ACC approves Grant of Rights

[ConnHuskBask]

I heard from very good authority back in September 2009 that when (not if, when) the ACC decided to move to 14 members the additions would be UConn and Cuse. The thinking was that it would take away the (then) three most recent BE national titles, relegate the remaining BE to where the first raid was supposed to leave the conference, give them what they could bill as the second best college men's hoops rivalry (to the UNC-Duke rivalry they already had) and lock up the entire eastern seaboard.

JH saw this as a done deal (only variable being the when) and banked on nothing possibly changing over time that would lead the ACC to decide something different. In the spring of 2010 when Delaney began making waves about how large the B-10 would end up being, JH should have been on the phone with anyone and everyone from tobacco road (where we were the top choice) and wherever else he could find a friend in the ACC to make sure we were still the target they were after. This was one of many things that JH was too lazy about to legitimately do the job that he was paid to do.

It's stories like this that make me want to puke.

Just what incredibly inept leadership.

God, Hathaway was a clueless .

 

[nojokea4]

The ACC absolutely stated that the vote approving the increase in departure fees was unanimous.

There is a concept in which dissenting entities will join the majority for consensus as a formality after a vote even one which has not in fact been unanimous. Perhaps this is such a case?

Maryland and FSU in no uncertain terms voted against the exit fee increase per this article (which is a blog entry but is on the WAPO and there are about thirty other saying the same):

Maryland and FSU vote no

 

[nojokea4]

Other than FSU, these schools play no one. VT is the posterchild for paper tigers in the NCAA. They have long been known to wrap up gaudy records, and lose games against good teams. In the BCS bowls, the record is abysmal. Adding moribund BE schools didn't help.

I would rather be the B12 any day of the week. This is a night and day comparison. WV goes from tagging 70 points on Clemson in a bowl to getting stomped in the B12.

The ACC has been awful for 10+ years. It seems like its different problems for different teams. But the obviously fixable one is FSU. They haven't gotten back yet, but look at their records since Bowden retired, they are better than one would think. I don't think Jimbo Fisher is a Nick Saban but he will probably have them back in the BCS/playoffs whatever is going on now sooner than later. They have recruited right there with the SEC all along, so it really is a foregone conclusion that if you add a competent staff they will be very good. Clemson is a poor mans FSU in this regard. Dabo is stupid and probably not the right guy.

Louisville under Strong may join the above programs.

Miami and Virginia Tech are probably not going to return to that level, but Miami is in more or less the most fertile recruiting area on earth and Va Tech has a huge and loyal following.

UVA/UNC could be more than they are at some point.

The rest are never going to be regular BCS contenders but there are some programs with solid histories.

The B12 has Texas, Oklahoma, OK State (maybe unless the oil money goes away) and TCU (could be a paper tiger w/ real competition). K state will probably fall back when Billy Snyder goes again, WVU isn't the same thing they were with Rich Rod even now. The rest are singularly unimpressive.

In short if FSU can get back to Texas level and Clemson or Louisville or another can step it up, the gap between the top programs in the two conferences dissipates and the ACC top to bottom is a much better product over the long run (also it has a lot more TV eyes for what that is worth).

 

[HuskyHawk]

Here's a post on Michigan's blog site mentioning UConn as the primary speculative target for B1G expanding eastward: http://mgoblog.com/mgoboard/acc-announced-grant-rights[/quote]

You can tell that they are Michigan fans. Self absorbed, and with nothing whatsoever to fear in the CR landscape, they barely understand it. They seemed clueless about the GOR signed by the B1G, Pac and the Big 12, the latter of which was signed under similar circumstances, when the Big 12 was on the verge of collapse. Worst of all, some idiot kept referring to Pitt as a team that would improve real on field content. The magic mushrooms in Michigan must be potent.

For better or worse (worse) we are now the most CR battle tested program in America. Other programs' fans hear about the ACC GOR three days later while reading the paper. We had 50 posts on it within minutes. We are like the guy on draft day....waiting to be picked, sliding to the second round, watching losers go before him, thinking "when I finally get picked, everyone else will rue the day they decided to pass on me."

 

[UCFBfan]

In short if FSU can get back to Texas level and Clemson or Louisville or another can step it up, the gap between the top programs in the two conferences dissipates and the ACC top to bottom is a much better product over the long run (also it has a lot more TV eyes for what that is worth).

