record. It would probably help avoid the situation where Clemson and FSU should be in the CCG, but instead Duke or somebody else wins the other division. Louisville, FSU and Clemson are all in the "Atlantic" division...so that's the three best football teams unless VT or Miami return to past glory or UNC finally capitalizes on its potential.

There is one HUGE thing to any attempt at realigning the divisions. The annual FSU-CU game is off the table. Its non-negotiable. They WILL play annually. Whether as division rivals, or, a protected cross-divisional rivalry.

Truthfully, the only changes I'd make to what we already have is to switch Ga Tech and Pitt to the Atlantic, and, put Syracuse and Louisville in the Coastal. That'd mean that the two southernmost and northernmost trips in the league are split up, one in each division. Plus, everybody would play in Florida every other season, at a mimimum, for recruiting purposes. It would then make it so FSU would play their closest ACC rival, GT, annually. Which is something they have asked for.

Coastal-Atlantic
Syracuse-Pitt
Louisville-Clemson
VPI-BC
UVA-GT
UNC-NCSU
Duke-Wake
Miami-FSU

 

[HawkHusky]

There is one HUGE thing to any attempt at realigning the divisions. The annual FSU-CU game is off the table. Its non-negotiable. They WILL play annually. Whether as division rivals, or, a protected cross-divisional rivalry.

Truthfully, the only changes I'd make to what we already have is to switch Ga Tech and Pitt to the Atlantic, and, put Syracuse and Louisville in the Coastal. That'd mean that the two southernmost and northernmost trips in the league are split up, one in each division. Plus, everybody would play in Florida every other season, at a mimimum, for recruiting purposes. It would then make it so FSU would play their closest ACC rival, GT, annually. Which is something they have asked for.

Coastal-Atlantic
Syracuse-Pitt
Louisville-Clemson
VPI-BC
UVA-GT
UNC-NCSU
Duke-Wake
Miami-FSU

Wouldn't it just be easier to go to 4x4 pods?

FSU, Miami, GTech, Clemson

Wake, NC State, Louisville, Cincinnati

UNC, Duke, UVA, VPI

BC, Pitt, Syracuse, UCONN

Cross/Stimpy....use your contacts and make it happen!

 

[SouthronCross]

Wouldn't it just be easier to go to 4x4 pods?

FSU, Miami, GTech, Clemson

Wake, NC State, Louisville, Cincinnati

UNC, Duke, UVA, VPI

BC, Pitt, Syracuse, UCONN

Cross/Stimpy....use your contacts and make it happen!

If/when the ACC goes to 16, I am betting that you will see 4-team pods used. It would make it easier for each team to see the other league members more often that way. It would be a surefire way for the four southernmost members to ensure that they play each other annually.

By the time that comes, I am hoping FSU, CU, and, Tech will finally agree to a 9-game ACC schedule. It would make things very easy that way.

I mention it to the Rams Club (UNC Boosters) members that I know, but, unfortunately, they are not amongst the real power players within the organisation.

 

[SouthronCross]

Thursday, September 22, 2011 6:29 PM EDT
Source: Boston College working to keep UConn out of ACC
By Ed Daigneault Republican-American

According to sources, BC is not willing to allow UConn into the ACC without a major fight and is working to garner enough votes to block a move if and when it is considered. Herbst has attempted to smooth that rift by reaching out to BC President the Rev. William P. Leahy recently, a source said.

BC's actions were a huge mistake, IMHO. A BC-UConn rivalry within this league would be great for the northeast. Both of you in a pod with Pitt and Syracuse would make for some fun games across the spectrum of sports under the ACC banner.

 

[BlueHen]

BC's actions were a huge mistake, IMHO. A BC-UConn rivalry within this league would be great for the northeast. Both of you in a pod with Pitt and Syracuse would make for some fun games across the spectrum of sports under the ACC banner.

I have to agree here. BC's actions hurt UConn, but they hurt BC as well.

 

[SouthronCross]

I have to agree here. BC's actions hurt UConn, but they hurt BC as well.

And, by extension, the ACC.

 

[The Viking]

The only real hostility toward UConn that I've seen has come from Boston College. We've discussed it here, and I don't think it makes sense because it is petty. And I think Jim Calhoun caused some of it too along with the lawsuit. As an ACC fan who likes the idea of UConn as a member, I'd like to see Boston College get over it.

The rivalry between football and basketball in a league that is good at both is going to happen. I don't think anyone else in the ACC is shooting at UConn other than BC, and they can't block UConn alone. UConn is however perceived as a basketball school. Tons of basketball national championships will do that to a school. That's a good thing IMO. The 2002 additions were related to football. The 2011 additions were chosen by the basketball schools. Louisville by the football schools. Hopefully the next choice will be for basketball, and UConn will be chosen. Continued improvement in football will help alleviate the football faction's concerns. Changing divisional allignment to PODS that locallize more of the travel will alleviate concerns too.

Jim Calhoun was a brave man for saying he what he said. He was angry with the backstabbings of Father Leahy and Co. and as a Boston man who loved the New England and overall Northeast hoops, I'm sure the emotions were more than just anger.

I miss that man. Especially when a well-deserved technical is needed.

 

[SAMCRO]

Calhoun saying what he said wasn't brave, or courageous, or valiant. He was pissed off and spoke his mind. Is what it is, but was not a display of bravery.

 

[whaler11]

I'm surprised that FSU fans didn't like Thursday night games. They offer more visibility. Virginia Tech holds up their hand every year to play Thursday night games, sometimes 3 a season. UVA has had to go play them in Miami and Atlanta many times. The only home ones I can remember are against Clemson 10 years ago and against UNC 2 years ago.
.

Mr Virginia... Um... November 2nd 1995. Virginia 33 Florida State 28 in CVille.

Would you like to take a swing at what day of the week that was?