Agree that top to middle the ACC is stronger but Texas and OU are stronger than FSU and Clemson/Louisville. Also, the bottom of the Big 12 is stronger than the bottom of the ACC. I'd take KU, Texas Tech, and...? Over Wake, BC, Cuse, and Duke any season.


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[nojokea4]

Agree that top to middle the ACC is stronger but Texas and OU are stronger than FSU and Clemson/Louisville. Also, the bottom of the Big 12 is stronger than the bottom of the ACC. I'd take KU, Texas Tech, and...? Over Wake, BC, Cuse, and Duke any season.

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Not gonna argue much more on this especially because I think we're not far off, but I think FSU could be (certainly is not now) but could be equal to Texas and > OU. The others Clemson and Lousville (and i'm curious to see what Louisville can do now) are never going to reach OU, Miami might though if they ever reemphasize football.

I hate BCU and Cuse as much as the next guy but historically they are better programs than TT and certainly KU which is a dog in football.

Duke/Wake/Iowa St. are all terrible. Both leagues are bad. The ACC has a leg up in having all of its teams in locations with people though. Ames/Manhattan/Waco/Lubbock are gross and no one lives in those places (TV implications).

 

[Carl Spackler]

I heard from very good authority back in September 2009 that when (not if, when) the ACC decided to move to 14 members the additions would be UConn and Cuse. The thinking was that it would take away the (then) three most recent BE national titles, relegate the remaining BE to where the first raid was supposed to leave the conference, give them what they could bill as the second best college men's hoops rivalry (to the UNC-Duke rivalry they already had) and lock up the entire eastern seaboard.

JH saw this as a done deal (only variable being the when) and banked on nothing possibly changing over time that would lead the ACC to decide something different. In the spring of 2010 when Delaney began making waves about how large the B-10 would end up being, JH should have been on the phone with anyone and everyone from tobacco road (where we were the top choice) and wherever else he could find a friend in the ACC to make sure we were still the target they were after. This was one of many things that JH was too lazy about to legitimately do the job that he was paid to do.

Interesting stuff, but nothing anyone can say about who said what and knew when, changes the simple fact that all changes in intercollegiate athletics leagues in the past 25 years have occurred because of simple votes going way back to a 5-3 vote involving Penn State. A handful of individuals vote that you can count on your fingers vote, and multimillion dollar annual budget institutions change their business operations.

The fact is, that not enough people that actually vote (and there aren't that many) have voted in such fashion that UCONN would move to a different athletic conference. The last time, a vote occurred that involved a signicant change in UCONN athletics, it was the former big east membership, that voted to extend UCONN an offer to upgrade football and join the Big East as a BCS program. That was 17 years ago.

Now - could things have been handled differently, by literally dozens of different people in positions of power - such that the people that voted in 2009-10-11-12........on such matters, would have come to a majority rule to once again create a major change in UCONN athletics? I believe so - yes - whole heartedly.

UCONN needs to build the personal relationships and reputation among the people that matter, such that when a vote again occurs, which would impact UCONN significantly, that such a vote turns out in our favor.

In the meantime, while those personal relationships are established and/or repaired and/or cultivated, among the the people that actually vote.....the best we can do is embrace our current situation positively, invest in it, and go out and win conference championships and compete at a level that is nationally relevant.

 

[huskymedic]

Swofford's Tallahassee trips helped sell FSU on ACC deal

"The wooing of Florida State and its rich football tradition was vital to the recently expanded ACC’s ability to renegotiate a top-dollar, long-term deal with ESPN, the network that holds broadcast rights to most of college football. ACC Commissioner John Swofford needed buy-in from FSU, so he and the league’s TV consultant, Dean Jordan, made two previously unreported trips to Tallahassee during a six-week period before the conference sealed its deal with ESPN last week."

Anatomy of the deal here... http://www.tallahassee.com/article/...-s-Tallahassee-trips-helped-sell-FSU-ACC-deal

 

[mempheel]

Hey guys- first post here: come in peace. I've posted elsewhere that, though UConn is an obvious loser currently in conference musical chairs, I think the ACC GOR actually helps your prospects. Both the B1G and the ACC have made it abundantly clear that they covet TV sets and eyeballs in the NE, and with the other ACC schools now off-limits it leaves UConn the biggest (almost only) fish available anywhere on the Eastern seaboard. Neither league quite has critical mass in that market, so both are now likely to look to Storrs. The other factor is that the GOR will give the ACC league office much more latitude to do what they need to do to improve brand/ market share, without worrying about mutinous disaffection from a couple "football schools" on our southern flank that threatened to destabilize the conference (to put it mildly). Personally, I hope you guys end up in the ACC North playing against BC, Cuse, Pitt, etc., and that the B1G gets stuck with Butgers and the Twerps only; however it shakes out, I think the future for the Huskies will be brighter than some might fear...

 

[pepband99]

You do raise an interesting point...

Does the GOR, which in theory "locks in" the "ACC football schools" (large tongue-in-cheek there), cut down the risk of their griping about an addition, if it helps them enough in $$$?

 

[SubbaBub]

If you assume the GoR freezes all participants in place. Then our toughest opponent on the CR front is the stand pat option. Unfortunately, I think stand pat is leading.

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[upstater]

You do raise an interesting point...

Does the GOR, which in theory "locks in" the "ACC football schools" (large tongue-in-cheek there), cut down the risk of their griping about an addition, if it helps them enough in $?

The only entity that can address both your point and mempheel's well received points is ESPN.

 

[DarthGrumpy]

Hey guys- first post here: come in peace. I've posted elsewhere that, though UConn is an obvious loser currently in conference musical chairs, I think the ACC GOR actually helps your prospects. Both the B1G and the ACC have made it abundantly clear that they covet TV sets and eyeballs in the NE, and with the other ACC schools now off-limits it leaves UConn the biggest (almost only) fish available anywhere on the Eastern seaboard. Neither league quite has critical mass in that market, so both are now likely to look to Storrs. The other factor is that the GOR will give the ACC league office much more latitude to do what they need to do to improve brand/ market share, without worrying about mutinous disaffection from a couple "football schools" on our southern flank that threatened to destabilize the conference (to put it mildly). Personally, I hope you guys end up in the ACC North playing against BC, Cuse, Pitt, etc., and that the B1G gets stuck with Butgers and the Twerps only; however it shakes out, I think the future for the Huskies will be brighter than some might fear...

Can only hope that scheduling issues and the potential for more TV money pushes the ACC and/or B1G to expand to 16 as the GOR does not prevent a conference from expanding, just penalizes schools from leaving. That said, after 15 or so years of this, I am cynical and almost believe that the ACC would pick Temple, Delaware, Stony Brook, Old Dominion, etc. before UConn at this point. The bad blood between UConn and the ACC has also pushed a majority of UConn fans into the B1G boat.
Also, while I have nothing concrete, I expect that this year’s NCAA hockey final sent-up warning flags up at Chestnut Hill. The holier than thou folks will try to write-off ECAC members Yale and Quinnipiac as one-hit wonders; but, I bet that BC is now worried about UConn’s Hockey East footprint in Connecticut. ESPN stated that CT is a top 5 hockey recruiting state behind MN, MA, NY and tied with NJ. I did not know that. Expect BC to try and keep UConn strapped to the AAC to drain UConn of money so that UConn cannot threaten BC’s only sports cash cow.

 

[nojokea4]

i don't think BCU (or anyone) makes very much money from hockey.

 

[pj]

Mempheel has a great point; the ACC has room to add a team (due to the Notre Dame deal, an odd number of teams is not a big deal), and the GoR removes bargaining leverage from BC and any other objectors. If Fox had won the AAC contract, I think ESPN would be pushing the ACC to offer UConn. As it is, ESPN has UConn for small money. It seems unlikely they'd support spending an extra $18 mn to get the same fan base. I think the B1G is more likely for the time being. They might have to go to 15 to do it though.

 

[06029]

i don't think BCU (or anyone) makes very much money from hockey.

Can't the same be said about Uconn and WBB? Uconn is probably the only school in the country that makes money on WBB and that is only because of the TV deal. BC hockey, and I believe the same can be said for BU, North Dakota, Ninny and Denver, appear to get sufficient donations because of their hockey success and each of them also has some type of TV contract. So I think the big boys in hockey probably do a little bit better than break even.

 

[Fishy]

Very few programs make money on college hockey - Minnesota is probably the most successful in that regard.

Ticket sales are basically the driver there. If you put asses in the seats, you lose less than those who don't.

TV money is largely non-existant.

 

[UCFBfan]

Can't the same be said about Uconn and WBB? Uconn is probably the only school in the country that makes money on WBB and that is only because of the TV deal. BC hockey, and I believe the same can be said for BU, North Dakota, Ninny and Denver, appear to get sufficient donations because of their hockey success and each of them also has some type of TV contract. So I think the big boys in hockey probably do a little bit better than break even.

Does BC have it's own TV rights for it's Hockey games or is it a Hockey East deal? I know that Hockey East games are on NESN on Friday nights when the Bruins aren't playing....if BC has hockey rights, they aren't on a channel found in CT.

UConn giving it's WBB rights to the AAC was the worst move they could have ever made. They had a sweet deal with SNY. Now? Who knows.

 

[TerryD]

Very few programs make money on college hockey - Minnesota is probably the most successful in that regard.

Ticket sales are basically the driver there. If you put asses in the seats, you lose less than those who don't.

TV money is largely non-existant.

ND has its own, separate hockey TV deal.

Starting next year, all home ND hockey games will be televised on NBC Sports.

I would think that ND would make a fair amount of money from this deal.


http://www.ndsmcobserver.com/sports...east-announces-tv-deal-1.2633211#.UX7ND6KG3ng


http://www.bcinterruption.com/2011/...re-dame-nbc-sports-network-versus-tv-contract

 

[upstater]

ND has its own, separate hockey TV deal.

Starting next year, all home ND hockey games will be televised on NBC Sports.

I would think that ND would make a fair amount of money from this deal.


http://www.ndsmcobserver.com/sports...east-announces-tv-deal-1.2633211#.UX7ND6KG3ng


http://www.bcinterruption.com/2011/...re-dame-nbc-sports-network-versus-tv-contract

A lot of schools have TV deals, but the deals don't pay enough to make them profitable. Many of the Boston schools are on NESN, for instance.

 

[Fishy]

ND has its own, separate hockey TV deal.

Starting next year, all home ND hockey games will be televised on NBC Sports.

I would think that ND would make a fair amount of money from this deal.

I'm sure they make next to nothing on the television deal - I'm willing to bet that the average ND hockey broadcast on NBC Whatever pulls in well under 100,000 viewers.

 

[huskymedic]

A lot of schools have TV deals, but the deals don't pay enough to make them profitable. Many of the Boston schools are on NESN, for instance.

Just announced today - @LetsPlay_Hockey: Big Ten hockey schools will get $2 million per year from the BTN, in addition to regular allotment

That will help close any deficit.

http://www.buckys5thquarter.com/2013/4/29/4283628/big-ten-hockey-payout-tv-contract

Moved post because I originally posted it under Fishy's ND post. Wrong place.

 

[NEforceUConn]

The ACC has been awful for 10+ years.

In short if FSU can get back to Texas level ?

Your first sentence is 100% correct.

Your last sentence is 100% wrong. FSU has been, by far, the most over rated FB team in America. The Texas level, they will be lucky to get back to Baylor's level. In fact if Baylor played FSU for the next 7 years Baylor would be 4-3.

 

[whaler11]

Your first sentence is 100% correct.

Your last sentence is 100% wrong. FSU has been, by far, the most over rated FB team in America. The Texas level, they will be lucky to get back to Baylor's level. In fact if Baylor played FSU for the next 7 years Baylor would be 4-3.

Baylor has come a long way but they went 4-8, 7-5, 9-3 and 7-5 the last four years... and managed to lose to West Virginia last year 70-63.

The last 3 years is the first time Baylor won 7 games three years in a row since 1949-1951.

So maybe let's not go crazy on Baylor?

 

[kbdiggity]

Other than FSU, these schools play no one. VT is the posterchild for paper tigers in the NCAA. They have long been known to wrap up gaudy records, and lose games against good teams. In the BCS bowls, the record is abysmal. Adding moribund BE schools didn't help.

I would rather be the B12 any day of the week. This is a night and day comparison. WV goes from tagging 70 points on Clemson in a bowl to getting stomped in the B12.

Most people don't want to subject their student-athletes to repeatedly traveling halfway across the country for conference games. Especially those student-athletes who don't get the travel amenities provided to football or men's basketball.

Fans want to be able to brag about the strength of the football in their conference, even if they do it while their team is being stomped all season long. But University presidents have to make conference affiliation decisions based on more than fan bravado. If WVU had the option to join a major conference closer to home, they would have done it in a heartbeat. The didn't join the Big 12 because it was a superior football product to the ACC. They joined the Big 12 because it was the only major conference to throw them a lifeline while the Big East was collapsing. It took less than a year of membership before articles starter surfacing in which WVU officials began complaining about the travel.